Asscher in Tension Setting?

[TensionSetter]

Hi. I want to thank all the local diamond experts for the fountain of knowledge that this forum provides for all of us searching for the perfect diamond and ring! Over the past 2 days I have read many posts and learned a tremendous amount that will help me select the perfect diamond for my soon-to-be fiance.

That being said, I have narrowed down my selection to Either an Asscher (Square Emerald) or regular Emerald in a Tension setting by Genin Abaci. I went to some local jewelry shops and I immediately fell in love with the tension setting. I was wondering if anyone here as any experience with Tension settings, specifically by Genin Abaci, and whether or not an Asscher will fit into some specific models (For example, TR-145, TR-165, TR-157). Also, if there are other reliable makers of Tension settings that you know about, could you point me in their direction? Thank you in advance - and when I decide on the actual diamond I will definitely post it here to get opinions!

 

[ecf8503]

Hi there - congrats on your upcoming engagement! An asscher / square emerald is a wonderful choice. Regarding settings, here are a few brief thoughts -

1) Have you read about tension settings and their strengths and weaknesses? If not, you should... although the look is unique, they may not be the safest for the diamond
2) This site dimend SCAASI carries Gelin Abaci as well as advertises a large selection of asscher diamonds
3) Diamond Brokers of Florida also carries Gelin Abaci
4) I have never seen a cut-cornered square / rectangular stone in a tension setting (princesses, yes) - perhaps there is a reason for that??? Maybe the cut corners compromises the structural integrity a bit? Dunno -

I hope this helps, and I wish you the best of luck in your search for the perfect setting!

 

[Mara]

I think an Asscher would be fabulous!! I''d do a bit more research on the settings and also the shape of stones..talk to a few vendors to ensure that an Asscher can be set...

My husband has a small diamond in his tension set wedding ring, he loves it! We have seen some really amazing ladies tension set engagement rings on here as well...

Whatever you do, please post pictures! Have fun while shopping and educating yourself!

 

[TensionSetter]

I have read a lot about the Tension settings online through various diamond forums and sites, and I also spoke extensively with the local jeweler who deals with Genin Abaci. He said that he has never had a problem with the Tension settings that he has had done through them, although he has never had an Asscher put into the specific ones I had talked with him about.

After seeing the tension settings, I really don''t think I want anything esle - I know that they can be a tad more unsafe, although, from what I''ve heard, not considerably more than some other settings.

I am just curious if anyone here has a tension setting with an Asscher, Square Emerald, or standard Emerald that they could point me to and maybe inform me of any problems they had with it. Thanks again for all of your help.

 

[Catmom]

TensionSetter,

Congratulations on your upcoming engagement!! What a fun and exciting time for you. Can I ask you a question? I hope this doesn't come across as rude, I by no means mean it to be! You said that you fell in love with tension settings.........does your future fiance feel the same way about them? I only ask because tension settings have such a different look about them and some people just plain out don't like them. Has she seen tension settings before? It may be worth finding out her views on them before you purchase. Just a thought.

 

[TensionSetter]

Catmom,

Thank you for your concern. Indeed it was actually my future fiance who pointed the setting out to me almost 6 months ago when we were just browsing through a local jewelry shop that happened to have a couple of Gelin Abaci rings on hand. She thought they looked great, and I agreed with her.

Now if I can only decide on the model that will look good with a 1 carat Asscher or Sq. Emerald.....

In looking at www.Mickyroof.com I noticed they have charts that show what rings can go in what settings, which is very helpful. I am debating between TR-107, TR-112, and TR-121 in 18k white gold.

 

[Catmom]

Date: 5/28/2005 9:54:34 AM
Author: TensionSetter
Catmom,

Thank you for your concern. Indeed it was actually my future fiance who pointed the setting out to me almost 6 months ago when we were just browsing through a local jewelry shop that happened to have a couple of Gelin Abaci rings on hand. She thought they looked great, and I agreed with her.

Now if I can only decide on the model that will look good with a 1 carat Asscher or Sq. Emerald.....

In looking at www.Mickyroof.com I noticed they have charts that show what rings can go in what settings, which is very helpful. I am debating between TR-107, TR-112, and TR-121 in 18k white gold.

TensionSetter, that''s great! I''m sure that she is going to love whichever setting you finally choose. We will all be waiting to see the pics!!

 

[valeria101]

Asscher or Ec would work just fine in a tension setting: there are some restrictions regarding the location of inclusions and girdle thickness which remain to be discussed with the jeweler, but this is so for any diamond to be set in tension rings.

