e bay help, asap, please!

[shminbabe]

i hope this is the right forum and i''ll make it brief.

won a david yurman ring from a first time seller with no prior history or feedback (probably my mistake).

seller is requesting paypal payment via two invoices she e mailed me. total price was $380 so she billed me $200 via paypal on the first invoice and $180 on the second invoice.

i wondered, why two invoices?

i read on paypal about buyer''s protection. there is a section that states the protection is only in effect if buyer pays for an item via a single payment, even if the seller requests more than one payment. as in, this situation.

i wrote to the seller and explained my trepidation: first time seller, no history/feedback; why 2 invoices?; my rights null and void if i pay in this way (twice, in a broken up payment).

so: why do you think she is invoicing this way? does it seem like a scam? what should I do?

i do not intend to pay for it in this method.

am i safe paying via paypal if i pay her the total amount in a single payment? as I wrote to her: i need to feel protected in case you don''t send it to me, or it isn''t a david yurman piece, as you describe. i was courteous. but my anxiety over buying from a first-timer was heightened when she sent me these 2 invoices.

i need some advice! i''ve purchased exactly 20 items from e-bay in 5 years, so i know enough to have a little experience but i''m not a wild e-bay shopper who knows all the ins and outs.

 

[Hera]

Something sounds very fishy, and I think you should try to get out of this. Maybe by contacting eBay and telling them the situation. I usually don't do any purchases with people with their transaction under 100. I also have a very high criteria for the percentage. They need to have at least 99.8% positive feedback unless the item is really inexpensive (and even then I will scrutinize their feedback).

 

[wolftress]

I would definitely contact ebay about this. It''s very suspicious. Did she give you a reason for wanting two payments?

 

[Po10472]

You can request that she sends you the correct invoice for the full amount, which should include postage and packing etc. You can go back to your ebay page and it should tell you what the total amount is. If it was me, I wouldn''t accept 2 invoices and unless she sent you the correct one, I would report her. You are protected if you pay thro paypal so don''t worry about that. good luck!

 

[aquarius_ser]

Sounds VERY fishy to me as well. I would contact e-bay and try to get out of it. I''ve never heard of 2 invoices before, that is a huge red flag and there HAS to be a reason for it (which you have already found in the proections rules).

I require a seller to have a over 100 transactions and a 99% feedback before I buy from them, especially if it''s an item over $100.

 

[Independent Gal]

The only explanation I can think of off hand is that you need to have a business account with paypal to accept amounts over a certain number per month (not sure what that number is). Once you switch to a business account, paypal takes a chunk of your money every time you accept a payment. So, it''s possible that this lady, since she''s not a regular e-bay business, only has a normal-person account and can''t accept all of it via paypal. If you switch to a business account, you can''t switch back more than once or they cancel your paypal privileges.

If that''s the case she should say so, and probably she should suck it up and let you pay that way. Mind you, she has the right to refuse that you pay by a particular method unless she already said you could. e.g., a business can refuse a cheque or not take credit cards. But if she already said you could pay by paypal, then...

 

[iheartscience]

If it sketches you out, don''t do it. I got sketched out by one seller in a similar position (no feedback, trouble making payment, etc.) but I paid for the item anyway. Of course, I never got sent the item, and while PayPal did reimburse me, it was less $20 or $25 that they take as a fee. It was a pair of $50 vintage boots, so there went half of my money.

I would just not pay for the ring and if you have to take a negative feedback, so be it. You can always write an explanation under the feedback and leave her a negative feedback for her sketchy payment requests. Maybe if you report it to eBay they won''t let her give you negative feedback.

 

[shminbabe]

I really appreciate your replies. I feel like a dope for bidding when she had NO prior history. My bad. But still, I''m going to contact e bay about this situation.

I have not heard back from the seller yet. I understand what you said about the business account,etc. she should also understand and address my trepidation in the matter.

paypal IS the best way to go, isn''t it? in that my personal information is protection from the seller, right?

I''ll let you know!

(and yes, I''ll take the negative feedback if need be, and explain my side. this is close to $400 we''re talking about.)

jeannie

 

[MichelleCarmen]

Hi,

I''m not highly versed in eBay but have bought/sold about 330 items and NEVER have had two invoices sent to me for a single item. This is very out of the ordinary. The only benefit of the doubt I can give the seller is that she is new and messed up the invoices. But, your suspicion that this is some sort of scam seem valid.

