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calling kenny

slg47

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hi Kenny :wavey: I was curious to know more about your green FCD...I know many PSers (myself included) are absolutely :love: :love: with it

do you know if that particular cutting house usually cuts FCDs with that type of faceting pattern? it seems lovely and also somewhat unusual? also do you know where it came from, and if there are more of that color? (no, I am not interested in buying one, just curious :) ) sorry if you don't have any of the answers to these questions, but would love to know more about that green
 

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Rockdiamond

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Hi SLG,
I'm not Kenny ( clearly) but I'd be happy to answer about natural green diamonds in general

Pure Green is one of the rarest colors in diamonds- right up there with Blue- pure green anyway. Yellow green, brown green and other combinations are far more common.
In many cases GIA can't even guarantee that a pure green diamond is natural- because it's natural radiation that causes the color- and it's not possible to ascertain if the radiation was man made.
For this reason cutters will submit the diamond in it's rough state to GIA- at which time GIA can determine that it's natural.
I was lucky enough to see an incredible collection of natural green diamonds recently.
A number of them- which were natural Intense Green- had rather large areas left completely unpolished ( rough) which allowed GIA to declare them natural, and it also contributed to the color retention.
The prices of the Intense green stones were astronomical- but there were rounds, radiant cuts and cushions.
 

kenny

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Edit.
Thanks.

No time now.
Respond later.
 

kenny

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Thanks so much Sig.

Tacky as it is to mention price, I think it may be relevant here to state $38K for 0.26 ct was not an easy pill to swallow.
I'm not sure whether I'm the luckiest man or the biggest sucker on earth.

I am beside myself with disbelief and gratitude to have such a rarity.
I wish everyone could just come over and see it live, to see all the personalities in different lighting.
The round cut (looks to me like Old European Cut or a transitional cut) blows just blows your head off with chunky fire.
I've been spoiled by the light performance of our ACA, Solasfera, asscher and Octavia.
I always thought I'd have to give up light performance if I wanted to get into FCDs.

AFAIC a diamond achieving GIA's natural Fancy Intense Green grade with no modifying colors is awesome and truly rare, but combine that with such kicken light performance (in a cut that is antique or is an emulation of antique cutting style) is truly a once in a lifetime acquisition.
That's why I grabbed it fast when it was listed.
BTW, I was so nervous about the green really being of natural origin I insisted it go back to GIA for a second report before I pulled the trigger.
After all, if that color was man-induced it looses 98% of its value.

Today FCDs are cut to bump up the color grade and/or for weight retention, often at the expense of the light performance, many are too deep or have windowing from being too shallow.

I'm really surprised they cut my green into a round, which is not a cut cut that amps up the color strength like radiant and others, by keeping the light bouncing around several times before exiting back out the top.
If they had cut this rough into a radiant (or another color-amplifying cut) it may have gotten that ultimate and coveted vivid grade and an even higher price tag.

All this makes me think it really was cut long ago, when money grubbing perhaps wasn't the priority that it is today.
Leibish told me they have no provenance on it.
I'll let them know about this thread and perhaps they will respond here.

Now that I've lived with The Kenny Green ( :lol: ) for a couple months I have absolutely no qualms whatsoever about its cost and size.
If fate has me selling off my worldly possessions then so be it, but this green miracle will be the last to go.

Since there seems to be interest I'll take some new pics in the next few days if I can.

Picture 22.png
 

slg47

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kenny thanks for responding :) it really is beautiful
 

Rockdiamond

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It's a beauty Kenny!
Very true that Fancy Intense Green is remarkably rare. $146,000 per carat is actually not a crazy price for a stone graded Fancy Intense Green.
Some of the ones I saw recently had higher prices- and were not as nice.

It's not necessarily true that round is not best for color retention, in all cases.
I would not underestimate the cutter- cutting into a radiant/cushion may not have been possible- or feasible.
It's also too broad a generalization to say FCD's are all cut at the expense of Light Performance - actually such a statement highlights why the term "light performance" is more of a sales technique, as opposed to an accurate method of describing the way a diamond handles light IMO.
I do agree, however , that many FCD's are deep- and that some do show windowing.
But in some cases ( not all of course), these aspects don't detract from their beauty.

