Colored Diamond Quality and costs

[tomb]

Hi, this is my first time use of the forum. I came across it last week doing research for an International friend who asked for help on possibly purchasing a few investment color diamonds. Approached by a Canadian company (Consolidated Diamond Group) with 2 diamonds. As we both are "untainted" by any real diamond knowledge, the Forum responses shows there are many real experts out there who might help educate us.



The first stone is a pear brill1ant, 7.49x4.30x2.8mm, .60 carat,depth 65.9%, table 52% girdle thin to extremely thick,faceted, no cutlet, polish very good, symmetry good, VS1, color natural Grade Fancy Brownish Orange Pink, distribution even, fluorescence none, comments crown angles are greater than 40 degrees. GIA. $18.500



The second stone is EGL, 1.ct, oval, 7.195.16x 3.30 mm,VS1, natural color, fancy vivid greenish yellow, symmetry good, polish good, fluorescence distinct yellow. $16,950.



We would appreciate any help on the quality and pricing of these diamonds, what my friend should look for in investment colored diamonds and what other sources might have to offer. Thanks.

 

[valeria101]

I surely hope that your friend is already an expert in the diamond business, if not I would reconsider.

 

[tomb]

Thank's for the recommendation. As neither of us know about diamonds, would appreciate it if you could be more specific.

 

[Rank Amateur]

If it isn't GIA certed you'd better reaaalllly know your shiite. The fancy market is all over the board - from the most valuable (see the Smithsonian's current display) to worthless FMC (fried monkey crap).

I'd also stay away from anything with the word "brown" in it. But that's just me. There are many pros here who deal in colored stones daily who can point you in the right direction. I doubt that many of them will tell you that the colored market is a good place for a Rank Amateur to invest.

R/A

 

[tomb]

R/A,

You have my attention. I hope that some of the experts will jump in and point out the challenges.The world of color diamonds sounds like a place to stay out of unless you do have excellent knowledge/advice.

 

[diamondsbylauren]

Hi Tom,


My company specializes in natural fancy colored diamonds.




I would strongly advise against buying the stones you've described for investment purposes.


The first diamond sounds like it would be very difficult to sell for a profit.




The second stone is graded by EGL- a very nice gem lab- but not when you're considering such expensive, rare fancy colored diamonds.


In general, any dealer using EGL for such a stone has something to hide.




Suffice it to say that if you do invest your money, you will be paying a huge price for a diamond lesson.




Stick around here and learn for free!

 

[tomb]

David, thanks for the comments. To help in my education, would you mind telling me from your perspective the good and bad points about the stones and prices.Also what good investment colored diamonds should look like color wise plus physical descriptions. I realize this could be done in 2 or 3 sentecces or take up the contents of a book. I just need a few of the highlights so I will better understand what I will read in the Forum as I continue to learn. Thanks again.

 

[diamondsbylauren]

Tom, unless you're in the jewelry business, there is NO SUCH a thing as investment diamonds. Look I don't love the stock market's performance over the last few years either- but do not confuse diamonds and investment vehicles.


That's the most important fact I can give you.






As far as the stones you've listed.


There's absolutely way to tell anything about the stones in question without even a photo to look at.




We sell quite a few diamonds to people that buy bofore they ever see the diamond in person- BUT - we give them at least 5-10 detailed photos.




Do you have photos to post?

 

[valeria101]

What great color diamonds look (and their grades read) like is not hard to find out. But what on earth would make them a better investment than the more conservative financial instruments designed as such? The high rise in diamond (colored or not) prices which some sellers of 'investment gems' tout do not factor in either inflation (even over DECADES) or, and this is much worse, the actual liquidity of such an investment. High quality gems address a narrow market niche and do conserve value better than most other phisical assets during economic recessions but this is all. Unless you live in a country with persisting double digit inflation or high propensity to civil wars and revolutions, diamonds don't make all that great an investment. These comments are weaker for trully rare gems (something top auction houses may call 'magnificent jewels' for example, or never get their hands on). But still...
And, do call Australian authorities to identify that firm. It is worth it.

