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breanne

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jun 7, 2016
Messages
188
I've been reading a lot more on appraisals, is it mostly true that the appraisal is to confirm you've purchased what you think you've purchased? I've seen the diamond in person through a loop, 20-50-100 magnification, seen the GIA report, as well as the inscription on the diamond, ASET etc.

Am I safe to go ahead with insuring my diamond without an appraisal, unless required? Or is it a good idea to see if it's valued more than the purchase price in the event of having it replaced?

Thank you!
 

Modified Brilliant

Brilliant_Rock
Trade
Joined
Mar 24, 2005
Messages
1,481
Consumers want an appraisal for different reasons....the most common is for insurance purposes. If you are comfortable with all the specs of your diamond and that all the specs match your GIA Diamond Grading Report...then why not take all that information along with your mounting and incorporate it into a detailed appraisal report with photos? Your appraisal should provide all the necessary information to replace your item with "like kind and quality." Plus you will have the retail replacement value for insurance purposes. A detailed, professional appraisal report will protect your interests and will give you peace of mind even if your insurance company may not require it.
 

breanne

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jun 7, 2016
Messages
188
It's mostly because the only independent appraiser in 4-5 hours away, if it wasn't for that, I'd have it appraised no question. We do often visit that area, but it may not be for a few weeks etc. who knows, so my fear is not having it insured during that time.

Edit ** It would be for insurance purposes. Also, there's a CGA locally, but they mentioned keeping the ring for 5 days, which I wasn't fond of.
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 11, 2006
Messages
55,630
Breanne, I am not an appraiser, obviously, but I can tell you when I use an appraiser.

When I buy a new diamond at retail and it is GIA or AGS graded, I use my purchase receipt and the diamond grading report to insure. I do not see any reason to get an appraisal.

I have bought a diamond second hand before, and in that case I needed an appraisal to establish a replacement value for insurance. I also had a diamond pendant that came from my mother, and I had that appraised as well.
 

denverappraiser

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jul 21, 2004
Messages
8,747
As mentioned above, people seek out appraisals on new purchases for a variety of reasons. Here's a few:

1) To confirm or refute things that the seller told you.
2) To tell you things that the seller didn't, either because they didn't know or because they were hiding something.
3) To act as an informed quality control step for the manufacturing techniques, setting, other materials and so on.
4) To inspect for damage.
5) To provide information about the other materials like side stones, metals, etc.
6) To confirm or refute branding and similar claims as well as claims about light performance and so on.
7) To confirm that documents provided, like lab reports, are for the correct stone(s) and that there have been no changes or damage since the date of inspection.
8) To document things for replacement. This includes weight, dimensions, counts, setting techniques, photographs and so on. The description in the documents you give the insurance company will become the purchase order for your replacement in the case of a loss and it's common among sellers that these descriptions and photos are, umm, inadequate to the task.
9) To set a budget for the replacement and, in effect, to set your premiums.
 

denverappraiser

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jul 21, 2004
Messages
8,747
breanne|1469495826|4059300 said:
It's mostly because the only independent appraiser in 4-5 hours away, if it wasn't for that, I'd have it appraised no question. We do often visit that area, but it may not be for a few weeks etc. who knows, so my fear is not having it insured during that time.

Edit ** It would be for insurance purposes. Also, there's a CGA locally, but they mentioned keeping the ring for 5 days, which I wasn't fond of.
Your insurer will probably bind a policy based on the lab documents and sales receipt. I presume the seller gave you SOMETHING, right? You can 'update' the documentation at any time so just schedule an appointment with the appraiser of your choice when it's convenient for you.
 

breanne

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jun 7, 2016
Messages
188
Is it enough to have the GIA report number, and the diamonds specs written on the receipt with it's total price with setting? I have all that in my email at the moment.

I haven't received the finished ring yet, it'll be shipped sometime after Friday, so I'm not entirely sure what'll be included, or what else should be included? I also wouldn't have access to it as the actual engagement is a surprise, so although it'll be shipped Friday, I won't physically have it till, who knows :)

I would like to start insurance asap, I didn't realize I could make changes should I meet with an appraiser at a later date, it IS something I'd like to do, it's just the distance that's the issue.

Would you recommend applying for the insurance, then making changes once I'm able to meet with Harry Weinstein, perhaps a month or two from now?