I'll look forward to seeing more of your excellent photographs of it!
 

Dancing Fire

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an amazing diamond Kenny :appl: :appl:
 

kenny

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Thanx.

I don't know whether this stone went to GIA as rough and multiple times during polishing (to get the coveted color of natural origin blessing) but the cutter did leave lots of the rough's skin, especially on two opposite sides, visible a top view of the round.
In some of the naturals you can see those important brown radiation stains on this VS2 stone.

To me this makes me think maybe it is not an antique stone.
I doubt 100 years ago they would specifically leave brown surface stains for GIA's future equipment to analyze.
Then again, maybe it is old and they just left those naturals for weight retention.



Does anyone know what these mysterious nine fairly evenly spaced round marks are on the girdle? Natural or the result of bruting or some other operation?
It's hard to believe they are naturals because of the facets polished around them and how similar they are.
Could they be leftover damage from it being set into some jewelry piece?
Also, check out how the culet is crooked.

Picture 17.png

Picture 20.png

Picture 21.png
 

kenny

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Below you can see how they left so much of the flat skin of the rough that is affects the round appearance.
I guess this maximized the apparent diameter achieved from this rough.

I love this stone's kozibe effect, how you can see multiple reflections of the culet.

Picture 22.png

Picture 23.png
 

Cehrabehra

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hey kenny, how does the stone do in full sun, eg fire?
 

Rockdiamond

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Phenomenal photos Kenny!

The marks on the girdle are "natural"- not made as a result of cutting- rather they were not possible to polish. The make those indentations smooth may have been totally impossible- or, the cutter would have had to grind away a significant amount of diamond. Hard to say which, but very likely either reason.
Also a great shot showing the brown area ( picture20) which is part of the "skin" left from the rough diamond.
Some of the Intense Greens I saw had quite a bit more "rough" areas left on the skin.

Put this all together, and the likelihood that your stone was cut a long time ago is virtually nil.
 

kenny

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It's really full of aggressive fire, especially for such a small stone.
I have no idea if this is typical of high crowned rounds cut in this old way or not.

I wish I could post a video of it.
 

slg47

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you should post a video!!! (if you have the right camera to capture it?)
 

LGK

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Kenny, I never get tired of seeing your beautiful pics of that gorgeous green!

FWIW, I would say it's a new cut. First, the faceted girdle is a modern thing- you really don't see diamonds except those cut in the last 20 years or so with faceted girdles, unless they've been recut recently. The naturals make me think that the faceting of the girdle is original to the stone.

Also, and I really wish I could rembember *where*, I saw another amazing FCD that had a similar lovely antique repro cut, and also with a faceted girdle, that looked to me like the same cutter's work. If I can remember where I'll post it... but for now, my brain is feeling a bit useless and decaffeinated :cheeky:

ETA: IMO high crowned stones with an antique cut have the best fire, sometimes at the expense of white light performance though. It's definitely the look that I prefer in diamonds, and I bet it's killer with the amazing minty green of this stone. And even if they're small, well cut antique (style) stones can be major, major fireballs. One of my co-workers has a teensy OEC- probably around .15 ct or a smidge more- and i took it to get sized for her, and of course I wore it the whole way :devil: and it was a firecracker. I mean, tiny- sure. But very, very eyecatching, way more fire than you'd expect from the size.
 

Cehrabehra

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I agree that cut lends itself to fire, especially in small stones... but I guess my question was more, if it has a ton of fire, how does the green hue effect it? Notice anything?
 

stepcutnut

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Lovely stone Kenny!

