Diamond Comparisons-Small Hand, Instrument, Cuts?

[halfway-there]

Hello everyone,
I''m new and am looking to purchase a diamond for my girlfriend. We''re planning to get married next year. She''s wonderful and wants to be surprised. So, I find myself having to make a lot of decisions on my own. She''s petite (5''3"), has pretty small hands (ring size probably around 4.5), and studies viola performance (similar to a violin but bigger) at a local conservatory. She would like to be able to play her instrument with the ring, wants yellow gold, and doesn''t "want it to stick up too much." I like the round, ideal cut diamonds, and I''ve been looking at some of the following. Having seen some diamonds in person in the 0.50-0.75 carat range, I don''t think these would be too big for her hand or viola playing. If I could get your opinions on the quality of these diamond deals, size (weight), or suggested ring settings, that would be great. Is it a toss-up between the vendors listed below? If the non-Blue Nile diamonds have ideal symmetry and polish, will they be comparable to the Blue Nile signature cuts? Lots of questions, I guess. Thanks.

Aaron

Price: Around $3,000

Blue Nile Ideal Signature Cut
Stock number: LD00119253
Price: $3,494
Carat weight: 0.73
Cut: Signature Round
Color: G
Clarity: VS2
Depth %: 60.2%
Table %: 55%
Symmetry:Ideal
Polish: Ideal
Girdle: Thin to medium, faceted
Culet: Very small
Fluorescence: Medium blue
Measurements: 5.85 x 5.90 x 3.54 mm
http://www.bluenile.com/diamonds_details.asp?pid=LD00119253#grading_report

Blue Nile Ideal Signature Cut
Stock number: LD00333946
Price: $3,185
Carat weight: 0.73
Cut: Signature Round
Color: H
Clarity: VS2
Depth %: 61.4%
Table %: 55%
Symmetry: Ideal
Polish: Ideal
Girdle: Thin to slightly thick, faceted
Culet: Pointed
Fluorescence: Negligible
Measurements: 5.79 x 5.82 x 3.56 mm

Pricescope Results:
USA Certed
Stock Number: 6705108
Price: $3,072*SP
Carat weight: 0.74
Cut: Round
Color: G
Clarity: VS1
Depth %: 61.3%
Table %: 55%
Symmetry: Ideal
Polish: Ideal
Girdle: m-tk
Culet: no
Fluorescence: no
Measurements: 5.82 x 5.88 x 3.58 mm
http://search.virtcert.com/cgi/u/1012/v.cgi?stock=6705108&_s=1012&_p=sdf348gd743&_c=&_fs=1&prestock=&_ln=ps

Whiteflash
Stock Number: 10878291
Price: $3,117*S
Carat weight: 0.740
Cut: Round
Color: G
Clarity: VS1
Depth %: 61.3%
Table %: 55%
Symmetry: Ideal
Polish: Ideal
Girdle: m-tk
Culet: no
Fluorescence: no
Measurements: 5.82 x 5.88 x 3.58 mm
http://www.whiteflash.com/diamonds/diamond_Details.aspx?itemcode=10878291

 

[belle]

hey halfway

welcome to ps!

you can''t go wrong with a performance based report from ags. they have made it easy for people, especially those buying sight unseen, to be guaranteed a great diamond. with a ''0'' in light performance, you know you are getting a winner.

in that respect, you are doing well with the blue nile stones. the last ''two'' diamonds are actually the same stone. if you want to have more comparisons, yet narrow down your search and eliminate virtual diamonds (of which, the last one is) you can use the ''pricescope your diamond'' search and select ''cut quality'' or ''in house''.
finding a low setting may take some work. i was surprised at all of the really (really) high settings that are out there. it''s great if you don''t mind a high setting but for those of us that need something more unobtrusive, it takes some work!

i ended up with the 3stone w-prong from whiteflash. it is very low and exactly what i was looking for. they also make a solitaire version as well. i would assume it is as low as the 3prong but if you were seriously interested, i would contact them to make sure.

you''re off to a great start and i have no doubt you will find a beautiful ring that your fi will be genuinely pleased with.

best of luck!

