Emerald cabochon - does this inclusion pose structural problems?

[Pomelo]

I've had the ring for 6 years and never had it re-brushed. The finish looks like new. But to be fair, I have err... quite a few rings. So, though I wear two rings every day, individual rings don't get that much wear. Also, because this is an emerald ring, I wear it with care.

On the 1930's ring (which I love!), I'd guess patina. All my polished gold rings seem to develop a soft patina pretty quickly, i.e. in less than 6 months. This, one of my first rings, and a similar design to the 1930s ring, is typical (or maybe a bit worse). It's never been repolished:


Not sure what to make of this. Maybe that while brushed finish will show severe scratches, it's less affected by normal wear that a polished finish?

Ooh if that’s the patina that develops over 6 months, then I think I’ll go for polished!

I’m leaning towards platinum for as neutral a base a possible. The colour of the stone is really quite beautiful and saturated, I’m not sure whether I’d want yellow gold to amp it up.

Hmm, let’s see… I’ll get the stone back in about a month from GRS so I have plenty of time to think about it!

As much as I love some of the Trombino rings (and I do not love a lot of vintage Bulgari but some of those are amazing), you have such a clean design sensibility, @Pomelo, that I picture you with a very gemmy gumdrop/sugarloaf cab ring with not a lot of extraneous elements. You would run the risk that the uninformed will assume that it's not genuine or that it's synthetic -- since it lacks the "this is special" diamond fireworks. But your jewelry "wardrobe" suggests -- as I once overheard my dad telling my mom -- that if you wear it, no one will thinks it's fake.

Thanks @LilAlex , you know my taste so well.
I think I got excited that I have a stone that I could picture being used by JAR, Hemmerle etc and wanted to do some research into fancier settings. But you’re right - I like clean designs!

I’d be thrilled if others think it’s fake - less likely to get mugged

 

[Pomelo]

Please tell me I didn’t make a mistake when I passed on this ~4.5ct Colombian emerald today…!
Tagging @Autumn in New England @Crimson @LilAlex and grateful for input from others too!

My reasons for passing were:
1. Has a fairly noticeable inclusion at the centre of the stone which looks okay from certain angles but not from others. The inclusion was surface reaching under a loupe as well
2. It has a small window in the centre
3. I already splashed out on an emerald cab which is waiting to be collected from GRS in HK!

Buuut
1. I got to compare this stone with several others, including one with a GRS Muzo designation. I preferred this one as the colour is ever so slightly lighter / less blue and felt more vibrant
2. The ring and setting fit me well. It was like a Cinderella-shoe moment

This was also the first time I’ve tried on a ballerina setting. I didn’t understand it before but now I do… the undulating baguettes are stunning on the hand and with movement. Pictures can’t capture it.

 

[RRfromR]

@Pomelo I love my Columbian ballerina, it's my go to ring for Christmas parties. I think the geometry of it all makes it easier to dress it up or down. I need glow for my emeralds, and I think it's easier to get that from a sharp cut. I love the one that you have on, on the pic above.

 

[Autumn in New England]

Please tell me I didn’t make a mistake when I passed on this ~4.5ct Colombian emerald today…!
Tagging @Autumn in New England @Crimson @LilAlex and grateful for input from others too!

My reasons for passing were:
1. Has a fairly noticeable inclusion at the centre of the stone which looks okay from certain angles but not from others. The inclusion was surface reaching under a loupe as well
2. It has a small window in the centre
3. I already splashed out on an emerald cab which is waiting to be collected from GRS in HK!

Buuut
1. I got to compare this stone with several others, including one with a GRS Muzo designation. I preferred this one as the colour is ever so slightly lighter / less blue and felt more vibrant
2. The ring and setting fit me well. It was like a Cinderella-shoe moment

This was also the first time I’ve tried on a ballerina setting. I didn’t understand it before but now I do… the undulating baguettes are stunning on the hand and with movement. Pictures can’t capture it.