May I ask what camera set up you used to capture the green color-or did you have to do quit a bit of photo editing to achieve the color in the photos, I have a terrible time capturing green stones in photos!?!?!
 

kenny

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Cehrabehra|1292555220|2799233 said:
I agree that cut lends itself to fire, especially in small stones... but I guess my question was more, if it has a ton of fire, how does the green hue effect it? Notice anything?
Sara, I'd go out and check but it's raining now. :(sad
Speaking from memory, in sunlight it looks green but IIRC the flashes of fire apparently have the same colors that a white diamond would have.
It is not like the blue, yellow, cyan, orang, red, violet etc. are noticeably shifted in the green direction.

I love this kind of question because it exposes the imperfect way the mind works.
We must contend with . . .
1. What we expect
2. What we experience
3. How what we expect influences (consciously or unconsciously) what we believe we experience, or rather, our perception of our experience.
(we've all seen those optical illusion things that trick the mind)
I took art classes and they talked a lot about breaking through what the mind expects and getting to what the eye actually sees.
If you can't SEE it you can't draw it accurately - An example being a round table seen at an angle.
The brain knows it's round but the eye is actually seeing an oval.
Almost everyone drawing it will draw the oval too round.
The brain pulls towards what it knows, at the expense of what the eye is actually seeing in the moment.

My rational mind tells me that the laws of physics demands that the green body color has to influence every color of fire in the green direction.
But, how much, and can the eye detect it?
The answer must be dependent on:
1. How powerfully green this green "filter" is
2. How bright are the fire flashes are, and how capable the human eye is at differentiating hues when the intensity it at its upper threshold (sunlight is blindingly bright)
3. Is the eye being influenced by the mind expecting to see green in every color of fire?

So, in summary, I really suspect the green body color does push all the fire colors in the green direction but I honestly cannot say I can detect it.
You have me curious though and I want to take it out in the sun now next to white diamonds, but today it's raining. :(sad

When the sun comes out I'll do this and get back to you.
 

ChunkyCushionLover

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So, in summary, I really suspect the green body color does push all the fire colors in the green direction but I honestly cannot say I can detect it.
You have me curious though and I want to take it out in the sun now next to white diamonds, but today it's raining. :(sad

When the sun comes out I'll do this and get back to you.
Really Kenny you see strong Red flashes as strong as some of the other colors?
 

kenny

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stepcutnut|1292604025|2799565 said:
Lovely stone Kenny!

May I ask what camera set up you used to capture the green color-or did you have to do quit a bit of photo editing to achieve the color in the photos, I have a terrible time capturing green stones in photos!?!?!
Another simple question I cannot answer briefly. Sorry.
Actually here's the short answer: Yes, I do edit.
If interested, here is the very very long answer:

I do not like my camera.
It was very fancy and expensive, Nikon D200, but every pic seems to me underexposed when I import it into my computer.
I have a Mac and it comes with a photo program called iPhoto.
Every pic I import (not just diamond pics) requires manipulation before it looks accurate to my eyes and memory.
The exposure usually looks too dark and sometimes the color temp, color saturation [what you are asking about], highlights and shadows could benefit from adjustment to return it to what I remember seeing.

Doing this is not "lying".
It is "restoring to truth", if you will.
I'm not sure if my D200 is defective, but it is so easy to fix exposures I've just gotten into that habit.

The famous photographer Ansel Adams did this, and more, in the darkroom when he manipulated the highlights and shadows (dodging and burning) as he exposed paper under his enlarger.
Live original prints of his look alive in ways that are very unusual for B&W photography.

Was what he did cheating or lying?
Yes and no.
Even the very first pic ever taken back in the 1800s was full of lies.
We've just gotten used to them after all these years.

Imagine standing outside during a a sunny day looking at a lake in front of a forest, with a few clouds in a blue sky at noon.
When the human eye looks into the clouds, or the reflections of sunlight on the water, the pupils constrict to resolve detail in the highlights.
When the eye looks under the trees the pupils dilate to let more light in to resolve detail in the shadows.
The eye must do this because our retinas have too narrow of a range to capture the light range present in nature.
Film also has too narrow of a range and the camera's pupil, or aperture, must be adjusted to place the scene within the light range that the film can record well.