Oh, and I''m not sure if she would need a business account to collect on the entire amount. When I went on a selling spree a while back and sold about $5-600 worth of items, I still used my regular PP account. I never bothered to set up an ugraded account and all my transactions went fine.

 

[Harleigh]

Hi schmin,

YES, contact ebay and notify them, and also contact PayPal and notify them, as well. I have been dealing with ebay for years, and this does not fit into the "safe" trading habits ebay touts.

I would be very cautious, and if you don''t feel comfortable, ask to have the transaction cancelled (you have ample reason for your trepidation) and ebay is very accommodating. Be sure to keep your emails from this seller as both ebay and PayPal will probably ask for them. They will be able to trace where they came from as well as whether or not this is a legitimate seller.

I am so sorry you are having to deal with this. I, too, have hit a few snags with ebay along the way, but in the past several years, they have ALWAYS made things right, so be confident that that will be the case now.

Good luck and let us know how it all turns out.

 

[Kay]

Date: 9/15/2007 12:38:08 PM
Author: shminbabe


paypal IS the best way to go, isn''t it? in that my personal information is protection from the seller, right?

I only shop sporadically on ebay, but I always pay using paypal. For extra protection, I pay paypal using my AMEX card. I know from experience with a couple of furniture stores that AMEX is pretty quick to reverse a change if the merchandise is not delivered or is "nonconforming tender" (i.e., not the same item you ordered, damaged, etc. -- a fake would fit in this category). That way, if paypal gives me a hassle about a refund, I''ll just call AMEX.

I always request that the seller ship the item insured. I have had both USPS and UPS just leave packages on the doorstep w/o a signature when we are not home. I would send the seller another e-mail asking for a single invoice that includes all costs, including shipping insurance (if not already included). If the seller does not comply, you should be able to cancel the transaction.

Hope it all works out for you!

 

[Kaleigh]

My daughter buys from ebay, and uses pay pal. She buys clothes mostly. Just wanted to wish you good luck, hope it all works out for you!!

 

[scarleta]

I would definitely pay only one invoice ( pay pal only) What difference does it make to seller who gets their money.I don''t have much experience with ebay or pay pal , but don''t expect much help in a hurry.Just let the seller know you only pay one invoice in full.HOpe it works for you..

 

[diane5006]

Hi...there may be svveral reasons why they are invoicing yo thi way...

I could be simply that they are a new seller and they made a mistake on the first one and corrected it...

Yes they could be trying something fishy...but it could be a simple problem of them not being experienced at invoicing

The best place to get info...is in the eBay answer center...

http://pages.ebay.com/community/answercenter/index.html

this is a memeber to member forum where experienced eBayers help people

You can also get you sellers phone number and call them to sort things out...

The safest way to pay is via Paypal back by a credit card...

Best of Luck...

diane

 

[shminbabe]

thanks, you guys, for all the input. it helps me a lot.

i e mailed the seller last night as i told you. very courteous, explained my situation, etc., and asked why 2 invoices, that i''d have no protection,etc.

i did not receive an answer. rather, the seller issued another 2 invoices, ostensibly from paypal, with the language now a reminder to pay. i wrote back, said please reply to my emails, we need to discuss this, etc. then i wrote to the e bay help desk (whatever you call them) and explained the situation, gave them the seller id and item #. it might take 48 hours to hear back.

does paypal simply issue pre-programmed invoicing? if the seller does not reply to me, i can have the transaction cancelled? shouldn''t all sellers be reachable via e mail? i realize it''s only been one day since I "won" the item, but i want to be on top of the situation in case there really is a dispute. i will not pay if the seller refuses to communicate.

so, i should contact paypal as well?

thanks so much. this is really new territory for me. i think i was downright stupid to even bid with a brand new seller? what was i thinking, really? (okay, i was thinking of that gorgeous david yurman blue topaz petite albion ring with pave diamonds...probably the other bidders were wary of the seller, don''t you think?) a great big

DUH to me. sometimes my naivete amazes me.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

I do not think you can cancel. I don''t think contacting Paypal is the thing to do either. I''d focus on getting advice from Ebay what to do about the two invoices. Use that member forum while you wait to hear from Ebay. There are probably people on there who may have some advice.

