Find your diamond
Find your jewelry
shape
carat
color
clarity

Help?!? Paraiba Tourmaline ring.. 5.7k worth it?

ShulinaOY

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 13, 2015
Messages
54
Inclusions are expected. It's hard to say what will happen if you wear it all day every day. I've worn a small stone like this every day for 5 years. I dont clean at all really. But I wear it to the gym all the time and sometimes come out of the class realizing I was pretty cavalier about whacking it into stuff. I louped it the other day and there's no sign of damage.

I think you'll have to be a lot more careful with yours as its bigger and sitting higher up off your finger. Unfortunately as it is a chippy material it's kind of one of those things where you could be fine for years and then one day whack it on something and realize its suddenly damaged.

I would actually anticipate you'll wear this for a while then realize you want another stone to alternate with it (sort of like some people do with shoes they're feeling protective of).
Yes we have been looking arnd and the price seems alright. Though indeed most likely the stone isn't going to disappear any time soon. However, the price of this ring seems to keep climbing since they started selling it last year and we found older posted prices of this ring.

As for alternating... YES! I will! hahah I do have my diamond engagement ring which I have worn daily for the last 4 years and well... I do exercise and bang it up around alot. So this ring is more for days when I know I wouldnt be doing much vigorous stuff. I already know I am most likely going to "baby" this ring alot... it cost double my engagement ring!!!

Thanks so much for the advice! I'll pop by asiatique later!
 

qubitasaurus

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
Dec 18, 2014
Messages
1,227
Mmm if you havent read the new to coloured gemstones threads now is also a good time to do that. There are some good posts there and you'll get a better feeling for the materials such as highly included tourmaline.

The following came about from the following thread by Roger Dery with regards to what types of stones are best suited for rings.
[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/lowest-mohs-hardness-for-rings-other-decisive-factors.176872/#post-3220969#p3220969']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/lowest-mohs-hardness-for-rings-other-decisive-factors.176872/#post-3220969#p3220969[/URL]

Mohs 9 - Ruby and Sapphire: generally considered the most durable of the colored gems. If untreated in any way, will hold up very well in most all situations. Even those subjected to 'high-heat-only' still do very well. Example: my wife's 2ct oval Sapphire engagement ring was worn daily for 15 years before needing a very minor tune-up. Exception: Ruby that has been filled with substances such as glass have a much lower resistance to damage such as abrasion from wear. Ruby, under high-heat-only with flux present, will also handle wear well.

Mohs 8-1/2 - Chrysoberyl including Alexandrite: in my experience Chrysoberyl holds up very well against wear. It does not exhibit severe brittleness seen in other gems - and would be a great stone for regular wear as a ring stone.

Mohs 8 - Spinel: is generally considered a gem that wears well. It is resistant to damage and not just damage from abrasion.

Mohs 8 - Topaz: can be worn in rings, but some caution should be exhibited. This is especially true with Topaz colored blue because it has been irradiated [and then subsequently heated]. This process has weakened the stone in some way that it does not hold up as well as Precious Topaz - which may, or may not have been treated at all.

Mohs 7-1/2-8 - the Beryl family including Aquamarine, Heliodore (golden Beryl), Morganite, Goshenite wear fairly well and unless totally exposed from the metal, can be worn in rings though may not be suitable for 'everyday wear'. The heating of any of the Beryl's is done at a low temperature and it is not a factor regarding their durability. Beryl's do have an element of brittleness though not as severe as some other gems.

Mohs 7-1/2-8 - Emerald (of the Beryl family) is not well suited for everyday wear. A totally clean Emerald will hold up as well as an Aquamarine. But, finding an Emerald with that level of clarity is extremely rare. Roughly 99% of all Emeralds have been treated with a filler of some type to (usually) improve their clarity. The filler is likely to not hold up well over time. *Emerald's that have been treated should not be placed into an Ultrasonic cleaner, nor placed under a steam cleaner as this may affect the clarity enhancement substance. **Caveat: Emerald's treated with a specialized process known as "Excell" in the trade are known to have a higher level of durability over those treated with other methods.

Mohs 7-1/2 - Andalusite has reasonable wearability though it does have a slight brittleness. Facet junctions are likely to show wear after only a few years regular wear. Distinct cleavage is present in Andalusite though I have yet to see the affects of it.

Mohs 7-1/2 - Iolite in my experience holds up fairly well for hardness 7-1/2. It does, however, have distinct cleavage and a sharp blow in one or more specific directions may cause it to separate into more than one piece. Though, when I have tried to do this in the rough, I have not been successful.