This means even the earliest cameras told lies.
The washed out white blobs in the sky (clouds) actually should contain lots of subtle detail.
The washed out black blobs under the trees are actually full of subtle detail.
We just got used to how pictures looked; we overlook the lies inherent in photography.
Today's technology makes possible many newer "lies", that some of us consider not pure photography.

In fact there is a new thing in digital photography called HDR, or high dynamic range.
The camera takes 3 pics; one is exposed for the dark parts, one for the light parts and one for the middle.
Then a computer combines them.
The result is called a lie by photo purists but is actually closer to what the eye sees live.
 

kenny

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Here is a screen capture of the pic before "editing".
Even this fancy camera set with "automatic" white balance got it wrong - too yellow.


Here it is after editing.
You can see all the adjustments I made.
I changed the color temp, and at the top you can see I moved the left and right buttons in which strengthened the dark and light areas.
In this case I did not need to adjust the color saturation at all.
In this case I did not need to increase the color saturation.


Of course my decisions are made looking at MY computer monitor.
I have no idea what all this looks like on YOUR monitor.

Before.png

After.png
 

kenny

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Also LIVE my green diamond (more-so than my other 3 FCDs) sometimes looks more pale green and other times very strongly green.
It depends on the lighting, environment and angle of view.

I have now learned that the concept that one pic can accurately show the true color saturation is absurd.
I feel sorry for vendors of FCDs in this day and age.
I also feel sorry for buyers, like me, who are stuck with making buying decisions based on pics of FCDs.
Take all FCD pics, especially green, you see with a huge grain of salt.

It is not fair to us and it is not fair to vendors, but it is just the nature of FCDs to change how they look depending on the light and environment.
Sorry.
 

kenny

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ChunkyCushionLover|1292613576|2799701 said:
So, in summary, I really suspect the green body color does push all the fire colors in the green direction but I honestly cannot say I can detect it.
You have me curious though and I want to take it out in the sun now next to white diamonds, but today it's raining. :(sad

When the sun comes out I'll do this and get back to you.
Really Kenny you see strong Red flashes as strong as some of the other colors?
Good question, red being the opposite of green, red is the color that would be most-attenuated by a green filter.
When the sun comes out I'll take the green and some whites out to evaluate if the red flashes seem different.
I'll also take out the blue and look for orange flashes.
I'll take the Purple Pink diamond and look for green flashes - sorry I dont' have a red ;(

For a true apples to apples comparison you need two identically-cut flawless diamonds placed in precisely the same location with respect to the sun and your eye in order to compare the exact same flash.
Also you'd replace the human eye/brain with an objective and calibrated hue-measuring instrument.
What I'll see and report is far from scientific and definitive, but at least it IS a data point.
There are not a whole lot of data points about this stuff.
 

Rockdiamond

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Great stuff Kenny!

You bring up some great points.
Put very simply: When "film photos" are developed, the exposure is controlled- and done so in a way that generally changes what's on the negative.

Your photos are truly remarkable- I really love them.
After reading about your methods, I realize that I could probably copy them- and maybe even get similar results after a lot of practice.
BUT- the time involved is the detriment.
A seller needs to balance the quality of photos, with the time each one takes.
Unless the seller is only selling one or two stones.


I've also found the green is one of the hardest colors to capture in diamonds.
Lucky for me, yellow is a lot easier.

I think that photos are absolutely necessary for consumers to be able to select diamonds- and I agree that the color of natural fancy colored diamonds changes- based on the viewing environment.
 

LD

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Kenny does your beautiful green have any fluoresence? I'm wondering because you said that it sometimes looked more green in some lights than others?
 

kenny

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LovingDiamonds|1292629919|2799944 said:
Kenny does your beautiful green have any fluoresence? I'm wondering because you said that it sometimes looked more green in some lights than others?
The GIA report says Fluorescense: None.

Soon I'll get a pic of the collection under my UV light.
 

rosetta

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Drool fest. :love:

At that price I won't be buying any green diamonds so thank you for letting us share in yours!

Are you planning to set this wonder?
 
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