Did I choose wisely? Help!

[TaylorDog]

Was going to make the dreaded Tiffany''s mistake, stumbled in this forum, and found out about BlueNile. After much searching and many phone calls to them (they''re great people, BTW), I selected this diamond, mounted on a six-prong platinum solitaire. Did I choose wisely? I wanted something that sparkled like the Tiffany rings and the people on the phone said that this will shine as good, if not better, than any of those rings. I''m somewhat OCD, so I was wondering if you guys/girls have any opinions. Well, here is the diamond!

Carat weight: 1.37

Cut: Ideal

Color: H

Clarity: VS2


Depth %: 62.0%

Table %: 55%

Symmetry: Excellent

Polish: Very good

Girdle: Medium, faceted

Culet: None

Fluorescence: Faint

Measurements: 7.20x7.15x4.45 mm

Price: 9,126.00

On the report, on the comment section, it says: "surface graining is not shown." This worried me a bit. Should I be?

This is a lot bigger/cheaper than what I would have gotten at Tiffany''s, so thanks to everyone on here for helping me make an informed decision!

Your opinions would be welcome and very very appreciated.

Thanks again!

 

[sevens one]

I''m sure it will be beautiful.
If this is a done deal already - why question it.

Enjoy it- I bet she will.

Plus, like you said- you saved $$

(don''t forget to post it)

 

[TaylorDog]

It''s done, but with BN''s policy I could always send it back. I just want to make sure I didn''t overlook something. I don''t care so much if I overspent a little, I just want to make sure the diamond is nice.

 

[icekid]

Hi Taylor- welcome! glad you found pricescope!!

The diamond you are looking at from BN may or may not be a good performer based on the information you currently have. We also need to know the pavilion and crown angles. I am not sure if BN will provide you with those or not. Or if the stone is AGS certed, then that information should be on the cert.

And if size matters, you could do a little better on price with other vendors most likely. BN tends to be a bit more expensive (though still much better than Tiff's of course!). You might also consider going down in clarity a bit...

for example, http://www.dirtcheapdiamonds.com/diamond_detail.cfm?did=7429293&ref=PS622 if eye clean, this would move you up to 1.57 ct

1.54 ACA (hearts and arrows) http://www.whiteflash.com/diamonds/diamond_Details.aspx?itemcode=AGS-5130402 just over $9000 w/ pricescope discount

good luck!


ETA: if you already have the stone and love it, then go with it! your eyes are the best judge of whether or not it's a good stone.

 

[JohnQuixote]

Date: 5/19/2005 3:31:39 PM
Author:TaylorDog

On the report, on the comment section, it says: 'surface graining is not shown.' This worried me a bit. Should I be?

Surface graining is nothing to worry about. Many times the grading report will list surface graining, pinpoints, additional clouds, etc. as 'not shown.' They are just noting that these things exist for sake of thoroughness. They are non-issues. Surface graining is just structural irregularity. You can see it with a microscope. The graining may resemble faint facet junction lines, or cause a grooved or wavy surface. They look like polishing lines, but they often cross facet junctions (polishing lines don't). It is a natural characteristic of the diamond crystal and not a reflection of the cut quality.

Which lab did the grading report and who gave it the 'ideal' cut grade?

I'm just curious. The bottom line, as Sevens said, is that if it looks amazing, you love it and saved some $ - be happy.

(I do understand OCD though...believe you me.)

 

[TaylorDog]

The lab report is from GIA and the "ideal" cut grade appears to be from BN. Is there a problem?

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 5/19/2005 3:46:52 PM
Author: TaylorDog
It''s done, but with BN''s policy I could always send it back. I just want to make sure I didn''t overlook something. I don''t care so much if I overspent a little, I just want to make sure the diamond is nice.

That''s very true - BN has a 30-day return policy, so it''s stil not too late to do a little homework.

In order to know what the make is, you really needed to know crown/pavilion angles. Since a GIA report doesn''t provide that info, most folks either ask for a Sarin or OGI report, or they take it to an independent appraiser to have that done. However, your stone is already set, so they cannot get these measurements without unsetting the stone.

I''d say at this point....we can''t really tell you if you got a nice stone or a good deal. That''s something an appraiser could tell you, though. I''d recommend doing that as soon as possible. If you''re happy with their feedback, great....and if not, you can return it.

