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Comparison and stolen stone from years ago

Terabyte

Rough_Rock
Joined
Apr 28, 2017
Messages
3
I'm new to the board. My wife and I have been happily married now for 11 years. A few months before we married her ring was stolen from my car. Now 11 years later I've saved up enough to purchase a better/similar replacement (I hope).

My question is in comparing the original stolen stone and the replacement I'd like to get her a replacement that is just as bright and amazing as her original and while I've done lots of research leading me up to this forum I'm somewhat indecisive on the stone.

Stolen Stone: Color: H, Clarity VS1, CW: 1.05, Strong Blue
HCA: 0.8 TIC
(HCA is what has me concerned its a very low HCA and that's probably why the stone was so amazing the short time we had it)
AGS Document Number: 0005497406
(it was never found and I hadn't purchased insurance for it)
BLUE NILE (with AGS copy on their site, I still have the original AGS Papers :( )
https://www.bluenile.com/diamond-details/LD00487383


Replacement Stone: Color G, Clarity VS1, CW: 1.13, Strong Blue
HCA: 1.7 TIC
(while still great it is a much higher HCA than the original)
BLUE NILE
(I did already purchase but they mentioned if I was not happy it would be no problem to return/replace.)
https://www.bluenile.com/diamond-details/LD08524348

Yes the replacement is a larger stone which isn't my concern. I prefer something as close to hers as possible and in my search this is the best/closest replacement I've found. I do prefer to purchase through Blue Nile since that's where I purchased her original.

Thank You for any help.
 
Last edited:

tyty333

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Dec 17, 2008
Messages
27,198
HCA is used as a binary tool. If it scores 2 or less than it is worth further consideration. Over 2, then no. Doesnt make a 0.7 better than a 1.7.

I cant look at the stone on BN because it says that is has already sold. Can you post the GIA report number?
 

Terabyte

Rough_Rock
Joined
Apr 28, 2017
Messages
3

AdaBeta27

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
Sep 7, 2004
Messages
1,077
AGS#:
5497406
Report Type: Diamond Quality™ Document
Shape and Style: Round Brilliant
Measurements: 6.56 - 6.63 x 4.00 mm
Cut Grade: AGS Ideal 0
Polish: Ideal
Symmetry: Ideal
Proportions: Ideal
Color Grade: AGS 2.0 (H)
Clarity Grade: AGS 3 (VS1)
Carat Weight: 1.050
Fluorescence: Strong Blue
Comments: Additional pinpoints are not shown.
Table: 57.0%
Crown Angle: 33.9
Crown Height: 14.8%
Girdle: Faceted, 0.9% to 1.8%
Pavilion Angle: 40.7
Pavilion Depth: 43.1%
Total Depth: 60.6%
Culet: Pointed

^ There are the proportions of the original stone, except the lgf % is not given. lgf 80% gives a more splintery arrow than lgf 77% which would be a fatter one. The report didin't give lgf or star, so there's no way to guess the "character" of the original diamond and whether it had the hearts & arrows pattern. Table size and crown height and steeper crown angle give the fire. For fire, you want a smaller table. For brilliance, you'd go larger like 58% - 60% possibly.

You had an AGS 000 stone, graded in Sept 2004, and we're mising some info. What I would recommend is choose an AGS 000 stone, or choose a GIA 3x that thae HCA says falls within the AGS 000 range. I'd use the "Pricescope cheat sheet" values, and look for HCA more like 1.6 or under. That originated with Todd Gray of niceice.com:
http://niceice.com/diamond-buying-secrets/15-seconds-diamond-buying-success/
If you want fire, smaller table, taller & steeper crown, deeper diamond, might face up a bit "small" in diameter. If you want a balance, then follow that NiceIce guide, below:
Total depth between 59 – 61.8%
Table diameter between 53 – 58%
Crown angle between 34.3 – 34.9 degrees*
Pavilion angle between 40.6 – 40.9 degrees
Lower girdle facets between 75 – 78%**
Star facets between 45 – 50%***
Girdle thickness between thin and slightly thick
Culet: AGS pointed or GIA none
Cut grading changed a couple of times between 2004 and now, iirc. PS cheat sheet and HCA well under 2 will put you in the right ballpark. You can choose size of table (I'd pick 55 or 56 and not larger), the wider or splintery arrows (I'd veer toward 77 because I prefer bold flashes of fire and brilliance), and decide how much of a stickler you want to be about getting a true H&A pattern.
 
