blue spinel

[VapidLapid]

pretty blue color for a spinel

cobalt

 

[VapidLapid]

Well I am thinking of buying this since I saw Chrono''s cobalt and I turned blue with envy, so people''s opinions are welcomed. This will be my first spinel an dI am wondering if this is a good one, a good price for what it is.....

 

[Lady_Disdain]

On my monitor, the stone seems too dark, but Richard has a very good reputation as a dealer of fine gems. Have you contacted him?

 

[PumpkinPie]

seems a bit dark to me too, not that I''m an expert!

 

[T L]

Date: 3/31/2010 9:31:00 PM
Author: VapidLapid
Well I am thinking of buying this since I saw Chrono's cobalt and I turned blue with envy, so people's opinions are welcomed. This will be my first spinel an dI am wondering if this is a good one, a good price for what it is.....

Since you asked for opinions, I find it to be very dark and greyish. I know Richard describes it differently, but unfortunately that's what I see from the photograph. Notice he called it "cobalt blue," and this should therefore not be confused with a spinel truly colored by the presence of cobalt. Chrono owns two true cobalt spinels certified as such, and they appear, photograph wise, to have much more blue saturation than this stone.

Unfortunately, finding a blue spinel that exhibits a strong blue color is extremely difficult. They are typically very grey and/or very dark in tone, which can add to the desaturation. I think it took Chrono a few years to locate a true cobalt spinel.

 

[Arkteia]

I, too, have noticed that it says "cobalt blue spinel", not "cobaltospinel".
I have seen only two cobalt spinels, none in real life. One was in Chrono''s posting, the other one, if I am not mistaken, was sold by a well-known vendor on ebay. Both were beautiful, although the ebay one was small.

 

[Lady_Disdain]

Date: 3/31/2010 11:16:51 PM
Author: crasru
I, too, have noticed that it says ''cobalt blue spinel'', not ''cobaltospinel''.
I have seen only two cobalt spinels, none in real life. One was in Chrono''s posting, the other one, if I am not mistaken, was sold by a well-known vendor on ebay. Both were beautiful, although the ebay one was small.

Crasru - Brad has a tiny (0.1ct) cobalt spinel up for auction now. I really, really wish it was larger.

 

[Michael_E]

Just a little comment on the spinel pictures. The background is gray, as are the reflections on the crown facets. One should take this into account when deciding if the stone itself actually shows any gray, (I don't see it). As to the depth of color in the stone. Well the picture was obviously taken using a low level light from a reflected source...probably shot through a hole in a white card with the light being directed towards the camera. This low level of light floods the stone without overwhelming it and giving a pretty good indication of what the stone will look like in other low light situations, though in other situations the light will not be so evenly distributed. I think that this picture shows a stone which is very strongly saturated in blue, but not overly dark or inky at all. The attached picture, in contrast, is from a blue sapphire which was shot using strong direct light from a high color temp fluorescent ring light. I had to pump all the light I could into this thing to make it look like it does, since in normal lighting this stone looks very dark. The moral of this little picture analysis, look at the light levels before deciding about something being too dark and ask for more pictures if you aren't sure.

 

[Arkteia]

Yes, I saw the spinel. Hayune, too. Both are so small. I saw a piece of jewelry with tanzanite under a loupe glass. His stones would look nice in such a setting! Beautiful color (sigh...)

 

[T L]

When I say I see grey in a blue stone, I typically mean that the stone is not very saturated in blue color. Grey tends to take over in blue stones when the color is not strong. I just want to clarify. I am not an expert with lighting or cameras, but if that stone is truly saturated in blue color, I find that to be a terrible picture. No offense to Richard Wise, but perhaps he should have used a brighter lighting setup, not necessarily to flood the stone with light, but to show off the color more accurately. As Michael suggested, it is probably a good idea to ask for more accurate photos if that is truly an inaccurate depiction of the stone's true color.

Sometimes it is difficult for people to see grey in blue stones. However, when you place a stone that is a stronger blue color, with similar tonality, next to the gem in question, then the grey becomes more apparent.