 

[Regular Guy]

Date: 5/19/2005 4:07:24 PM
Author: aljdewey

I'd say at this point....we can't really tell you if you got a nice stone or a good deal. That's something an appraiser could tell you, though. I'd recommend doing that as soon as possible. If you're happy with their feedback, great....and if not, you can return it.

With all due respect to you Aljdewey, except for the featured appraisers here, I don't know that most appraisers here are going to more than match the cert, either, which is not the point being sought here.

Taylordog, to the extent this is a concern for you, I'd suggest reviewing the tutorial here; see above, under Knowledge.

Also, you can just walk into Tiffany's make your Pepsi test, and decide from there.

Best,

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 5/19/2005 5:35:55 PM
Author: Regular Guy

Date: 5/19/2005 4:07:24 PM
Author: aljdewey

I''d say at this point....we can''t really tell you if you got a nice stone or a good deal. That''s something an appraiser could tell you, though. I''d recommend doing that as soon as possible. If you''re happy with their feedback, great....and if not, you can return it.

With all due respect to you Aljdewey, except for the featured appraisers here, I don''t know that most appraisers here are going to more than match the cert, either, which is not the point being sought here.

With all due respect to you, RG, any *qualified* appraiser can do a lot more than just "match the cert". I''m quite aware of what his point is....what he''s looking for, and I DO think that appraisers can help him achieve his objective.....hence the suggestion.

In fact, the nature of appraising being what it is, I''d venture that more of their work is done on finished pieces than on loose goods, but that''s just my guess. Perhaps Dave, etc. could shed more light.

 

[hoorray]

I think RG was referring to the fact that many appraisers do not have sarin machines, so can''t measure the angles for him. That shouldn''t mean that they can''t evaluate the cut and performance of the stone, but I know there are some who come well recommended who really don''t focus on cut/light performance. (Not the ones active here, but I have been to one who mostly did just evaluate whether it matched the cert.)

I think the thing to do is talk to the appraiser before going there to findout what they will be able to do before just assuming. There seems to be a big swing in what they do, how they do it, and what they charge.

 

[Regular Guy]

I''m sorry, Aljdewey and lop, in my support, I think you both have a point. That is, lop, yes, that was my point...with the discussion tracking the need for crown & pavilion angles, most independent appraisers won''t be able to measure it. And Aljdewey, with most people having their ring appraised with finished pieces, and TaylorDog will be included in this group, even an appraiser with sarin equipment would be prohibited from using it.

(Appraisers) Rich Sherwood here purportedly has a procedure for approximating angles with Diamond Calc, and Denverappraiser, last reported, was working on same. Garry Holloway will tell you that an idealscope will help you as much or more...but for my money, at the point of using an appraiser for a judgement on these things, I think I''d be looking for something more quantitative than that could provide.

I don''t really know what the variables are, as to what makes an appraiser sensitive to a good cut, or not. It may be as Ana signs her posts: "The greatest experts are only as good as the sum total of what they have seen." [Souren Melikian]. Maybe they''d be fine, generally.

I think I may come back to you, TaylorDog. Purportedly...by shopping on the internet, you CAN do as good as either Tiffanys, or what you''d see with "Hearts of Fire." Although you can take your diamond to an appraiser, what you''ll want to do, in any case, is see what difference a comparison will make.....seems to me. Hopefully, in making this comparison, you''ll like what you see, and can call the shopping process concluded.

With best wishes,

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 5/19/2005 7:19:13 PM
Author: lop
I think RG was referring to the fact that many appraisers do not have sarin machines, so can''t measure the angles for him. That shouldn''t mean that they can''t evaluate the cut and performance of the stone, but I know there are some who come well recommended who really don''t focus on cut/light performance.

I think it''s on point to ask one''s appraiser what their various appraisal levels entail....of course. Many appraisers offer different levels of service.......for $40-50, they will simply verify that the stone matches the cert. For somewhat more, they will do a complete work-up on the stone (less the measurements because the stone is set).

As to what RG may have meant.....it really doesn''t matter if the appraisers do or don''t have Sarin machines because this diamond is already set. That means no Sarin unless this person wants to have it unset, THEN take it to an appraiser, and THEN have it reset again.

