Delicate Situation....

[Italiahaircolor]

So, much to my surprise, the other day my younger sister M received an e-mail from our older half-sister H. H e-mailed to inform my sister that M is an aunt.

Here is where it gets complicated...

H is estranged from our family, and has been for over 3 years. H is a master manipulator, very devious, and she doesn''t care about anyone but herself. These are things we''ve always known about her...but it all came to a head over her wedding. When my father refused to pay for the flowers (he was footing the bill for everything else, and H was in her mid-30''s) H decided she didn''t want him (or any of us) at her wedding. She acknowledged her mother and step-father as her parents on the invitation, which was sent to my parents friends and flat out humiliated my dad...she never returned any of the depo money my father put out for her wedding and she never called again. She did e-mail my father the week before my wedding...but nothing since.

Now this baby-news.

My father, after her wedding incident, was devastated. My father lost a daughter many years ago in fire, and he''s always held his relationships with us very close to his heart...so when H essentially disowned him, it crushed him. Understandably so, H has been a touchy subject we just don''t go near. I''m sure my dad thinks of her, wonders about her life now, but she delivered a very public slap in the face and I think he''s still recovering from that.

My younger sister M (the one who received the e-mail) is not even 21, she''s very shy, soft spoken and just a good person. This has put her in an incredibly uncomfortable spot. She has this "information" and she''s not sure what to do with it. She knows telling my dad could lead to ten million different senarios...most not good knowing H the way we all do and how nothing is ever what it seems. But on the same note, she feels like she''s "deceiving" our dad knowing that he''s a Grandfather and not telling him, she doesn''t feel that it''s fair. She''s never been faced with this sort of thing before and she''s really upset.

I am afraid to guide M on this due to fact that I strongly dislike H. I''m very protective of my family, and I can''t be neutral on this issue. I just don''t know what to say. I''ve been very emotional over this for the past few days (e-mail came on Friday) and I''m no closer to knowing the "right" thing to do now than I was then.

The baby is almost year old. Meaning H has had ample opportunity to tell us and hasn''t. I feel like if we tell my dad, the we''re opening Pandora''s Box...but if we don''t, we''re cheating him.

What should I do? Please be kind, I didn''t ask for this type of situation.

 

[elrohwen]

If I were you, I would advise M to email H back and encourage her to tell your father about the baby. He really should know and make a decision about how he wants to deal with H, but H should be the one to tell him in the first place. If H says she absolutely doesn''t want to tell him, then I would leave it alone.

 

[Italiahaircolor]

Date: 7/28/2009 9:43:41 AM
Author: elrohwen
If I were you, I would advise M to email H back and encourage her to tell your father about the baby. He really should know and make a decision about how he wants to deal with H, but H should be the one to tell him in the first place. If H says she absolutely doesn''t want to tell him, then I would leave it alone.

Thanks! I am passing all the advice onto M, and she''ll be making the decision, but this sounds spot on. I do know that M doesn''t want to get into it with H--back and forth e-mails and such.

 

[elrohwen]

Date: 7/28/2009 9:47:16 AM
Author: Italiahaircolor

Date: 7/28/2009 9:43:41 AM
Author: elrohwen
If I were you, I would advise M to email H back and encourage her to tell your father about the baby. He really should know and make a decision about how he wants to deal with H, but H should be the one to tell him in the first place. If H says she absolutely doesn''t want to tell him, then I would leave it alone.

Thanks! I am passing all the advice onto M, and she''ll be making the decision, but this sounds spot on. I do know that M doesn''t want to get into it with H--back and forth e-mails and such.

You''re welcome! It really is a tough situation. I''m sorry some of your family members are such a pain in the butt! I can''t imagine having a baby and not telling my dad, even if we never spoke. And it really bugs me that H put your sister in this position. It sounds to me like she''s trying to cause drama.

 

[Hudson_Hawk]

First, I''m so sorry you think we''d give you harsh advice in this situation. Our advice, while sometime a little harsh, always comes from a place of caring about fellow PS''ers. In my opinion, friends should tell it like it is, no matter what. I expect that from my friends and as such, that''s how I operate.

Second, I''m so sorry your sister is in this position. H was a s*itty sister in that regard (it sounds like she is in other regards as well). I imagine she knew just who would be most effective to deliver this blow to the family and had no concept of how it would affect your little sister.