 

[halfway-there]

Belle,
Thank you for the reply and information. I think I get what you''re saying, but I just want to make sure.

Blue Nile Signature Cut has an AGS 0 light performance and there''s nothing else very special about the Signature Cut?

Using the In-House Pricescope Search, I was able to come up with another list of diamonds. I''ve attached a printscreen. I think I understand all the columns but two. The girdle rating of thin, thick, etc. makes sense to me, but sometimes they include numbers. What am I missing?

And, the spread column seems a little odd to me. I understand you want your spread to be close to 6.50 when looking at diameters and such. I made a spreadsheet and using just the diameters and weight. I came up with some values. For instance, for the first one listed on the attachment (diameters of 5.82 and 5.83 mm with wieght of 0.718 carats), I get a value of 6.505, which looks good and has a percent difference from 6.50 of +0.079%. However, the spread column says it is +2%. Is my calculation wrong or just different from what they''re calculating. Is this spread related to the Halloway Cut Analysis?

One more thing:
Using the Halloway Cut Analysis on the Blue Nile LD00333946 diamond, I get ex-ex-ex-vg. I''m guessing a very good spread is pretty typical for diamonds of this size and price range because the cut quality search (image referenced below) I performed seems to come up with ex-ex-ex-vg as well.

Thanks again for your help, and I hope I''m not asking too many questions.

Aaron<img

 

[belle]

Date: 10/24/2006 1:59:37 PM
Author: halfway-there
Belle,
Thank you for the reply and information.

you are very welcome aaron, it is my pleasure.

Date: 10/24/2006 1:59:37 PM
Author: halfway-there

Blue Nile Signature Cut has an AGS 0 light performance and there''s nothing else very special about the Signature Cut?

i would not be certain that *all* bn signature cuts have ''0'' in light performance, i was just speaking of the ones you posted. you can easliy check any bn stone by looking at the report. i''m not sure of the exact criteria for bn signature cuts, except that they are in house and have ags/gcal reports with them. there is nothing ''special'' about the cuts themselves (ie faceting, arrangement) and the two criteria i mentioned previously may be all that is needed to qualify them as ''signature cut''.

Date: 10/24/2006 1:59:37 PM
Author: halfway-there

Using the In-House Pricescope Search, I was able to come up with another list of diamonds. I''ve attached a printscreen. I think I understand all the columns but two. The girdle rating of thin, thick, etc. makes sense to me, but sometimes they include numbers. What am I missing?

the numbers are probably coming directly from the ags report. they don''t list any girdles with a descriptor, only the the measurement.

Date: 10/24/2006 1:59:37 PM
Author: halfway-there

And, the spread column seems a little odd to me. I understand you want your spread to be close to 6.50 when looking at diameters and such. I made a spreadsheet and using just the diameters and weight. I came up with some values. For instance, for the first one listed on the attachment (diameters of 5.82 and 5.83 mm with wieght of 0.718 carats), I get a value of 6.505, which looks good and has a percent difference from 6.50 of +0.079%. However, the spread column says it is +2%. Is my calculation wrong or just different from what they''re calculating. Is this spread related to the Halloway Cut Analysis?

i am not sure how spread is calculated. i will see if i can search out some older posts on the subject, if not perhaps leonid or garry could explain how it works.

Date: 10/24/2006 1:59:37 PM
Author: halfway-there

One more thing:
Using the Halloway Cut Analysis on the Blue Nile LD00333946 diamond, I get ex-ex-ex-vg. I''m guessing a very good spread is pretty typical for diamonds of this size and price range because the cut quality search (image referenced below) I performed seems to come up with ex-ex-ex-vg as well.

yep, i''ve found the same thing. very rarely will you get all ''excellents'' on any given stone (and even if you do, that doesn''t necessarily make it better

). the cut advisor gives some great direction when narrowing down diamond choices but again, you are already ahead of the game by looking at ags 0.
i don''t want to give the impression that ags 0 is the only way to go (i have an awesome gia ''very good'') but ags has made it easy. if you want to learn more and explore other options, it''s possible to find something without the ags report if you know what to look for. lest i make it seem like ags is the *only* way to go.

