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How much colour would you drop?

J

Just_Starting

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Apr 3, 2014
Messages
167
Had a lot of people on here suggest I drop colour to boost other aspects of a diamond for the price, I was looking at D-F colour. Considering I'm looking at stones around 0.5 carat I think that means I can get away with more of a drop? I'm only looking at round brilliant cuts, will be in a 6 prong platinum mount. How noticeable would a drop from D-H be at this weight/mount etc? What colour do you think is the best trade-off at this weight?

Thanks for any input I look forward to reading your opinions :)
 
Well you can definitely go down to G.

As for H, yes, I think that's certainly safe. Your .5 carat diamond is going to be largely covered up on the sides by the prongs. H is very conservative still.

It is important to remember is that color is graded FACE DOWN. Where there is NO light return. Not face up where there is light return and refraction. You wear diamonds set. FACE UP.

Within one color grade, even the labs can't agree on the color grades of stones and something could be a "high" H or a "low" E. So... no. Not really. Within 2 color grades it is hard. Not impossible. But very hard. And it gets harder once set. If you are talking ideal rounds, or any stone with ideal light return and no sharp corners it gets harder still because the ideal light return masks body color.

Generally we say to be conservative stay above H.

If you are talking fancy shapes without ideal light return (because there is no 'ideal' for EC's Radiant, etc) it's a bit different.

This is how I think of it.

Ever gotten one of those HUGE paint fan decks? Where there are literally 100s of colors of whites? And when they are RIGHT next to each other you can TOTALLY tell that one is bluer/colder and one is a bit warmer and which one is one is TOTALLY warmer. One there's one that's slightly greener. One that's slightly pinker? But really. They are all white?

Then you pick one after agonizing over this white or that white and when it's on the walls and people are like: Oh. You painted again. And it's STILL white. Great.

And you're all... BUT it's BLUE white. Or it's a WARM white now. It used to be ____ white. It's TOTALLY different.

It's like that. You are talking about shades of white. D is colder... J is warmer. But it's all white.

YES. If you have an accurately graded F and an H THAT HAVE THE SAME PERFORMANCE you are going to be able to tell them apart when you compare them side by side. Just like you would be able to tell if you painted your walls a warm white, but painted the crown molding a cold/straight white. But both are STILL white, you only see the contrast because of the proximity. But it's very slight, you could set an F center with G sides and never tell the difference. And even H sides depending on the setting and the size of the sidestones... especially with round brilliants.


I want you notice all the qualifiers thought. I'm talking about stones with the SAME performance. An ideal H will out white an F that has compromised light performance from a poor cut.

NOTHING impacts the appearance of a diamond as much as cut. CUT is king.

You want the shinest whitest and brightest diamond out there: Cut is King. No other factor, not color or clarity or anything else impacts how white bright an shiny a stone is.
 
A K, a G and a D

p1070496.jpg
 
Perfect thanks Gypsy and Jimmianne. I really appreciate the effort in writing such a comprehensive reply Gypsy :). As for Jimmianne, you're full of excellent pics :appl:. The whole different shades of white explanation has helped a lot. I definitely agree on not compromising cut, that's why I am looking to drop a bit of colour to compensate :).
 
I am like you, new to buying a diamond for a ring. What I did was set myself a budget and in that budget try to get the best diamond possible! So for me I wanted to get big stone d-f which was triple excellent and that was it. My jeweler said if its triple excellent it is the best stone. But no triple excellent is not enough as I soon found out when I asked people on here what they thought. You need to look at the diamond specs. So I had to go back searching for a diamond with ideal proportions and then found 1 diamond which ticked all the boxes.

here is my story: [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/buying-an-engagement-ring.200923/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/buying-an-engagement-ring.200923/[/URL]

hope that helps

Daz
 
Thanks daz1, I read that thread and it was interesting :). I am however interested in the diamond you ended up with and where you bought it from? Seems you're buying in the UK like me. I'm afraid to import due to paying duty etc and if I have to return I won't get it back lol.
 
