How many have done a Pre-Nuptial Agreement; and why

[perry]

I live in a community property state (there are 8 or 9 of those in the US); and am working on a Pre-nup with Princess Z to try to minimize the possible damage that could be done to the other if things turned sour in the future due to the community property laws here in Wisconsin. Note I believe in the various Murphy’ laws. If we prepare in advance we are unlikely to ever need the provisions and legal protections. But, if we don't prepare....

Just thought I'd ask if anyone else has done a Pre-nup and why if you are willing to share.

Have a great day,

Perry

 

[tyty333]

How is the Princess taking it? A lot of women dont agree with the notion but I have no problem with them
especially when one person comes to the marriage with a lot more than the other person has. Of course I think that
anything that comes in after the wedding (via work not inheritance) belongs to both. If something is inherited then
I feel like it belongs to the person that inherited it. If they want to share it with the other person, thats great.
As you can see I have a lot of conditions on whats right/wrong. Like I said, I dont have a problem with them but I dont
think most women agree with me.

 

[Trekkie]

Every marriage ends. Some end due to death, some end due to divorce... But eventually, every marriage ends. IMHO it would be foolish not to make provision for this right from the beginning.

 

[rubybeth]

DH and I did not do a pre-nup, though we joked about it during pre-marital counseling (required by our church) and our deacon informed us that it would invalidate our marriage (!), so we had to clarify that we were really only joking.

Anyway, I think one thing I *would* have wanted to protect my spouse from (and be protected from) would be any debt that we incurred before marriage. I feel kind of guilty about my student loan debt (which wouldn't transfer to him in any case since it would never be in his name due to federal rules), but if I'd had any other debt, I wouldn't feel right about him having to assume it via marriage and then possibly have responsibility for it upon divorce.

 

[kenny]

Prenups seem so unromantic.
I realize they are realistic since divorce is common now but going into a marriage aren't you supposed to be all googoo-eyed, positive, committed to the lifelong partnership, and trusting?

Prenups strike me as feeding into (and perhaps contributing to) the temporariness of marriage.
Things get tough? I'm otta here.

Also, don't some churches forbid prenups?

 

[Imdanny]

The idea of pre-nuptial agreements for ordinary people makes me want to throw up a little bit in my mouth to be honest. Sorry.

 

[amc80]

The idea of pre-nuptial agreements for ordinary people makes me want to throw up a little bit in my mouth to be honest. Sorry.

Agreed. DH and I didn't even discuss it. It's hard get in the mindset of a marriage being forever when you're planning for its demise before it has even started.

 

[Skippy123]

I think it is smart to do one personally to be safe.

We never done one but I do think some people should do them.

 

[TC1987]

Female. Childless. Married at age 36 for the first time. Had a prenup, at my insistence, because my life was uncomplicated and my finances secure, and my husband-to-be came with "preexisting conditions" that I refused to accept any financial responsibility for, or worse yet, have a court tap my resources for.

If you are both young and starting out with nothing, or with equal nothing-but-debt, and earn roughly equal incomes, then why bother with a pre-nup. But the more mature and established the individuals are, or the more un-equal their financial situations are, the greater the need for a pre-nup, I believe. I am female, and my ex came with a heap of baggage, a heap of college loan debt 17 years after he'd graduated, a heap of credit card debt, and he continued to run up more credit card debt (in his name) for the 9 years we were married. He had racked up close to $37,000 in credit card debt, owed $12,000 on his truck, and had a $38,000 / year gross income when we divorced. Because of the pre-nup and the fact that we'd kept separate finances throughout the marriage except for joint expenses that were paid out of our sole joint bank account, his debts and baggage remained completely his when the marriage dissolved.

It's all well and good to marry for love, but that usually works out much better for very young people who start with nothing and build a life and a financial portfolio together. Ex-spouses, children from previous relationships or marriages, financially dependent parent(s) and/or adult children, etc., all of these realities have to be dealt with, later in life.

 

[Haven]

We didn't do a pre-nup, but then again neither of us came to this marriage with all that much to lose.

I think I would have been opposed to the idea, had DH brought it up during or before our engagement. I can't be certain, because he didn't, but I think it would have made me think twice about whether we were both entering into this marriage with the same mindset.

It wasn't a good idea for us, but I think they're a good idea for people who are entering a marriage where a) one partner has amassed a large fortune and the other hasn't, and b) they haven't been dating for, say, at least three years prior to the engagement. Or, of course, if the partner with the large fortune is an historically terrible judge of character.