Last edited:

AdaBeta27

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
Sep 7, 2004
Messages
1,077
Oh, and AGS 000 is still a stricter cut spec to meet than GIA 3X, which includes some steep/deep diamonds and other marginal stones that would never get AGS 000. The HCA plots the outlines of GIA 3X and AGS 000 for you when you run it. Stick to AGS 000 and you won't even need to run the HCA because AGS 000 is always HCA under 2.
 

Terabyte

Rough_Rock
Joined
Apr 28, 2017
Messages
3
^ There are the proportions of the original stone, except the lgf % is not given. lgf 80% gives a more splintery arrow than lgf 77% which would be a fatter one. The report didin't give lgf or star, so there's no way to guess the "character" of the original diamond and whether it had the hearts & arrows pattern. Table size and crown height and steeper crown angle give the fire. For fire, you want a smaller table. For brilliance, you'd go larger like 58% - 60% possibly.

You had an AGS 000 stone, graded in Sept 2004, and we're mising some info. What I would recommend is choose an AGS 000 stone, or choose a GIA 3x that thae HCA says falls within the AGS 000 range. I'd use the "Pricescope cheat sheet" values, and look for HCA more like 1.6 or under. That originated with Todd Gray of niceice.com:
http://niceice.com/diamond-buying-secrets/15-seconds-diamond-buying-success/
If you want fire, smaller table, taller & steeper crown, deeper diamond, might face up a bit "small" in diameter. If you want a balance, then follow that NiceIce guide, below:

Cut grading changed a couple of times between 2004 and now, iirc. PS cheat sheet and HCA well under 2 will put you in the right ballpark. You can choose size of table (I'd pick 55 or 56 and not larger), the wider or splintery arrows (I'd veer toward 77 because I prefer bold flashes of fire and brilliance), and decide how much of a stickler you want to be about getting a true H&A pattern.

So the HCA 1.7 I purchased is probably not going to fall in line with the original because of AGS grading being a bit stricter? Also I see the new ones table is 58% instead of the recommended 53-57% Thanks for the help.
 
Last edited:

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 11, 2006
Messages
58,547
Your new stone has numbers within ideal cut territory. It certainly can be every bit as good as the first diamond. I wouldn't be worried. The top GIA triple excellent stones would generally grade as AGS ideal. Nothing is wrong with 58% table. There are many more stones to choose from with GIA grading. I would definitely not limit my selection to AGS graded stones at Blue Nile.

We could help you get a better stone than the original, but that would be through one of the hearts and arrows vendors that carry the very top cut diamonds.
 

gm89uk

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
May 26, 2015
Messages
1,491
Todd Gray's personal preference is very strict and although very useful, isn't particularly helpful to consumers that want a cheat sheet. This is because GIA cover the majority of the market and round up to the nearest 0.5% for crown and to the nearest even decimal for pavilion.

This would then rule out all 34 and 35 GIA crowns on certificate due to rounding alone. I'd also go up to 62.3% on depth, any more if it's an otherwise great diamond with spread matching other similarly priced.

cheat sheet is:
crown angle: 34-35 (35.5 with pavilion 40.6 can be ok)
pavilion: 40.6 - 40.8 (41 ok with crown of 34).
table: (53) 54-58
depth: 60-62.3
 

bmfang

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 2, 2017
Messages
1,851
If you are looking for a stone similar to your original (which does have Fluor), you should consider a Brian Gavin Blue stone. It will likely be cut better than the BN one you have purchased. Otherwise, I would recommend that you consider other PS approved vendors like Whiteflash as their stones are cut (generally speaking) way better than BN stones.
 
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