**Edit ** My concern in doing this is, if I purchased the diamond for less than it's appraised for, why would the insurance company want to increase the amount? Does this make sense?
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 11, 2006
Messages
55,630
Get the insurance immediately. See if the jeweler setting the stone will write up an insurance valuation for you. Tell him the price of the stone (if bought elsewhere) so the value can be what you paid for the stone and setting. Then you can send copies of that, the GIA report, and your sales receipts to the insurance company. If you get all that, I don't see why you'd need anything else.
 

breanne

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jun 7, 2016
Messages
188
I purchased the setting and diamond from one person. My invoice has the USD total for the diamond, followed by the conversion to Canadian, with the setting cost, and of course grand total. It has a small piece of information about the diamond, (1.42ct J SI1) but doesn't have the actual GIA report number listed.

The only other thing maybe I should ask to have clarified is that the setting was in platinum? It has it in abbreviation "ERPLT" but that may not be good enough should there ever be any issues down the line? Do you think that would suffice or should I have that written out, and have the GIA report added? Also, should I have it all written out in just the Canadian dollar total to avoid confusion?

I know insurance companies can be very finicky, so I want to cross all my T's.
 

denverappraiser

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jul 21, 2004
Messages
8,747
The typical insurance valuation is and estimate of what it could be reasonably expected to cost to replace the item with another one like it new, at retail, locally. It's common for transactions to be for less than that, especially if it was in some other sort of marketplace. It's also common for 'appraisals' to be used to propagate a fictitious high number in order to make you feel like you got a bargain. You'll notice in my list above that one of the things appraisals are NOT particularly good for is deciding if you got a 'bargain'.

I can't tell you if the documentation given by the jeweler is sufficient but there's actually a fairly easy test. Read the description section and look at the pictures. Nothing else, and specifically ignore the price. Imagine that someone (not the original jeweler) were to produce the cheapest thing possible that meets or exceeds that description. Are you likely to be happy with the results?

Yes, I'm suggesting you bind the policy immediately using the paperwork you have and then update it with better documentation when you get an opportunity, assuming that what you have doesn't meet the above test.
 

breanne

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jun 7, 2016
Messages
188
I totally get what you're saying, it really doesn't matter what I paid or what it's appraised for, it really matters that it'll be replaced for exactly what it was, so technically, it's more important to have the diamonds information loud and clear more than anything? I think that's great information!
 

denverappraiser

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jul 21, 2004
Messages
8,747
breanne|1469505962|4059343 said:
I totally get what you're saying, it really doesn't matter what I paid or what it's appraised for, it really matters that it'll be replaced for exactly what it was, so technically, it's more important to have the diamonds information loud and clear more than anything? I think that's great information!
Diamond and other things.

When I appraise new purchase items and they end up going back to the jeweler, it's usually not the weight/color/clarity on the center stone, especially if it's been to a credible lab.

The #1 reason for returns has to do with craftsmanship. Loose or broken stones, snagging, uneven or improper setting, casting porosity and so on.

#2 has to do with the other materials. That would be grading on the side stones, karatage on the metals and things like that.

#3 is simply failure to follow instructions. This can range from the improper ring size to the spelling on the engraving. These aren't defects per se, but obviously they're important problems.

#4 would be damage. Chipped, missing or broken stones. Broken and missing prongs and abraded gems and broken welds are other examples.

#5 is probably the problem with BS labs and grading. I don't actually see very much of this any more. It used to be a lot. I suspect it's still going on but they don't end up on my desk. People who are suckers for the 'cheapest' diamond are also suckers for the cheapest appraisal.

Price is very rarely the issue. Mostly, people who make it far enough down the road to reach me are pretty careful shoppers. They know what things cost and if price is a hot button, which usually it is, it's already been addressed as part of the shopping process. I'm a 2nd (or 3rd or 4th) opinion on that.
 

breanne

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jun 7, 2016
Messages
188
You've been extremely helpful, and I appreciate your time. Being new to everything, I want to be sure I take the appropriate steps to protect my ring, and potentially other items down the line. Nothing would be worse than something happening, but at least if I'm covered, it'll be a little easier to resolve. I've asked my jeweler to write out all the information on an invoice, including the GIA report, this way should anything happen, the diamonds specs and price are readily available. You've given me a lot of peace of mind, thank you so much. :clap:
 
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