 

[VapidLapid]

Thank you all for your observations. I wasn''t very quick on picking up that "cobalt blue" was metaphor. When I go to the art supply store and get "cadmium red paint" I know that color is cadmium! Michael I was thinking exactly the same as you about the photo and the lighting. I even went back to Chrono''s photo of her cobalt and looked at them side by side. Hers had brighter, more direct lighting as could be seen in the brightness of 3 or 4 pavilion facets shining through the stone, while this one is softer and more diffuse with no facets front or back showing hard highlights. All of which makes me think it may not be too dark either. I am still on the fence about calling them. I''ve been looking at it for a few days and I''ve been getting attached to the idea of it more than anything (and I really like rovals) but if it''s not really cobalt, and doesnt have that edge of mineralogic interest as well, then it may be overpriced for a small dark stone.

 

[T L]

Date: 3/31/2010 11:56:02 PM
Author: VapidLapid
I wasn''t very quick on picking up that ''cobalt blue'' was metaphor.

It is an extremely common metaphor to described blue spinels with a higher saturation of blue color than your typical ordinary average blue spinel. A true cobalt spinel should come with a reputable lab report that indicates the presence of cobalt. That being said, just because a spinel does contain cobalt, that does not mean it will be very saturated blue. Iron causes the grey cast that are in most of these gems, and many cobalts contain both iron and cobalt. Therefore, some cobalts have much more blue color than others.

 

[T L]

Here are two stones that were referenced as "cobalt spinels" without the metaphor, and one (the left one) was stated as being better than the one on the right. I know they''re different photos, but at least you have some more examples of what these stones can possibly look like. In the Luc Yen province of Vietnam, there is a mine that produces windex blue spinels. They are incredibly rare, expensive, and hard to come by, and look a lot like neon hauyne.

 

[Arkteia]

I love the one on the left!

 

[chrono]

Very good catch on the cobalt coloured blue spinel versus cobalt spinel description. I’ll be very interested in finding out how RW’s blue spinel will look under more natural lighting as opposed to this very low lighting situation which makes the stone look terribly dark and grayish. I agree that his price is rather high for a sub-carater but I’ve also heard that his stones come with a premium attached for hand picking each stone individually.

 

[redfaerythinker]

I think the color is pretty, but am I the only one that is a bit disturbed by the shape? I know that he''s calling it a "roval" but it just looks lumpy to me.

 

[LD]

My concerns with this stone are that it will look very dark and it shows extinction in the photo. Couple that with the very distinct grey mask that can be clearly seen in the profile picture, the rather odd "roval" shape that appears to be uneven (or lumpy as RFT has just said - great description) and the price which is very much on the high side, I''d say that you could find something equally as pretty for much less elsewhere.

 

[empress]

Coincidentally, TL, the electric blue spinels from Luc Yen are colored by iron.

Cobalt spinels are not necessarily greatly saturated or attractive stones, as TL points out. It''s the combination of the two factors that makes them special.

If you like the stone that Richard has, I''d ask him if it''s a cobalt - I find it hard to believe he''d be participating in the "name game" used on EBay. It probably does not have a lab report, at that size, but the presence of cobalt can be confirmed with a spectroscope.

 

[T L]

Date: 4/1/2010 10:20:36 PM
Author: empress
Coincidentally, TL, the electric blue spinels from Luc Yen are colored by iron.


Cobalt spinels are not necessarily greatly saturated or attractive stones, as TL points out. It''s the combination of the two factors that makes them special.


If you like the stone that Richard has, I''d ask him if it''s a cobalt - I find it hard to believe he''d be participating in the ''name game'' used on EBay. It probably does not have a lab report, at that size, but the presence of cobalt can be confirmed with a spectroscope.

I asked this question about Luc Yen spinels being colored by cobalt to a spinel expert who specifically hunts for these stones. He''s actually studying them and will come out with results on them shortly. I don''t know if the true consensus is that they get their color by iron. I know that iron is responsible for the grey in many blue spinels from other locations.

 

[T L]

BTW,
Here is one of the very sought after and desired windex blue spinels from Luc Yen. In contrast to any of the spinels shown above, it''s very saturated blue.