 

[DiamondExpert]

To buy for investment, you might consider linking up with an experienced, trusted specialist in the fancy colored diamond world - otherwise you will be easy pickin's - start by reading Stephen Hofer's, "Collecting and Classifying Fancy Coloured Diamonds" - and perhaps taking his personal course). Not an easy nor quick row to hoe, but a less expensive and more rewarding one perhaps!

Good luck!

 

[diamondsbylauren]

With all due respect Gary.


I have been delaing extensively with fancy colored diamonds for over 10 years. I have a very active internet presence-our store is known for natural fancy colored diamonds.


Still, every time I invest in stones, there is never any guarantee- and there are quite a few times I must sell at cost, or even a loss..


I realize there's no guarantee in the stock market, or anywhere else.


But here's a guarantee: If somone inexperienced were to buy diamonds for investment they WILL be dissapointed.


IF they took your advice and went with an "expert" they're STILL going to be dissapointed, unless the "expert" also guarantees to buy the stones for a profit.

 

[tomb]

AnA, Gary and David. I can see my education is coming from experienced and concerned people. Your recommendations and comments are very much appreciated. I will check out the Hofer book. But now out of curiosity, if my International friend still wanted to buy a colored diamond and put it in his safe for a few years, what would you recommend in size, color, etc? Are there a lot of honest sources for these stones? Again thanks for pointing out the pitfalls. What a great Forum!

 

[diamondsbylauren]

Welll, how much money are we talking about investing?

 

[tomb]

David, he indicated somewhere in the $50-75K range. I would imnagine it could be more or less if he still maintians an interest after our forum discussions and if so on the availability of accurately priced quality colored diamonds.

 

[diamondsbylauren]

Tom- If I had 75K to invest, and I wanted to do so in fancy colored diamonds to put in a safe somewhere:


I would need to sit in a place like NYC, or Antwerp ( actually, not) or Tel Aviv, or Johannesburg.


If you're "trying" to buy- you ain't gona find anything like a real bargain.


Remember, you can go to Tiffany's or Harry Winston and simply buy a blue or pink for retail. Then your wait before you could sell for a profit would be much longer than if you bought from a cutter.


SO- the only way to do it ( in my opinion) is to wait - and be in the right place at the right time.




If you just want to own something awesome there are plenty of paces to find amazing stones- at good prices- but not prices that I would go for. I need to own at prices to compete with awesome stores like IceStore- he's got awesome things.


It's really a full time job buying diamonds in this manner- and it's a job requiring years and years of training.

 

[tomb]

David, you make a lot of sense with your observations. I think I can convince my friend to re-think his investment ideas. If he is so hot on colored diamonds, maybe he should buy the best he can for his wife to wear and if they increase in value so much the better.

 

[diamondsbylauren]

That's exactly the right idea Tom- the way to maximize your investment is to enjoy the gems for their beauty. Over time diamonds have proved better than most other items people buy for value retention ( but NOT for investment)

 

[valeria101]

----------------
On 10/23/2003 9:45:24 PM tomb wrote:

I think I can convince my friend to re-think his investment ideas. ----------------

I might not be a diamond expert (really not) but about weird investments I may know a thing or too. Now, I guess the (quoted) idea is the right one and I am glad that no one cited 'investment' grades out there! Best wishes hunting that awesome stone!

 

[Gene]

Ok. Unless you have the buying power to get stones
at wholesale, and unless you have really good luck
finding someone interested in such a special stone
when it comes time to sell, you'll be losing a lot
on transaction costs, both the buy and sell side.

That aside, the greenish-yellow with yellow fluoro
actually sounds like a really nice stone, and that
kind of rare beauty can be the pride and joy of a
good collection -- something most other investment
vehicles don't offer.