As you astutely point out, lop, a "qualified" appraiser CAN make *some* evaluations about the make and the performance of a stone even when set. Will he be able to measure a crown angle? No. Will he be able to tell you if the stone is a fine make? Yes, he will.

Evaluating cut and light performance is a lot more than "matching the cert". Matching the cert means ONLY verifying that the diamond in hand is the one represented in the grading report....with NO further evaluation in most cases. Clearly, a qualified appraiser could do much more than that.

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 5/19/2005 11:58:15 PM
Author: Regular Guy

(Appraisers) Rich Sherwood here purportedly has a procedure for approximating angles with Diamond Calc, and Denverappraiser, last reported, was working on same. Garry Holloway will tell you that an idealscope will help you as much or more...but for my money, at the point of using an appraiser for a judgement on these things, I think I''d be looking for something more quantitative than that could provide.

Looking for something more substantive than an appraiser could provide would be fine IF....IF someone else could give you what you really want, which is crown/pavilion information. In a perfect world, I want all that information too.

BUT.....no one else can give him that! We need to deal with the realities of T/dog''s situation as it is *today*......he has bought a ring that is already set, so unless he plans to dismantle it, there is no way he''s going to get crown/pav info, et. al. from *anyone*.

Further, he''s not asking if this stones falls within specific measurements/tolerances.....he''s simply "did I choose wisely and will the stone sparkle......did I buy a good performer?" Sorry, but an Idealscope or a trained eye CAN answer that question without measurements.

Did he get a *nice* stone? To find out, he can:

1) evaluate it himself.....which he''s not terribly confident in doing since he''s only likely seen a handful of diamonds and doesn''t necessarily know what to look for.

2) he can ask us to evaluate it........us on PS who''ve never laid eyes on his stone, and who cannot get enough information about measurements to be of any meaningful help to him at all......

or

3) He can seek counsel from a QUALIFIED appraiser.....who won''t be able to give him measurements but whose line of work means he''s (hopefully) seen thousands of stones (making his eye far more experience than Taylor''s) and who can actually EXAMINE the stone (making his input far more substantive than anything WE could give him here).

In this situation, who''s opinion would you want? I''d pick the appraiser.....all day long.

Once upon a time, calculators didn''t exist and people had to actually do the math themselves. The calculator has made it easier, sure, but it''s not impossible to arrive at the right answer without a calculator.

Similarly, having all the *numbers* on a diamond are certainly helpful, RG, but before anyone realized they were important, appraisers were trained to evaluate stones by LOOKING at them. That is still more than sufficient to answer T/Dog''s questions, I think.

 

[Regular Guy]

Al,

(This isn't supposed to be between you and me, is it?)...though the main recent issue is that we posted around the same time, such that we really don't differ very much, except for the punch line, where I conclude differently than you do (see above).

You talk about what's sufficient:

"That is still more than sufficient to answer T/Dog's questions, I think."

I think differently about what's sufficient, and think that when you're interested in relative information...how well you did....and appraiser will be hard pressed to help. Also, as far as even anectodatal reporting on Pricescope, I don't think you'll see a lot that contradicts that. But I'd be interested in being proven wrong.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 5/20/2005 11:52:23 AM
Author: Regular Guy
Al,

(This isn't supposed to be between you and me, is it?)...though the main recent issue is that we posted around the same time, such that we really don't differ very much, except for the punch line, where I conclude differently than you do (see above).

Responding to a point you made isn't really making it "between you and me", RG.....discourse on ANYONE'S input certainly helps the OP consider from many angles. That's part of why it's a forum.....brainstorming is meant to consider COLLECTIVE input, not just OP to you and me to OP, etc.

Date: 5/20/2005 11:52:23 AM
Author: Regular Guy


I think differently about what's sufficient, and think that when you're interested in relative information...how well you did....and appraiser will be hard pressed to help. .

Again, I maintain that I respectfully disagree. "How well you did" doesn't typically mean "did I manage to select within certain tolerances" to MOST people. It may mean that to you, but you're the engineer-y type, so undertandable.

What "how well did I do" means to *most* folks, though, is one of two things: 1) "Did I pick a nice quality diamond?" and/or "Did I pay a fair price for what I selected?"