I'm not going to lie... it's a pretty stone and beauuutiful ring. For me personally, the clarity is a bit beyond my tolerance. Some folks don't mind a heavily included emerald. And while I would say this one is just moderately included, I still look for relatively eye clean material. It costs a lot more, hence my stone is only 2ct. lol But the color of this one is lovely and the size is . I bet it looked great at arm's length. I'd say it's your call, my friend. I would just be sure it comes with a proper cert that states minor CE (or less). That's non-negotiable for me; it might not be for you. In any event, I have a feeling I'm going to like your cab even better. Please show us when you're ready!

 

[Dreamer_D]

Im no expert @Pomelo but when it comes to gems I usually say “trust your gut” and your gut told you to pass!

Now your gut may change its mind in a few days… in which case you can buy it lol

 

[mellowyellowgirl]

Omg I absolutely love it @Pomelo but there’s something that made you walk away so I’d trust in that. There will be others. There are ALWAYS others.

 

[Starstruck8]

Well,,, I would be delighted with an emerald like that - beautiful blueish green colour, and it's huge. I'd be prepared to overlook the clarity and the small window. But would you? I have a modest budget (by PS standards) and I always compromise. But your collection suggests that you like and can afford to do better. Would it sit well in your collection? (Genuine question, not rhetorical.)

 

[LilAlex]

I was one of the folks who "enabled" you to walk away. It's a gorgeous ring, to be sure. I only know about you what I see here, and at the time it aligned less well with what I'd envision for you (presumptuous, I know). But when you ask for opinions, you're inviting that kind of overstepping!

It's true: sometimes what we think we like is an imperfect predictor of what we will like. I have a few examples of this -- cars, watches, cities, people...

The good news: I think "passing" on a superb, good-sized, minimally-treated cabochon is much more likely to be an error you can't recover from -- there is just so little high-quality material being cabbed right now. A ballerina ring with a step-cut, fine-color emerald is less likely to be a true (permanently) missed opportunity, imo, as evidenced in part by the similarity between the one you considered and @RRfromR's. If it's still available, take another look. I think it would be easier to source this gem or even this final product than a killer emerald cab.

 

[Pomelo]

Thank you @RRfromR @Autumn in New England @Dreamer_D @mellowyellowgirl @Starstruck8 @LilAlex
I needed to hear that there will be others and to trust my gut! I also think that if I already had my cab back from GRS, I wouldn’t be craving another emerald so much.

But @Starstruck8 hit the nail on the head. Why do I think about this ring/stone so much? Because it’s a great price, and cheaper than I can get from a trade show. I saw $2,000/ct emeralds at the HK show and their colour is nowhere near as saturated / mostly more windowed.

GRS have been slow (I guess that’s to be expected, as I submitted the cab immediately after the Sept trade show) so I’m still waiting for the green light to collect it… Actually, that’s a lie - they’ve already assessed the stone but the printing is done outside the lab and it’s been over two weeks but no sign of a physical cert yet They haven’t told me the grading yet either.

@Starstruck8 you asked an interesting question about whether it’d would fit in my collection and the answer is no, haha!
I typically prefer minimalist, non-diamond settings. I don’t own a single halo ring, and my OEC Ophelia has single-cut stones on the shank, but I was thinking of resetting this as the little diamonds & two-tone setting have started to bug me and I just want a plain, WG or platinum shank

BUT! I am a minimalist who has the occasional maximalist fantasy and I think a stone of this size with a big ballerina looks a good proportion on my finger…!

Recent pic of Ophelia


~

16ct Cushion and the pear (maybe 12ct? I can’t remember!) were $2,000/ct. Even if I take haggling into account, the ballerina emerald is much better pricing.

(I’m in Japan again - it’s only a short flight from Beijing and great for a long weekend / an excuse to celebrate my husband’s birthday. Very glad he likes it as much as I do)


I also saw this on a direct-from-mine account on Instagram and was shocked at the price for that window…!!!

