Buy online from London-UK

[rouniftw]

Well after some research I found a London based site www.diamondmanufacturers.co.uk and I want to buy a GIA cert or DMGG diamond from them.

Any feedback about the site/company ?

(sorry for my English , isnt my native language

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 12/30/2008 4:43:08 AM
Author:rouniftw
Well after some research I found a London based site www.diamondmanufacturers.co.uk and I want to buy a GIA cert or DMGG diamond from them.

Any feedback about the site/company ?

(sorry for my English , isnt my native language

Welcome!

No sorry I haven''t heard of them. If you are looking for reliable sellers in the London area, then Dr Indira Marchant at-

www.bestdiamonds.co.uk is an expert and very nice lady, you could contact her.

 

[oldmancoyote]

I haven''t heard of them either - however bear in mind that even after paying VAT and duty, US-based vendors are often cheaper.

 

[rouniftw]

They offer

Round cut
Carat 0.99
Cut Very Good
Colour G
Clarity VS2
Certificate GIA
Price £1827

Thats around 2,650 USD or 1850 euro.

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 12/30/2008 8:22:15 AM
Author: rouniftw
They offer

Round cut
Carat 0.99
Cut Very Good
Colour G
Clarity VS2
Certificate GIA
Price £1827

Thats around 2,650 USD or 1850 euro.

We need the following proportions to judge the cut of the diamond, without a good cut you won''t have a beautiful diamond. If you could post the -

depth %
table %
crown and pavilion angles
girdle thickness
diameter measurements
fluorescence if applicable

then we can find out more.

 

[rouniftw]

What about that one ?
http://www.bluenile.co.uk/round-diamond-1-carat-ideal-cut-f-colour-si1-clarity_LD01472289?__fun_frm=i&filter_id=0#grading_report

Carat weight: 1.01
Cut: Ideal
Colour: F
Clarity: SI1
62% depth, 58% table, 37° crown angle, 40° pavilion angle
Price: £3125 or $4500

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 12/31/2008 2:30:37 PM
Author: rouniftw
What about that one ?
http://www.bluenile.co.uk/round-diamond-1-carat-ideal-cut-f-colour-si1-clarity_LD01472289?__fun_frm=i&filter_id=0#grading_report

Carat weight: 1.01
Cut: Ideal
Colour: F
Clarity: SI1
62% depth, 58% table, 37° crown angle, 40° pavilion angle
Price: £3125 or $4500

I would keep looking quite honestly, the pavilion angle is shallow, although the diamond scores ok on the HCA, it is a more unorthodox combo and without more info such as Idealscope images etc, we have no way of really seeing how this diamond looks. Also it has been brillianteered which also warrants an Idealscope image to check, however BN do not provide them.

Here are some numbers you can use as a guide to help you find a well cut diamond.

depth - 60 - 62% - although my personal preference is to allow up to 62.4%
table - 54- 57%
crown angle - 34- 35 degrees
pavilion angle - 40.6- 41 degrees
girdle - avoid extremes, look for thin to slightly thick, thin to medium etc
polish and symmetry - very good and above

note - with crown and pavilion angles at the shallower ends ( CA 34- PA 40.6) and steeper ( CA 35- PA 41) check to make sure these angles complement in that particular diamond - eyeballs, Idealscope, trusted vendor input - check as appropriate!

And from expert John Pollard.

"As the above implies, configurations depend on each other. A little give here can still work with a little take there.

With that said, here's a "Cliff's Notes" for staying near Tolkowsky/ideal angles with GIA reports (their numbers are rounded): A crown angle of 34.0, 34.5 or 35.0 is usually safe with a 40.8 pavilion angle. If pavilion angle = 40.6 lean toward a 34.5-35.0 crown. If pavilion angle = 41 lean toward a 34.0-34.5 crown.

GIA "EX" in cut is great at its heart, but it ranges a bit wider than some people prefer, particularly in deep combinations (pavilion > 41 with crown > 35)."

