Apartments and pets: policies, rent prices, etc.

[musey]

Since becoming a dog owner in a renter''s city, I''ve noticed a few interesting things about buildings that allow dogs (vs. buildings that don''t):

1. Rent prices are higher.
I don''t know if that''s some unspoken rule with landlords, but it seems that they charge more because they know they can get away with it, because pet-friendly housing pickins are slim. Allowance of pets is considered a "luxury amenity" in many ways.

2. The sense of "community" in a pet-friendly complex is higher than in pet-unfriendly complexes.
Having lived in both types of buildings, and talking with friends who both have pets and don''t, live in buildings that allow them and those that don''t... one thing seems to be universally true: pets bring people together. This seems to be especially true of dogs, since they force you to be more sociable while out (especially when seeing another dog, they want to stop and meet each other, maybe play, etc. and you "have" to talk to the other owner while the dogs get acquainted) - though I''ve seen it with cats too, people schmooze others to hopefully find a free pet-sitter to visit the cats, feed, etc. while they''re out of town.

3. People stick around in the same apartment longer.
Okay, this one has very little to back it up - but I''ve certainly noticed it. Since it''s hard to find a pet-friendly building, the moving process is just that much more laborious with a pet. Then people are resistant to leaving. This is also played into by the sense of community I mentioned above.



ANYWAY...... the reason I''m thinking about this is that my friend desperately wants a dog, and his building does not allow them - but in sort of a wishy-washy way (they don''t have a hard-and-fast policy in the leases, they just say "no" when asked). I''m trying to help him build a case for his landlord, showing why it would be to HIS benefit to permit tenants to have pets. The above three are all I can come up with. Additional thoughts?

 

[purrfectpear]

There are quite a few pet friendly rentals in Orange County, and Long Beach too. I don''t know about the rest of LA?

I disagree that the rents are higher in my previous experience renting in Santa Clarita, Huntington Beach, and Long Beach.

While I would encourage landlords to allow pets, the sad truth is that the majority of pet owning renters do NOT pick up properly after their pets. This is true even in complexes that PROVIDE the baggies and place for disposal. Sad but true. It makes it harder for all responsible pet owners and it irritates me to no end. For every dozen pets I see being walked, I see maybe 4 of the owners pick up the doo-doo

 

[janinegirly]

From my rental experiences, pets are often discouraged if occupant is a renter only (potential damage to building, potential for lawsuits if the pet attacks other residents,etc). If you''re an owner, it''s usually at your discretion however. Sounds like your buiding is management company owned, so if you are seeking to "convince them" you have to show them what they would get out of it. Best argument is that in this market, it''s tough to reel in tenants at competitive rents, so a pet friendly policy certainly allows for a wider net to be cast.

Another option is to just sneak the pet through if they seem lenient. I know plenty people who''ve done that. But like I said, in my experience some apts allowed for it while others didn''t so it was easier to kind of blend. Of course depends on how big the pet is and how often it''s taken in and out.

 

[musey]

Date: 5/20/2009 2:11:36 PM
Author: purrfectpear
There are quite a few pet friendly rentals in Orange County, and Long Beach too. I don't know about the rest of LA?

I disagree that the rents are higher in my previous experience renting in Santa Clarita, Huntington Beach, and Long Beach.

Definitely not

especially not for people in the mid-to-lower income bracket (okay, not all that low, just fresh-out-of-college 20-somethings income). We spent almost 6 months apartment hunting in 2007, because we couldn't find anything in our price range that allowed dogs. Everything was just a bit too high. If we took dogs out of the equation, everything was much lower. This is in actual LA, mostly on the west side, not suburbs (valley/pasadena/south bay/etc).

I've found that apartments within our and our friends' range generally charge $200-500/month less if pets are not allowed, which is a big chunk for our age and income level. It's something we've all noticed, since many of us are pet owners (or aspiring pet owners).

Perhaps in your rent range (presumably much higher than ours), there is little to no difference. Or perhaps it's simply more common for people in suburban LA to own pets than it is in the more Urban areas, so rentals have to comply with the market.