I bought an F color diamond recently and it looks great. But when I took it to a local appraiser they were able to show me how it matched up with their "master set" of diamonds that they use to determine color grade. It had diamonds of each grade lined up so I took a look starting with D and didn't see any noticeable difference till about H. So I would say G/H would be the best value. If I had to buy again, I'd probably go with G, but I'm happy with the price I got for my F so will be keeping that one :D
 
Yeah F-H is what I am aiming for now ^^. Nice to hear you got a stone you're happy with.
 
Gypsy|1398112834|3657311 said:
Ever gotten one of those HUGE paint fan decks? Where there are literally 100s of colors of whites? And when they are RIGHT next to each other you can TOTALLY tell that one is bluer/colder and one is a bit warmer and which one is one is TOTALLY warmer. One there's one that's slightly greener. One that's slightly pinker? But really. They are all white?

Then you pick one after agonizing over this white or that white and when it's on the walls and people are like: Oh. You painted again. And it's STILL white. Great.

And you're all... BUT it's BLUE white. Or it's a WARM white now. It used to be ____ white. It's TOTALLY different.

It's like that. You are talking about shades of white. D is colder... J is warmer. But it's all white.

YES. If you have an accurately graded F and an H THAT HAVE THE SAME PERFORMANCE you are going to be able to tell them apart when you compare them side by side. Just like you would be able to tell if you painted your walls a warm white, but painted the crown molding a cold/straight white. But both are STILL white, you only see the contrast because of the proximity. But it's very slight, you could set an F center with G sides and never tell the difference. And even H sides depending on the setting and the size of the sidestones... especially with round brilliants.


I want you notice all the qualifiers thought. I'm talking about stones with the SAME performance. An ideal H will out white an F that has compromised light performance from a poor cut.

NOTHING impacts the appearance of a diamond as much as cut. CUT is king.

You want the shinest whitest and brightest diamond out there: Cut is King. No other factor, not color or clarity or anything else impacts how white bright an shiny a stone is.
Click to expand...

The paint fan deck comparison is the best one yet! Great way to explain diamond "colors" -- thanks Gypsy!
 
I am comfortable with G-H ,but if I have the money then I'd go higher like E-F
 
I'm verry comfortable with my H

_17201.jpg
 
Mrs. Stevens was insecure about her J until I put it next to an F and she noticed no difference in colour. Many images of diamonds you see on websites do everything they can to bring out color in ways that aren't observable to the human eye.
 
I think G is the best value for one wanting a whiter stone since it is at the top of near colorless but just one step below F.
 
G, at lowest for me, H
 
Nice to see so much input on this thread thanks :). Seems F-H is the most popular :). I saw an I recently and couldn't see any yellow in that either or tell the difference from a G (from memory, wasn't side by side).
 
Dancing Fire said:
I am comfortable with G-H ,but if I have the money then I'd go higher like E-F
Click to expand...
+1
I just bought a superbly cut G and am thrilled with it. I started out wanting a D or E. But G was the highest I could afford considering I also wanted size and clarity to be high. I've compared it to E & F at a local jeweler and mine was brighter and whiter than theirs. But if money was no object, I'd be wearing a D IF so big that I'd need a sling to hold my arm up..... :cheeky:
 
It wouldn't matter even if they were side-by-side. Diamonds colors are like those commercials for teeth whitening products saying you can whiten by three shades if you just use their overpriced product. You can tell the difference between the smoker's teeth and the person who brushes three times a day, but the differences between three nearby shades are so fine that only an expert with special techniques can observe them in real life.

The only time I've ever seen any color in Mrs. Stevens's J ring was when we were sitting at Harry Winston looking at some D's. Then the HW salesman cleaned her ring (they do have great service) and it turned out the color was caused by some gunk build-up.
 
Just_Starting|1398290871|3658750 said:
Nice to see so much input on this thread thanks :). Seems F-H is the most popular :). I saw an I recently and couldn't see any yellow in that either or tell the difference from a G (from memory, wasn't side by side).
Click to expand...