 

[shminbabe]

Okay, I did post my question on the members forum on e Bay. I really hope it works.

How can I get the seller''s phone number when the seller won''t reply to my e mail? I won''t give up hope yet; it''s only been about 36 hours since the auction ended. But still, I''ve received those two invoices, twice now, from her.

On another e Bay matter: in 2005 I got negative feedback on a transaction that never even happened. I contacted e Bay, and the seller both but no one replied so I just gave up, since I rarely use e Bay. But still, that negative item is there. It says I refused to reply and ignored the dispute! I honestly never knew there was a dispute against me, was not aware i''d won an auction. No one ever corresponded with me. What was THAT about? It was in ''05; should I just forget about it and explain it to a future seller if I ever have to?

Geesh.

 

[ljmorgan]

It''s only been 36 hours as you said, I wouldn''t get upset just yet about her saying something negative. What is her payment policy listed on the auction, near the bottom? Usually you have something like 7 days to pay, a time period set by the seller. It is very unusual to give two invoices, there is no reason for that, and I would not pay like that. So far you''re doing the right thing. Usually you can go to the auction page where you won, and click a link to see the seller''s contact information (phone and address.) But again if you have 7 days to pay, I''d give it a few days before you call the seller.

About your negative feedback from the transaction that never happened -- that would definitely be unusual. There is no way to leave feedback for a member unless you have bought/sold with them. The only thing I can think of is that someone used your account without you knowing. When my husband and I returned from our honeymoon, we found 10+ auctions under his account, selling expensive golf clubs!! The person was then linking it to his own paypal account, to take people''s money and run. We immediately shut down the auctions, thankfully no one had purchased them yet, reported it to eBay, and changed his password.

If you haven''t changed your password since ''05, you might want to now.

 

[Sabine]

I don''t know if this is relevant for your situation or not, but another thing to check out is the shipping time promised in the auction. One time I bought a DVD from a seller that said they were shipping from the US, but really they were overseas. I hadn''t read the fine print, but they said in the auction that they had, umm, I think it was 30 days to deliver the item. When I didn''t receive the item, I couldn''t file a claim until those days were up, and I think Paypal has a limit on the timeperiod you can file claims with. Although I complained to ebay when I didn''t receive the DVD, and the seller was eventually kicked off ebay, I never got a refund because I waited too long to file with Paypal. Luckily I was only out the price of a DVD.

Wishing you good luck!

 

[shminbabe]

Just an update: well, the seller did communicate with me yesterday, so I do feel better. She fixed things with Paypal (had an explanation about why 2 invoices, something with Paypal like someone else here mentioned) so she sent me one single invoice which I paid via Paypal and my credit card, so in case something goes wrong I''ll have recourse (right?!). I figure w/ Paypal and then the credit card, I''ll have backup if I need to argue the payment. Anyway, she said she''d had bad luck with sellers before so she hoped I''d feel better now that she''d given me a single invoice. I really do hope it''s okay. After all, it''s $380. But, if it does work out well and the ring is as promised, it''s a David Yurman blue topaz Petite Albion ring with pave diamonds, in sterling silver and I love it.

Oh, shipping time? Well, I don''t remember what was promised about speed of shipping, if anything. I''m kind of naive here; I better go check.

Thanks for all of your good advice, you guys. I''ll let you know if/when it comes.

 

[shminbabe]

UPDATE

I paid the seller last night.

Just now I received an e mail from e Bay advising me NOT to pay; that she''s been removed from e Bay and if I''ve already paid, to take steps to file a claim, stop payment, etc.

I should have trusted my instincts, shouldn''t I ?

 

[gailrmv]

OH NO!!! So sorry to hear it!
Don''t beat yourself up. Every buyer/seller has a first time and if nobody took a chance with them, nobody could become experience buyes/sellers, right? As I mentioned on your other thread I had to dispute a seller once and I won and got my money back even though it took a long time. Keep us posted and don''t beat yourself up.