While I would encourage landlords to allow pets, the sad truth is that the majority of pet owning renters do NOT pick up properly after their pets. This is true even in complexes that PROVIDE the baggies and place for disposal. Sad but true. It makes it harder for all responsible pet owners and it irritates me to no end. For every dozen pets I see being walked, I see maybe 4 of the owners pick up the doo-doo

Yep, annoys me to no end. Our last building was fabulous in this way (condos, so our neighbors were owners... this came up in the "what wouldn't you live near" thread, and was the main basis for my argument that apartment dwellers are generally less invested in maintaining common areas than condo/home owners), but our current street - ACK. We have seven buildings on our little dead-end street, which all allow pets, and there are unacceptable amounts of dog mess around the sidewalks.

Really bugs me - but I would definitely prefer to have that than lose the dog-friendly community. I love the other things that come with it!

 

[musey]

Date: 5/20/2009 2:31:44 PM
Author: janinegirly
From my rental experiences, pets are often discouraged if occupant is a renter only (potential damage to building, potential for lawsuits if the pet attacks other residents,etc). If you''re an owner, it''s usually at your discretion however. Sounds like your buiding is management company owned, so if you are seeking to ''convince them'' you have to show them what they would get out of it. Best argument is that in this market, it''s tough to reel in tenants at competitive rents, so a pet friendly policy certainly allows for a wider net to be cast.

Yeah, that''s the approach we''re taking. I''ll add your last sentence to our list, thanks

Another option is to just sneak the pet through if they seem lenient. I know plenty people who''ve done that. But like I said, in my experience some apts allowed for it while others didn''t so it was easier to kind of blend. Of course depends on how big the pet is and how often it''s taken in and out.

I came close to doing this a few years ago, before we had our dog and back when I lived in a no-pets building. I wimped out at the last minute. It''s too scary for me - I would be afraid of getting evicted... but my friend isn''t too worried about that, wouldn''t mind being evicted I guess

I bet he''d consider it.

 

[mia1181]

If I were trying to persuade a landlord to allow me to have a dog I would:

1. Offer to pay more for rent. And offer a pet security deposit in addition to the regular deposit.

2. Get a small dog. Smaller dogs usually don''t damage as much. Or find a breed that isn''t known for barking a lot.

3. Discuss with the landlord that you plan on cleaning up the dog''s poo.

But I have to say that I''ve tried convincing landlords before and some people just aren''t convinced. We have always had a hard time getting apartments that allow dogs. I couldn''t imagine not being able to have a pet, but I do understand that a lot of tenents let their dogs damage the apartment, or fail to clean up after them. It ruins it for the rest of us!

 

[musey]

Date: 5/20/2009 2:46:25 PM
Author: mia1181
If I were trying to persuade a landlord to allow me to have a dog I would:

1. Offer to pay more for rent. And offer a pet security deposit in addition to the regular deposit.

2. Get a small dog. Smaller dogs usually don't damage as much. Or find a breed that isn't known for barking a lot.

3. Discuss with the landlord that you plan on cleaning up the dog's poo.

But I have to say that I've tried convincing landlords before and some people just aren't convinced. We have always had a hard time getting apartments that allow dogs.

Yeah, this landlord isn't budging with either the "I'll make it worth your while" approach (ie. extra rent/deposit(s)/etc.) or the "I promise I'll be a responsible owner" approach. I think their "fear" is that if they allow it for him, they'll have to allow it for everyone, and they don't even want to open that can of worms. Not surprisingly, I suppose!

I do think it's mostly a lost cause, but I promised my friend that I'd help him build a case

I would be very surprised if it ended up working, but it's worth a try

I couldn't imagine not being able to have a pet, but I do understand that a lot of tenents let their dogs damage the apartment, or fail to clean up after them. It ruins it for the rest of us!

Seriously! I'm actually afraid that our building might change the lease agreements to disallow pets because of this kind of stuff

don't know if they can even do this, but it'll force us to move if so.

 

[neatfreak]

I think this is a tough one. While I agree with your point about community, longer tenants, etc. for *good* owners-the reality is that most pet owners just aren''t. They don''t clean up after their pets, they let the pets damage the apartment, let them bark, etc. It''s really sad for those of us who are good pet owners!