Mohs 7-7-1/2 - The Garnet group is generally thought of as reasonably durable. Facet junctions will show wear within the first few years of being worn. And, the facet junctions may not chip as much as 'crumble' for lack of a better way to describe this. Of the Garnets, the Andradite/Demantoid type is the least durable, and we have found the Pyrope/Almandine/Spessartite group seem to wear slightly better.

Mohs 7-7-1/2 - The Tourmaline group is suitable for rings, though not for everyday wear especially if the top of the stone is exposed. Tourmaline can be brittle, does not hold up well where temperature changes are radical. They are known to 'chippy' as can be seen along facet junctions that are exposed.

Mohs 6-1/2 to 7-1/2 - Zircon is often thought of as brittle. Zircons heated to high temperatures (over 1,000*C) to convert them to blue are definitely more brittle and show the effects of wear easily. Blue Zircon worn high on a mounting will need refurbishing regularly. Unheated Zircons and those subjected to much lower temperatures (of various colors) are less prone to show wear - and appear less brittle. There is no known dilemma with faceting or polishing Zircon for the experienced lapidary. There is, however, a known direction to its hardness which could create difficulty for some.

Mohs 7 - The Quartz family is well known due to being available and popular. Its wear pattern is predictable. Facet junctions (even when faceting) can be 'chippy'. Chipping along the crown facets is common, and abrasions from wear are as well.

*as a general rule, at least from me, I don't suggest wearing hardness less than 7 on a regular basis as the wear will become evident well before you expect it. I do suggest moving this type of gemstone into mountings offering great protection or off the fingers or wrist.

Mohs 6-1/2 to 7 - Kunzite is not a durable gemstone. It is brittle, does not resist scratching well, does not repair easily, and has perfect cleavage in two directions. In addition to all that, it has the unfortunate problem of being light sensitive - reducing its depth of color with prolonged exposure to direct sunlight. I have repaired my fair share of Kunzite's and I don't relish the fact that they show up waiting for my handy work. But since they don't wear well over time, they will all eventually need reconditioning.

Mohs 6-1/2 to 7 - Peridot does not share the fate of Kunzite, though its wear pattern is predictable. Abrasions are readily seen on exposed gems that are frequently worn - and fortunately, a refurbishing is not usually problematic.

Mohs 6-1/2 to 7 - Tanzanite is very popular and goldsmiths have taken to mounting them in lavish and risky ways. Exposed surfaces will show wear in a relatively short time and the perfect cleavage can be a problem. Tanzanite is also heat sensitive - even though it is well known to have been heated to acquire the beautiful blue to purple hues. It is the shock of rapid temperature change that may cause damage. This is not a common situation with consumers as this is more likely to take placec in the creation or repair to a mounting.

Mohs lower than 6-1/2 - Apatite, Opal, Orthoclase/Sunstone, Scapolite, Sphene and Sphalerite and other low hardness gems all need special care to be worn in rings. It is generally accepted that these gems are best suited for pendants, pins, brooches or earrings.
As long as you know what you're dealing with no problems.

It's common for some jewellers and dealers to rise their prices on existing inventory which has not sold, with time. I usually elect not to deal with them once I see this. It doesnt neccessarily correlate with increased demand and having something in inventory for a long time doesnt mean that they had a voracious market for it in the first place (it tends to mean they had it over priced or it wasnt something their usual consumer base typically went for). But if you love it and are happy with the price I wouldn't deliberately boycott someone for doing this -- especially as they seem to have many similar stones so it could have been a different ring.
 

DauphineMucha

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Oct 13, 2010
Messages
363
Does the pendant offer by asiatique look more greenish than those your considering? Maybe the black background making it less blue?
 

qubitasaurus

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
Dec 18, 2014
Messages
1,227
Does the pendant offer by asiatique look more greenish than those your considering? Maybe the black background making it less blue?
You'd have to go see it, his indoor lighting is yellowish to my eyes (hence why blue stones often look much better in real life than they do in his store lighting photos). I think it might be accademic as the pendant is probably gone. At an educated guess based on my memory of the pendant it was probably slightly greener and price per ct was much lower. Pretty in real life. I didn't look too carefully though and wasn't personally interested in buying it (so my memory may be hazy).
 

voce

Ideal_Rock
Joined
May 13, 2018
Messages
3,976
Untreated really is better than heated.
With all due respect, when it comes to tourmalines (including paraiba tourmalines) even independent labs cannot detect the difference between heat and no heat. It is known that many paraiba tourmalines are heat treated to get a blue color. So since untreated cannot be verified by lab, I wouldn't put stock in the claim a paraiba tourmaline is untreated vs heat only. I would avoid oiled paraibas.