I really think your father should know. The past is the past and how he manages his relationship with you girls is his business. This could be the opportunity he''s looking for to reconnect with her. Similarly, she probably knows how bad she was to him and doesn''t know how to reach out to him. I know you want to protect him, but I imagine he can take care of himself and if he still wants to distance himself from her and her family then fine, but at least he knows he has a grandchild. You shouldn''t hold a possible relationship between him and the baby just because you (collectively) dislike your sister is what I''m trying to say.

 

[atroop711]

 

[atroop711]

Date: 7/28/2009 9:43:41 AM
Author: elrohwen
If I were you, I would advise M to email H back and encourage her to tell your father about the baby. He really should know and make a decision about how he wants to deal with H, but H should be the one to tell him in the first place. If H says she absolutely doesn''t want to tell him, then I would leave it alone.

ditto this

 

[House Cat]

Italia,

H chose M for a reason. You said it yourself, she''s a master manipulator. She chose who she believed was the family''s weakest link. I think that no one should play her game. If you give M the advice to respond to the email at all, which I have my reservations about, then the email should be finite.

"Congratulations on the new baby. I''m very happy for you. I have a feeling Dad would be very happy to hear this news."

Something like that. But make no indication that M will tell dad and make no indication that M will continue contact with H. H is up to something. She either needs something, wants something, or is in the mood for stimulation. This will end badly for someone in the family.

I hate quoting Dr. Phil, but this particular quote is so true, it goes something like "The only true predictor of future behavior is a person''s past behavior." I believe people like H do not change.

Italia, one more thing, do you really think your dad would be happy to hear the news? Do you think that this might send him into another tailspin? She''s had this baby for a year and didn''t contact him, that is HURTFUL. This is ugly. Your poor father.

 

[Bia]

I would tell my father.

I don't know about telling sister to tell H to tell your father (maybe that is the best way). I just know that if it were me hearing this news, I would tell my father myself and let him decide what he wants to do.

He's grown man, a respectable man, and he can handle it. After all, it's not bad news you're sharing, right? A baby is almost always good news.

 

[Lilac]

Date: 7/28/2009 9:43:41 AM
Author: elrohwen
If I were you, I would advise M to email H back and encourage her to tell your father about the baby. He really should know and make a decision about how he wants to deal with H, but H should be the one to tell him in the first place. If H says she absolutely doesn''t want to tell him, then I would leave it alone.

First of all, Italia, I''m so sorry you and your sister are dealing with this tough situation. And I feel really bad for your father - the whole situation must have really hurt him.

Only you know if your father would be able to handle this kind of news without being hurt more deeply. Putting aside your own negative feelings towards H, do you think YOUR FATHER would want to know this information even if it meant he couldn''t see or get to know his grandchild? If the answer is yes, then you should tell him. If you''re not sure if he could handle this and you think he might be hurt by it, then I think you should follow elrohwen''s advice above and tell your sister to email back H and say she thinks H should consider telling your father herself. H might not want to - and then it''s her decision. But maybe H emailed your sister as a go-between because she doesn''t know HOW to bring this up to your father after all the years of being estranged. Is it possible she wants to form a relationship now that she has a child, but doesn''t know how to after all this time?

 

[Madam Bijoux]

If I were M, I would send an e-mail to H congratulating her, and that''s all I would do. I would not mention the e-mail to your father or anybody else. M risks being dragged into an unpleasant situation if she mentions the e-mail to other family members and might even be blamed for digging up unhappy memories or trying to cause more friction.

 

[Italiahaircolor]

Mrs. Hudson_Hawk...I don''t think that anyones advice is ever "mean" per say...but I think sometimes people can be in really tough situations and the blame can fall to them even when they just want the easiest out possible. And I only really added the cavet in there because this isn''t advice for me...but my sister. She''s having a tough time with this. She can''t tell my mom because that would just lead to disaster....so she''s really out there on her own.

I agree that it''s my dad''s right to handle his relationships as he sees fit. But, we get caught on this because he decided to no longer deal with her 3 years ago. He knew what he was doing when he hung up the phone and was like "I''m done"...he knew that one day there might be grandchildren and so on. We feel like yes, he deserves to know that he has a granddaughter out there...but we also know how he feels about H.

