Being comfortable with something other than D, VVS1

[Cynthia]

I''ve spent lots of time reading on this forum but I have never noticed whether or not someone has asked this question.

Without sounding rude, how does one decide to purchase something other than a D color and a VVS 1 quality? I''m asking because I have talked to some people that will not consider stones less than a F and VVS quality, but there are so many others out there and surely not everyone has these types of stones.

So, in the end, does the personality of the stone count more than the color? (keeping in mind a great cut, etc. I know there is lots more than just color and grade). Does anyone feel "less than" when they are talking to someone with a VVS and they have an SI or VS? Or do others seem to respond negatively? Or do most folk not even know the difference?

Just looking for thoughts on this.

Cynthia

 

[Daniela]

The party line around here is not to pay for what you can't see. Some people can see the difference between an F and an H. Others can't. (Edited to add: Even if could see the difference between an F and an H, which I'm not sure I can when a stone is mounted, I would then have to decide if I preferred the H, anyway. Colourless might not be for everyone). I, personally, would always comprimise on colour and clarity and go for size until I reach a certain carat weight. After that I still probably wouldn't splurge on a clarity higher than VS in a round brilliant unless I really had money to burn.

I have a hearts and arrows one carat H VS-2. I see absolutely no colour in my stone from all angles. Remember that whether or not the stone is mounted makes a difference. Honestly, if I went around telling people it was D VVS-1, then I don't think I personally know *anyone* who would actually be able to see the difference in colour. I definitely know that no one would be able to see the difference in clarity. What I do know is that I get countless compliments on the size and the sparkle. People recognize it as a high quality stone (which it is, quite frankly).

One (ill-informed) woman who worked in a jewellery store once complimented my stone and said to me, "It must be a nice clarity because it sparkles so much." At that time I owned an SI-1.

So you see the whole D VVS-1 thing is very much a mental issue and not a visual one. I am not against people buying these stones, however, if that's what floats their boat. To each their own.

One thing I'm certain of, though, is there are very few women on this board who would have wanted a smaller stone in order to have a D VVS-1.


So you see, I have no trouble living with my H VS-2.

 

[Cynthia]

I am so happy that you shared your thoughts on this. I guess it is really a mental issue.

I'm interested in an emerald cut. I know someone that just purchased an E-cut, D, VVS1, .8 ish and her ring is beautiful. I have never seen a diamond so clear. And as childish as it sounds, I want mine to be as nice but at the same time I don't want to spend the budget that she did.

Reading here I see lots of people who love their ring and it has really openned my eyes. I think that I need to be a bit more 'individualistic' and not really worry about others.

C

 

[Daniela]

Hmm, so you're looking at an Emerald cut. In that case, you may end up having to pay a bit more for clarity and colour as opposed to a round, as step cuts show both more easily. But even then, I would think that F colour would be plenty white and VS-1 would be plenty clean. There is definitely no need for you to spend more than you want to and get a D VVS-1.

 

[fire&ice]

Yeah, an emerald cut is a different animal all together. Of all the shapes, they do show color & clarity in real life viewing as well as on paper.

I would go and look at some emeralds & determine your threshold on color & clarity.

 

[valeria101]

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On 7/20/2004 8:28:13 AM Cynthia wrote:



...Or do most folk not even know the difference?

----------------

I would think most people would know what those names of gades mean: you have the four Cs infront, a scale of quality of each and the urge to top it!

But then comes the relation between those words and reality: it is another matter to actualy see some difference between diamonds (or do the grading). It seems that this is why not everyone is much in favor of those top grades.

Let's put it as a little game: say you do not see the difference between a D-IF and a F-SI1 stones shown to you. Would you go for the D-IF after you are told the grades? Probably some will and some would not. Any thoughts?

 

[Cynthia]

I guess that is what I'm getting at when I said do people even know the difference ... could you tell to the naked eye if you didn't have the specs in front of you.

So, in essence, it really comes to more bang for your buck ? (Keeping in mind the cut, etc)

C

 

[moremoremore]

if you flash someone a ring...there is no way that they could tell the difference between most color grades...or clarity for that matter...unless they really get a chance to inspect it and the stone has some visible inclusions... My sister is in a position at this point to upgrade her 1 carat D IF ten fold...she has no desire to...a 1 carat D IF is all she ever wanted... I tend to lower my clarity and color standards for a larger ring...

 

[Mara]

yes I agree, most people will not know a D from an H or a VVS from an SI if the stone is chosen with care. I have an H SI1 and it's perfectly 100% eye clean and looks just as white as my G did...in fact sometimes it looks whiter and DEFINITELY better because the cut is top-notch. I feel as though my stone is better than most, even those with D VVS because I know that the cut of my stone is one of the best out there and for less money than alot of people pay. Many average people with D VVS just looked at color and clarity and not the cut. (Note I said Many and not ALL, esp as Pscopers are a different breed so it doesn't really apply to anyone here!)




So really I guess it's whatever floats your boat. Getting the most bang for my buck on a great product that outshines most stones around me really tickles MY fancy, while others may want D VVS or D IF because it's the idea of perfect or better.

 

[canuk-gal]

HI:

My simple advice is to keep an "open mind" when viewing stones of various quality.

Case in point: while looking for stones, I visited a high end B & M in my city with the idea that a J color would be the outer parameter I would consider in regards to color. I asked to try on a 4.5 Emerald Cut, set in platinum, and it was FAB! VS1 in clarity--it was clear as a pane of glass, simply delightful. It was with incredulity that I listened to the (certed) color---K. While I knew it wasn't a high white (D,E), seeing the K as it was amazed me completely.

Given my original parameters, I would not have even 'considered' looking at this stone, and yet I would have missed seeing this one fabulous, "white facing" stone.

