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HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond?????

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nicimarie

Rough_Rock
Joined
Dec 9, 2010
Messages
9
My husband and I just purchased my diamond wedding ring and I am concerned I might have got shafted with my diamond. From what I have read online I think I might be experiencing the fish eye effect but I am having a hard time telling since there isn't a tremendous amount of information available online regarding the fish eye in diamonds. When I look at the diamond from the top there is a tiny black hole directly in the center of the diamond about the size of the tip of a pen - like someone pricked a hole at the bottom of my diamond. If I begin to move my finger at all and barely angle the ring (and I mean barely) I start to see a black "hole-like" area in my diamond and the more I angle my diamond the bigger the black area/hole gets. If I keep angling the diamond I loose about a 1/4 of my diamond to this black "hole".

My husband and I don't remember seeing this when we picked out the diamond. We looked at it under the microscope, under UV light, under sun light and set it on top of the ring prongs. Once I got the ring back from the jewelers (they set the stone) I noticed this black area immediately. Because I noticed it after the stone was set I thought it might have something to do with the way it was set. I went back to the jewelers yesterday to ask about why this is happening and I think I got fed a load of crud. Their "diamond expert" says that it is normal for a lot of rings and that by me my moving my finger at a slight angle I am preventing light from reaching that area of the ring. She then went on to tell me that it is actually a sign of a good diamond because it is colorless and a VS2 so I am able to all the way through into the bottom of the diamond and that there are no inclusions that are blocking the ring giving a false sense of clarity. She said that this happens in all "good" diamonds but I don't think I believe her. I asked her if I looked at other diamonds of equal or better quality would they do the same and she said yes there is no way to avoid it. Why invest a quite a few grand in a diamond if every time I look down at my diamond all I see is what I am now calling an eye sore. Can anyone help or give me some guidance?? Is this normal for all diamonds or do I need to return it and find a new one? I am trying to get a picture of it by my camera just doesn't want to focus on the ring.

Here are the specs that I do know:

Shape/Cut: Round Brilliant Cut
Measurement: 5.64-5.68 x 3.49 MM
Weight: 0.70 CT
Color: Colorless (E)
Clarity: VS2
Polish/Symmetry: good/good
Treatment: none

I.G.I. Certified

I don't know the depth or table or crown angle or pavil angle, etc.
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

Could your head be blocking the light when you look at your ring? There is not enough information about your stone an evaluation without seeing it. Photos and angles are needed. Also are you sure it's the same stone you looked at loose?
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

Perhaps is the table slightly big and the pavilion slightly deep...
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

I am positive, if my head was blocking the light it would probably be blocking the light from the entire diamond not just a section above the midpoint. I can take the ring off and hold it above me and in all different angles of light and I am still seeing the black / hole-like area. It happens everywhere, in every room, in the car, in the store, etc.

I am sure it is the same stone because I verified the I.G.I. Certificate number that was laser-scribed on the side of the diamond when the ring came back.

I went to the I.G.I. website to see if I could get more info on the ring and they only provide me with the same info the jeweler did. I was hoping someone would know how to figure out the calculations by the measurements I do have - I don't know if it is possible but I figured it wouldn't hurt to ask.

I guess my really big question is, am I risking having this problem with all diamonds? If I seek out a new diamond is the likelihood still there that I will experience what I am experiencing now?
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

QueenMum,

I have no idea, I don't know how to tell and my Authenticity Report doesn't give me those dimensions.
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

You could try to take a picture?
Your diamond has a 61.7% depth, that's not too much, but it can be too much if the table is large...
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

What you describe sounds like a 'nail head', not a fish eye.
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

This is the best I can get right now......it is blurry so the image is distorted a lot but you can see the area on the center diamond where it is dark - The picture was taken in low light but regardless of the light that black spot is still there - and it looks deeper in the ring than the picture is depicting. in person everything shines and reflects beautifully except for this spot - I wish I could get a better picture up but my camera is crapping out on me and my hands are not steady enough.