 

[rouniftw]

Hey Everyone,

Just want to say thanks for all the good info I''ve gotten from this site.
I got that diamond from BN uk , http://www.bluenile.co.uk/certs/2049/GIA1106445876_zoom.jpeg
The setting will be a custom tiffany legacy like , soon i will post photos

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 1/11/2009 4:19:59 PM
Author: rouniftw
Hey Everyone,

Just want to say thanks for all the good info I''ve gotten from this site.
I got that diamond from BN uk , http://www.bluenile.co.uk/certs/2049/GIA1106445876_zoom.jpeg
The setting will be a custom tiffany legacy like , soon i will post photos

You did great, EXCELLENT choice!!!

 

[Indira-London]

Date: 12/30/2008 7:41:22 AM
Author: oldmancoyote
I haven't heard of them either - however bear in mind that even after paying VAT and duty, US-based vendors are often cheaper.

I have being reluctant to post in this and similar recent threads for fear of violating forum rules but I just need to correct the general misconception re. prices. Whilst I cannot and do not speak for other UK vendors - I for one sell the same quality diamonds as other Crafted By Infinity traders at the same dollar trade prices without import duty for UK/Europe. All I really want to do is correct the misconception re. prices.

I hope this is allowed for me to say this and does not cause offence to anyone.

 

[Indira-London]

Date: 12/30/2008 4:46:26 AM
Author: Lorelei

Date: 12/30/2008 4:43:08 AM
Author:rouniftw
Well after some research I found a London based site www.diamondmanufacturers.co.uk and I want to buy a GIA cert or DMGG diamond from them.

Any feedback about the site/company ?

(sorry for my English , isnt my native language

Welcome!

No sorry I haven''t heard of them. If you are looking for reliable sellers in the London area, then Dr Indira Marchant at-

www.bestdiamonds.co.uk is an expert and very nice lady, you could contact her.

Thank you for the compliments Lorelei

 

[rouniftw]

Got the diamond today from BN , delivery to Greece was flawless in 2 days.

 

[Lorelei]

You are most welcome Indira!

Roun, the diamond looks great - congrats!!

 

[LD]

Date: 1/12/2009 10:09:56 AM
Author: Indira-London

Date: 12/30/2008 7:41:22 AM
Author: oldmancoyote
I haven''t heard of them either - however bear in mind that even after paying VAT and duty, US-based vendors are often cheaper.

I have being reluctant to post in this and similar recent threads for fear of violating forum rules but I just need to correct the general misconception re. prices. Whilst I cannot and do not speak for other UK vendors - I for one sell the same quality diamonds as other Crafted By Infinity traders at the same dollar trade prices without import duty for UK/Europe. All I really want to do is correct the misconception re. prices.

I hope this is allowed for me to say this and does not cause offence to anyone.

If you don''t mind, I would like to 2nd this too! Good quality diamonds are available in the UK (GIA cert etc) at the same price or less than if a UK based customer bought from the US - particularly because customs tax is a killer for UK individuals buying from a US company! I buy all my diamonds from a UK based company and after extensive research I know that the prices I pay cannot be bettered.

 

[oldmancoyote]

Date: 1/20/2009 4:01:45 PM
Author: LovingDiamonds

Date: 1/12/2009 10:09:56 AM
Author: Indira-London

Date: 12/30/2008 7:41:22 AM
Author: oldmancoyote
I haven't heard of them either - however bear in mind that even after paying VAT and duty, US-based vendors are often cheaper.

I have being reluctant to post in this and similar recent threads for fear of violating forum rules but I just need to correct the general misconception re. prices. Whilst I cannot and do not speak for other UK vendors - I for one sell the same quality diamonds as other Crafted By Infinity traders at the same dollar trade prices without import duty for UK/Europe. All I really want to do is correct the misconception re. prices.

I hope this is allowed for me to say this and does not cause offence to anyone.