Which G&A seting do you have in mind ?

Just for ref, around Pricescope, Pearlmanjewelers lists tension settings and Boonerings makes Titanium ones...

Just for the sake of picture posting,

this is one 3 carat emerald cut diamond set in Titanium tension ring by Absolute Titanium Design :

And another ring, with a smaller (half carat or so) square:

 

[valeria101]

Did you see Stephan's wonder ?

LINK to thread

Not a tension ring in fact, but it does have the look, in my opinion. This is a large stone (3-4cts) on size 10 ring - hard to tell from the picture.

 

[TensionSetter]

I checked with mickyroof on the tension settings that i like that will fit an Asscher or Sq. Emerald and have narrowed down my selection to TR-107, TR-112, TR-121, and TR-030. Keep in mind the center diamond will be aproximately 1 carat, H or G, VS2 or SI1 - either an Asscher or Sq. Emerald. 14k or 18k white gold as well. Thanks all for your input, I appreciate it a lot!

 

[valeria101]

Date: 5/28/2005 11:05:09 AM
Author: TensionSetter
I checked with mickyroof on the tension settings that i like that will fit an Asscher or Sq. Emerald and have narrowed down my selection

These are certainly not the usual spartan tension setting !

 

[TensionSetter]

Update:

So after shopping around today I have decided to go with the TR-107 Gelin Abaci setting in 14K white gold, as shown in the picture above (thanks valeria). Now, I just have to find my Asscher center diamond!

In the local shops around me I was able to loupe 3 different Asschers: one was 1 Carat VS1 G 70% depth 55% table, one was 1.05 Carat VS2 H 68% depth 58% table, and the final one was 1 Carat G VS2 68 depth 62% Table. I noticed a big difference in color between the H and the G in how the light was reflecting in the diamond - but the difference between the VS2 and the VS1 was not that great given that they were the same color grade. My question is this: If i went up to F color would I notice a big difference between G? Right now I am thinking of doing a G or F, VS2 - and if i decided to go with the F, I would probably have to sacrifice some carat weight (to .95 or so maybe) for budgetary reasons.

Does anyone have any suggestions for this situation? Also, as far as depth % and table % - what is a good guide line?

Thanks a lot.

 

[valeria101]

Date: 5/28/2005 4:45:53 PM
Author: TensionSetter

I noticed a big difference in color between the H and the G in how the light was reflecting in the diamond - ...

If i went up to F color would I notice a big difference between G?

Wait a minute... " how the light was reflecting in the diamond " is a matter of cut, not color. Color differences are best seen with the diamonds sitting face down on something white. Otherwise, what you see is very much influenced by brilliance, not color.

I find it hard to tell the difference between F and G at all, and impossible on set stones. Just IMO, of course.

The numbers ound ok, but do not tell allot about a step cut. How about If you get to see the stones, what you see is what you get for brilliance - that cannot be guessed from table & depth numbers. Something like THIS helps communicate cut quality online. No tool is perfect though.... and this is the only one that can be used by buyers.

How about THIS diamond ? I do not know the prices you were facing of course. A bit under 1 carat usually means an attractive price though, and no size difference given that slight variatins in proportions make the size of diamonds of the same weight go all over the place. Allot of 1 carat square emerald cuts would be just as big as 1 carat and so on... A quick search in the database above will turn up lots of weird examples like that.

 

[TensionSetter]

Valeria,

Thank you very much for all of your help, I appreciate it immensely! As for the diamonds, after looking over many articles on this website I think I will be making the purchase online or through the jeweler who is going to have it set for me (MickeyRoof). I looked at that specific diamond as well and it is very attractive, although I think I am going to stay with G color after your recommendation. Because the ring is going to be tension set (with the TR-107) in white gold, I don''t think the color difference will be that noticeable.

So, I am going to give whiteflash a call with a couple of different Asschers I saw they had listed and ask for the IdealScope images and GIA numbers. For the diamond I am looking to spend under $4,500 - so the one that you linked would fall under that price range. Once I have the scopes and the certs I am going to decide on a diamond and then post them so everyone can give me their opinion hopefully. Thanks again!

 

[kenny]

TensionSetter
I am not in the industry and not qualified to offer advice.
I am like you, a costomer shopping for about a 1 ct and a tension setting.
I am going with a round diamond although I love the squares.

But the new cuts and grading of princess has me interested in that too.

