do teachers always write with perfect grammars?

[Dancing Fire]

do they ever make mistakes with their grammars and spellings?...

 

[Guilty Pleasure]

title question: no.


thread question: yes.

 

[davi_el_mejor]

I know a lot of math teachers who don't know the difference between a subordinate or insubordinate clause...

 

[that_someone_special]

I know a lot of math teachers who don't know the difference between a subordinate or insubordinate clause...

 

[isaku5]

Speaking from my own experience only and based on 19 years of teaching secondary school, there are quite a few teachers who mess up both grammar and spelling. Yikes!!!

 

[somethingshiny]

My mom used to correct the teachers' notes in red pen and return them to the school.

 

[PinkTower]

I am sure we do make mistakes. There are 21 small children in my classroom. I do not make many mistakes in written notes to parents, because I do not have time to write the notes in the first place.

 

[Tuckins1]

Of course we make mistakes!! Often if i'm in a rush, or just in casual conversation I find myself using incorrect grammar or idioms. I've always had a good sense of proper grammar, so I don't think that's just a teacher thing. I do pay close attention when i'm at work, because I want to be sure to set a good example and hold my students to the same standard to which I hold myself.

 

[katamari]

Of course not. The difference isn't that I am able to write a perfect first draft and they are not. Instead, it is that I am willing to edit something until it is well-written, and they (mostly) are not.

 

[AGBF]

do they ever make mistakes with their grammars and spellings?...

It would be cheering if one could believe that it was only math teachers who made egregious grammatical and spelling errors, or that

the incidence of such errors was low, but I fear that neither is the case. I think that almost all teachers in classrooms today have

problems speaking and writing correctly. Many incredible teachers with great grammatical precision have retired from the lists!

(Isabelle, are you still teaching?)


Deb/AGBF

 

[Dancing Fire]

do they ever make mistakes with their grammars and spellings?...

It would be cheering if one could believe that it was only math teachers who made egregious grammatical and spelling errors, or that

the incidence of such errors was low, but I fear that neither is the case. I think that almost all teachers in classrooms today have

problems speaking and writing correctly. Many incredible teachers with great grammatical precision have retired from the lists!

(Isabelle, are you still teaching?)


Deb/AGBF

how about Dan Quayle isn't he well educated?...

 

[davi_el_mejor]

how about Dan Quayle isn't he well educated?...

Who?

 

[yennyfire]

This is one of my MAJOR pet peeves. I am a stickler for grammar and punctuation and it drives me nuts when teachers butcher the English language. I don't like it when anyone does it, but to me, it's worse when the people who are educating our children are doing it incorrectly. Have you read the book, Eat, Shoots & Leaves by Lynne Truss? It's a humorous book about a zero tolerance policy regarding poor punctuation and grammar.

One of my favorites:

"If you have any questions, see Mrs. So and So or myself"....nope, it's "see Mrs. So and So and me"...the principal of my son's elementary school gets this wrong over the PA system on a regular basis.

 

[isaku5]

Speaking from my own experience only and based on 19 years of teaching secondary school, there are quite a few teachers who mess up both grammar and spelling. Yikes!!!

AGBF, if you were referring to my post on this topic, I deserve 20 lashes for the redundancy 'committed' there.

I retired several years ago (a good thing, right ).

While our granddaughter was in elementary school, I helped her proofread her history project. What it lacked in content (according to her teacher), it made up for in both spelling and grammar. He made no comment on those positives writing that, " They are merely conventions"??? What!!!??? Yet another elementary teacher who can't spell...

 

[Haven]

Yes, teachers make errors in their writing; I know I am certainly one of them.

I won't pretend to be better than that, although in my professional correspondence I do take the time to edit and revise my work. (I apologize to everyone here on PS, as I don't take the time to do much of that with my posts. )

The history of grammar education in America and the UK is really very interesting. If you were in school before the '60s, you were probably taught traditional grammar--you learned to parse sentences, and memorized a prescriptive set of rules about grammar. You also probably believe that there are a firm set of rules about correct and incorrect usage, and that grammar rules don't change over time. (Both of these beliefs are untrue.) If you were in school between the 1960s and 1990s, you probably didn't have much exposure to grammar at all. Instead, you were exposed to language in society and "natural" use, and are likely to have little or no appreciation of the grammar. If you were in school after the 1990s, you were likely introduced to grammatical terminology and rules, but in a way that placed grammar in the larger context of how it is used to make meaning in language.*

Isn't it fascinating? Our expectations about grammar, and our approach to it, are largely influenced by our educational experiences, which are largely influenced by the educational trends of the time.