If you don't mind, I would like to 2nd this too! Good quality diamonds are available in the UK (GIA cert etc) at the same price or less than if a UK based customer bought from the US - particularly because customs tax is a killer for UK individuals buying from a US company! I buy all my diamonds from a UK based company and after extensive research I know that the prices I pay cannot be bettered.

OK, since I'm the one who started the controversy, no offence caused (to me at least - and I'm delighted to know that I can buy CraftedbyInfinity in the UK), but I'd like to correct a few misconceptions too:

1. Import duty for the whole EU/EFTA for jewellery or stones coming from the US is 2.5%. Hardly a killer. On top of this you pay VAT - at the standard rate, as you would at any vendor. Of course, since CraftedbyInfinity is based in Antwerp, this particular 2.875% (2.5 + 15% VAT) is avoided, which is all for the good if you buy a stone from them. If you want another manufacturer (I don't see why one would, given the quality available, but people are funny, or maybe they just want an emerald cut), then it really depends on where the stone starts from.

2. I'm really glad that you are finding diamonds at better prices in the UK than in the US - perhaps you can share your source? I never have - possibly because finding online diamond vendors in the UK and comparing prices online is pretty much impossible, or perhaps because I've looked in the wrong places. These places have included one-man band gem traders dealing from home, large chain stores and pretty much anything in between. I haven't looked at UK vendors for a couple of years, so it's possible things have changed since; at any rate, I have simply said that often US-based vendors are cheaper (and the reason why is below).

3. I can't buy diamonds at trade price - unfortunately. Overheads (rents/leases, salaries, energy,...), interest rates and taxation are all considerably higher in the UK (particularly prior to the recent collapse in the £ exchange rate vs. the US$), thus I have reasonable grounds to believe that UK retail prices - including recovery of overheads, financing costs and company tax charges - are generally higher than in the US, even if profit margins are the same or possibly lower, and the wholesale/trade price for the goods is the same for a UK trader. This has been a consistent observation over 10 years of regular travel for a number of items ranging from consumer electronics to clothing to jewellery.

Does it apply to all items at all times? No - for example right now Tiffany online prices seem to be about 12% lower in the UK than in the US (assuming US sales tax to be 7%), due to the appallingly low exchange rate (lowest since August 1985). However, if one uses an average exchange rate of 1.7 $/£ (average of the last 10 years), then Tiffany UK prices are about 8% higher, at least across the half-a-dozen items I checked (the difference seems to be pretty consistent, though, on items priced as little as $250 and as much as $10,000). At the exchange rate of 6 months ago, UK prices were higher by 25%.

 

[LD]

OMC - I beg to differ on the import duties you have laid out. If an item is shipped by FedEx (for example), FedEx apply a fee, on top of that you have VAT which is up to 17.5% (although this has recently changed), then you have customs charges (which vary) and the list goes on. If a seller doesn''t declare shipping costs in the correct way, they get added on top (even if you have paid for this) and you can get charged again! As a general rule of thumb if I buy from a US company I may as well add on 20-25% to allow for these costs.

I am happy to share my source of where I buy diamonds. One of the main places I buy is from Diamondgeezer.com - they are online sellers but call in stones as required. They buy from all over the world. Their internet site only has some of the diamonds they sell and whilst they don''t offer a Sarin or Aset service etc etc., they use their eyes and expertise. In order to get a proper quote (or get them to search for a particular diamond) I find it better to call. Their personal service ensures they search for and I get exactly what I want.

By way of an example, I have just bought the most stunning pear shaped 1.02ct diamond, SI2, I colour with strong blue fluor, GIA cert. It''s an absolutely stunning stone and has received many compliments on this site. The price I paid was £1350 which equates to around $2,000. I DEFINITELY could not have bought the same diamond from the US at that price. As a regular customer of theirs I know they work extra hard to find me equisite diamonds and make very little money out of me but it''s a two way street as I have been a repeat customer for many years now. The price of this diamond is not the "norm" and I appreciate that - I was in the right place at the right time and Diamondgeezer just happened to fall on this little beauty.