 

[colormyworld]

Date: 4/1/2010 10:34:09 PM
Author: tourmaline_lover

Date: 4/1/2010 10:20:36 PM

Author: empress

Coincidentally, TL, the electric blue spinels from Luc Yen are colored by iron.



Cobalt spinels are not necessarily greatly saturated or attractive stones, as TL points out. It's the combination of the two factors that makes them special.



If you like the stone that Richard has, I'd ask him if it's a cobalt - I find it hard to believe he'd be participating in the 'name game' used on EBay. It probably does not have a lab report, at that size, but the presence of cobalt can be confirmed with a spectroscope.

I asked this question about Luc Yen spinels being colored by cobalt to a spinel expert who specifically hunts for these stones. He's actually studying them and will come out with results on them shortly. I don't know if the true consensus is that they get their color by iron. I know that iron is responsible for the grey in many blue spinels from other locations.

"I know that iron is responsible for the grey in many blue spinels from other locations."

TL Will you please post a link to this info?

 

[T L]

Date: 4/2/2010 7:05:25 PM
Author: colormyworld

Date: 4/1/2010 10:34:09 PM
Author: tourmaline_lover

Date: 4/1/2010 10:20:36 PM

Author: empress

Coincidentally, TL, the electric blue spinels from Luc Yen are colored by iron.



Cobalt spinels are not necessarily greatly saturated or attractive stones, as TL points out. It's the combination of the two factors that makes them special.



If you like the stone that Richard has, I'd ask him if it's a cobalt - I find it hard to believe he'd be participating in the 'name game' used on EBay. It probably does not have a lab report, at that size, but the presence of cobalt can be confirmed with a spectroscope.

I asked this question about Luc Yen spinels being colored by cobalt to a spinel expert who specifically hunts for these stones. He's actually studying them and will come out with results on them shortly. I don't know if the true consensus is that they get their color by iron. I know that iron is responsible for the grey in many blue spinels from other locations.

'I know that iron is responsible for the grey in many blue spinels from other locations.'

TL Will you please post a link to this info?

It is a known fact that blue spinel gets it's color from iron in many cases, and blue spinel is found in more than one location. Just google "spinel iron color." On another site, which I cannot link to, I was told by some experts that iron is the cause of the grey in many blue spinels. BTW, is it just my posts you respond to, or anyone else's?

 

[colormyworld]

Will you post a link to iron causing the grayness

 

[colormyworld]

Maybe I should have asked. Can you post a link to this info?

 

[T L]

Date: 4/2/2010 7:30:03 PM
Author: colormyworld
Will you post a link to iron causing the grayness

I cannot since I learned this on another forum. Better yet, tell me why you think it does or it doesn''t get it''s greyness by iron.

 

[colormyworld]

Please send me a link. I have searched where you are talking about and can not find this info.

 

[colormyworld]

Date: 4/2/2010 7:34:13 PM
Author: tourmaline_lover

Date: 4/2/2010 7:30:03 PM

Author: colormyworld

Will you post a link to iron causing the grayness

I cannot since I learned this on another forum. Better yet, tell me why you think it does or it doesn't get it's greyness by iron.

I do seem to remember a conversation where it was discussed that iron was not a cause of gray in a lot of stones. Please send the link.

 

[empress]

http://www.palagems.com/php/db_search.php?action=gemdetail&inventory_number=17368

This is a link to one of Pala''s Luc Yen blues = with an identification of the chemistry - Iron and Chromium.

 

[VapidLapid]

UM, as nice as it might be for there to be an unofficial victor in the Citation for Greyness Causing Trace Elements in Natural Spinel competition, The OP (me) was asking about THIS spinel and the acceptability of a widely used but no less misleading nomenclature.

The stone has arrived. In my opinion it is too dark for a spinel of any of any coloring agent. These photos were taken by a south facing window in the late afternoon, therefore in diffuse daylight and are very representative of real life experience. In incandescent light there is a pronounced shift to violet.

BTW TL thank you for all the great info and that amazing foto of glowing cobalt s. I looked at Vincent P''s website because of your post and it was fascinating, informative and full of nice pics!

 

[VapidLapid]