IMG_0226.jpg
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

It looks like it could be normal table reflection. And the larger the table of your diamond, and the deeper (I believe) the diamond is, the more table reflection you see. It is normal. I'll see if I can find an old thread that explains it better with diagrams.
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

Big table, long LGF, but not a nail head.
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

I found a thread where table reflection and table size are discussed. Take a look at the post by John Pollard with the diagrams and see if this is similar to what you're seeing in your diamond
https://www.pricescope.com/communit...rea-above-culet.148354/#post-2681811#p2681811


ETA: And your jeweler was giving you a load of BS about the clarity and the color of the diamond; you were right about that. What you're seeing is a function of the cut of the diamond, not its color and clarity. ;))
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

Thank you for the link Lula.

I was pretty sure she was trying to blow smoke up my wazoo. Which I don't get because if this is unique to this diamond and I can find one that doesn't have this problem then I will have no qualms about spending a bit more money than I already have - her loss though because now I am not going to trust her or her jewelers.
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

Out of curiosity does your diamond have a culet?
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

nicimarie|1291936149|2792583 said:
Thank you for the link Lula.

I was pretty sure she was trying to blow smoke up my wazoo. Which I don't get because if this is unique to this diamond and I can find one that doesn't have this problem then I will have no qualms about spending a bit more money than I already have - her loss though because now I am not going to trust her or her jewelers.
Click to expand...

Yes, what she should have said that it's due to the cut of the diamond. Many people like larger tables, and there may be nothing "wrong" with your diamond, so she could be right about that. But she's wrong about the color and clarity causing the effect that I believe you're seeing.

If you truly do not like the look of your diamond and want to exchange it, I recommend you do some reading under the Knowledge section in the blue toolbar on this site. This will help you learn what to ask for when you sit down with your jeweler to discuss a different stone. One thing you will want to find out is if they carry any GIA or AGS diamonds that have full certifications with all the numbers on them (table, depth, crown angle, etc.). If all the store carries is EGL diamonds with incomplete certifications, that will make it harder for you to know what you're looking at.
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

I think you should follow your suspicion of being fed a line of 'crud'. Their diamond expert don't make sense. From your explanation it sounds like she was telling you: All good diamonds don't perform well?!?

Their explanation raises concerns immediately.

It is possible you are a victim of a "Bait and Switch" scam. If you did not see it under a microscope, I highly doubt it would be visible by the naked eye AFTER mounting. Especially, considering there are 2 of you that have the same opinion.

https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/diamond-clarity/
VS1 and VS2 – Very Slightly Included
VS1 and VS2 diamonds have minor inclusions that are seen under 10X magnification, but inclusions typically cannot be seen without the aid of a loupe or microscope.
Click to expand...

If it is still under warranty - Take it back and start the process over. DO NOT WAIT!
If you're not happy with it and you can get your money back, do so. They might try to drag it out so they don't have to give your money back.

Good luck working through this.
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

Take it back, immediately! Get a full refund!
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

no inclusions to hide the clarity? lol seriously! clarity is not the same as good cut, I do not know if your stone has fish eye (or nail head) but clarity has nothing to do with it.
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

I think you are describing a nail head. You should look around at other diamonds to see if it's they have the same effect. Well cut diamonds should not do this.
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

Take your picture from farther away at the highest resolution and then crop the picture... the inclination is to fill the view with the little object but then the camera which is more farsighted wants to focus on things behind it.
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

It doesn't matter what it is. You're not happy with it. Return it immediately.
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

I believe the diamond does have a culet.
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

I just want to make sure I am not being overly picky or that I am out of my mind. If this is something that isn't normal than I definitely want to take the diamond back and pick out another one. I am just so new to the world of jewelry and diamonds that I don't really know what to look for other than the 4 C's. In other words I guess I really don't know what is normal, all I know is that the black spot is the first thing I see EVERY time I look down at the darn thing and it is driving me crazy.