They have also made me a large number of bespoke pieces (using their diamonds and/or mine) all of which they''ve completed for much much much less than elsewhere.

Bearing all that in mind, I very rarely have to buy from the US or Europe.

 

[oldmancoyote]

DL - thanks for the recommendation. I'll check them out, especially since Bourton-on-the-Water is a very nice place too!

However, sorry, but your description of what happens is not at all accurate.

VAT is to be paid indipendently of whether you buy from the US, New Zealand or the jewellery store on your local High Street. It was 17.5% until a gentleman called Gordon Brown recently decided it was a great idea to force all shopkeepers to relabel their goods in the name of a fairly worthless fiscal stimulus. From this point of view, there is little difference buying from DiamondGeezer or WhiteFlash - the only difference being that you see the VAT added to the bill in one case much more prominently than in the other, but the amount of tax you pay is the same (assuming the same net starting price).

Custom charges do not "vary" arbitrarily and VAT is not "up to" x%. The rates are laid down in UK law, and for jewellery customs duties are equal to 2.5% of the declared value of the goods including declared shipping and insurance costs (i.e. the total invoice price), on top of which (goods, shipping, other costs and duty) VAT at the standard rate - now 15% - is charged. In addition to all this, FedEx (and RoyalMail) charge about £10 for customs processing.

See here for an explanation of the process, here for duty rate on loose diamonds (which is 0% on loose stones, by the way, so I was wrong) and here for duty on jewellery (which is - as I said - 2.5%). I can't find a schedule of "ancillary fees" on FedEx's site, but I was charged £7.50 on the two most recent packages I received from the US (and £11.75 by RoyalMail).

Net result: way less than 20% on top of the website's list price, particularly on loose stones with VAT at 15%.

On the competitiveness of UK prices: let's take a look at a the price of a 1.2 carat GIA G/VS1 round - a typical stone if there is one. The average of the top three most expensive stones on Blue Nile/Abazias/UnionDiamond comes to $8,476 per carat. Plus 17% (VAT, shipping, fees etc.), divided by 1.4 $/£ = £7,083/carat, all inclusive at your door. Same thing on diamondgeezer, using their "discounted" price: £7,895/carat. A difference of 11%. Not worth the fuss? Maybe, but remember the exchange rate is very low at the moment, and on a £10,000 stone it's still more than £1,000 savings. (BTW - if I pick Blue Nile / Scaasi / WhiteFlash on in-house stones from PS's search engine the average is even lower: -14% less net-net).

I'm sure you get great bargains from DiamondGeezer, but saying that "the prices you pay cannot be bettered" is not really borne out (I too get bargains from my "regular suppliers" whereever they are, particularly if I move quickly and cash in hand, but the one-time buyer - and they are the vast majority - does not). DiamondGeezer may be competitive, but certainly not lower cost compared to "low cost" US-based dealers. Service, closeness and trust are of course hugely valuable, and they may well swing the balance in favour of buying "local", but that's not the argument.

One last point - whether you like it or not, the UK is in Europe - geographically, politically, culturally and economically. No matter what the Daily Telegraph says or whether the UK decides to opt out of the EU and into EFTA (a wise thing in my opinion, although probably unfeasible)

 

[LD]

OMC thank you so much for your explanation of VAT etc - quite obviously I must look at all my documentation as clearly I have always been overcharged.

You have taken my words out of context with regard to my diamond pear - which by the way was only one example. To clarify, at the time I was looking, the price for the same carat weight, cut, clarity, certification etc could not be beaten and I had approached various PS vendors (Whiteflash to name but one) at that time. During my search, I was simply looking at the sale price and not the cost of shipping. At that time, nobody could match or beat the price that I bought the diamond for from Diamondgeezer.com. You clearly have a view that I am wrong and that''s fine. I will continue to buy from the seller that offers me the best deal (wherever that may be). That may be in the UK or the US or elsewhere.