 

[Dreamer_D]

Off topic but I love your authentic setting for Ophelia. Can you change just the shank to simplify? The Colette and basket are something special.

 

[Pomelo]

Off topic but I love your authentic setting for Ophelia. Can you change just the shank to simplify? The Colette and basket are something special.

Hehe if the setting were authentic, I wouldn’t touch it at all! But it’s actually a reproduction which means I have no qualms on taking it apart.

I’d be saving the collect/basket and just removing / replacing the shank with a simple polished ~2mm platinum one

I like the darkened collet design and the finger coverage it gives

 

[RRfromR]

Is this too small? I like the transparency and color on this one. The setting looks original, so back then oil was the only treatment available.

Vintage Edwardian Era Cabochon Cut Colombian Emerald Ring GIA

We are thrilled to offer this vintage beauty!!We love cabochon cut gemstones.They just seem to always glow and show off the natural beauty of the gem.Ring DetailsMaterial: 14K Yellow & White GoldEra: Edwardian Era 1900 - 1910Head Height: 8.1mmHead Width: 12.6mmShank Width: 1.8mmWeight: 3.1...

www.heirloomjewelers.com

 

[Pomelo]

Is this too small? I like the transparency and color on this one. The setting looks original, so back then oil was the only treatment available.

Vintage Edwardian Era Cabochon Cut Colombian Emerald Ring GIA

We are thrilled to offer this vintage beauty!!We love cabochon cut gemstones.They just seem to always glow and show off the natural beauty of the gem.Ring DetailsMaterial: 14K Yellow & White GoldEra: Edwardian Era 1900 - 1910Head Height: 8.1mmHead Width: 12.6mmShank Width: 1.8mmWeight: 3.1...

www.heirloomjewelers.com

The high dome is delectable
But re: size of face-up, I think only you know your size preferences!

 

[LilAlex]

Is this too small?

Pretty ring! I clicked on it, and GIA says F2:



Dendritics estimates ~ 3 ct for cab with those dimensions, but that sounds low -- it could be a more with that hemispherical look.

 

[RRfromR]

Pretty ring! I clicked on it, and GIA says F2:



Dendritics estimates ~ 3 ct for cab with those dimensions, but that sounds low -- it could be a more with that hemispherical look.

@LilAlex , good catch, I didn't see the GIA. I love it, but I'm too clumsy (active?) for an emerald cab.

 

[Dreamer_D]

Hehe if the setting were authentic, I wouldn’t touch it at all! But it’s actually a reproduction which means I have no qualms on taking it apart.

I’d be saving the collect/basket and just removing / replacing the shank with a simple polished ~2mm platinum one

I like the darkened collet design and the finger coverage it gives

That’s a good plan! Who made it?

 

[Pomelo]

That’s a good plan! Who made it?

Pragnell’s, a British jeweller

 

[Pomelo]

I got the verbal report from GRS back (physical report still being printed) and it’s:

• Colour: Green
• Comment: Minor to moderate (hardened resin)
• Origin: Colombia

Not gonna lie, I was a bit upset when I saw the hardened resin.

Then, I went for a killer gym session which helped put things into perspective.

I’m not surprised at the level of treatment and having seen @Crimson ’s comments about fine minor oil emeralds costing $10k+/ct (with price going up for larger stones), I got what I paid for! I’m just gutted that I didn’t bargain harder!

My top criteria was a big, glowy cab (that I can reasonably afford), and I was willing to compromise on other criteria, so this ticks the boxes. Minor oil-only is a mind-clean thing that I can get over, but unglowy, too-included material is not.

~

Separately, the spess came back as:

• Spessartine “mandarin” - garnet
• Colour: Orange
• Origin: [blank]
• No heat

Does anyone know why the mandarin is in quotation marks, and why no origin is included? I couldn’t find anything on GRS’s website about spess or garnets in general!