I guess I just want to hear that not all diamonds do this and that it is possible to get a diamond that looks brilliant from all angles.
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

So from everyone's suggestions and feedback it seems like it might be a table reflection? If so, can this be avoided in a high quality diamond?

I paid almost $4,000 for this diamond - I feel like for the money I should be completely happy but I am not. I do not mind spending a bit more if necessary, as long as this is something that can be avoided.
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

Take your ring in to a hearts of fire dealer. Ask him for a mounted stone of similar size and to clean your ring for you. Then put the rings side by side... walk around the store (best to do this when it is daytime so you can get away from the jewelry lights and near the windows for natural light. Put them both on your finger, one after another. With yours on the bottom first, then with yours on the top so you see them on your hand. Do you see a problem?

See what you think.
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

Gypsy|1291949078|2792774 said:
Take your ring in to a hearts of fire dealer. Ask him for a mounted stone of similar size and to clean your ring for you. Then put the rings side by side... walk around the store (best to do this when it is daytime so you can get away from the jewelry lights and near the windows for natural light. Put them both on your finger, one after another. With yours on the bottom first, then with yours on the top so you see them on your hand. Do you see a problem?

See what you think.
Click to expand...

this is good advice.
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

I agree with a bait and switch. A setting will not change table reflections or light leakage (that is what it sounds like from your concerns, I can't really tell from the photos). Return that bad boy and find a new jeweler!

Just a note as well, you can get a diamond that size and clarity for close to half what you paid. Not only does it sound like they scammed you, they are way way over charging as well. Check out white flash.com or bluenile.com.
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

Gypsy and RockHugger,

Thank you for your suggestions. I was planning on going to a few other jewelers to compare diamonds before going back to the jeweler. I know the diamond was not switched because the jeweler had me verify the IGI Cert # laser scribed on the side of the diamond under the microscope once the diamond was placed.

As far as price and reputability, I got the diamond from Jared. I heard they had a good reputation and I liked the salesman we dealt with. However after dealing with the manager I am so turned off by them that even if I found a diamond I like through them again I don't think I would re-patronize the place again.
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

The picture that you posted isn't clear but from what i see this is not a fish eye and definitely not a nail head. This doesn't mean though that the diamond is an excellent performer and that it should necessairily please your eye. I'd say that you should be honest with yourself and decide whether you like the diamond or not. If you like it, forget about everything we have discussed here, but if you don't like it and you feel that it won't make you happy, then return it while you can still get a full refund.
 
Re: HELP: am I seeing a fish eye effect in my new diamond???

I agree that it seems you paid too much for this diamond, based on the fact that it has an IGI cert -- did it come with one of those small plastic cards? -- and not a full GIA or AGS certification. The color and clarity of your diamond are very nice, but the problem is I don't know how IGI compares in color and clarity grading with GIA or AGS, so the color and clarity of your diamond may in fact be lower than that if it had been graded by AGS or GIA -- I don't know enough about IGI to say for sure.

I also don't know enough about the cut of the diamond (since your cert doesn't have those numbers) to do more than guess about the cut quality. You do know that you are unhappy with the way it looks mounted.

Since you bought it at Jared's, the simplest thing to do is to ask them to show you some of their Peerless line diamonds. Jared's Peerless Collection is their "best cut" so if there is indeed something about the cut of your diamond that is producing the dark circle, comparing it to a Peerless will demonstrate that difference to the sales associate. Ask them to show you a diamond with a table smaller than 57%. If the sales associate is unable to do that, then just get your money back and buy a diamond from someplace that educates their sales staff.

Again, I'm just guessing, based on the few numbers that you have, the photo, and your description of what you're seeing, that it is the cut that is causing the darkness. You'll need to do some "visual research" of your own to determine if what you're seeing is indeed "normal."

But a caution I would have is to make sure you educate yourself about the proportions of a well-cut diamond, and make sure your sales associate shows you a Peerless, and not just several other diamonds cut similarly to yours, for comparison.
 
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