Atroop...you''re right, "why now"....why when the baby is a year old? Why not when she was pregnant, or right after the baby was born? Why now? And if that e-mail was sent to me, this would be a different story, but M and I are very different--polar. She''s very shy, quiet...M doesn''t want to get into a screaming match with H...because M wouldn''t know how to defend herself, she''s never been in an argument before--believe it or not---she''s just incredibly sweet natured like that. If H had e-mailed me, I would have confronted her...but like I said, I''m different. Right now, this isn''t "my fight"...I can support M, but I cannot fight her battles for her. H knows not to mess with me...we had it out 3 years ago.

 

[lucyandroger]

I don''t think it''s your place to determine what your father can and cannot handle. Now that you have the information, I think you should pass it on to him. I might suggest that H tell him first but if she doesn''t, I would let him know he has a grandchild.

What if he finds out about the child 2 years from now? Then he has lost 3 years with the baby rather than just one. And how will he feel to know that ALL of his daughters have been keeping this secret from him?

Your father has raised you to be a strong woman, I''m sure he is a strong man. What''s done is done. You can''t get that year back for your father but you CAN prevent him from losing more precious time with his grandchild.

 

[Hudson_Hawk]

Italia, how would he feel if he knew that you all knew about the baby and no one told him? Yes he decided to be "done" with her, but he might view you guys keeping mum as hiding things from him.

 

[Loves Vintage]

Date: 7/28/2009 10:25:42 AM
Author: lucyandroger
I don''t think it''s your place to determine what your father can and cannot handle. Now that you have the information, I think you should pass it on to him. I might suggest that H tell him first but if she doesn''t, I would let him know he has a grandchild.

What if he finds out about the child 2 years from now? Then he has lost 3 years with the baby rather than just one. And how will he feel to know that ALL of his daughters have been keeping this secret from him?

Your father has raised you to be a strong woman, I''m sure he is a strong man. What''s done is done. You can''t get that year back for your father but you CAN prevent him from losing more precious time with his grandchild.

I agree with this entirely. I could not imagine being in your situation and NOT letting your father know. Of course, he deserves to know, regardless of who tells him.

And, ditto to Hudson Hawk as well. I was about to say the same thing!

 

[Lilac]

Despite what I said in my earlier post, I think reading what others have said about your father viewing it as ALL of his daughters keeping this secret from him has changed my mind somewhat. He might view it as a betrayal of trust in some way - if he finds out one day about this grandchild (and he probably will one way or another), it would likely hurt him a lot more to know all 3 of you kept it from him.

Based on this, I think you should tell him. It will probably hurt him for a while, but less than it would if he found out you all knew and nobody told him.

 

[Italiahaircolor]

Date: 7/28/2009 10:25:42 AM
Author: lucyandroger
I don''t think it''s your place to determine what your father can and cannot handle. Now that you have the information, I think you should pass it on to him. I might suggest that H tell him first but if she doesn''t, I would let him know he has a grandchild.

What if he finds out about the child 2 years from now? Then he has lost 3 years with the baby rather than just one. And how will he feel to know that ALL of his daughters have been keeping this secret from him?

Your father has raised you to be a strong woman, I''m sure he is a strong man. What''s done is done. You can''t get that year back for your father but you CAN prevent him from losing more precious time with his grandchild.

I never said we were speculating what he could/couldn''t handle. I don''t think my dad would have a class A meltdown over this. But I do think it would hurt him, and I feel like he''s been hurt enough by her that its at least worth taking a moment to consider before we jump into telling him.

That said...

I personally want more information before we tell him. M and I agree that we have no idea "why now" and I am of the mindset that we need to have that answered...not for the sake of being mean or prolonging this issue, but if it boils down to her needing money or her wanting something other than a plain ol'' relationship--and it''s not simply a change of heart on her part but something more twisted...then we''d be stupid to expose my dad to more manipulation.

H isn''t the type of person to give without taking. This is who she is. I can vividly remember H telling my parents that she wanted to live with them. My parents decided that if she wanted to live with us, we''d make it as seamless and comfortable for her as possible. We moved. My parents built a lovely home with a private entrance for her, her own garage stall, a huge room with a private bath...everything an 18 year old could want. That wasn''t without scarafice...we moved into my Great grandmothers home while we waited for the house to be built...my mom drove us for 45 minutes each way to school. We had no friends. And the day they closed on the finished home, H told them she "changed her mind" and didn''t move in. Later she told my father her mother masterminded the idea to see how far he''d go for her. But, H was 18, she knew better than that.