But I am also considering Gelin & Abaci and Steven Kretchmer to make my tension setting, www.stevenkretchmer.com

I have a friend who had a princess tension set and the stone vanished.
He didn't do a lot of research on who is best at tension setting.
He had some local guy do it.

I'm going to call several insurance companies and ask them if they insure tensions settings the same as prongs.
You know what they say, "Follow the money."

About Absolute Titanium.
Aren't they in Montreal ?
Isn't there a problem shipping diamonds over the border with paying 25% duty or something?
I considered them, I like that black metal they use.

 

[TensionSetter]

Kenny,

I am not sure about Absolute Titanium, I have not looked into them at all.

As for the tension settings, it is all a matter of going with a respectable company that has done a lot of them - which is why I would go with either Kretchmer or G&A. Personally, I like the G&A designs better so I am going to go with them. For insurance, you can either go through your Home Owner''s insurance (if you have a home) or you can have it independently insured through various firms (I forget the exact name of the one I am probably going to use).

I am still trying to solidify the diamond I want, but I will have to wait until Tuesday to get on the phone and get some scope images and certs.

Best of luck to you!

 

[Hongerhond]

I have a G&A tension setting (round diamond). I bought the diamond from Superbcert and had it set by Mickey Roof, who was great to work with. My ring was insured through Chubb in 2003 and at the time they assured me that the rate for a tension setting is not higher than a regular setting. I think they do charge more for a princess cut, regardless of setting, because the corners tend to chip easier. I don''t know what their policy regarding Asschers/Emeralds is. Oh, and I have never had any problems with my ring.

 

[TensionSetter]

That is very comforting to hear hongerhond! I am pretty confident going through Mickey Roof for the setting, now if I can just find the diamond I want....

 

[TensionSetter]

Update:

So I''ve been searching for my center diamond and stumbled accross this Asscher at Whiteflash and was wondering what you guys think about it in terms of the Tension setting I picked out. I am a little worried because the girdle is thick on it and I don''t know if that makes a big difference in the Tension setting. Thoughts?

Item Code: GIA-14262625
Price: $3,826.00
Report: GIA
Shape: Asscher
Carat: 0.95
Color: G
Clarity: VS1
Depth: 75
Table: 66
Girdle: Very Thick
Polish: Very Good
Symmetry: Good
Culet: None
Fluorescence: No
Measurements: 5.37-5.36X4.02
Length/Width: 1.00

 

[TensionSetter]

Valeria,

I took another look at the Asscher that you linked from goodoldgold and I noticed that on the GIA report under characteristics it says "needle". What does this mean? Also, it says it has very strong blue fluorescense....again, what does this mean? Will the diamond look considerably blue in the light or what?

Thanks.

 

[strmrdr]

You need to get a regular picture of that WF diamond the cutlet is 2.3% off center which is likely visible. That will make the pattern look lopsided.

 

[strmrdr]

Date: 5/30/2005 11:08:18 AM
Author: TensionSetter
Valeria,


I took another look at the Asscher that you linked from goodoldgold and I noticed that on the GIA report under characteristics it says 'needle'. What does this mean? Also, it says it has very strong blue fluorescense....again, what does this mean? Will the diamond look considerably blue in the light or what?


Thanks.

A needle is a type of inclusion.
It is visible in the inclusion photos.
That diamond with a v-thin spot in the girdle likely will not work in a tension setting.
It does have real nice patterns.

strong blue fluorescense - means under UV light it glows strongly blue.
It will also likely have a blueish tink under bright sunlight.
I like the look myself but some dont.

 

[TensionSetter]

Strmrdr,

Thanks for the response - after reading many of your posts it appears that you have a very good grasp on what makes a good Asscher! Would you mind if when I finally decided on an Asscher that I send you the scope images and stuff to verify it?

For the girdle on the asscher, considering the tension setting by Gelin Abaci (TR-107) - do you have any idea how thick it needs to be? Medium at least? Thanks a lot for your help - I appreciate it immensely.

 

[valeria101]

Date: 5/30/2005 11:38:53 AM
Author: TensionSetter


For the girdle on the asscher, considering the tension setting by Gelin Abaci (TR-107) - do you have any idea how thick it needs to be? Medium at least?

That's what I know about rounds, you might want to ask. I do not go if there is a limit to how thick girdles can be in absolute terms...

Actually, it may be possible that you do not need to ship the diamond to another jeweler to have it set. It would be anyway re-sent to G&A, not set by the local shop. Perhaps the seller of the diamond could do that for you.