In either case, I respectfullly assert that an appraiser most definitely can providing meaningful input. An appraiser can give his assessment of color, clarity, performance, and a whole host of other things even without measurements! He can opine on a stone's symmetry, it's liveliness, etc. Since all of these factors ALSO affect a diamond's market value, he'd have quite a bit to offer by way of input on VALUE.

Since an appraiser's JOB is to evaluate a stone and assign a monetary value to it, he ABSOLUTELY can tell you how well you did as long as he knows what you paid. If he knows similiar stones to be worth $11k and TD paid 9K, then he's absolutely qualified to say "you did VERY well".

Taylor, my *personal* advice....which others may or may not agree with.....is to seek a qualified appraiser and get your stone evaluated. It will be helpful for insurance purposes, too, and I'm confident it will provide the reassurance you're seeking. My two cents.....for what they are worth.

 

[TaylorDog]

Thanks everyone for your time and help. I owe you guys at least a clarification of my thoughts, so here it goes. I just wanted to know if the ring will sparkle a lot (I now know I didn''t provide enough information), and if it''s generally a "good" diamond. As long as it looks good, she likes it, and it is really fiery (which will make her like it more), then I''m happy. I also wanted to know if I got a decent deal. I don''t need to have a gotten a great deal, but I also didn''t want to be had. I''m just happy I didn''t go the Tiffany route, so I''m happy in that regards. I will def. take it to an appraiser, hopefully next week, to see how much the diamond is worth, and like someone here said, that will make me feel better. I''ll also hopefully feel a lot better when I receive the ring tomorrow morning! I just don''t know if I should not propose tomorrow as planned if I don''t like the ring (I think that''s the route I''ll take), or propose then continue hunting. Since the latter is more romanting, I think that''s what I''ll do if I don''t like the diamond (visually) when it arrives tomorrow. Wish me luck!

Thanks again for all your help.

 

[Regular Guy]

Date: 5/20/2005 5:21:55 PM
Author: TaylorDog
I just don''t know if I should not propose tomorrow as planned if I don''t like the ring (I think that''s the route I''ll take), or propose then continue hunting. Since the latter is more romanting, I think that''s what I''ll do if I don''t like the diamond (visually) when it arrives tomorrow. Wish me luck!

Thanks again for all your help.

Well...I''ll bet you''ll like it just fine. But, and in any case, if you''re ready, and even open to proposing, and then shopping, should you for some reason be disappointed....that''s what I would do.

Certainly...we wish you luck!

 

[TaylorDog]

Whoops, I meant the former is more romantic. So if I don''t like it, I won''t propose tomorrow as planned (which I hate to put off, b/c we''re going out of town tomorrow, etc.) and will put it off until I find the perfect ring. The pressure is on.

 

[noobie]

Date: 5/20/2005 5:21:55 PM
Author: TaylorDog
Thanks everyone for your time and help. I owe you guys at least a clarification of my thoughts, so here it goes. I just wanted to know if the ring will sparkle a lot (I now know I didn''t provide enough information), and if it''s generally a ''good'' diamond. As long as it looks good, she likes it, and it is really fiery (which will make her like it more), then I''m happy. I also wanted to know if I got a decent deal. I don''t need to have a gotten a great deal, but I also didn''t want to be had. I''m just happy I didn''t go the Tiffany route, so I''m happy in that regards. I will def. take it to an appraiser, hopefully next week, to see how much the diamond is worth, and like someone here said, that will make me feel better. I''ll also hopefully feel a lot better when I receive the ring tomorrow morning! I just don''t know if I should not propose tomorrow as planned if I don''t like the ring (I think that''s the route I''ll take), or propose then continue hunting. Since the latter is more romanting, I think that''s what I''ll do if I don''t like the diamond (visually) when it arrives tomorrow. Wish me luck!


Thanks again for all your help.

I think for you are looking for, you did fine. No need to worry about it.

 

[fire&ice]

For Pete''s sake.

Do you love the stone? Have you bonded with it? Do you think it represents a good value?With the information you provided, the stone could be nice at a fair price. I don''t see any red flags whatsoever. BN is a reputable company. You are correct - at Tiffany''s you would have most likely gotten a similar cut stone much smaller & more expensive.

Good luck!