We have two large dogs and it is VERY hard to find apartments-I am so glad that (fingers crossed) we will be buying a house this summer so we don''t ever have to deal with it again!

Where we are we have by far had the most luck with small landlords who manage the properties themselves. They are usually much more willing to allow a pet if you seem responsible and cough up a bit more money. Is it a possibility for your friend to move?

 

[musey]

Date: 5/20/2009 3:18:36 PM
Author: neatfreak

Where we are we have by far had the most luck with small landlords who manage the properties themselves. They are usually much more willing to allow a pet if you seem responsible and cough up a bit more money. Is it a possibility for your friend to move?

He lives in an 18-unit building that''s privately owned (as opposed to a management company), so that''s the only reason we''re attempting to "work" the landlord. We know it wouldn''t work otherwise.

He just moved in 2 months ago and is already itching to find a new place

I think his lease is 12-month so it''ll be awhile (unless he breaks his lease... I''ve never tried to do that so I have no clue how it works). More than likely, he''ll just wait until he finds a new place... but in the meantime it''s definitely piqued my curiosity on this topic.

 

[tlh]

some places charge "pet rent" in addition to another "additional pet deposti" which can be $50+ a month based on size weight/and species (and deposits an additional month''s rent)... so it could be an easy way for an apt to make some additional money. I mean they are going to charge the tenant for any damage done... so that pet deposit can be refundable or not, I''ve seen both, in additon to additonal cleaning fees they can charge... "pet carpet sanitation fee" but your friend could recoop that.. the additional "pet rent" would just be straight off the cuff charging for an animal - as though it was a tenant.

Which I always found weird... that they charge $1000 for an apt, but if you have a dog, $1100... it isn''t like if I get pregnant and have a baby - my rent increases... or have 3 people vs 1 living in the unit.... strange.

 

[LAJennifer]

Some dogs scratch and bark. I would be annoyed if a new tenant of 2 months asked me for permission to get a dog, when he knew at the signing of the lease (2 months ago) that no dogs were allowed.

 

[musey]

Date: 5/20/2009 4:05:38 PM
Author: LAJennifer
Some dogs scratch and bark. I would be annoyed if a new tenant of 2 months asked me for permission to get a dog, when he knew at the signing of the lease (2 months ago) that no dogs were allowed.

Totally with you on that. He says that the building manager told him she "thought" a dog wouldn''t be a problem, until after he signed the lease... after which she said "whoops I was wrong, no pets." I haven''t seen his lease so I don''t know, but either he didn''t read it thoroughly enough to see that it states "no pets" or it doesn''t contain a statement about pets in either direction.

I know, it''s weird and he should''ve gotten a firmer response before signing... but what can ya do. If it were me, that''s what I would''ve done, but at this point all I can do is help him formulate an argument, I suppose.

 

[MichelleCarmen]

If I was living in a pet-free apartment building, I would be very angry if my neighbor was permitted a dog! Some people choose those types of apartments because they do not want to hear a yappy dog next door!

And, possibly other tenants picked that building because it doesn't allow pets. It's not fair to them to up and allow one person to have a dog who may drive everyone nuts.

 

[purrfectpear]

Well fair or not, a landlord owning a building can decide to make it pet friendly at any time. If the current tenants don''t like that, they are welcome to move. To be fair, the landlord should not hold them to their lease or be punitive about their leaving early. A landlord can also revise a pet policy but would have to allow current pet renters to stay until the end of their lease.

I''ve always lived in pet friendly apartments, and now condos. I''ve never heard a dog yapping or barking (other than one or two barks when a doorbell rings). Dog noise is usually not a problem. Dog messes, maybe.

Yeah, rents on the Westside are crazy with pets or without. Landlords there think they live in a whole ''nother universe.

I''ve actually convinced some landlords to rent with my 8 lb. doggie when the ad clearly said "no pets". Sometimes you have to pull the "cute" card

 

[Erin]

I almost rented a different house where I was ready to sign and then he asked (with the paperwork under my wrist) You don''t have any pets do you? I said yes, a 28 pound dog but he''s seven years old so he''s definitely relaxed and perfectly otty trained. He gave me some sob story about how he lost his dog to cancer and knows how much a dog becomes part of your family and then said Sorry, No Pets. Pfffft. I tried arguing that my little dog would not cause a problem and that I could give him references for the last few places we''ve lived.... Still no.