 

[Jennifer W]

Prenups seem so unromantic.
I realize they are realistic since divorce is common now but going into a marriage aren't you supposed to be all googoo-eyed, positive, committed to the lifelong partnership, and trusting?

Prenups strike me as feeding into (and perhaps contributing to) the temporariness of marriage.
Things get tough? I'm otta here.

Also, don't some churches forbid prenups?

Some countries do. It's not legally competent in several jurisdictions, as people may not contract their way out of statutory law in these places (Scotland being one of them, but there are many others).

So no, we don't have one. If we could have, I don't think we would have done it, either. Mostly because we had roughly equal assets when we got married, and similar earning power going forward. There wasn't really anything to protect, in our case.

 

[Imdanny]

people may not contract their way out of statutory law

Here either and if you try your contract will be eviscerated by a court. I don't know of any area of law in which this isn't true.

 

[Jennifer W]

Ah, but there's always someone who will have a go anyway...that's what keeps lawyers in work.

Some statutes here do make provisions to come into force when there is no agreement to the contrary. Then, you can choose your own terms. Not marriage or civil partnership, though.

 

[Imdanny]

I've had the option of getting "married" (civil union)... now please try to imagine this... for 2 months and 18 days out of anywhere I've lived in my lifetime.

Ok, so I looked at all this. Complicated!

My income would become his, his would become mine, my debts would become his, his would become mine?

There are some things about this marriage business I don't think I would like!

 

[Skippy123]

I found this thread and it was 4 pages long on Pre-nups

[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/pre-nups-and-financial-stuff.137835/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/pre-nups-and-financial-stuff.137835/[/URL]

 

[MichelleCarmen]

I can only imagine a pre-nup if one of the individuals has a lot of money, like hundreds of thousands or millions in savings/equity. If you're financially set like that, then get one if you feel it's in your best interest. If we're talking about just a little bit of money, sounds like unnessary drama...and your future wife will be working once she is married, right? Rather than focus on protecting what is "yours," why not make sure she has a solid foundation of her own to stand on in the case that life doesn't work out as planned!

 

[Imdanny]

Hear, hear!

 

[Enerchi]

Married in 1985, so prenups weren't that common way back when. I believe you should protect what is yours before marriage and if that is significant (you built a business, you won a lottery, you are a rich prince .. you know... the usual...) get one, but from the day you are married, joint property would then be divided equally if your marriage dissolved (not a lawyer, but that's what I would understand to be the process). If you are both coming in on fairly equal footing, I think you could be stirring up trouble where there may not be any...???

If one person inherits a significant amount of money, I am pretty sure you can have a notarized document that makes that amount untouchable if the marriage ends. Again - not a lawyer.

If I were to remarry now, I have 'stuff' and things I would want to go to my children, so at this point in my life, I would want a prenup. But not planning on a second marriage anytime soon...

 

[sba771]

I have one. When it was first brought up to me I was disgusted and extremely emotional. Once I calmed down and retained my own lawyer, I took romance out and looked at our situation rationally. We only have one that deals with our assets prior to marriage and our dog. I am beyond protected in mine. It really worked out to benefit and safeguard my future and I am very comfortable with it.

 

[Lulie]

Yes, they can be unromantic but it's nice to put in writing the way that people who are planning a 'life' together SHOULD behave when in reality, often don't. I married a divorced man with a child many years ago, I'm telling ya' sometimes people you'd least expect to be spiteful treat people [and kids] hideously when they are mad.
I wanted children and early retirement so a simple pre-nup was in order. It took him over a year to pay off his ex-wife's debt, so he had no choice
This should be private as many still think prenups are for rich people only
What aobut your credit? Want to keep your favorite piece of jewelry in the family?
I view prenups as marital insurance, not planning for an inevitable failure, it's having a plain in case of failure.

 

[Dancing Fire]

I can only imagine a pre-nup if one of the individuals has a lot of money, like hundreds of thousands or millions in savings/equity. If you're financially set like that, then get one if you feel it's in your best interest. If we're talking about just a little bit of money, sounds like unnessary drama...and your future wife will be working once she is married, right? Rather than focus on protecting what is "yours," why not make sure she has a solid foundation of her own to stand on in the case that life doesn't work out as planned!

it doesn't matter,because she'll still take you to the cleaners... so yes on the Pre-Nup

 

[Dancing Fire]

I think it is smart to do one personally to be safe.