I alternate between an AGS Ideal I and an GIA F-stone ring. I see color (top view) in the I, and it is more apparent in certain lightings. It may not be yellow per se but I would not call it white white either. To me, G is always white, F and up are icy white. Despite my preference for whiter stones, I bought an I (for size) knowing that i would see color and am very happy with the decision. So at the end of the day, your priority and preference trump all, as long as you know what each color means to your eyes.

Also, I find that the more you look at diamonds the more your eyes are trained to pick up colors. So what you don't see now, you might see it when you have the diamond in possession for a while.
 
I have H studs, I pendant & K e-ring (gasp!) I'm having a five stone ring made with H-I stones in 1.75 tcw.
If I were in the market for any diamond purchases I would be my starting point. If I couldn't find what I liked in I color I would move up to H. I see zero reason to spend on higher color and would rather max out the size for the money.
 
I have a H diamond in my e-ring and it still looks white to me five years on. I have a good eye for colour (part of my job) and never had any issues. Honestly unless you start comparing side by side or you really want that icy look, I think going to a H is absolutely fine.
 
For a MRB, I would be quite happy with G/H for mounting with white metal, even down to I/J for mounting in yellow or rose gold.

DK :))
 
GeorgeStevens|1398222375|3658320 said:
Mrs. Stevens was insecure about her J until I put it next to an F and she noticed no difference in colour. Many images of diamonds you see on websites do everything they can to bring out color in ways that aren't observable to the human eye.
Click to expand...


Not trying to be rude, but there are many people who can readily see tint in a J or even an I. If you can't, then either your stone has strong blue fluorescence to help it out, or you are only looking directly at it in certain lighting and face-up. The GIA I range is where most people can start to see tints, and I can see the tint in a I color princess from the side from at least a yard away. I wear a J as my everyday ring, and it so clearly has a yellow tint that I had it mounted in yellow gold just to downplay that. I have a large older diamond that is a J or possibly even K, and there is no way to not notice the tint in that stone.

Fancy shapes, deep cuts, step cuts, older RB cuts not optimized for light return, shapes with pointed corners or a pointed end, larger size diamonds: All of those factors will accentuate tint.

If we are talking smaller RBs .5ct and less, I've heard it said that it's difficult to see tint in RBs that are .33ct and under.

Have a look at God Old Gold's tutorials on the 4 Cs, Color section. Jon did a fantastic job of showing the colors, compared to each other and to a D colorless. http://www.goodoldgold.com/images//4csbeyond/color/nearcolorless/DGcompare.jpg D-G
http://www.goodoldgold.com/4Cs/Color/NearColorless/ and work forward and back from there.
 
Just_Starting|1398112565|3657310 said:
Had a lot of people on here suggest I drop colour to boost other aspects of a diamond for the price, I was looking at D-F colour. Considering I'm looking at stones around 0.5 carat I think that means I can get away with more of a drop? I'm only looking at round brilliant cuts, will be in a 6 prong platinum mount. How noticeable would a drop from D-H be at this weight/mount etc? What colour do you think is the best trade-off at this weight?

Thanks for any input I look forward to reading your opinions :)
Click to expand...

I'd say H or I. G-H would probably be safe for most people who want a colorless look.
 
Some people must have better peepers than I. Just like the nose of people who can detect honeysuckle, cigar box, and pipi de chat in a wine. (half kidding)

The J that I was comparing does have medium fluor and that seems to help its color. Also I was looking face-up rather than along the side, which is the only way anyone ever sees it. The GOG comparisons are interesting, but I find that photos on websites in general tend to show more color than there actually is - this is true for both fancies and D-J stones. And when I see diamonds in a showcase such as at a Christie's preview, I can tell the M's from the E's without being told, but not often the stones separated by just 3 or 4 color shades. I'm sure the experts are better at this than I.
 
Picking two different colour diamonds on James Allen's site seems a good way to compare, spinning the diamonds around is a nice test. Of course it's against a white background which makes the difference even more apparent (I won't be buying from here just making use of their site :lol:). I am considering F-I range, looking at an I at the moment, AGS ideal cut h&a - the increase in weight seems worth it to me. 0.5 F to 0.7 I with everything else being quite similar is only a $400 increase - this seems very good to me.
 
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