Definitely do not pay a premium for an untreated paraiba because no lab can verify whether there was indeed heat treatment.
 

qubitasaurus

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
Dec 18, 2014
Messages
1,227
With all due respect, when it comes to tourmalines (including paraiba tourmalines) even independent labs cannot detect the difference between heat and no heat. It is known that many paraiba tourmalines are heat treated to get a blue color. So since untreated cannot be verified by lab, I wouldn't put stock in the claim a paraiba tourmaline is untreated vs heat only. I would avoid oiled paraibas.

Definitely do not pay a premium for an untreated paraiba because no lab can verify whether there was indeed heat treatment.
Yes you are right. I had forgotten they couldn't reliably detect heat treatment in tourmaline. By the time things reach Singapore they've usually passed through a few hands (then I strongly suspect some nontrivial portion of pieces get passed around Singapore some more before they sell). So honestly there is no reason to believe the entire supply chain is 100% reliably transferring information about a non-detectable treatment and voce is right -- it is probably not worth splitting hairs over heated vs unheated.
 

icy_jade

Ideal_Rock
Joined
May 1, 2009
Messages
3,309
Apparantly it seems we only get the cert if we purchase. Then they will send it to the lab. Also the paraiba tourmaline is from mozambique
I never buy without cert. I will be willing to put a deposit for them to send to certify at Nanyang but no cert means no sale.

Price seems on the high side to me.
 

LD

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jun 29, 2008
Messages
9,682
So you are forced to pay full price even if the cert comes back that it's not what th vendor says it is? That would be a massive red flag for me. Mozambique copper bearing tourmaline is much cheaper than authentic Brazilian paraiba, but also less bright and neon. I would insist on a cert before giving them money.
I've been collecting Paraiba Tourmaline for around 20 years and I have to be honest and say that some Mozambique PT is as good as (and in some cases) better than Brazilian PT. There are good and bad from both locations. For me, having one from that locale would not be a deal breaker. If the gem speaks to you, and you feel the price is good then go for it.
 

lovedogs

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jul 31, 2014
Messages
11,379
I've been collecting Paraiba Tourmaline for around 20 years and I have to be honest and say that some Mozambique PT is as good as (and in some cases) better than Brazilian PT. There are good and bad from both locations. For me, having one from that locale would not be a deal breaker. If the gem speaks to you, and you feel the price is good then go for it.
I dont disagree, but I just wanted OP to know that in general the African material is more affordable than Brazilian
 

Rad_Fan

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Sep 1, 2018
Messages
2,477
I've been collecting Paraiba Tourmaline for around 20 years and I have to be honest and say that some Mozambique PT is as good as (and in some cases) better than Brazilian PT. There are good and bad from both locations. For me, having one from that locale would not be a deal breaker. If the gem speaks to you, and you feel the price is good then go for it.
OP, I am very sorry to hijack your thread....

@LD have you set your marquise cab Paraiba yet? Love to see it if you don't mind sharing.
 

LD

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jun 29, 2008
Messages
9,682
I dont disagree, but I just wanted OP to know that in general the African material is more affordable than Brazilian
I don't disagree but I'd rather pay less for a fantastic PT from Mozambique than a middle of the road one from Brazil! It's good to have options because at the end of the day it's colour and neonicity that will dictate the price.
 

icy_jade

Ideal_Rock
Joined
May 1, 2009
Messages
3,309
Anyway just to clarify, both Qubitsaurus and I are in Singapore.

If you really love the ring and want it regardless (it happens, I’ve been there), there is always the smalls claims tribunal if things go wrong but you have to make sure the receipt states very clearly what item you got. So nothing generic like a ruby ring. It has to be unheated, untreated natural ruby from Myanmar in 18k white gold setting with 1 ct natural diamond setting, etc. Full description. Otherwise the shop can wriggle away. Even natural ruby can end up being a treated natural ruby so need to be careful to state treatment. I hate going through the trouble so for me it’s always been cert or nothing, unless I’m buying at a jewelry/gem show.

And Nanyang is trusted. Have heard can be stricter than more well known labs esp where color descriptions is concerned.

 

qubitasaurus

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
Dec 18, 2014
Messages
1,227
Anyway just to clarify, both Qubitsaurus and I are in Singapore.