(I’ll also ask GRS the same questions, am curious is all)


Just reattaching some pics to remind myself that I am still excited by the emerald despite the report (!)

 

[LilAlex]

Not a bad result for a well-priced, enormous, and spectacular emerald! It will make a sensational ring!

Purchase was not in any way contingent upon the report result?

I (semi-naively) wanted the antique one I recently sent to AGL to be old-fashioned oil (and it was), but then you're sort of down-graded for poor stability of the treatment. That said, I guess my favorite adulterant would be traditional uncolored cedar oil.

The spess sounds great -- nothing to worry about there? I have not looked at many spess reports, but I presume the "mandarin" designation is a good thing, and I infer nothing undesirable about the quotation marks. I don't think they're mocking us.

 

[Dreamer_D]

Is the resin a stable treatment?

 

[Pomelo]

Not a bad result for a well-priced, enormous, and spectacular emerald! It will make a sensational ring!

Purchase was not in any way contingent upon the report result?

I (semi-naively) wanted the antique one I recently sent to AGL to be old-fashioned oil (and it was), but then you're sort of down-graded for poor stability of the treatment. That said, I guess my favorite adulterant would be traditional uncolored cedar oil.

The spess sounds great -- nothing to worry about there? I have not looked at many spess reports, but I presume the "mandarin" designation is a good thing, and I infer nothing undesirable about the quotation marks. I don't think they're mocking us.

Thank you, this makes me feel better.
Purchase was not contingent, partly because I completely forgot to ask in detail about treatment, I was just smitten by the stone itself…

Ooh have we seen a pic of your antique emerald?

Yes spess sounds good, I’m just curious whether “mandarin” is a specific colour or origin designation like Muzo green or Cornflower blue!

Is the resin a stable treatment?

Very good question! I asked them if they can shed more light on the specific type of resin used but fully expect them to tell me “no more info sorry”!

 

[RRfromR]

It is a beautiful stone and the resin makes it more low maintenance than the oil. And you can't even tell

 

[mellowyellowgirl]

You got a decent price for it so it just comes down to very much a mind clean thing. I have scrubbed all my emeralds in soap after every buffet and they are no worse for it. With the number of beautiful rings you have, I’m assuming this will go in rotation so it’s not going to be an issue at all.

Plus she’s so so so beautiful!!!!

 

[Dreamer_D]

Well it’s a gorgeous gem either way. I wish it was disclosed! I hope you can still enjoy her.

 

[Autumn in New England]

I got the verbal report from GRS back (physical report still being printed) and it’s:

• Colour: Green
• Comment: Minor to moderate (hardened resin)
• Origin: Colombia

Not gonna lie, I was a bit upset when I saw the hardened resin.

Then, I went for a killer gym session which helped put things into perspective.

I’m not surprised at the level of treatment and having seen @Crimson ’s comments about fine minor oil emeralds costing $10k+/ct (with price going up for larger stones), I got what I paid for! I’m just gutted that I didn’t bargain harder!

My top criteria was a big, glowy cab (that I can reasonably afford), and I was willing to compromise on other criteria, so this ticks the boxes. Minor oil-only is a mind-clean thing that I can get over, but unglowy, too-included material is not.

~

Separately, the spess came back as:

• Spessartine “mandarin” - garnet
• Colour: Orange
• Origin: [blank]
• No heat

Does anyone know why the mandarin is in quotation marks, and why no origin is included? I couldn’t find anything on GRS’s website about spess or garnets in general!

(I’ll also ask GRS the same questions, am curious is all)


Just reattaching some pics to remind myself that I am still excited by the emerald despite the report (!)

So I'll be honest with you... I briefly wrestled with this as well, and here is my conclusion. Extent of CE is far more important to me. I couldn't care less what the substance is, as long as it's colorless. Because while oil itself might be a naturally derived substance, it is processed by man and impregnated into the stone by man. It is all done artificially... never by the earth. In that respect, I don't see a difference. Lastly, as long as you're buying from a reputable source that has their emeralds properly treated (which goes for oil too), hardened resin is much longer lasting and more stable than oil, which eventually dries up and can cloud the stone (unless re-oiled). The resin shouldn't budge, barring any unforeseen event (like an improper cleaning with chemicals or an ultrasonic). So it really shouldn't affect the value. I wouldn't give it a second thought!