Cheers

Sharon

 

[ringbling17]

Here is one for you think about.
I have a G VS1 H&A diamond and after I had it reset, I decided to get it reappraised to make sure there was no damage to the diamond and that the person who set it did not accidently give me the wrong stone.
I went somewhere with pretty good recommendations and they charged me almost $250 to appraise the ring. I figured it was worth it though, for my peace of mind.
I had the certificate in my bag, but I didn't want to show it to her because I really wanted to see what she would appraise it for without knowing what the stats were.
Can you believe that she actually appraised it as an E color and she said minimum VVS2 clarity because she could only find one pinpoint inclusion.
I was expecting the VVS clarity, but not the E color, so I pulled out the certificate and asked her if the stone matched the certificate. I thought maybe my stone had been switched!!!
Well, it hadn't been switched, because the laser inscription was there as well and the inclusion that she found was the same one and in the same location as the certificate.
So, to make a long story short, i could easily go around telling people that I have an E color VVS2 clarity stone.
NO one would know the difference.
You can't be certain that what people tell you is always true. Unless the certificate is right there in front of you, even the experts can be fooled!!!

 

[valeria101]

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On 7/20/2004 11:14:41 AM Cynthia wrote:



So, in essence, it really comes to more bang for your buck ?

C----------------

I don't know.... take for example this: what if you wanted a small diamond for something ? Maybe 30 points or so... would you insist on D-IF? Not that anyone sees anything (and the fine details of a small diamond are even less obvious) but then, the most perfect diamond dot would not cost much more in absolute terms than any one with reasonably preffered grades.


As for what can I actually see... well, I definitely do not bet on telling D from F apart all the time, regardless of conditions (diamnds not set, correct lighting, etc.). Of course I am no diamond grader, but neither are 99.99% of person who will se the ring. Besides, what do they care ?

The lower grades (say, starting downwards of K) are much more easy to tell apart since they are set at wider intervals of color saturation.

It probably makes sense to set an immage of the ring you want - so you know what approximate size of stone you'd like and work it down from there to whatever color, clarity and cut grades work for you. lab reports are useful - but only after you know what visual effect corresponds to them... I would think.

Without being in your shoes looking at diamonds

, this is about all I know.

 

[Hest88]

Yes, I do think it's a matter of more bang for the buck. If we could all afford 3 carat, D, IF diamonds this would be irrelevant. So, it comes down to paying for what you can see--what really impacts the visual beauty of your diamond--and not paying for anything you won't see under normal conditions. Hence why many of the regulars here on PS rate cut as our #1 consideration.

It also differs depending on the circumstance. Others have mentioned that an EC shows color and inclusions more than brilliant cuts. You also might be someone who is unusually sensitive to color variations or unusually good at spotting inclusions. That may mean what is okay for someone else is not okay for you.

What you have to start doing is seeing different stones, in different colors, and different clarities, and different cuts. Once you get a sense of what makes a stone beautiful to you you'll probably have a better sense of what you're comfortable with, as opposed to what *others* say you should be comfortable with.

 

[headlight]

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On 7/20/2004 8:28:13 AM Cynthia wrote:

... how does one decide to purchase something other than a D color and a VVS 1 quality?

I think that decision is made based on budget! If the cost of D, VVS1 stones weren't prohibitive, everyone would have 'em.

... I have talked to some people that will not consider stones less than a F and VVS quality

Are these people you've talked to just "considering" a purchase or have they made a purchase? It is one thing to have one's "ideal" specs in mind but another thing when you actually get out there and shop for it and see what one's budget will actually afford.

... surely not everyone has these types of stones

You bring up a great point because it seems like most "people" (not here on PS) would say that their stone is like E/F color, and VS clarity at the worst -- I always laugh to myself because there just aren't that many of those stones on everyone's fingers. One thing I really like about PS is that people are totally honest and not ashamed to say that they purchased an SI2, I color diamond.

...does the personality of the stone count more than the color?

I think so! My stone is a conglomeration of things that just somehow "worked" to achieve a look that was appealing to my eye yet allowed me to get the size I wanted within my budget.

Does anyone feel 'less than' when they are talking to someone with a VVS and they have an SI or VS? Or do others seem to respond negatively? Or do most folk not even know the difference?

I have no idea whatsoever what other people's stones grading happens to be. And I would never ask. The same as I would never share what mine is. I suppose it is because I feel a little "ashamed" that it is an SI2, H color in light of the fact that the majority of people only know these ratings for diamonds and perhaps if I owned something like an F color, VS clarity or better than maybe I wouldn't feel this way. Since the general public doesn't get how cut plays into the stone's appearance, they only go by clarity and color grades as to what constitutes a fine looking stone. But then again, if I DID own a stone of very high color and clarity I STILL would not share that info because I would feel like it was bragging. Bottom line is that people see the size of my stone (3.29) along with the rest of my lifestyle just assume that it must be a good diamond. I would personally never ask anyone the specs of their stone because I think it is like asking someone what their household income is.



Cynthia----------------

 

[Cynthia]

I really appreciate all your thoughts about this. I guess it comes down to your personal preference, the quality of the stone and your budget.

 

[ame]

I base it one 1) budget and 2) who can tell without a loupe unless there is a huge honker of inclusion going on. Colorwise--I was told that anything over a G is really overkill but if you want white metal never go below an H (except for extra-faceted cuts, in which case I). We went with H in this special cut because when you sat it next to a D, it was actually BRIGHTER and WHITER than a D. WHy buy a D in this cut when this is just as great.

My diamond is gorgeous. I obsess over it constantly. If we bought a different size/clarity/color, it would have been bigger, brighter, clearer, but who would know other than us, the jeweler, the insurance company and anyone I felt like telling? Who needs to know?

I guess my deal is why overpay?