Thank you also for the unnecessary lesson in geography and assumption that I am a Daily Telegraph reader. I find it incredulous that you assume I don''t know where the UK is!

If you don''t mind, I''m drawing a line under this debate. You have a view that I''m wrong and that diamonds in the UK can''t match diamonds in the US for price and quality. I beg to differ.

 

[xjenkins]

Hi,

I think I can chip in on this debate having recently been through the process of comparing UK and US vendors. I asked a similar question in this thread:

https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/buying-from-the-us-still-a-good-idea-for-brits.104042/

where lorelei directed me towards Indira at best diamonds.

I contacted Indira and requested info on several AGS 0 Infinity diamonds which I benchmarked against similar stones on Whiteflash and others. The upshot is that once VAT, duty, postage and insurance are added it was slightly cheaper to buy from the UK (by about $100 or so). Indira even broke the price down into the base US$ cost, the VAT and the exchange rate used to make it even easier for me to see this.

There are Jewellers in the UK that can match the quality and price of the US sites, Indira is one of them and I am sure there are a few others, however as far as I can see there aren't any pure play online stores in the UK that are similar to Whiteflash etc. This isn't really a problem - all you have to do is email the UK jeweller if you want to compare prices and specs. If your buying an Infinity diamond you can double check all the specs (idealscope, asetscope, hearts/arrows pictures etc etc) on http://www.craftedbyinfinity.com and you can be sure you know what your getting.

The big upside of buying from the UK is that you can visit the Jeweller and choose your diamond - in my case I wasn't sure what a J colour diamond would actually look like - and be sure you love it before parting with your money. Often you will be offered additional services such as free resizing and free lifetime "ring checkups" to make sure your purchase stays in tip top shape.

I run an online advertising agency and have worked in dot coms for nearly 10 years, If I can buy something online for less than I can get it in a shop I'd be the first to do it, but in this instance there was no need.

Cheers

rob

 

[oldmancoyote]

Date: 1/22/2009 2:50:20 PM
Author: LovingDiamonds

OMC thank you so much for your explanation of VAT etc - quite obviously I must look at all my documentation as clearly I have always been overcharged.

You have taken my words out of context with regard to my diamond pear - which by the way was only one example. To clarify, at the time I was looking, the price for the same carat weight, cut, clarity, certification etc could not be beaten and I had approached various PS vendors (Whiteflash to name but one) at that time. During my search, I was simply looking at the sale price and not the cost of shipping. At that time, nobody could match or beat the price that I bought the diamond for from Diamondgeezer.com. You clearly have a view that I am wrong and that''s fine. I will continue to buy from the seller that offers me the best deal (wherever that may be). That may be in the UK or the US or elsewhere.

Thank you also for the unnecessary lesson in geography and assumption that I am a Daily Telegraph reader. I find it incredulous that you assume I don''t know where the UK is!

If you don''t mind, I''m drawing a line under this debate. You have a view that I''m wrong and that diamonds in the UK can''t match diamonds in the US for price and quality. I beg to differ.

DL, I don''t mind drawing a line, but I do mind if my words are twisted or attributed incorrectly.

1. I haven''t mentioned your diamond pear at all. However, your first post said quite unequivocally "I buy all my diamonds from a UK based company and after extensive research I know that the prices I pay cannot be bettered." (my emphasis). Undoubtedly true for the pear (yes, I did check...

), and equally true for you in many other cases. Published prices tell a different story.

2. I have a view that the US often provides better value for money. So far, I have backed that claim with evidence and sources. I don''t contest your claim that the UK may be able to offer equal or better value in some cases, I just say that it''s worth checking. And as rob (xjenkins) says, there is value in being able to see the item before committing to buy.

3. My apologies - and I mean that - if my remarks on "Europe" have offended you. I am however greatly irritated by the British habit of referring to "Europe" as if it was something quite separate that Britain doesn''t belong to.

Peace?