Any DINK (Double income no kids) couples out there?

[kbaker]

We''ve done the expecting motherhood thread...Now I''m looking for the rapidly growing number of people who have decided not to have children. Any PS-ers out there who decided to hold out?

 

[AChiOAlumna]

I like this thread!!!

We're holding out permanently!! I don't think my body was given a "biological timeclock."

I knew at 16 that I didn't want children.

When we began dating, I was very upfront with my DH letting him know that I didn't want children...he was fine with that, which would've been a deal-breaker for me. Instead, we spend the "what-would've-been the college tuition and wedding funds" on annual vacations.

 

[sxn675]

We don''t have kids, but we do plan on having them at some point....

 

[WTNLVR]

Positively no kids . Knew at a young age I didn''t want any and hubby never did either. I read a poll somewhere that said a large percentage of parents, if they had to do it over again- would not have had kids-even thouh they love the ones they have. I think it''s highly over rated. Just going to a party with little ones makes me cringe when I see what the parents go through trying to control them. Hubby and I just laugh, look at each other, and say "reason number?" We''ve lost count at this point. This is not to meant to show any disrespect for those who have kids- god bless you all. I just don''t have the patience for it.

 

[kbaker]

I was wondering if this would be a good thread...I am also in the "not having kids club". I am a speech pathologist for severly handicapped children and don''t get me wrong, I love kids, but I just can''t bring myself to have them in my house permanently!! My husband and I are on the same page and are enjoying our quiet happy lives, without daily kid drama!

This trend is becomming more popular too. We meet a ton of couples that are also not planning to reproduce (of course we seem to meet them while vacationing--highly likely that''s a concidence!)

Anyone else out there?

 

[ame]

My sister is a speech pathologist for the special school district here and she isn''t sure she wants them either. My husband doesn''t necessarily want them but knows that I would like to bang out a couple (preferably twins...) and if we can''t have them ourselves Ill adopt, though I will probably go with older kids if I adopt. Not that little ones aren''t cute but it upsets me that so many much older kids are passed over because they aren''t little babies.

 

[AChiOAlumna]

Date: 7/31/2005 8:14:15 PM
Author: kbaker
This trend is becomming more popular too. We meet a ton of couples that are also not planning to reproduce (of course we seem to meet them while vacationing--highly likely that''s a concidence!)

I''ve heard that up to 40% of all women at the age of 40 are choosing NOT to have children!! I wonder what that means?? (Not complaining since I''ll be in that 40%...just wondering)

 

[DiamondLover23]

We don''t want any either!

I am so sick of hearing people say "You''ll change your mind!" but I know myself.

 

[cflutist]

Websailor and I don''t have kids either.

I work with a lot of professional career women who don''t have kids either.
I''d say its probably 70% don''t, 30% do at my office.

We gave one woman a "puppy shower" complete with MilkBones, Snausages, Raw-Hides, leashes, dog bed etc. when she got a new puppy. Hey, that''s only fair since she didn''t have any kids either.

 

[nutty]

We sort of qualify for this thread. We have one son, and don''t get me wrong, I love my son more than anything and wouldn''t change the fact that I have him. But we''re definitely done. I''m tired of hearing that we''ll change our mind and I''m tired of hearing that it''s "cruel" that we''re not giving him a sibling. We give my son a wonderful life and I don''t feel like I''m not fulfilling something by not having any more kids. I''m done. He''s 11 and I don''t want to start over.

In two weeks, it won''t even be an option for us anymore.

 

[websailor]

Cflutist beat me to this topic!!!!!

I was going to say that we are DINKS but have kids in our life..... we get to play with them, watch them grow up, hear about their trials and tribulations, contribute to their cookie drives, etc....and then they go home to their Mom and Dad.

Just the way we like it!

For the two of us, it was clear during our dating days that neither of us wanted to have kids at this stage in our lives....

I do sometimes kid her that she''s missing out in life - the baseball games inside the house, the hide and seek games using all the closets, furniture, etc, the series of "pets" they''d bring in to show Mom, etc..... The look she throws my way ensures me that we made the right decision!!!!

