Did I get taken?

[dia help]

In retrospect, I probably should have done a bit more research before my purchase. Yesterday I purchased a diamond with the following dimensions:

1.01 Carats (round)
E Color
SI/1
EGL cert.
here''s the kicker, it has a depth of 68%

I paid $3100 for the diamond and the solitaire, white-gold setting. I feel as though it was a very good deal, but now I''m realizing that the depth may be way too high for a round diamond.

Can someone please comment and give their opinion? Thanks.

 

[pearcrazy]

For the diamond's weight, E color SI1 you sound like you got a good deal. But, what are the stone's dimensions? A 1 carat round stone with the proper depth will usually measure somewhere close to 6.5 by 6.5mm. I'm guessing that you diamond will measure much smaller across since a lot of weight is carried underneath the stone in a large depth %. So you may have a stone that looks closer to maybe .75 to .85 carat and doesn't sparkle nearly as much as a well cut diamond of that size would.

So if your diamond only looks like a 3 quarter carat why not just get a well cut 3 quarter carat that sparkles like crazy?

 

[Todd07]

Can you provide full details from the cert

 

[dia help]

I'm at work right now and don't have the cert with me. I'll post all the detailed information in a few hours when I get home.

 

[Todd07]

Also, if you are feeling bad about the purchase, can you return it? This will give you the freedom to study and buy the one you really want.

 

[dia help]

Is a depth of 68% extremely high for a round diamond and how much would that decrease the value of the stone?

 

[Todd07]

Price Stats




choose 1-1.5 carat round


$/carat for E SI1


H&A 5.9k


1A 5.6k


3B 4.7k




Choose the cut you want to compare and you can see the diamonds that back up the ave price, along with their numbers.


Since your diamond was significantly cheaper than the ave 3B cut internet pricing, something smells bad, sorry.




What is your return policy

 

[jesrush]

Value-wise you did not get "taken", that is reasonable price for a stone of those specs.

But yeah, that's too deep... not a well cut stone. That said, all diamonds are beautiful, even ones with mediocre cuts, so if you're happy with it I wouldn't fret.

Personally, I would probably take it back and look for something with a depth in the 60-62% range.

-JES

 

[quaeritur]

Sorry, I just don't agree that all diamonds are beautiful. I have seen some really really ugly ones... some of them may be in the good the bad and the ugly thread in the SMTR folder

 

[Carmel]

I'll also agree that there are some ugly ducklings out there – not that your purchase is one of them . . . but your eyes can play tricks on you, especially when you are making a heartfelt decision.

If the return policy is liberal, then slow down a bit and see if you can find some ideal cut stones for comparison. I don’t know if I would personally go to the extent of taking the purchased ring along for comparison (I’m too much of a Murphy’s Law cynic), especially if you don’t have insurance coverage on the ring yet. Another consideration of bringing the ring with you (assuming you do what some of us do, and go to a “mall” jeweler to see diamond variations) would be that you might not be very well received by the typical “mall” sales staff. I usually just behave as though I’m clueless - which isn’t too much of a stretch for me – and spend most of my energy actually absorbing what I see, not what I hear. You won’t find many stones with the stats just freely posted, and the sales staff can look them up in some cases depending on the stone’s certification (the AGS certified stones will have the info you need), but once you get a system down for comparing, it will become second nature for you. You could even go to a higher end shop and look at some premium H&A cuts in comparison to average commercial cut stones – all in the name of “just looking.” In either case, the trick is to curtail your desire to purchase.

If the return policy is stringent and only a week or so, then I’d suggest you consider making an immediate return for a full refund and starting from scratch. Hanging onto an undesirable stone can fee like a 1000-pound burden. If you rid yourself of it now, it may be much easier to fill the void.

 

[Todd07]

If you choose not to return the ring or their policy does not allow a return, I'd hurry and get an independent appraisal. An appraisal will:


- confirm you got the deal of the century


- or identify a problem, such that it doesn't match the cert




I can understand getting a deal from an individual or estate sale (example) but someone in the business (B&M, pawn shop) is unlikely to undercut internet pricing by 1/3.

 

[dia help]

I initially found the company I purchased the diamond from through the internet. I went to their office in downtown Los Angeles with a friend who is also looking to purchase an engagement ring. However, he's looking for a much more expensive stone (i.e. approx. $13k). I told the owner that I have a few friends that are also searching and if I got a great deal, I would refer them.

When I left after the purchase, I felt as though I got a great deal. However, when I got home and remembered reading that you shouldn't buy a round stone with a depth higher than 64%, I started to get nervous that maybe I bought a crappy stone. It does look really nice, but from some of the responses to this thread, I think I should have it appraised independently. (in retrospect, I definitely acted too quickly)

How much does it cost to get it appraised? How long does it take? and, where do you go to get it appraised?

 

[quaeritur]

Look under the resources link at the top of the page -there's a list of independent appraisers by area

 

[Todd07]

Cost is probably between 60-150$ Small change for your piece of mind and for insurance.




Under resources, click the appraiser link to find a local one


Under knowledge, click the appraiser essentials link to read up




Also, this is a good post


Getting the most out of your jewelry appraisal.




I read that 45% of guys buy without doing any research - you have lots of company, if that helps. Good news is you now have PS for support/advice /idealbb/images/smilies/appl.gif

 

[valeria101]

'good deal'... no idea, this is one relative judgement after all. You've got one relatively small (for 1ct that is) and not so great cut diamond that weighs that one carat mark. Is the weight important ? It would not really show there anywhere but on the label and certificate. The stone is what it is.