*I'm almost certain that I regurgitated this information straight from David Crystal's How Language Works. (<--A great book for anyone who is interested in a general overview of linguistics. I believe it was published around 2005. I have a nerd crush on Mr. Crystal, he's a fabulous linguist and his writing on the subject is wonderful.)

I think Pink Tower's post ("I am sure we do make mistakes. There are 21 small children in my classroom. I do not make many mistakes in written notes to parents, because I do not have time to write the notes in the first place") speaks to a larger problem in education. As we ask more and more of our teachers, I challenge you to consider what they should give up in order to meet the growing demands of the job. Precision in spoken and written language? Individualized attention to students? Professional development experiences? Quality lessons? Feedback on student work?

I also want to assuage anyone's fears that a teacher is going to ruin a child's literacy development. Parents have the strongest influence on a child's literacy development, and that influence begins the day your child is born and continues well into his adult years.

 

[davi_el_mejor]

Yes, teachers make errors in their writing; I know I am certainly one of them.

I won't pretend to be better than that, although in my professional correspondence I do take the time to edit and revise my work. (I apologize to everyone here on PS, as I don't take the time to do much of that with my posts. )

The history of grammar education in America and the UK is really very interesting. If you were in school before the '60s, you were probably taught traditional grammar--you learned to parse sentences, and memorized a prescriptive set of rules about grammar. You also probably believe that there are a firm set of rules about correct and incorrect usage, and that grammar rules don't change over time. (Both of these beliefs are untrue.) If you were in school between the 1960s and 1990s, you probably didn't have much exposure to grammar at all. Instead, you were exposed to language in society and "natural" use, and are likely to have little or no appreciation of the grammar. If you were in school after the 1990s, you were likely introduced to grammatical terminology and rules, but in a way that placed grammar in the larger context of how it is used to make meaning in language.*

Isn't it fascinating? Our expectations about grammar, and our approach to it, are largely influenced by our educational experiences, which are largely influenced by the educational trends of the time.

I'm a post 90's educated student. I learned very little in the ways of grammar. Granted, I took "normal" English classes in HS. My friends who applied themselves, learned a butt-ton of grammar in the their AP classes. They diagrammed sentences and learned how to use ";" correctly.

In fact, I learned more grammar in my four years of French classes than 12 years of taking English.

 

[Jennifer W]

Everyone makes mistakes, that's fine. Notes written in a hurry are something I could forgive easily. Most people know how it is to be under pressure at work. What really annoys me is hearing a teacher use incorrect grammar in spoken English, because that suggests to me that they don't know any better.

I spoke to the woman who is likely to be my daughter's first teacher last week - she said "I done my Christmas shopping online this year." I've also heard here say "I seen you at Church." Either that has to improve or we have to find a different school.

My mother was a teacher and grammar was a big, big deal to her. She said that by the time she retired, she was correcting it in the staff room as often as in the classroom.

 

[ksinger]

I was in elementary school in the late 60's, and I can tell you, at least where I was, that grammar WAS taught. In 4th grade, for some reason, I started losing it. I was getting lost in all those parts of speech. I told my mother - that product of 12 years of parochial school - and she said, "Oh NO. THAT will never DO!" and proceeded to drill me on the parts of speech until I could recite them in my sleep. Later, I was the grammar wiz, and just LOVED diagramming sentences, the more complicated the better. Nowadays I probably couldn't tell you if my particple was dangling if you grabbed it and bludgeoned me with it. But the rules never really leave you, if you learn them early enough. They're always there, under the surface, directing you.

I don't mind people using some bad grammar, but I can usually tell if a person is doing that because they are making a conscious "artistic" choice, or because they are ignorant. It's really pretty easy to tell if you listen closely. I'm all for creatively breaking the rules a bit....once you know the rules.

