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Green Tourmaline, Keeper or not?

hwm

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 27, 2016
Messages
25
I purchased this tourmaline for a bypass ring project and I like its color, size and shape.

Spec: 3.68 ct,
Origin: Mozambique
Cut: Precision
Price: 380 USD per ct
Clarity: One small inclusion under the gridle, not huge but can be seen by nake eye if you know where it is, not surface reaching

I like this stone a lot and just want to make sure I did not overpay the stone massively (I know very little about tourmaline so not sure if this color is considered as good or not, or if I can get a similiar stone with a much lower price... I did some research from the trusted vendor's listings and found that tourmaline's price range is extremely wide so I am lost....).

The below photos are the stone's performance at normal day light, under table, vendor's picture, and its inclusion.
Please let me know what you think of this gem...



Day Light.jpg Under Table.PNG Vendor Photo.jpg IMG_9434.jpg


Thanks!
 

voce

Ideal_Rock
Joined
May 13, 2018
Messages
3,960
No, you did not overpay. You can expect to pay $100/ct for a larger precision cut green tourmaline, and yours has a bluish tone, which is valued higher than green tourmalines with yellow tones.
 

voce

Ideal_Rock
Joined
May 13, 2018
Messages
3,960
?? I don't really know. This is something that seems to vary by vendor. Bluish green sells for higher than yellowish green. Exactly how much higher is uncertain.
 

hwm

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 27, 2016
Messages
25
?? I don't really know. This is something that seems to vary by vendor. Bluish green sells for higher than yellowish green. Exactly how much higher is uncertain.
Because the tourmaline I purchased is 380/ct so I just want to make sure a comparable stone should value at least ~300usd/ct. I really like the color, size and cut and is willing to pay for 20%-30% premium but if the premium is say 50%+ I might return it and wait for another opportunity
 

voce

Ideal_Rock
Joined
May 13, 2018
Messages
3,960
Oh, I missed that. I had somehow thought it was 380 total. Well, if you're not satisfied with what you bought, you should return it. For a glowy green bluish paraiba tourmaline, I've paid as high as $700/ct, but that was tourmaline from Brazil. I think for a 3ct+ size, yours is still within the range of reasonable, but more on the higher end of that.
 

Arcadian

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Sep 17, 2008
Messages
7,452
Nice gem, looks precision cut? tiny table which is good.

First I'mma put up some sciency stuff. its pretty cool and helps lots learn about tourmaline


Next is price. Gemstone prices are not always set in stone. It will depend on LOTS of factors like, how many hands the stone passed through because each one tries to make a profit selling the stone.

The more hands, sometimes the more expensive.

The color, and this one being more blue side of green makes it more eye pleasing and therefore, more valuable.

Location sometimes plays a part but in tourmaline not always, it usually only does with few varieties. In your stone, it has no bearing.

Who cut your stone also plays a part. Precision cut stones can be more expensive. Cut by a branded cutter? yeah you are at that time paying for the cut and their name.

IMO the stone is nice, good sized, works out to be 103/ct. Given what I see, that's fair price.

For some gemstone species, bigger the stone is, the more per ct you'll pay + if named cutter is cutting, even more, if put in branded jewlery, more more (get where this is going?).

That said, you(general you) will have your limits. I've seen similar stones for a little less and a little more and those factors I noted come into play.

The inclusion... I would not worry about the inclusion much as the stone looks to be very clean for the type of stone it is. But this falls under mind cleanliness. If you will not be able to get that out of your mind, pass on it. Just know that your going to get inclusions with certain types of stones. Very clean tourmaline without any flaw are quite rare, you do pay more for that just as an FYI. that small flaw could be the thing that keeps the price in the normal range.

In general I don't mind some inclusions as they can be identifiers of YOUR stone should you ever take a piece of jewelry in for cleaning or whatnot. Just ensure that its not something that will be damaging to the stone when set.
 