Find out six months later he had rented it to a young married couple with no kids or animals and they trashed the place with wild parties

 

[Italiahaircolor]

I own a condo which I rent out...and I don''t allow pets. It''s not that I don''t like pets...I really really do...but renters are different, and it''s a risk. There isn''t the same "pride of ownership"--they view your property as a pass through...so what if they distroy the carpet....tear a door down to splinters. In 12 months they can walk away minus a security depo.

And frankly, I don''t want to deal with ruined property when they leave. No matter how well trained a dog or cat is...accidents happen. Accidents that ruin carpet and leave unwelcoming smells behind. Scratching that damage doors and moldings, tear up hard surface flooring. Even if I were to charge a pet premium, there is no way that 12 months of that would cover repairing/replacing everything.

If his landlord is anything like me, nothing will change his mind. I think your friend should consider doing 1 of 2 things if this appeal doesn''t work....

1. Break his lease and move on. Or, sublet (if it''s allowed). Find a pet friendly apartment where he won''t have to cut red tape.

2. Tough it out...10 months isn''t terribly long...he can spent the time finding the *right* pet friendly apartment for him to move to once he''s done at this current home.

 

[MichelleCarmen]

Date: 5/21/2009 10:28:05 AM
Author: purrfectpear
I've always lived in pet friendly apartments, and now condos. I've never heard a dog yapping or barking (other than one or two barks when a doorbell rings). Dog noise is usually not a problem. Dog messes, maybe.

We've lived next to yappy dogs and it's a nightmare! One would go all day long and this was in a condo/townhome complex where nearly all the units were owned! It drove me nuts! Finally, the dog shut up and I didn't see it anymore. I think the owners were asked to get rid of the thing.

 

[purrfectpear]

Date: 5/21/2009 12:24:46 PM
Author: MC

Date: 5/21/2009 10:28:05 AM
Author: purrfectpear
I''ve always lived in pet friendly apartments, and now condos. I''ve never heard a dog yapping or barking (other than one or two barks when a doorbell rings). Dog noise is usually not a problem. Dog messes, maybe.

We''ve lived next to yappy dogs and it''s a nightmare! One would go all day long and this was in a condo/townhome complex where nearly all the units were owned! It drove me nuts! Finally, the dog shut up and I didn''t see it anymore. I think the owners were asked to get rid of the thing.

No one should have to deal with that, I agree. It''s a royal PITA and would drive most of us nuts.

 

[musey]

Date: 5/21/2009 12:19:15 PM
Author: Italiahaircolor
I own a condo which I rent out...and I don''t allow pets. It''s not that I don''t like pets...I really really do...but renters are different, and it''s a risk. There isn''t the same ''pride of ownership''--they view your property as a pass through...so what if they distroy the carpet....tear a door down to splinters. In 12 months they can walk away minus a security depo.

And frankly, I don''t want to deal with ruined property when they leave. No matter how well trained a dog or cat is...accidents happen. Accidents that ruin carpet and leave unwelcoming smells behind. Scratching that damage doors and moldings, tear up hard surface flooring. Even if I were to charge a pet premium, there is no way that 12 months of that would cover repairing/replacing everything.

If his landlord is anything like me, nothing will change his mind. I think your friend should consider doing 1 of 2 things if this appeal doesn''t work....

1. Break his lease and move on. Or, sublet (if it''s allowed). Find a pet friendly apartment where he won''t have to cut red tape.

2. Tough it out...10 months isn''t terribly long...he can spent the time finding the *right* pet friendly apartment for him to move to once he''s done at this current home.

Italia, I think all of that goes without saying (though as others have pointed out, in many cases the people themselves are a greater risk than pets). Those are definitely his obvious options, he''s just trying to explore all possible ways of convincing his landlord before leaving.

If it were me, I would have made sure the building allowed pets before renting (I''d need it in writing), and if not, I''d just wait it out until my lease was up. But he''s wanting to find the best approach for trying to convince the building owners to turn pet-friendly, so this is just my attempt to get more ideas than I have on my own.