My husband has several marked regional speech mannerisms that are not grammatically correct (and he knows it) but they are retained almost as an affectionate tip-of-the-hat to his rural roots. So, other than the little conciously chosen fillip here and there, his speech is quite lovely, and he has a truly comprehensive collection of pithy phrases collected and composed over a lifetime. Even after all this time he can catch me off guard and have me in stitches with a clever new phrase. His vocabulary is extensive, his spelling is middling (spellcheck is a boon to him), his handwriting is an atrocity ( he has really large blocky hands better suited to ripping apart engines than penmanship), but his written word is excellent. I stil treasure his emails for their spare, sardonic style.

I can guarantee you one thing, his grammar towers above that of his students, and most of their parents.

 

[ksinger]

Yes, teachers make errors in their writing; I know I am certainly one of them.

I won't pretend to be better than that, although in my professional correspondence I do take the time to edit and revise my work. (I apologize to everyone here on PS, as I don't take the time to do much of that with my posts. )

The history of grammar education in America and the UK is really very interesting. If you were in school before the '60s, you were probably taught traditional grammar--you learned to parse sentences, and memorized a prescriptive set of rules about grammar. You also probably believe that there are a firm set of rules about correct and incorrect usage, and that grammar rules don't change over time. (Both of these beliefs are untrue.) If you were in school between the 1960s and 1990s, you probably didn't have much exposure to grammar at all. Instead, you were exposed to language in society and "natural" use, and are likely to have little or no appreciation of the grammar. If you were in school after the 1990s, you were likely introduced to grammatical terminology and rules, but in a way that placed grammar in the larger context of how it is used to make meaning in language.*

Isn't it fascinating? Our expectations about grammar, and our approach to it, are largely influenced by our educational experiences, which are largely influenced by the educational trends of the time.

*I'm almost certain that I regurgitated this information straight from David Crystal's How Language Works. (<--A great book for anyone who is interested in a general overview of linguistics. I believe it was published around 2005. I have a nerd crush on Mr. Crystal, he's a fabulous linguist and his writing on the subject is wonderful.)

I think Pink Tower's post ("I am sure we do make mistakes. There are 21 small children in my classroom. I do not make many mistakes in written notes to parents, because I do not have time to write the notes in the first place") speaks to a larger problem in education. As we ask more and more of our teachers, I challenge you to consider what they should give up in order to meet the growing demands of the job. Precision in spoken and written language? Individualized attention to students? Professional development experiences? Quality lessons? Feedback on student work?

I also want to assuage anyone's fears that a teacher is going to ruin a child's literacy development. Parents have the strongest influence on a child's literacy development, and that influence begins the day your child is born and continues well into his adult years.

Haven, I STILL have my MOTHER'S coverless, yellowed, and very dog-eared copy of "The Plain English Handbook" (last copyright on it is 1951) that she had in highschool, and later gave to me. I'm sure it is much more rigid than what is taught today, but that was my guide when I was in highschool. It even has a section on oral communications, with rules of what to do and what not to do. One of them is this: "Do not be overcorrect: Use good wholesome speech, but do not overdo it be becoming finicky about unimportant usages." It seems like a good thing to remember when it really is something minor.

And yes, my mother was THE most important influence in my life as far as speaking and writing correctly. She NEVER let me get away with a mispronounced word, or incorrect usage. And I ALWAYS was told to "go look it up". That annoyed me immensely at the time, but has been one of the best habits I was ever forced into!

And Haven. Tsk. You of all people should KNOW that teachers are supposed to mitigate EVERY failing of the parents and be solely responsible for a child's success or failure. How can you be so ignorant on this topic??

 

[Haven]

I see I should have added the disclaimer that the general trends I spoke of in my last post are just that--general trends in education. I'm sure we can all add anecdotes about how *our own* education differed from the trends that emerged as a result of ongoing linguistic research and focus. My point is that your experience of and beliefs about grammar are greatly influenced by factors such as when, where, and by whom you were educated.

Grammar is a fascinating linguistic subject. I love the way people respond so strongly to it, an effect we can see by the range of emotions expressed in this thread. Language is constantly evolving, and thus the rules do change over time. The evolution of language is what I find most fascinating, really, because the language itself becomes a historiography of the culture and its norms.

ETA:

KSinger--We are so very much alike in this respect! I still use a faded old copy of the High School Handbook of Composition by Wooley, Scott & Tressler, copyright 1931. I found a first edition of it in my grandparents' junk shop (ahem, I mean antique store) when I was in middle school, and immediately fell in love. Some of the rules are outdated, and the examples are so dated they're hilarious, but I love my little book.