 

[kbaker]

I hear the " You''ll change your mind and go baby crazy eventually" I''m pretty sure there will be no mini-me''s growing inside me! My husband and I are content to travel, pursue our interests, volunteer our time and enjoy each other. I think that child rearing has changed so much. Households are different, kids know WAY too much and they suck the life and money out of ya............But they are sure fun to play with, sugar up and then send home!

 

[Mara]

we've got a dog..she is like our child...4 legs and fur! we adore her, she listens to us, loves us unconditionally. she makes it hard to think about the real thing.

we are unsure about children...i know the whole once you have them you'd never change it type scenario but to actually make that decision to give up your life to some squalling infant who will probably hate you in their teens....yeah we aren't there yet.

bottom line for us is that we have alot we want to do, aka traveling and things to achieve in life including enjoying each other, before we can even CONSIDER it. so at this point it will at least be about 3-5 years before we seriously discuss it. we give each other reality checks aka have you changed your mind and so far so good we are still on the same page.

i wouldn't be surprised if we decided not to...i like some people's kids when they are raised right, but they are hugely in the minority, for me most parents are way too soft on their kids and kids get way more 'freedoms' and rights than when i was a kid. the whole 'kids should be seen but not heard' thing is sooooo not happening today unfortunately and too many parents let their children run wild.

long, funny story for those who feel the same way we do...we were at a pasta pomodoro last sunday near our house, they have an outdoor seating area that is very nice and relaxing and they play old b&w movies on the restaurant wall. well it was warm out, we're relaxing with our drinks and waiting for our food as the sun goes down and out comes 3-5 loud kids with some guy who was a family friend. he was perpetually amused by their antics, loud yelling and laughing. on the patio along with us were about 2 other couples like us, 2 single guys eating alone and reading a book or paper and a table of about 4 gay guys with a small dog. well one of the older couples not so near us befriended the kids and family friend and they were all talking in SUCH LOUD VOICES, seriously it was ridiculous. well it just escalated and the kids, buoyed by all the attention, started playing tag and eventually started including our tables etc. the death glares everyone was giving them was just lost on the kids who were having a great time. finally the kids go near the dog and it barks and growls at them (to our delight!)....the guy tells the kids to go back to their mom, the mom comes outside and is talking to the family friend and one of the diners asks the mom if her kids have an 'inside voice'. the mom immediately notices whats going on, barks at the kids, they all go inside, peace and quiet finally! well not quite! 10 minutes later they all come out again, who knows maybe inside kicked them out. they are having ice cream now...and the kids are talking so loudly and playing and the older couple is playing with them and teasing them etc. at this point Greg is like..lets just go inside..this is ridiculous. well also at this point the other diners had just HAD IT, so one of the gay guys walks up to the table and says something to the mom like 'can you take your kids inside, because they are really making me sick'. well the mom is like shocked (please you don't know your kids are hellions?!) and then she says 'yes we'll go inside' and then all the other diners erupt into clapping and people are yelling out things like 'those kids belong in a zoo' and 'take them to mcdonalds'

....the mom herds her brood inside and we all settle into dinner finally. when the older couple that liked the kids and was egging them on left the guy turned to us all and said, 'you know you were all kids one day'. to which all the diners again erupted into boos and sayings and i had to chime in saying 'yes but when i was a child, my mom left me AT HOME!'. which is true. my mom would never have subjected people paying good food for a meal to my hyper self...!

the whole thing was a weird shocked hilarious when all was said and done but what struck me is how everyone on the patio was so firmly in the camp of 'irritated by the children'...the worst part is that the PP is in a small area where there is a Baskin Robbins about 3 stores down. So why not take the little devils there for ice cream?! Why torment people having a leisurely Sunday dinner? totally inconsiderate.

 

[confusedtoo]

hi everyone (i''m new here, btw -should have said hello and all in my previous posts but i''ve been pretty neurotic about finding the right stone so sorry for the manners)

i am curious as to how old (if that''s not rude) most of you that are replying to this are...

only because i always felt like ''NEVER IN A MILLION YEARS'' but now i feel the hormones surging and screaming ''BABY BABY!'' and frankly, it''s rather unselttling because i still find most kids pretty scary.

anyways - from 15 - 33 i was firmly ''no baby'' and now that i''m 35 i''m sort of ''maybe baby''.

hopefully this too shall pass. i moved to kentucky a year ago... maybe that has something to do with it...