Arcadian

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Sep 17, 2008
Messages
7,452
Ok I went back and read the OP again. I thought it was 380 for the entire stone...lol Let me apologize for answering before I had enough coffee!

Let me reiterate. 380/US is a good price for that stone which means its 103/ct. paying more than that? I WOULD be extremely judgy and I admittedly would give it a pass at the current price. I feel like you could find something cheaper, especially these days.

Does the stone have a report? I do wonder if seller is selling as an indicolite and even if that answer is yes, it would still be too expensive per ct.
 

Musia

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Mar 28, 2020
Messages
821
$1400 for this stone is way too much in my opinion.
 

lovedogs

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jul 31, 2014
Messages
11,374
Ok I went back and read the OP again. I thought it was 380 for the entire stone...lol Let me apologize for answering before I had enough coffee!

Let me reiterate. 380/US is a good price for that stone which means its 103/ct. paying more than that? I WOULD be extremely judgy and I admittedly would give it a pass at the current price. I feel like you could find something cheaper, especially these days.

Does the stone have a report? I do wonder if seller is selling as an indicolite and even if that answer is yes, it would still be too expensive per ct.
That was my reaction too. I thought 300 for the STONE was totally fair. 300/ct is too much
 

minousbijoux

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Aug 5, 2010
Messages
12,402
Agree with the above. There are some blue green tourmalines that can command that price per carat, but they tend to be medium toned, eye clean, and extremely saturated. Kinda like the photo of it in the case if it had even brighter, more saturated bluish green color. Your stone is large and as Arc said, stones are more expensive per carat as they increase in size (the demarcation(s) depends upon the stone type).
 

Cockatiel

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
Dec 28, 2017
Messages
678
I never understood why some sellers list the price per carat like that and omit the total price. Is that meant to like soften the blow? Like is that supposed to entice buyers? Not like that's going to be successful, for like more than a second. Or is that supposed to aid in price comparisons, like in case you are shopping around for the lowest $ per carat ratio possible. Nobody shops for gems like that, at least end consumers like us.
 

Rfisher

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Oct 19, 2013
Messages
2,659
Thanks for all the opinion! Guess I will return it then.
Does it look like the vendor shot at any time in any environment to your eye?
The vendor is stating it is precision cut, and they routinely have sales - did you pay full list price? Or negotiate lower in line with their usual sale % off?
I believe you said you’ve been thru the PS vendor list looking around - have you found one you like that’s comparatively this size and color and at around $100/ct that it can be compared to?

If you really like it, as I believe you originally stated - sometimes we pay for what we like, for something that is available ‘right now’?
 

DauphineMucha

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Oct 13, 2010
Messages
349
I never understood why some sellers list the price per carat like that and omit the total price. Is that meant to like soften the blow? Like is that supposed to entice buyers? Not like that's going to be successful, for like more than a second. Or is that supposed to aid in price comparisons, like in case you are shopping around for the lowest $ per carat ratio possible. Nobody shops for gems like that, at least end consumers like us.
I must be 1 of the strange people. I prefer to know the $/ct.
 

Cockatiel

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
Dec 28, 2017
Messages
678
I must be 1 of the strange people. I prefer to know the $/ct.
Ha! There you go! Thanks for chiming in. I might be the strange one here. For me the $ per carat is kind of useless because I care more about the face up size than carat. Actually I do care about the weight in that I'd want it to face up appropriately for its weight, not too big - I'd be weary of a window or an easy to spot tilt window - nor too small, for obvious reasons. I avoid "big face up" stones in particular. But I digress.
 