ETA 2:

I know my favorite linguists would tsk tsk me for using such an old reference, but I can't let it go. I can't do it!

KSinger--I keep forgetting that my job as an educator is to educate and to parent. How is it that I just can't get that into my head?
Shocking, isn't it, that the moment a childless individual dares to post a response in a thread about parenting here on PS, for example, she is immediately reminded of her inability to truly understand because she has no children. Yet, we expect all of our educators, many of whom are childless, to do a better job of parenting than the parents themselves. A conundrum, yes?
Ah, sorry all--I love discussing education with KSinger and can't pass up an opportunity to do so. Carry on, grammarians!

 

[ksinger]

I see I should have added the disclaimer that the general trends I spoke of in my last post are just that--general trends in education. I'm sure we can all add anecdotes about how *our own* education differed from the trends that emerged as a result of ongoing linguistic research and focus. My point is that your experience of and beliefs about grammar are greatly influenced by factors such as when, where, and by whom you were educated.

Grammar is a fascinating linguistic subject. I love the way people respond so strongly to it, an effect we can see by the range of emotions expressed in this thread. Language is constantly evolving, and thus the rules do change over time. The evolution of language is what I find most fascinating, really, because the language itself becomes a historiography of the culture and its norms.

ETA:

KSinger--We are so very much alike in this respect! I still use a faded old copy of the High School Handbook of Composition by Wooley, Scott & Tressler, copyright 1931. I found a first edition of it in my grandparents' junk shop (ahem, I mean antique store) when I was in middle school, and immediately fell in love. Some of the rules are outdated, and the examples are so dated they're hilarious, but I love my little book.

ETA 2:

I know my favorite linguists would tsk tsk me for using such an old reference, but I can't let it go. I can't do it!

KSinger--I keep forgetting that my job as an educator is to educate and to parent. How is it that I just can't get that into my head?
Shocking, isn't it, that the moment a childless individual dares to post a response in a thread about parenting here on PS, for example, she is immediately reminded of her inability to truly understand because she has no children. Yet, we expect all of our educators, many of whom are childless, to do a better job of parenting than the parents themselves. A conundrum, yes?
Ah, sorry all--I love discussing education with KSinger and can't pass up an opportunity to do so. Carry on, grammarians!

Hah! Or even worse Haven, parents expect those teachers WITH children to neglect their own and be on call 24/7 for them and THEIR children. No boundaries. I mean, those teachers have no life other than MY kid, right? Hubs, as a child of a teacher, finds the concept of being a parent AND being a teacher problematic, having been on the receiving end of a parent who was a teacher. That teacher was frequently emotionally wrung-out at the end (like there really IS one) of his work day. Only when he became a teacher himself did he understand his father's situation more, but apparently it was pretty rough as a kid...

End jack. Back to the topic at hand...

 

[PinkTower]

I was in elementary school in the late 60's, and I can tell you, at least where I was, that grammar WAS taught. In 4th grade, for some reason, I started losing it. I was getting lost in all those parts of speech. I told my mother - that product of 12 years of parochial school - and she said, "Oh NO. THAT will never DO!" and proceeded to drill me on the parts of speech until I could recite them in my sleep. Later, I was the grammar wiz, and just LOVED diagramming sentences, the more complicated the better. Nowadays I probably couldn't tell you if my particple was dangling if you grabbed it and bludgeoned me with it. But the rules never really leave you, if you learn them early enough. They're always there, under the surface, directing you.

I don't mind people using some bad grammar, but I can usually tell if a person is doing that because they are making a conscious "artistic" choice, or because they are ignorant. It's really pretty easy to tell if you listen closely. I'm all for creatively breaking the rules a bit....once you know the rules.

My husband has several marked regional speech mannerisms that are not grammatically correct (and he knows it) but they are retained almost as an affectionate tip-of-the-hat to his rural roots. So, other than the little conciously chosen fillip here and there, his speech is quite lovely, and he has a truly comprehensive collection of pithy phrases collected and composed over a lifetime. Even after all this time he can catch me off guard and have me in stitches with a clever new phrase. His vocabulary is extensive, his spelling is middling (spellcheck is a boon to him), his handwriting is an atrocity ( he has really large blocky hands better suited to ripping apart engines than penmanship), but his written word is excellent. I stil treasure his emails for their spare, sardonic style.