 

[JohnQuixote]

Date: 10/24/2006 1:59:37 PM
Author: halfway-there

And, the spread column seems a little odd to me. I understand you want your spread to be close to 6.50 when looking at diameters and such. I made a spreadsheet and using just the diameters and weight. I came up with some values. For instance, for the first one listed on the attachment (diameters of 5.82 and 5.83 mm with wieght of 0.718 carats), I get a value of 6.505, which looks good and has a percent difference from 6.50 of +0.079%. However, the spread column says it is +2%. Is my calculation wrong or just different from what they're calculating. Is this spread related to the Halloway Cut Analysis?

Garry can address this decisively, but the HCA currently favors diamonds at the shallow side of commonly-accepted ranges here. Pricescopers are pretty good about giving their opinions on spread when you give them the mm measurements. Here is a thread Bluehammer started about the PS spread indication with some info.

https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/spread-on-search-by-cut.47596/

 

[belle]

here is a thread on calculating spread in the ps search https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/in-house-diamond-search-beta.35866/=

 

[diamondseeker2006]

I really like the .75 size a lot. I do not believe Blue Nile has in-house stones, so I prefer dealing with Good Old Gold and WhiteFlash who have excellent stones in-house and can actually answer questions about a specific stone. They also offer additional infomation such as IdealScope, magnified photos, etc. You're fortunate because there is currently a good selection of in-house stones in the G-H, VS category in your size range!

ETA: Once you decide on a stone, then we can help you with the selection of a low setting at that vendor, if possible!

 

[JulieN]

A ring won't really interfere with playing, unless platinum is weighing her down! Low-set, gold, and a good fit.

 

[halfway-there]

Thank you for this link. I''m an engineer, so I can relate to what this guy is saying.

Aaron

 

[halfway-there]

Thank you for this link as well.

https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/in-house-diamond-search-beta.35866/

I guess here''s the answer to the spread calculation as provided by Garry H (Cut Nut).

"The new Spread is what the carat weight difference would be comapred to a 53% table Tolkowsky Round with a very thin girdle. We choose that rather than surface area etc because you can relate it back to what you are gaining or loosing relevant to the carat weight difference which has the largest price impact."

All, I really appreciate the feedback about vendors as well. I''m going to take a look at some of the other providers, and I''ll most definitely run my final selection (possibly pre-final selections as well) by you all. Once, I figure out the diamond, I''ll move to the setting. This forum is great.

Aaron

 

[shel]

I''ve heard Blue Nile DOES have in-house stones. Supposedly all of their Signature Ideals.

Also found this to be interesting: Blue Nile now claims that all round Signature stones show a hearts and arrows pattern.

http://www.bluenile.com/diamond_signature_difference.asp

 

[halfway-there]

Okay, here we go. I think these are pretty good contenders. They are all AGS 0 for light performance, and the HCA gives them all ex-ex-ex-vg. I''m leaning toward #2, but would I see a difference between any of these? If I went from G to H, would I see the difference? The Blue Nile signature cuts come with GCAL ratings, while the Whiteflash ones show ideal scope images. Thanks again for your help.

Aaron

Pricescope:
1. Whiteflash
0.722 G VS1 60.9% 56% AGS tn f id id n 5.81x5.82x3.54 1% $3376
Crown=34.7° Pavilion=40.7°
http://http://www.whiteflash.com/hearts_arrows/a-cut-above-h-a-cut-diamond-129073.htm

2. Whiteflash
0.718 G VS2 61.5% 57% AGS tn-md f id id n 5.73x5.76x3.54 -1% $3117
Crown=34.8° Pavilion=40.7°
http://www.whiteflash.com/hearts_arrows/a-cut-above-h-a-cut-diamond-121238.htm

Non-pricescope:
3. Blue Nile
0.72 G VS1 60.4% 57% AGS thin-slightly thick id id n 5.81x5.84x3.52 ?% $3674
Crown=34.2° Pavilion=40.7°
http://www.bluenile.com/diamonds_details.asp?pid=LD00948370#grading_report

 

[shel]

All three sound like great stones. 1 and 2 are very comparable. I''d probably go for 2 because of the price. The Whiteflash stones have the advantage of being verified for the H&A pattern, which I personally prefer because symmetry is pleasing. Both WF''s have larger crown angles than the Blue Nile one which might give the WF''s an edge in terms of fire, especially #2.