If you really love the ring and want it regardless (it happens, I’ve been there), there is always the smalls claims tribunal if things go wrong but you have to make sure the receipt states very clearly what item you got. So nothing generic like a ruby ring. It has to be unheated, untreated natural ruby from Myanmar in 18k white gold setting with 1 ct natural diamond setting, etc. Full description. Otherwise the shop can wriggle away. Even natural ruby can end up being a treated natural ruby so need to be careful to state treatment. I hate going through the trouble so for me it’s always been cert or nothing, unless I’m buying at a jewelry/gem show.

And Nanyang is trusted. Have heard can be stricter than more well known labs esp where color descriptions is concerned.

Icy is definitely right.

But definitely order of operations should be (a) you agree to purchase (b) you pay for lab report (c) vendor sends to lab (d) stone comes back certified exactly as promised (e) you pay full total. This is singapore -- they only have to drop the stone off just down the road at far east. Something which shouldnt be too hard for a 8 k SGD agreed upon sale. These jewellers are also repeat customers for nanyang so they will have this part down pat (many will only go through the process once a buyer is found though).

I think it's a lovely looking stone from the photos. But it's not a bargain per se, so if you suspect they're randomly rising their price on it (from time to time). And they dont want to offer the service of at least a local lab report as the first step in the purchase process then I am a bit worried their customer service might not be up to snuff if you need help down the line (like retightening the prongs on the setting or something).

Did you have a chat to some of the other jewellers like asiatique?
 
Last edited:

YC

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Aug 21, 2013
Messages
539
Hi. I am in SG as well and I agree with what @icy_jade and @qubitasaurus suggested. I would strongly advise getting the stone certed by Nanyang BEFORE paying for the ring. It would ring alarm bells for me if they insist on completing the ring purchase before certification is done, particularly if you are a first time customer.

The ring is pretty but as Icy and Qubitasaurus said, not a bargain.
 

ShulinaOY

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 13, 2015
Messages
54
@icy_jade @qubitasaurus @YC thanks so much for all the responses! What I’m really peeved about the shop now is that apparently they quoted the price without GST!!!! I mean by our SG law they must at least state + or excl GST or something right?
Anyway hubs and I are going on Friday to look at it again -.-. We went to quite a few shops to look for paraiba and nothing came close or was seriously very very expensive.
I’ll try to check out asiatique.
Any chance anyone has bought from online - starlanka.com?
 

qubitasaurus

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
Dec 18, 2014
Messages
1,227
@icy_jade @qubitasaurus @YC thanks so much for all the responses! What I’m really peeved about the shop now is that apparently they quoted the price without GST!!!! I mean by our SG law they must at least state + or excl GST or something right?
Anyway hubs and I are going on Friday to look at it again -.-. We went to quite a few shops to look for paraiba and nothing came close or was seriously very very expensive.
I’ll try to check out asiatique.
Any chance anyone has bought from online - starlanka.com?
No sorry never heard of the online vendor before. I am sorry to hear they seem to be a bit unconventional all round, but if you take a long term view of it something else always turns up with gemstones (if you look long enough there will generally be another you also love). I am beginning to get the feeling I wouldn't deal with your jeweler unless they really had something 'I absolutely had to have' (they seem like a lot of trouble to deal with. There's also quite a few really lovely jewellers arround in SG). Icy and YC both have beautiful paraibas maybe theyll have some advice.
 

Rad_Fan

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Sep 1, 2018
Messages
2,477
Haha I found a video of our gem.
Wow...so pretty and clean! Are you into halo/3-stone/bezel/solitaire?

Do you mind me asking the approx. price for this oval? It's the biggest one too.
 

ShulinaOY

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 13, 2015
Messages
54
Wow...so pretty and clean! Are you into halo/3-stone/bezel/solitaire?

Do you mind me asking the approx. price for this oval? It's the biggest one too.
My husband is a no go on halo and bezel I think! We want something special and unique that would make the stone pop! So definitely white gold, white diamonds. No colours to distract from the stone!

I hope we got it at a reasonable price... it felt reasonable for the colour and clarity! It was about 3.1k USD.
 

DauphineMucha

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Oct 13, 2010
Messages
363
My husband is a no go on halo and bezel I think! We want something special and unique that would make the stone pop! So definitely white gold, white diamonds. No colours to distract from the stone!

I hope we got it at a reasonable price... it felt reasonable for the colour and clarity! It was about 3.1k USD.

3.1k only :shock: and it’s the cleanest and biggest of them all!

How about blacken gold...?
 

YC

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Aug 21, 2013
Messages
539
Thank you everyone! We ended up getting this lovely 2.29ct oval loose stone! Next step is to figure out how to set it! :)
Any suggestions?