It may be nice on it's own, but I somewhat doubt it would hold its own when compared with a better cut. It might, but there is no way to know until you try.

It would be great to have those other specs (crown and pavilion height...and size) from the EGL cert. And you may want to look down this link for some more.

Just my 0.2, of course.

 

[dia help]

Here is the information from the EGL USA Certificate:

1.01 Ct
Round Brilliant
SI1
Color: E
6.12 - 6.04 x 4.18 mm

Depth: 68.8%
Table: 58%
Crown: 15.8%
Pavillion: 44%
Girdle: Thick to Very Thick Faceted
Cutlet: None
Polish: Very Good
Symmetry: Good
Flourescence: None

 

[Todd07]

Found one brokered diamond in the d-base offered by three vendors for $3347:


1.02c/H/SI1/EGL Good Pol & Sym/Depth 69% /Tbl 58%/ 6.15x6.06x4.21


If you also got a setting in your price, your price may have been good for your spec.




I tried to plug your numbers into the HCA tool but it wouldn't work. Says you have an extremely thick girdle or the numbers are wrong.

 

[quaeritur]

Just for reference, my ideal cut 0.79ct has an average diameter around 6.04mm. Your stone will definitely not look like a 1ct

. Can you return or exchange it? Will your vendor be willing to find a stone to your specifications?

I tried the HCA too. Couldn't get it to even run until I dropped the depth down to 65.8, at which point it scored a 5.1 (scores <2 are the best). If I were you, assuming you want a pretty stone, or one that looks its size, I'd return this one and start over. You might want to look over the tutorial here too, it's extremely helpful!

As for this being a good deal -I think you got what you paid for. It seems like a fair price for the quality of the stone, as far as I can tell.

 

[Paul-Antwerp]

You did not get taken, but you did.

What you paid is a fair market-price for that stone. But the market however is not entirely correct in the way it connects the beauty of a stone to its value.

Your stone has the diameter of a 0.78 Ct.

The girdle thickness is 9%. It must have been years that I did not see such stones anymore. With a girdle of 6%, we already say that you can ride a truck on the girdle. On your stone, you have a full highway. In that way, one could even say that you have a very unique diamond.

You could have done a lot better with a smaller weight stone, similar diameter, and a good cut.

Live long,

 

[dia help]

Now I kind of feel like crap and feel like maybe I made too hasty of a decision.

So basically, the stone I bought looks the size of .78 carat stone, but with less fire, brilliance, etc.???

 

[dia help]

I'm meeting with the jeweler this afternoon and hopefully I will be able to exchange the stone for a higher quality cut.

Thank you all for all your help!!!!!

If you're curious, I'll update this thread with my (hopefull) exchange.

 

[reena]

hooray! now, have you done enough research to be sure you'll know what a "better cut" is?

you don't want to find yourself in this same situation a second time!

 

[valeria101]

----------------
On 9/30/2004 12:30:44 PM dia help wrote:



So basically, the stone I bought looks the size of .78 carat stone, but with less fire, brilliance, etc.???----------------

Basically... yes

You may wnat to take a look at that 5 min video on preciousmetals.com.au (Garry's discourse). The story of your stone is pretty much the point of the presentation. The 'bad' diamond used for example there is quite an extreme case, but you may see something close to that comparison. It would be a good idea to see what a top cut round looks like from some other shop before asking for the replacement, IMO.

 

[dia help]

Before I write further, thank you all for your input and I'm so happy I stumbled onto this website.

I went back to the dealer and told him that I wanted to exchange my diamond for a better cut diamond. I was obviously at a huge negotiating disadvantage since I had already paid $3100 for a ring I no longer wanted. After doing much more research, I realized how important the 4th C actually is (the Cut).

I knew that in order to get a similar diamond with a much better cut I would have to sacrafice something or pay substantially more.

He showed me a few stones and I found one that stood out. Here are the dimensions:

1.01 Carat
E Color
SI/2
6.46 - 6.42 x 3.98
Depth: 61%
Table: 59%
Crown: 14.6%
Pavillion: 43.2%
Thin to Thick Faceted
Polish: Good
Symmetry: Very Good
Cutlet: None
Flourescence: None

He wanted an additional $400, but he settled on an additional $200. So, all in, I paid $3300 for the above stone which includes a nice solitaire (white gold) setting.

I feel a lot more comfortable than I did with the previous stone. I realize that the above cut is not perfect, but I am very happy with the way it looks and I know she'll love it.

Lesson learned.... do your homework!

 

[pearcrazy]

Could you tell the difference in sparkle with your eyes? I'm sure you can tell the difference in size. I'm glad that it all worked out for you and I'm sure you're intended will love it. Best wishes to you!!

 

[dia help]

I could definitely tell a difference in size and it does seem to sparkle and fire much more than the other stone. I liked the way the previous stone looked, but now that I've seen a better cut stone, I think it makes a huge difference.

 

[quaeritur]

Good for you!!!

And congrats on getting a better stone

 

[Jennifer5973]

Congrats--this stone sounds much better! 68% depth is extreme.

 

[Todd07]

Good news. Your vendor treated you well on the upgrade.




We all still recommend getting an independent appraisal for peace of mind and ring insurance.

 

[dia help]

All in all, I feel like I made a great purchase. I should have done much more research initially and I wouldn't have had to make an exchange. However, being that I never even negotiated a return/exchange policy with the dealer I purchased from, I was surprised at how receptive they were to helping me out.

Since I'm new at this site, I don't know if you are allowed to recommend specific dealers, but if anyone is in Los Angeles I would be more than happy to let you know the dealer I bought my ring from.

I may be wrong, but I feel as though I got an unbelievable deal.