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Color vs Clarity vs Carat trade-off

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abcunnin

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 30, 2010
Messages
18
Hi Everyone,

I'm preparing to share my engagement ring diamond parameters with my boyfriend, so he can pick a diamond for my ring. I'm looking for some outside, educated input on the different C trade offs. Our budget is somewhere between $4000-$8000 for the diamond, but we would like to spend as little as possible while maintaining an eye-clean diamond. Here are my parameter ranges and questions for input:

On cut, I'm pretty solid on ideal/excellent or very good. On clarity and color, I feel like I'm happy within a range and would like to choose the lower of the range in exchange for a larger diamond. My boyfriend is challenging me on this, suggesting that it might be worth going higher just because it is of better quality...in exchange for a smaller diamond. I'm looking for outside opinion on why I would pick one direction or the other. My parameters that would handle some movement are color (I'm considering the lower range of D-I, but my boyfriend thinks we should go more on the colorless end) and clarity (I'm considering the lower range of VS1-SI1 as long as it is eye clean, but I'm not sure if I should spend the money on higher grade). If I only care about how it looks in isolation to the naked eye, is there an argument for going to higher quality in terms of color and clarity in exchange for a smaller diamond? Or, given my priorities, would you go for a bit larger (1.3 versus 1 carat for example) and lower color and clarity?

Hope this makes sense. I know that final decision, I still should look AT the diamonds themselves.

Thanks in advance,

Alli
 
Well, I would do a little compromise and go with H VS2 with those parameters! An ideal cut H is beautiful and G-H is at the upper end of near colorless. G-H and VS is my personal preference range, and I consider it very high quality if the diamond is ideal/excellent cut. I would not sacrifice size to go with D-F color, but I also would prefer not to go to the lower end of near colorless in a ring. You should be able to get a 1 ct. H VS2 in the $6000+ range and up to about 1.2 if you want to spend the $8000.
 
I would go down to an H in color (or G if your boyfriend doesnt want you going to H). I also would go with an
eye-clean SI1. If you cant see anything in the stone, why pay for what you cant see when you can get a larger stone?

If eye-clean
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2212151.htm
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2336877.htm
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/H-SI2-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1303464.asp
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/H-VS2-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1333808.asp
 
I do not consider H SI1 to be a compromise on coloor or clarity, since such a diamond will look very colorless and is relatively easy to find eye clean! So I would simply get the largest stone I can afford. If I wanted to ensure icy white, I would maybe go for a G.

Unless there are cultural reasons to get a colorless stone, or you personally like the way colorless stones look the best, it is really not necessary IMO. It is not better "quality".
 
please look at some videos that Jonathan at GoodoldGold has made, this one is specifically on D, H and J color diamonds it'll also help give you a sense if you haven't seen many Ideal cut diamonds before... I would also venture in the I color if you are looking at Ideal Rounds.

http://www.vimeo.com/3768278

Also I DITTO Dreamer.
 
Hi,

I also think an H would be an excellent choice. I have a D and wouldn't shell out the $ to get another. I sold my E stone, and now have F and G and find my G to be wonderful. If I purchase in the future, my goal would be an H.
 
This is really helpful. Most people are confirming my opinions...that it is what we can see that matters and will an ideal cut round, a near colorless diamond will be great...similarly with SI versus VS2. I think it's really important to remind myself over and over again that I shouldn't pay for something I cannot discern with my eyes.

It seems, from looking around, I should be able to save $1000-2000 by getting an SI2 and G/H/I instead of VS2 and E/F given the same carat size. And, if I want to, I would be able to afford going up in size.

Thanks, again!! (Of course I'll take anyone else's opinion!)

Now, time to obsess over the setting :-) Well, and whether I want to pay more to go up in size!
 
abcunnin said:
This is really helpful. Most people are confirming my opinions...that it is what we can see that matters and will an ideal cut round, a near colorless diamond will be great...similarly with SI versus VS2. I think it's really important to remind myself over and over again that I shouldn't pay for something I cannot discern with my eyes.

It seems, from looking around, I should be able to save $1000-2000 by getting an SI2 and G/H/I instead of VS2 and E/F given the same carat size. And, if I want to, I would be able to afford going up in size.

Thanks, again!! (Of course I'll take anyone else's opinion!)

Now, time to obsess over the setting :-) Well, and whether I want to pay more to go up in size!
Click to expand...
This is just me...I'd be a bit uncomfortable going down to an SI2, especially for an eng. ring. Mine is a VS2. My earrings are SI1 and look amazing, but then again, the stones are smaller and super ideal cut so all that shows is the sparkle.
 
If you plan to go for an SI2 make sure to look at it in many different lighting environments and be sure that there is a nice return period (say a week) to make sure you are comfortable with the eye cleanliness of the stone.
 
This is so interesting as everyone has different preferences.

We didn't have a huge budget to play with for my e-ring, and I priorotised size and colour (and cut, of course) over clarity. My e-ring is an eye clean SI2, and I am totally fine with that. "Knowing" that it is an SI2 doesn't bother me. It's in the 1ct range, and I know that if I wanted higher clarity, I would have to go down to .75-.80, and I didn't want that.

We also managed to find a GIA 'very good' that has an HCA of 1 and is a wonderful stone. There are many 'excellent' stones that look nowhere near as good, and don't have as good numbers, but that's a whole different subject.