E78A47E1-7DA0-4C8C-A55E-B32E00584226.jpeg 05F1B254-54C7-4146-AA9F-B5EE6ABA0800.jpeg 36C6CFAC-A15B-4067-960F-50F4D49BA093.jpeg 7F1D1A4A-B116-4420-A4B5-302145263C65.jpeg
@ShulinaOY, your stone looks clean for a Paraiba! How does it look in different lighting eg in natural light?
Out of curiosity, is this stone from the "5.7k + GST;-)" ring shop or another shop? Anyway, giving a quote without GST ( and hiding the fact until you were close to buying) is a disgusting tactic to lure customers ( with apparently lower price) and up their profits even further, should the customer relent:angryfire::angryfire:
 

ShulinaOY

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 13, 2015
Messages
54
@ShulinaOY, your stone looks clean for a Paraiba! How does it look in different lighting eg in natural light?
Out of curiosity, is this stone from the "5.7k + GST;-)" ring shop or another shop? Anyway, giving a quote without GST ( and hiding the fact until you were close to buying) is a disgusting tactic to lure customers ( with apparently lower price) and up their profits even further, should the customer relent:angryfire::angryfire:
We didn’t take it out of the shop to look at it but under just plain white lighting it looks great! Clarity of this stone is really nice!
unfortunately, yes... this stone is from there -.-zzzz! And I really don’t like it. I hate it even more than when I told them, they completely ignored my comment. I wish they had just said something like “sorry for the misunderstanding, we will review this matter”. I felt that’s the least they could do. However, after looking at so many stones, this was really the best price we could find for a reasonable blue, size and it’s clarity.
I did go to asiatique btw! Nice owner! Cheerful and friendly guy! hes decided to take apart his paraiba tourmaline necklace and redesign into 2 rings. They aren’t here yet but I’ll probably go see when they come. It’s huge though his paraiba tourmaline.... one of it being arnd 4.9ct.
 

YC

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Aug 21, 2013
Messages
539
We didn’t take it out of the shop to look at it but under just plain white lighting it looks great! Clarity of this stone is really nice!
unfortunately, yes... this stone is from there -.-zzzz! And I really don’t like it. I hate it even more than when I told them, they completely ignored my comment. I wish they had just said something like “sorry for the misunderstanding, we will review this matter”. I felt that’s the least they could do. However, after looking at so many stones, this was really the best price we could find for a reasonable blue, size and it’s clarity.
I did go to asiatique btw! Nice owner! Cheerful and friendly guy! hes decided to take apart his paraiba tourmaline necklace and redesign into 2 rings. They aren’t here yet but I’ll probably go see when they come. It’s huge though his paraiba tourmaline.... one of it being arnd 4.9ct.

I have seen the Asiatique Paraiba pendant previously. The stones were elongated drop shaped. Maybe rings sell better than pendants?

After you set your stone, do return and post photos!!
 

ShulinaOY

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 13, 2015
Messages
54
so the design has come back... what do your think? Does it look strange?
does it look ok? We love cats so we are hiding a secret kitty at the side. Haha! I’m wondering if I should go for a rose gold kitty while the rest is white gold.
B019957C-DE0B-4B6D-8D0B-571DD2297332.jpeg
 

voce

Ideal_Rock
Joined
May 13, 2018
Messages
3,976
so the design has come back... what do your think? Does it look strange?
does it look ok? We love cats so we are hiding a secret kitty at the side. Haha! I’m wondering if I should go for a rose gold kitty while the rest is white gold.
B019957C-DE0B-4B6D-8D0B-571DD2297332.jpeg
I think this looks like it could go all wobbly on you because it lacks good structural support to prevent it from moving like a door hinge. The only connections I see from the side and front views are solder-like wire connections, all along one side of the paraiba basket. A sound structure would have the center stone CENTERED more or less on the same axis as the ring's center of gravity. I guess you like a delicate look, but the ring as it's designed right now looks like it might snap with an impact like a knock or fall.
 

YC

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Aug 21, 2013
Messages
539
My main concern is same as what @voce voiced- about the ring rotating on its short axis when you wear it. Are you planning to wear it with your wedding band, hence placing the bulk of the stone on one side?
 
Be a part of the community It's free, join today!
    What is White Gold?
    What is White Gold?
    Push Present: Engagement Ring Upgrade
    Push Present: Engagement Ring Upgrade
    20th Anniversary Upgrade
    20th Anniversary Upgrade

Need Something Special?

Get a quote from multiple trusted and vetted jewelers.

Holloway Cut Advisor



Diamond Eye Candy

Click to view full-size image.
Top