 

[Crimson]

Oh dear @Pomelo. We live and learn.
That’s why gems are so interesting. They challenge us all the time.
Given that you have to wipe baby and toddler bottoms and wash hands often, resin may not be a pragmatically bad result. It seems you really like the emerald too. So maybe it is a case of “win some, lose some”. I guess you cannot return the stone if you wish to?

Mandarin garner is a trade term often used for spessartite. Makes it sound more yummy and juicy! Sending you lots of auspicious and cheery mandarins.

 

[Pomelo]

So I'll be honest with you... I briefly wrestled with this as well, and here is my conclusion. Extent of CE is far more important to me. I couldn't care less what the substance is, as long as it's colorless. Because while oil itself might be a naturally derived substance, it is processed by man and impregnated into the stone by man. It is all done artificially... never by the earth. In that respect, I don't see a difference. Lastly, as long as you're buying from a reputable source that has their emeralds properly treated (which goes for oil too), hardened resin is much longer lasting and more stable than oil, which eventually dries up and can cloud the stone (unless re-oiled). The resin shouldn't budge, barring any unforeseen event (like an improper cleaning with chemicals or an ultrasonic). So it really shouldn't affect the value. I wouldn't give it a second thought!

Thank you @Autumn in New England , always good to hear your perspective and to learn from you and your wealth of experience in CS-land.

I don’t really know who the vendor or their reputation is, but they did have a big stall at the HK show and specialised in emeralds. This is the risk of going B2B!

I’ve followed up with GRS to ask for more details on the treatment but I’m not holding my breath.

In any case, what’s done is done and she’ll be back in a few days, and I’ll forget all about the treatment as I’ll be lost in the glow!

 

[Pomelo]

Oh dear @Pomelo. We live and learn.
That’s why gems are so interesting. They challenge us all the time.
Given that you have to wipe baby and toddler bottoms and wash hands often, resin may not be a pragmatically bad result. It seems you really like the emerald too. So maybe it is a case of “win some, lose some”. I guess you cannot return the stone if you wish to?

Mandarin garner is a trade term often used for spessartite. Makes it sound more yummy and juicy! Sending you lots of auspicious and cheery mandarins.

Thanks @Crimson ! To be honest, it was wishful thinking for just minor oil given the price tag…

I’m also 100% sure that if I were given the choice between the same stone but one that’s minor oil at 2x the price vs minor to moderate resin, I’d go for the minor to moderate resin

There was no return policy but I wouldn’t want to return the stone as it’s taken me so long to find an emerald cab that I love and within my price range

Having thought about this emerald’s treatment but also having noodled on a ruby purchase, I think I’ve come to the conclusion that I’m a jewellery lover first and foremost, rather than a stone / specimen lover.

How the piece looks when worn matters the most to me, and I can get over things like treatment level (to a certain extent). Others on PS hunt for wonderful stones with no treatment. We all have different priorities and that’s what makes this community so interesting!

 

[Pomelo]

I got my stones back from GRS and it always makes me chuckle how precious gems travel in flimsy plastic bags

Looking forward to setting these! I was wondering if anyone has any experience with setting stones that have wavy or rounded girdles? I’ve read that bezels and semi bezels are best, but would love to hear some first hand experience!

(It also helps that I plan to fully bezel the emerald, and semi-bezels the spess!)

(Also, please forgive the terrible lighting at my kitchen table after dark.)

 

[Dreamer_D]

I think you can prong set if you have a metal faux bezel like how I set my star sapphire. But probably bezel would be the look you want anyway. You’ll need a good bench! Seems it would require a lot of skill to design and set.