I can guarantee you one thing, his grammar towers above that of his students, and most of their parents.

I am going to go out on a limb here and make a guess that your DH is from the rural South? (As am I)
It is as if we find a kinship this way. We just have so many colorful aspects of our speech that we slip into when we are together. Of course we know that sentences don't end in prepositions, etc. ("Where are you at?") I think a lot of cultures have similar stories.

However, there is a lot of difference between what I am referring to and substandard speech, such as substituting "seen" for "saw."
I cannot express this very well, but I know many people like your husband, and I think it is sad that speech is sort of a melting pot now. I speak with a Tidewater/Coastal Southern accent, and my ears pick it up when I hear it, because it is no longer something I hear everyday. I guess people who have moved here from other countries feel this way all the time.

 

[ksinger]

I was in elementary school in the late 60's, and I can tell you, at least where I was, that grammar WAS taught. In 4th grade, for some reason, I started losing it. I was getting lost in all those parts of speech. I told my mother - that product of 12 years of parochial school - and she said, "Oh NO. THAT will never DO!" and proceeded to drill me on the parts of speech until I could recite them in my sleep. Later, I was the grammar wiz, and just LOVED diagramming sentences, the more complicated the better. Nowadays I probably couldn't tell you if my particple was dangling if you grabbed it and bludgeoned me with it. But the rules never really leave you, if you learn them early enough. They're always there, under the surface, directing you.

I don't mind people using some bad grammar, but I can usually tell if a person is doing that because they are making a conscious "artistic" choice, or because they are ignorant. It's really pretty easy to tell if you listen closely. I'm all for creatively breaking the rules a bit....once you know the rules.

My husband has several marked regional speech mannerisms that are not grammatically correct (and he knows it) but they are retained almost as an affectionate tip-of-the-hat to his rural roots. So, other than the little conciously chosen fillip here and there, his speech is quite lovely, and he has a truly comprehensive collection of pithy phrases collected and composed over a lifetime. Even after all this time he can catch me off guard and have me in stitches with a clever new phrase. His vocabulary is extensive, his spelling is middling (spellcheck is a boon to him), his handwriting is an atrocity ( he has really large blocky hands better suited to ripping apart engines than penmanship), but his written word is excellent. I stil treasure his emails for their spare, sardonic style.

I can guarantee you one thing, his grammar towers above that of his students, and most of their parents.

I am going to go out on a limb here and make a guess that your DH is from the rural South? (As am I)
It is as if we find a kinship this way. We just have so many colorful aspects of our speech that we slip into when we are together. Of course we know that sentences don't end in prepositions, etc. ("Where are you at?") I think a lot of cultures have similar stories.

However, there is a lot of difference between what I am referring to and substandard speech, such as substituting "seen" for "saw."
I cannot express this very well, but I know many people like your husband, and I think it is sad that speech is sort of a melting pot now. I speak with a Tidewater/Coastal Southern accent, and my ears pick it up when I hear it, because it is no longer something I hear everyday. I guess people who have moved here from other countries feel this way all the time.

He's not from the rural south, he hails from rural Oklahoma. I'm from here too although a city girl and daughter of Coloradans, but he has the genuine drawl of the state, while me? not so much, although in other states it is apparent, I'm certain. The one thing I hear from him regularly is during the course of a greeting: to him: "How are you today?" him: "Just fine! And yourself?" I find it endearing, but on others it might grate.

And yes, I understand what you're talking about. I worked with a woman who consistently said, "had went", and generally got tenses backwards. Drove me nuts.

Now, I say "I've gone and done whatever" or "went and got", which I KNOW are wrong, but hey, it's part of the speech pattern around here, so I don't think too much about it. (And of course y'all, with the occasional all y'all!) Oddly enough, the aforementioned are the ones that drive my husband nuts. We all have out little "things". But you know what? When the situation requires, I can be very formal indeed. No slang. Standard usage. Clip the consonants, and un-dip or tripthong the vowels. I always try to tailor my speech to the sitution and the listeners, within limits of course. And isn't that pretty much what it's all about? I like having the palette of choices that comes from knowing the difference.