My stone is an F and I love it. I have a superideal G, and I still prefer my F, even though I am happy to move in the F-H range. Would consider 'I' but for other jewellery.

So there you have it, compromise on what's not important to you, and ultimately get a ring that will make you really happy.

dinamit
 
GHI color range looks great to most people. Ideal proportions can make a lower grade "face up", look whiter, than it really is. SI1 with a clean center and no black is usually good enough for the average person but if you have a sharp eye you may want to go to VS2. I find that H SI1-VS2 is a great place to be for the best of al world's with regard to cut, clarity, color, carat, and cost.

Best Regards, Matt
 
This is so interesting as everyone has different preferences.

We didn't have a huge budget to play with for my e-ring, and I priorotised size and colour (and cut, of course) over clarity. My e-ring is an eye clean SI2, and I am totally fine with that. "Knowing" that it is an SI2 doesn't bother me. It's in the 1ct range, and I know that if I wanted higher clarity, I would have to go down to .75-.80, and I didn't want that.

We also managed to find a GIA 'very good' that has an HCA of 1 and is a wonderful stone. There are many 'excellent' stones that look nowhere near as good, and don't have as good numbers, but that's a whole different subject.

My stone is an F and I love it. I have a superideal G, and I still prefer my F, even though I am happy to move in the F-H range. Would consider 'I' but for other jewellery.

So there you have it, compromise on what's not important to you, and ultimately get a ring that will make you really happy.

dinamit
------------------------\

Excellent post! I recommend that to many clients......buy what looks good and will make you happy! Look at the differences and pick which characteristic you want to pay for and which one you can not bother with! It may not be as good "on paper".....but how good it is on your hand is what ultimately matters!

Matt
 
Thanks Matt,

And may I say that is one wonderful looking ring in your avatar. It really caught my eye, and I am looking forward to having a browse through your website.

dinamit
 
One more bit of advice: read the section under the Knowledge tab on this site. It will be extremely helpful. Also, there are excellent pictures of diamond color and clarity characteristics on the Good Old Gold site under 4 C's and Beyond. Also, it can be very helpful to look through the Show Me the Bling section of this forum to look at many engagement rings to get some ideas of what you really might like.
 
I have discovered that the sweet spot for me is a G VS2. I just traded in my G SI1 for a G VS2. The SI1 was a beautiful stone and was eye clean, but I had problem convincing myself that this was the diamond for me. Now that I have gone up in clarity, I feel very satisfied with my choice :))
 
a well cut G-H VS2-SI1... :love: if i had a lot of money then i'll go F VS1.
 
I'd go larger -- but no lower than an H in color, and an eye-clean SI1. I had a friend who was looking for a RB last month and I found him a AGS0 1.1ct G SI1 at whiteflash for under $6k (expert selection too, five stars!). I was trying to persuade him to go lower in color because I feel like going to an H-SI1, he would have gotten a bigger diamond. Like this one: http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2531915.htm (HCA = 1.5)...

Btw, I did a cost analysis using ct weight, color, and clarity this summer -- basically, the sweet spot for an ideal cut, H&A RB is H-VS2. If you buy a higher color or higher clarity than an H-VS2, you're penalized (in the sense that you're paying proportionately more for the increases in color and clarity). This is why I say H-SI1 is the sweet spot for me, because if you can find an eye-clean H-SI1, you're getting the most carat weight (conditional on choosing an ideal H&A RB) for your money. On average.

I would publish it, but can't think of the right forum (e.g., peer reviewed journal).
 
Have you looked at stones in person or videos? This weekend I realized that BF and I are not color sensitive at all. we looked at D all the was to H and I color and they practically looked the same to me. BF even thought the H looked whiter than the E at one point. lol so my point is just to see if you really need a higher color. Knowing that I'm not color sensitive, I might even consider a lower color grade now as well.

My priorities are cut (ideal/excellent) then eye clean then color.
 
I've gone to both extremes: my e-ring at 1.46 is a J, VS2, and my pendant at 1.30 is an E, SI1. Just going off personal preference ....

1) I learned I really like warmth. I love my pendant, but I stare at my e-ring non-stop.

2) Paying for clarity is purely a mind-clean thing. I use my loupe a lot, but even so, SI1 is good enough for government work: I doubt I'll go higher again.

Go out and look at stones in person to see which ones fascinate you and draw you in: this is purely personal.

P.S. - I, myself, am obsessed with fluorescence. It's a gorgeous effect when it's visible, and still a discount when it's not ... my E pendant stone was priced something like 25% lower than comparable stones (and, sadly for me, it's not even visible outside of a black light). Something to consider ....
 
abcunnin|1288492679|2751391 said:
On cut, I'm pretty solid on ideal/excellent or very good.
Alli
Click to expand...

Don't settle for Very Good cut. In fact, don't settle for GIA Excellent that's not really a good performer. AGS0 or equivalent is the way to go.
 
This is a really old thread! That Bobby person is bumping up old threads and adding posts w/his link to a website!
 
MC|1393437290|3623522 said:
This is a really old thread! That Bobby person is bumping up old threads and adding posts w/his link to a website!
Click to expand...

I was just noticing that, and about to say something.
 
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