GliderPoss

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Sep 25, 2008
Messages
2,558
I never understood why some sellers list the price per carat like that and omit the total price. Is that meant to like soften the blow? Like is that supposed to entice buyers? Not like that's going to be successful, for like more than a second. Or is that supposed to aid in price comparisons, like in case you are shopping around for the lowest $ per carat ratio possible. Nobody shops for gems like that, at least end consumers like us.
Ugh agreed, I absolutely hate that pricing method! :angryfire:
 

hwm

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 27, 2016
Messages
25
@Arcadian, no it does not come with a lab report
@Rfisher, 380/CT (or 1400 USD) is the discounted price. The original price is 460/CT (1700 USD). Under low light the vendor picture is pretty accurate and I am quite impressed with its low light performance.
I looked though the trusted vendor list and found that other options are either not the size/shape I want (after all it is a bypass ring project...), or too dark for my taste. That is why I open this thread and would like to know if this size+shape+color of tourmaline is easy to come by. I am willing to pay for a premium but if the premium is like 50%+ then I probably would return the stone and keep looking

The vendor did mention that this stone has a paraiba color but personally I only consider neon blue as paraiba and also this stone does not have a lab report.
 

Arcadian

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Sep 17, 2008
Messages
7,452
This is my touraline which is paraiba color. no trickery, straight out the can. I live in FL and in certain lights its just like this. When I lived in Massachusetts you definitely saw the two tones that make up the stone more. Neither are great pics but show how pretty the colors can be in different environments.

506252

Taken in Massachusetts (it was winter time, near about 3pm so pretty dark out, and thats snow in the background) 428820


Yes, Paraiba types can come in that color, it comes in purple, violet, and straight up green.

If you're looking for indicolite, thats fine, but just know that some will try to sell them as being paraiba color which is not right IMO.

My stone was sold as non copper bearing blue-green/green-blue tourmaline, not paraiba anything or even paraiba like.

Gemstones are at the very heart of it, an emotional purchase. When you pick a stone that makes your heart sing it can be hard to find anything else that comes close.

Here's what I have to tell you based on my own personal experience; If you are hesitating on a stone based on ANYTHING pay attention to why. I've been where you are...so have many of us. And sometimes we've regretted a purchase because we got emotional first. If the feeling to return is strong, pay attention to why it is. It might be to your benefit to just return the stone and start over.
There's only been a few times where I didn't care how much I was paying, I had to have it, and that stone above was one of those times. The price had me wincing sure, but that was MY stone and I knew it. No regrets now, none then either!

So I and many others can only say what we would do in your situation, because some of us have been where you are in the decision making. What you ultimately decide to do is really your choice.

The litnon stone comes out to be less than your current stone, but slightly darker. keep in mind its got an open cullet (some like that and some don't). Michael has been for me very easy to work with. Stone will likely deepen once set.


Take a look at AJS. I don't know how they accept returns or if they do during this time, but best to ask, they've been great to work with.
 

Cockatiel

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
Dec 28, 2017
Messages
678
@Arcadian

I looooove that tourmaline. And the setting too!!!! Are those french cuts? If you don't mind who made the setting?
 

Arcadian

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Sep 17, 2008
Messages
7,452
@Arcadian

I looooove that tourmaline. And the setting too!!!! Are those french cuts? If you don't mind who made the setting?
yes, those are french cuts and if I remember all the stones are F-G color. Brilliantly Engaged made the setting, which is really beautiful and quite substantial, its the highest sitting of all my rings but my goodness, I just don't care...lol.

I did inquire about larger graduated set but they fell outside my budget, would have set my ring project back by a lot!

They don't make the setting anymore to my knowledge but its worth asking if they could if you really like it. (its not hand made it's cast).
 

fredflintstone

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jul 18, 2020
Messages
68
@Arcadian, no it does not come with a lab report
@Rfisher, 380/CT (or 1400 USD) is the discounted price. The original price is 460/CT (1700 USD). Under low light the vendor picture is pretty accurate and I am quite impressed with its low light performance.
I looked though the trusted vendor list and found that other options are either not the size/shape I want (after all it is a bypass ring project...), or too dark for my taste. That is why I open this thread and would like to know if this size+shape+color of tourmaline is easy to come by. I am willing to pay for a premium but if the premium is like 50%+ then I probably would return the stone and keep looking

The vendor did mention that this stone has a paraiba color but personally I only consider neon blue as paraiba and also this stone does not have a lab report.
Paraiba can be blue or green. Normally the blues has a green modifier and the green has a blue modifier.