 

[Jennifer W]

I see I should have added the disclaimer that the general trends I spoke of in my last post are just that--general trends in education. I'm sure we can all add anecdotes about how *our own* education differed from the trends that emerged as a result of ongoing linguistic research and focus. My point is that your experience of and beliefs about grammar are greatly influenced by factors such as when, where, and by whom you were educated.

Grammar is a fascinating linguistic subject. I love the way people respond so strongly to it, an effect we can see by the range of emotions expressed in this thread. Language is constantly evolving, and thus the rules do change over time. The evolution of language is what I find most fascinating, really, because the language itself becomes a historiography of the culture and its norms.

ETA:

KSinger--We are so very much alike in this respect! I still use a faded old copy of the High School Handbook of Composition by Wooley, Scott & Tressler, copyright 1931. I found a first edition of it in my grandparents' junk shop (ahem, I mean antique store) when I was in middle school, and immediately fell in love. Some of the rules are outdated, and the examples are so dated they're hilarious, but I love my little book.

ETA 2:

I know my favorite linguists would tsk tsk me for using such an old reference, but I can't let it go. I can't do it!

KSinger--I keep forgetting that my job as an educator is to educate and to parent. How is it that I just can't get that into my head?
Shocking, isn't it, that the moment a childless individual dares to post a response in a thread about parenting here on PS, for example, she is immediately reminded of her inability to truly understand because she has no children. Yet, we expect all of our educators, many of whom are childless, to do a better job of parenting than the parents themselves. A conundrum, yes?
Ah, sorry all--I love discussing education with KSinger and can't pass up an opportunity to do so. Carry on, grammarians!

It might be a very different system in the US, but I would be as mad as hell over a teacher attempting to parent my child. That's my job and I will be the only one who does it (well, my husband does half of it, but you know what I mean). Are parents really happy to allow this? Or is it just some parents?

 

[swimmer]

Oh Jennifer, I wish your kid was in my class.

A brief list of things that I have found that SOME parents EXPECT teachers to explain: (Haven, Pink, Ksinger, others, please add)

inappropriateness of burping/picking nose/zits/scabs in public
how to resolve conflict without violence
use of deodorant
regular showering/changing clothes (to clarify, these are not poor kids)
use of table utensils, chewing with mouth closed, not speaking with mouth full of food
sharing is good (I teach 17-21yr olds)
bring a writing utensil to class (be prepared)
look adults in the eye
tell the truth
be kind to others
don't smoke, it is not cool and no one will ever want to kiss your smelly pre-cancerous mouth
don't pick on others, not only is it cruel and wrong, now it is illegal
write your own paper, the internet is a tool, not the end deal. (Oh and to parents who say "how do you know that the website didn't copy from my kid?" What exactly are you trying to teach your kid?)
getting pregnant in high school is economically and emotionally a bad call, my suggestion is to simply not speak to males till college.
And of course, use of tampons and/or condoms -I coach the swim team, you can't make your daughter sign up for a water sport without preparing her for what to do about her period. The girls always want to know how they work, I just give them the instruction packet from in the box. I sometimes wonder how I still have my job. I feel for the health teacher...
ETA corollary to this, do not dress like a lady of the night for a 7:30am class.

Again, I teach world history, 6,000bce to today in 180 days of school, how I manage to regularly hit many of the above I really don't know. Why parents seem to expect that we want to or even can teach these things is beyond me. Ksinger, it is an interesting phenomenon. Parents have told me while I'm in the middle of expelling their kid for violence/drugs/trying to set up a prostitution ring/something else that is awful, that I can't understand I don't have kids...but now that I do have one, I am even more determined to do anything that will prevent him from becoming like their spawn.

 

[Imdanny]

I doubt it.

 

[ksinger]

Oh Jennifer, I wish your kid was in my class.