We never done one but I do think some people should do them.

i wouldn't mind signing a pre-nup if my FI was loaded with cuz i wanna let her know that i'm not marrying her for money.

 

[Laila619]

I think they make sense if it's a second marriage with kids involved, but for a first marriage with no significant assets, I don't generally see the need.

 

[Mayk]

We did one...second marriage for us both...

He is a partner in a business.. And I came with a retirement plan after 25 years with the same company... We both have kids that need to go to college. We were in complete agreement. It went very smoothly.

 

[Kaleigh]

That wasn't even thought of when we married, 25 years ago. And we went into it equally , we both had some money not a lot, but some. After building a business and buying real Estate, and family trusts and such. I would hope that my kids would. It just makes sense.

I am seeing many friends divorcing after many years.... It's heart breaking.

 

[Amys Bling]

The idea of pre-nuptial agreements for ordinary people makes me want to throw up a little bit in my mouth to be honest. Sorry.

Agreed. DH and I didn't even discuss it. It's hard get in the mindset of a marriage being forever when you're planning for its demise before it has even started.

agreed. We didn't do one.

 

[Amys Bling]

I think they make sense if it's a second marriage with kids involved, but for a first marriage with no significant assets, I don't generally see the need.

agreed.

 

[perry]

Thanks all: Here are some responses to help clear things up.

How is the Princess taking it? A lot of women dont agree with the notion but I have no problem with them especially when one person comes to the marriage with a lot more than the other person has. Of course I think that
anything that comes in after the wedding (via work not inheritance) belongs to both. If something is inherited then
I feel like it belongs to the person that inherited it. If they want to share it with the other person, thats great.
As you can see I have a lot of conditions on whats right/wrong. Like I said, I dont have a problem with them but I dont
think most women agree with me.

Princess Z's background is business. She understood when I brought up the subject months ago and told me that she assumed I would be looking into one (and this was before she needed to decide if she wanted to marry me). She does have some concerns; but this is being set up to protect both of us and we have discussed the pros and cons of each part from each side - and she has her own lawyer too.

by kenny » 18 Mar 2012 19:26
Prenups seem so unromantic.
I realize they are realistic since divorce is common now but going into a marriage aren't you supposed to be all googoo-eyed, positive, committed to the lifelong partnership, and trusting?

Prenups strike me as feeding into (and perhaps contributing to) the temporariness of marriage.
Things get tough? I'm otta here.

Actually, the biggest reason to get a prenup is to protect things so that we can cover for each other during marriage if something bad goes wrong with the other. In this we are setting things up to protect the marriage. Due to the community property laws in Wisconsin people are now getting divorced just to prevent their "family" from having to absorb responsibility for very large medical bills if they are diagnosed with long term illnesses that will eat up hundreds of thousands of dollars in the future (and health insurance is not what it used to be). Of course, it wrecks the family in other ways - and at a time when one of them needs emotional support as well due to the illness (I have a friend who went through this).

Quite honestly - if it was not for this particular legal quirk I am not sure if we would have done a prenup at all (and if we did it would have been much simpler).

by MC » 18 Mar 2012 22:28
I can only imagine a pre-nup if one of the individuals has a lot of money, like hundreds of thousands or millions in savings/equity. If you're financially set like that, then get one if you feel it's in your best interest. If we're talking about just a little bit of money, sounds like unnessary drama...and your future wife will be working once she is married, right? Rather than focus on protecting what is "yours," why not make sure she has a solid foundation of her own to stand on in the case that life doesn't work out as planned!

Actually, the basis of this pre-nup from day one was to be fair to both sides and to set her up for a more solid future (it is not and never was intended to be one sided). While it is true that initialy she is at a disadvantage, she would be at the same disadvantage without a pre-nup as no court is going to award her any kind of my resources or maintenance for only a short term marriage.

I do expect Princess Z to be earning very good money in a few years as well - and potentially more than I make (and I make very good wages).

----

Have a great day,

Perry

 

[monarch64]

Perry, I just wanted to offer my support in saying that I think you are doing the right thing by doing a pre-nuptial agreement. Best wishes to you and Princess Z.

 

[Amys Bling]

Best of luck perry!

What is the right thing for some- isn't for others. Do what's best for you and your princess