 

[Italiahaircolor]

Date: 7/28/2009 10:33:45 AM
Author: Hudson_Hawk
Italia, how would he feel if he knew that you all knew about the baby and no one told him? Yes he decided to be ''done'' with her, but he might view you guys keeping mum as hiding things from him.

That''s our fear.

 

[Sabine]

Could M maybe let your dad know that H emailed her with some news about her life, and ask your dad if he would like to know what she said? That way you don''t make assumptions about your dad, and you don''t feel like you''re lying to him by keeping the info. from him.

 

[lucyandroger]

Italia, I was just giving you my honest opinion. You can of course choose to ignore it.

To me when you say "I feel like he's been hurt enough by her," you are making a judgement about how much your father can and cannot handle. I don't think "handling" something necessarily refers to a meltdown (at least that's not what I meant).

You have a long history with H that none of us can know or fully understand but your father also had this history with H so I stand by my opinion that you should let your father make the decision himself whether he wants to have a relationship with H and his grandchild or not.

I hope that hearing differing opinions helps you to sort through this issue. I certainly don't envy the position H has put you and M in...good luck!

 

[decodelighted]

Hmmm .. this is grasping but ... anon email Dad? She'll assume one of you guys told him anyway so I don't know what that solves but ... gah, tough one.

 

[Italiahaircolor]

Date: 7/28/2009 10:05:18 AM
Author: House Cat
Italia,

H chose M for a reason. You said it yourself, she''s a master manipulator. She chose who she believed was the family''s weakest link. I think that no one should play her game. If you give M the advice to respond to the email at all, which I have my reservations about, then the email should be finite.

''Congratulations on the new baby. I''m very happy for you. I have a feeling Dad would be very happy to hear this news.''

Something like that. But make no indication that M will tell dad and make no indication that M will continue contact with H. H is up to something. She either needs something, wants something, or is in the mood for stimulation. This will end badly for someone in the family.

I hate quoting Dr. Phil, but this particular quote is so true, it goes something like ''The only true predictor of future behavior is a person''s past behavior.'' I believe people like H do not change.

Italia, one more thing, do you really think your dad would be happy to hear the news? Do you think that this might send him into another tailspin? She''s had this baby for a year and didn''t contact him, that is HURTFUL. This is ugly. Your poor father.

The thing is, I know H is never going to change. I could tell you stories that would blow your mind. I, personally, walked away and never looked back 3 years ago...at the time things went down, I knew full well what I was doing, I''d just had enough of her and her BS. Our relationship exploded in a bunch of nasty words and hateful things were said on both ends. I mean, she''s awful and I let her know it. I know that she is who she is. She''s not capable of change...it''s above her. But it''s not about my feelings or what I know to be true right now. I want M to do what she''s comfortable with. I don''t want influence her or make her see things my way for the sake of "winning".

I hate that she brought this upon my sister. M is basically a child herself, she has severe anxiety and slight OCD...she''s a wonderful person, and now she''s in the middle of this hot mess. Knowing how M is, for H to bring this to her makes me

. Like seriously...what did she expect M to do with this information, swallow it?

 

[movie zombie]

i agree with Madam B, again.

this person has been identified as trouble and a trouble maker. she deliberately sent a message to the most vulnerable of the family. actually, i don''t think any response is necessary and if the recipient feels the need to respond, a simple congrats and NOTHING ELSE is in order.

mz

 

[Italiahaircolor]

Date: 7/28/2009 11:23:06 AM
Author: lucyandroger
Italia, I was just giving you my honest opinion. You can of course choose to ignore it.

To me when you say ''I feel like he''s been hurt enough by her,'' you are making a judgement about how much your father can and cannot handle. I don''t think ''handling'' something necessarily refers to a meltdown (at least that''s not what I meant).

You have a long history with H that none of us can know or fully understand but your father also had this history with H so I stand by my opinion that you should let your father make the decision himself whether he wants to have a relationship with H and his grandchild or not.