A brief list of things that I have found that SOME parents EXPECT teachers to explain: (Haven, Pink, Ksinger, others, please add)

inappropriateness of burping/picking nose/zits/scabs in public
how to resolve conflict without violence
use of deodorant
regular showering/changing clothes (to clarify, these are not poor kids)
use of table utensils, chewing with mouth closed, not speaking with mouth full of food
sharing is good (I teach 17-21yr olds)
bring a writing utensil to class (be prepared)
look adults in the eye
tell the truth
be kind to others
don't smoke, it is not cool and no one will ever want to kiss your smelly pre-cancerous mouth
don't pick on others, not only is it cruel and wrong, now it is illegal
write your own paper, the internet is a tool, not the end deal. (Oh and to parents who say "how do you know that the website didn't copy from my kid?" What exactly are you trying to teach your kid?)
getting pregnant in high school is economically and emotionally a bad call, my suggestion is to simply not speak to males till college.
And of course, use of tampons and/or condoms -I coach the swim team, you can't make your daughter sign up for a water sport without preparing her for what to do about her period. The girls always want to know how they work, I just give them the instruction packet from in the box. I sometimes wonder how I still have my job. I feel for the health teacher...
ETA corollary to this, do not dress like a lady of the night for a 7:30am class.

Again, I teach world history, 6,000bce to today in 180 days of school, how I manage to regularly hit many of the above I really don't know. Why parents seem to expect that we want to or even can teach these things is beyond me. Ksinger, it is an interesting phenomenon. Parents have told me while I'm in the middle of expelling their kid for violence/drugs/trying to set up a prostitution ring/something else that is awful, that I can't understand I don't have kids...but now that I do have one, I am even more determined to do anything that will prevent him from becoming like their spawn.

Yes. All of it. Especially the deodorant thing. Only in his case the girls PUT IT ON IN CLASS. Yeah. Nice. Also, lessons on how to converse with another person without every other word being f*** is also a common lesson. He often points out that many of the kids that they have assessed as learning disabled are really SOCIALLY disabled. He says too much of their time is spent trying to make too many kids minimally HUMAN. I may have mentioned this, but just in case I didn't, a few months back, there was one day where there was a 1)kid resisting arrest, 2)another kid who threatened rape, and 3)2 kids caught doing the horizontal mambo on the bathroom FLOOR.

The schizophrenic attitude of many people to teaching just floors me most of the time really. The teacher should have....noticed the bullying/depression/lying/insert whatever. However, no matter how gently they TELL the parents this, they don't listen, because any criticism of their precious darling is unfair and don't you DARE parent MY kid. Right. You'd better hope SOMEONE is doing remedial parenting, because many parents aren't doing the minimum, the schools get the brunt of it, and because your kid is hanging out with these kids, and apparently it runs the spectrum from the poorest all the way up to the richest districts. No amount of money or gates are going to protect your children from THOSE KIDS.

Any teacher here will tell you that dealing with the kids is a cakewalk compared to dealing with irrational, defensive, blame-deflecting parents. It's NEVER their kid that is the problem.

 

[zoebartlett]

About the grammar issue, of course teachers make mistakes, just like everyone else.

About the parenting issue, I teach 7-8 year olds, I have no children of my own, and I have no experience teaching or working with the big kids. For those who do, bless you.

I've had students who showed up to school and you could tell they hadn't taken a bath recently. Their clothes were dirty, and so on...There's not much I can do about that other than possibly send him/her to the nurse to find ore appropriate clothing and clean up a bit. I can and do, however, spend extra time with these children. If they act out or are doing poorly with their academic skills, I can modify work, be patient, and help instill a sense of self-confidence. I try to see things from their point of view. I also show them that I truly care about their well-being. Are these things that a parent should be doing? Yes, absolutely. It doesn't always happen though, sadly.

I know this was off-topic but I wanted to address Jennifer's comments. The example I mentioned is just one that I could have given. I don't pretend that I'm this child's parent because obviously I'm not. When the child is with me, however, I do everything I can to make him/her have a successful day.

 

[swimmer]

Bless you Zoe, for your good heart and working with the younger kids. My hat is off to you sweet girl! Sigh, it is so sad that little kids are neglected, that just breaks my heart.

To answer DF's question, well, English is not my first language so I do the best I can, but I trust the little red line under words to help me out. I have however seen atrocious grammatical usage from some teacher and many administrators. I did enjoy editing in red pen a newsletter from a principal and sending it back to him. He took a bit more time with it from then on.

I personally feel that people who make grammatical errors don't tend to write much that is worth reading. Especially for those who only speak English, master your own and only language or look like a fool for not taking the time to learn it.

 

[yennyfire]

Well said swimmer!