As far as neon. Not all Paraiba's are created equal, just like any other gemstone. I've seen non-Paraiba stones as neon as many so-called Paraiba’s. The best Paraiba’s are a sight to behold, no doubt. Just don't let the moniker fool you into overpaying.
 
Last edited:

fredflintstone

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jul 18, 2020
Messages
68
This is my touraline which is paraiba color. no trickery, straight out the can. I live in FL and in certain lights its just like this. When I lived in Massachusetts you definitely saw the two tones that make up the stone more. Neither are great pics but show how pretty the colors can be in different environments.

20170806_1307252.jpg

Taken in Massachusetts (it was winter time, near about 3pm so pretty dark out, and thats snow in the background) _27930.jpg


Yes, Paraiba types can come in that color, it comes in purple, violet, and straight up green.

If you're looking for indicolite, thats fine, but just know that some will try to sell them as being paraiba color which is not right IMO.

My stone was sold as non copper bearing blue-green/green-blue tourmaline, not paraiba anything or even paraiba like.

Gemstones are at the very heart of it, an emotional purchase. When you pick a stone that makes your heart sing it can be hard to find anything else that comes close.

Here's what I have to tell you based on my own personal experience; If you are hesitating on a stone based on ANYTHING pay attention to why. I've been where you are...so have many of us. And sometimes we've regretted a purchase because we got emotional first. If the feeling to return is strong, pay attention to why it is. It might be to your benefit to just return the stone and start over.
There's only been a few times where I didn't care how much I was paying, I had to have it, and that stone above was one of those times. The price had me wincing sure, but that was MY stone and I knew it. No regrets now, none then either!

So I and many others can only say what we would do in your situation, because some of us have been where you are in the decision making. What you ultimately decide to do is really your choice.

The litnon stone comes out to be less than your current stone, but slightly darker. keep in mind its got an open cullet (some like that and some don't). Michael has been for me very easy to work with. Stone will likely deepen once set.


Take a look at AJS. I don't know how they accept returns or if they do during this time, but best to ask, they've been great to work with.
The closer to the equator, the more vivid the stones looks outside. All to do with longer direct color wave lengths from the sun. That is why many are a tad disappointed when they buy from a dealer in the tropics with the pictures and video taken in their natural sunlight as compared to say NYC. That is why many times I want to see both indoor and outdoor pictures, before buying and what light the indoor pictures were takenin. All about the light.
 

Arcadian

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Sep 17, 2008
Messages
7,452
@fredflintstone I can tell you that I fell in love with some all over again when I saw what they could do down here versus what they did in Massachusetts. There was only a very small amount of them that I was bummed about, mostly because they lost some of the delicate color I really loved about them.

win some, lose some. Its because of this that I do encourage people to, when possible, see stones in their environments. I would not have thought it could make that much of a difference but it certainly does!
 

fredflintstone

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jul 18, 2020
Messages
68
@fredflintstone I can tell you that I fell in love with some all over again when I saw what they could do down here versus what they did in Massachusetts. There was only a very small amount of them that I was bummed about, mostly because they lost some of the delicate color I really loved about them.

win some, lose some. Its because of this that I do encourage people to, when possible, see stones in their environments. I would not have thought it could make that much of a difference but it certainly does!

Yes. It really is not talked much about. You being in Florida, your sunlight is great!:)


People need to know that sunlight in different latitudes can and will change the look of their stones. Even different times of day. They need to learn to compensate for that when they see stones taken in tropical light. So, they can try to figure out what to expect.:)
 

Adam95

Rough_Rock
Joined
Aug 12, 2019
Messages
45
I would return it. It has quite a lot of grey; you can get much more pure green/bluish green for that price
 
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