 

[Ellen]

Date: 9/17/2007 10:23:33 AM
Author: shminbabe
UPDATE

I paid the seller last night.

Just now I received an e mail from e Bay advising me NOT to pay; that she''s been removed from e Bay and if I''ve already paid, to take steps to file a claim, stop payment, etc.

I should have trusted my instincts, shouldn''t I ?

Have you called the CC Co.??

 

[aquarius_ser]

Did you pay with a credit card, if so call them immediately and try cancel the transaction.

 

[shminbabe]

Yes, I did call both Paypal and my credit card co. I paid w/ my c.c. via paypal. I have to open a dispute with paypal, and then go through the same process with my credit card but first I have to wait until the transaction is posted on my statement, which it hasn''t, yet.

Since the seller invoiced me albeit via Paypal, that means I did pay outside of e Bay. That should have been a clue. Her e Bay payment option was a straight credit card and I wasn''t about to give her my credit card # so I thought it best to do Paypal. But it was really just like sending her money, you know? I am SO STUPID.

I do think I''ll manage to get this resolved as I just saved all my e mails which I started as soon as the auction was over, which expressly state my concerns over her payment requests, and then e Bay''s message to me of this morning. But still. What if I don''t? Paypal said she could send me an empty box which would then give her a tracking # to show them that the item was sent. I can''t believe I did this. This is my payback for trying to buy something I should not have. I am too impulsive. And now potentially out $380

 

[Independent Gal]

It''s going to be OK! It may cause a little hassle for you, but I''ll be surprised if you don''t get either your ring, or your money back, given all the documentation.

 

[TravelingGal]

I''m sorry to hear this shminbabe...hopefully all will be OK! I did buy mine from an ebay seller who seems very reputable and still sells a lot of yurman stuff there (how she gets the merchandise, I don''t know.) I even took it to yurman and all seems fine with it. So if you are patient, you still may be able to find what you want for a deal.

 

[gailrmv]

I really hope (and think) that you will get your money back. Really!! I am sure ebay and paypal probably deal with this sort of thing pretty often and have good procedures in place. I think, honestly that they are usually more in the buyer''s favor than the seller, and if they kicked off your seller from ebay, they must have some reason to be suspicious and thus I would think, even more likely to be in your favor.

Don''t get me wrong I would be feeling just like you are, if it were me, but I really have a good feeling that it will work out in your favor.

 

[fleur-de-lis]

SHMINBABE, just jump through all the Paypal hoops as soon as possible to freeze/return payment and the odds are very good that things will turn out in your favor.

I''ve been an Ebay member since 1999. I don''t use it often, but I''ve been both a seller (of designer clothes that still have their tags on them in my closet

) and intermittent buyer (rare books, kerastase products for significantly less than at the salon). I one time sold an item to a disreputable buyer who rescinded her Paypal payment after she had USPS confirmation that it had shipped and then kept sending different -- and contradictory -- complaints why she shouldn''t pay... while keeping the item.

Anyhow, I just followed the procedure Paypal laid out, sent the proof I had that I had been the honest party, and the folks at Paypal figured it out correctly. I don''t know if the other party was dishonest or perhaps had some sort of mental illness involving multiple personalities, but the people at Paypal figured it out when given the evidence without much difficulty. So don''t worry, just do what you can to make your case; the fact that Ebay cancelled the transaction should indicate the fraud element you need. (Remember, Paypal is owned by Ebay, and the system only works when the consumer confidence is there.)

[BTW, it always amuses me to hear people''s requirements to buy (500 items sold, 99.8% positive feedback, etc.). I mean, sure, you don''t want to buy something expensive from someone with zero feedback. However, I''ve been on there casually for almost 8 years, but since I don''t beg for feedback, I think I currently have a score of about 90. But thanks to that one crazy person, my 89 positives to 1 negative means I have a feedback under 99%. Oh well.]

Good luck, and don''t worry, if you file with both Paypal and your credit card (and provide cross-evidence), the odds are pretty good that it will work out for you in the end.

 

[aquarius_ser]

I would keep following up with them on a daily basis, the squeaky wheel gets the oil, ya know?? They probably have a lot of this....

This kind of thing just INFURIATES me.

PEOPLE SUCK!