#3 from Blue Nile might also be an H&A although you would have to verify it yourself (or with an appraiser). Make sure to order the stone loose. Another strike against the Blue Nile stone is the feather that seems to abut the girdle. Probably won''t pose any structural problems but might be visible.

Whether the human eye can detect the difference between an ideal and a superideal cut is a conversation for another time.

Bottom line: I vote for #2.

 

[belle]

Date: 10/25/2006 12:01:56 AM
Author: halfway-there

Okay, here we go. I think these are pretty good contenders. They are all AGS 0 for light performance, and the HCA gives them all ex-ex-ex-vg.

they are all great.

Date: 10/25/2006 12:01:56 AM
Author: halfway-there

I''m leaning toward #2, but would I see a difference between any of these?

i think you would see a difference between the two aca''s and the bn stone. from the photomicrograph on the gcal report, the arrows look ''off''.

Date: 10/25/2006 12:01:56 AM
Author: halfway-there

If I went from G to H, would I see the difference?

if you held them side by side on white paper, probably. mounted, in normal viewing, not likely.

Date: 10/25/2006 12:01:56 AM
Author: halfway-there
The Blue Nile signature cuts come with GCAL ratings, while the Whiteflash ones show ideal scope images.

both are informative, in different ways. i much prefer the idealscope image because you can really tell a lot about the diamond itself. the most obvious being the optical symmetry, which is important to me.

Date: 10/25/2006 12:01:56 AM
Author: halfway-there

Pricescope:
1. Whiteflash
0.722 G VS1 60.9% 56% AGS tn f id id n 5.81x5.82x3.54 1% $3376
Crown=34.7° Pavilion=40.7°
http://http://www.whiteflash.com/hearts_arrows/a-cut-above-h-a-cut-diamond-129073.htm

2. Whiteflash
0.718 G VS2 61.5% 57% AGS tn-md f id id n 5.73x5.76x3.54 -1% $3117
Crown=34.8° Pavilion=40.7°
http://www.whiteflash.com/hearts_arrows/a-cut-above-h-a-cut-diamond-121238.htm

Non-pricescope:
3. Blue Nile
0.72 G VS1 60.4% 57% AGS thin-slightly thick id id n 5.81x5.84x3.52 ?% $3674
Crown=34.2° Pavilion=40.7°
http://www.bluenile.com/diamonds_details.asp?pid=LD00948370#grading_report

i like the first two very much. the bn stone doesn''t have anything about it that makes it worth $300 more. i''m not even sure if i would consider it for $300 less. the optical symmetry is that important to me.
any of them would be very nice though, guaranteed.

 

[halfway-there]

Okay, I''m going to give Whiteflash a call about #2.

 

[belle]

Date: 10/25/2006 11:17:03 AM
Author: halfway-there
Okay, I''m going to give Whiteflash a call about #2.

how exciting!

let us know what you decide.

 

[halfway-there]

Date: 10/25/2006 11:22:51 AM
Author: belle

Date: 10/25/2006 11:17:03 AM

Author: halfway-there

Okay, I''m going to give Whiteflash a call about #2.

how exciting!


let us know what you decide.

Okay, well I went ahead, called them, and decided on #2. I spoke with Katie Homuth from Whiteflash, who seems very nice. I also asked them to not ship it until I figure out the setting business. I may have them work a custom setting for me. We''ll see, and I''ll probably have some questions about settings very shortly.

Aaron

 

[halfway-there]

I''m leaning toward a yellow gold, trellis setting. Does anyone have any suggestions? Will it stick up too much? I feel that Whiteflash is a little on the expensive side for these types of settings, even though they have been excellent in everything else. They''ve also offered to perform a custom setting, but I''m not sure I want to go through the whole mailing process with waxes.

I live in the Boston area, and I''ve seen some reviews about ADCO and others. I checked out boston.citysearch.com and have found some very good reviews about Persona Jewelers. Does anyone have experience with them? Thanks.

Aaron