And another thing abou the setting: these cannot be resized, so you need to know your girl's ring size precisely. The safest way if to get a cheap ring sizer, select the right ring and send it to the maker. This, because ring sizers are not all well calibrated to begin with. Would you mind letting her nto the process for this reason ?

Between that stone and the one at GOG, oh well... I might preffer the one at GOG even though I have not taken a look at it at the time when I posted it. Both are nicely cut overall, but the one at WF is lower color and smaller for about the same cost. The IS seems to favor the one at GOG as well this time.

Here's the stats side by side:

WF
Price: $3,826 Price: $4000
Report: GIA Report: GIA
Carat: 0.95 Weight: 0.92 cts
Color: G Color: E
Clarity: VS1 Clarity: VS1
Depth: 75 Depth: 60.1
Table: 66 Table: 57.6
Crown height: 15.5 Crown height: 12.2
Girdle: Very Thick Girdle: Very Thin - Medium <--- both might be a problem !
Polish: Very Good Polish: Ex.
Symmetry: Good Symmetry: Ex.
Culet: None Culet: None
Fluorescence: No Fluorescence: very Strong Blue <---- something to ask about
Measurements: 5.37-5.36 X 4.02 Size: 5.82 - 5.83 x 3.51
Length/Width: 1.00 Proportions: 1.00


The prefference for the E/VS is a bit personal though... it is mostly about the shape, and IS (see below) and that fluorescence thing that may not be everyone's darling but I find cool.

Neither diamonds looks allot like the "traditional" Asscher with the close to octagonal shape. For what that's worth, the more square shape of these ones might work better with an equally modern tension setting.


Hope some of this helps. Best of luck !

 

[valeria101]

This is my attempt to use the Iscope for comparing the two...

Of course, these are not the only square ECs in the world. Looking for 0.9-0.99cts, F-VS1 ones on the database here plenty came up a bit less expensive and some larger. Only the bare stats are known about these though, and it would take a bit if chance asking to see one and hoping it would turn ok. Whether that''s worth it remains entirely up to you.

 

[strmrdr]

Date: 5/30/2005 11:38:53 AM
Author: TensionSetter
Strmrdr,


Thanks for the response - after reading many of your posts it appears that you have a very good grasp on what makes a good Asscher! Would you mind if when I finally decided on an Asscher that I send you the scope images and stuff to verify it?


For the girdle on the asscher, considering the tension setting by Gelin Abaci (TR-107) - do you have any idea how thick it needs to be? Medium at least? Thanks a lot for your help - I appreciate it immensely.

Yep Id be happy to help you out.
Yes medium is usualy the min. for a tension setting.

 

[strmrdr]

Both GOG and whiteflash have a good track record with bringing in asschers for people.
Out of the 2 usualy I like the ones in stock at GOG better.
Jon at GOG has listened to the many conversations we have had about what makes for a great S.E./asscher and has been selecting them accordingly.
Id contact them with your request and have them pull in a couple diamonds.

 

[TensionSetter]

Valeria and Strmrdr,

Thank you very much for your help - I am going to give Whiteflash and GOG a call today to see what they can do for me. Also, I am going to call MickeyRoof to see if I should just have the diamond sent directly to G&A for the setting.

My soon-to-be fiance already has a ring from me on her right hand (ring finger) that I got her more than a year ago. I know the exact size of that ring and it fits about as well as it could on her finger. I would prefer to do this without her help, but maybe because of the tension setting I should get her exact ring size on her left hand somehow. I will have to look into that.

Thanks again.

 

[njc]

Date: 5/31/2005 9:50:21 AM
Author: TensionSetter

My soon-to-be fiance already has a ring from me on her right hand (ring finger) that I got her more than a year ago. I know the exact size of that ring and it fits about as well as it could on her finger. I would prefer to do this without her help, but maybe because of the tension setting I should get her exact ring size on her left hand somehow. I will have to look into that.

I just wanted to throw in my .02 about the ring size...

I believe i have read something about a persons dominate hand having a larger ring size than the other. Being a righty myself, my ering (which fits perfect on my left ring finger) is rather tight on my right ring finger. Most of the time it is too tight to go all the way on, or if it does it is rather uncomfortable and im afraid it would get stuck. Ive noticed the same with other rings on other fingers as well.

Does she have a ring that she wears on her left ring finger? Is she a righty or lefty?

 

[TensionSetter]

She does not wear any ring on her left hand, and she is right handed. So maybe her left hand ring finger is smaller than her right hand? Guess I will have to construe some way of getting that information. Thanks for the input!