I hope that hearing differing opinions helps you to sort through this issue. I certainly don''t envy the position H has put you and M in...good luck!

I do appreciate your opinion, very much. It''s hard to seperate my logic from my feelings here. I didn''t receive the e-mail so it isn''t my decision who to tell. But I''m always going to be protective of my family...always. In my world, H is a stranger...she''s someone I never really "knew" but she was never coming from truth with us. I think, like anyone who counts their family amoung their blessings, would want to save them grief.

I don''t know what H wants...money, maybe? I worry that someone will get hurt...and that someone will be my dad.

 

[Italiahaircolor]

Date: 7/28/2009 11:23:45 AM
Author: decodelighted
Hmmm .. this is grasping but ... anon email Dad? She''ll assume one of you guys told him anyway so I don''t know what that solves but ... gah, tough one.

My sister was actually worried that it "true" intitally, and looked H up via facebook...it is true. She intially considered e-mailing our Aunt and asking her to break it to her...tell her she found H on Facebook or something....it''s still on the table.

 

[trillionaire]

M should forward the email to your dad, and CC H, saying:

Recieved this from H, thought you should know.

- M

They are adults, they can take it from there.

 

[tlh]

This is strange and sad. What wonderful news, the birth of a baby! I'm not sure where her hatred stems from, but disowning a family over flowers, just doesn't seem right. This is about a lot more than flowers to H. I'm not sure what it was... but something isn't right with her. Waiting A YEAR after the birth of your child to tell your sisters!!! And yet, the mother didn't tell anyone... did she know? There are a lot of secrets going around, and it just doesn't seem right.

I can say as someone who has cut someone out of my life, that the venom and resentment runs deep. Telling news about my personal life is a sacred trust. It is known, without being said, that I don't want to know this person, and I don't want this person to KNOW ANYTHING about me. If I were to find out that my trust had been violated - I don't think my response would be all that warm and fuzzy.

H telling M may just simply be because H TRUSTS M with her happy news, and she maybe wants to share that with her, and mend their relationship. If M violates H's trust by telling others... even by telling you - she may yank any privalege to see the baby away. Now you didn't give a blow by blow of the email... did it specifically say NOT to tell ANYONE, or NOT to tell dad? Because if not, M could just forward the news... in a reply to all and just use happiness and excitement as her excuse. If H did, then, well M already violated the trust by telling you. H didn't send the email to you, she sent it to the meek sister.

Tell your father the good news. It may hurt him, yes, but not as much as finding out even MORE YEARS later about it.. .and worrying about the time lost with a new child, that he can form a relationship with... before H permantly shapes the little one's mind against him.

hugs!

 

[luckystar112]

Is there any possibility that H is looking to rebuild the relationship in the best way she knows how? I''m sure that having a baby can lead you to examine your relationships with family. Perhaps H feels she owes it to her baby to forge some type of relationship with your family. Perhaps she want to M not because she is the most "vulnerable" but because she is the most "open"? It''s clear that she is assuming (hoping) that the news will make it to your father. She could have been afraid to reach out to him because of how their last conversation went.

 

[QueenB29]

It sounds like a really tough situation.

I''ve been in the position twice where important, life-changing information (about my mother''s health) was kept from me with the best of intentions, and when I found out I was devastated. I had to deal not only with her medical condition, but the knowledge it was hidden from me. It was extremely hurtful and made me feel a thousand times worse.

Now, a baby is a happy occasion, but hiding it might be just as painful to your dad. Every man has a right to know about his first grandchild, and he may feel like you and M betrayed him by not telling him. I''m not totally clear on this, but I think in some states he can even sue for grandparental visitation if he wants to see his grandchild (never mind about H, who sounds like a complete b!tch).

 

[rainwood]

Italia -

Just because H made the decision to put your sister in the middle of this mess doesn''t mean she has to be the one to deal with it. You could respond on your sister''s behalf so that H doesn''t get to go through the "weakest link." Channel the communication on your terms, not H''s. And don''t go ballistic. Just say "Thanks for the news. I hope you decide to tell Dad" then wait a month to see if she does. If she doesn''t, then tell him. Then neither of you will be keeping something from your dad, and you can just explain that you were hoping H would tell him herself, but when she didn''t you did. He''ll just have to handle it from there.