 

[kbaker]

No offense taken. I am turning 28 next month. And I have no doubt that one day, my hormones will start to go a little crazy. Have you ever heard secret to staying married? OLd folks love this one... " Never fall out of love at the same time"
Same is true for the little ones... Never experience the hormonal weakness at the same time!!

I am definitly not doubting human nature. I firmly believe we are all wired to desire reproduction at some time or another. I just have to count on my brain and hope that I can stay the course.

I am open to the possiblity that I may go baby crazy. My husband too...We''ll just see. I hope everyone is here in 7 years and we can see who has bailed out

 

[WTNLVR]

I think it''s natural to "second guess" your descision. When we were about 35 my hubby and I sat down and had a very long talk about the pros and cons of having kids. We wanted to make sure that it was a joint choice and that we thought it thru so we wouldn''t have regrets later. It reaffirmed our no kid stance and to this day I feel good that we had an honest discussion and made the choice together in a thoughtful way.

 

[AmantdeChat]

We are another DINK couple. Actually, my fiance has 2 children from a former marriage, but they are full grown, out of the house kids, so I consider us DINKS. I do not have any myself, and never really had the "urge" to procreate. It was actually more of an abstract, "sometime in the future", type thought when it came to kids. I do question it now and then, but since the urge has never been that great and I really enjoy my freedom to do what I want when I want, the possibility is remote at best.

The thing I get tired of is people saying that I am selfish! Selfish?! What is more selfish, having a child I do not really want and would possibily not give my best to, or making the wiser choice and refraining. There are too many unwanted children in this world, whose parents should have thought out their actions more thoroughly before they got pregnant. Society should not dictate what we as individuals choose. What works for you does not necessarily work for me.

It does seem to be a growing trend however. I have several friends that do not have any children and do not plan on having any kids. We are all in our 30''s and 40''s (except for my sweetie who is in his eary 50''s, though he does not look nor act like it

).

 

[Jennifer5973]

Oh, there have been some lively discussions around here about this very topic.

My husband and I don't think we want kids, and at 32, time's running out for me... We just don't feel it and both agree that it is too important a job to take lightly. So many of our friends follow the "big wedding, big house, have baby" formula....and I wonder how many of them REALLY wanted those kids... some do but others I really wonder.

Being a parent is an awesome resposnibility and I really believe, especially as a woman, that you have to want to be a mother very very deeply in your heart, soul and mind. I don't have those feelings and likely, never will. Also, i don't, as a rule, do things "half a**" and that's what it would be like to have a child now--doing it half-cocked and that's not for me. Do I worry that'll we may regret our decision at 40? at 50? Yes. Am I cognizant that there care NO guarantees and I could change my mind then be unable to conceive? Sure. And what about having a child after 35 and the increased risks of birth defects...how would we handle the moral and religious issue of temrinating a pregnancy if test results wre unfavorable? thes eare the cold hard realities we must face and deal with...but is having a baby as some sort of insurance policy against these things the right thing to do? Geez, that's a pretty big gamble with three lives, and one I am not willing to take.

Good and continuous communication between you & your spouse on the issue is critical as well.

 

[fire&ice]

Date: 7/31/2005 11:43:14 PM
Author: Mara
we''ve got a dog..she is like our child...
you are really going to go there?

''can you take your kids inside, because they are really making me sick''.

Don''t you think that is rather rude. Why didn''t someone go to management? And, it''s a bit judgemental considering their choice to bring a DOG to the restaurant.

 

[AChiOAlumna]

Date: 7/31/2005 11:58:58 PM
Author: wss
i am curious as to how old (if that''s not rude) most of you that are replying to this are...

wss...welcome to the PS boards!!

I''m 36-1/2 and my DH is 38....we''ve had the serious conversations recently about my ending BC pills since I''ve been on them since I was 21 and my body needs a well-deserved break from the hormones...plus we''ve recently found out that breast cancer now runs in my family so I need to get off of them!!

Anyway, with this conversation all the doubts came up...what if we''re 40? 50? and we regret it?? No one can predict the future and we may well regret it later, but I also know that right now kids are not in the plans for us and I can''t see myself changing my mind any time soon...so now we''re looking into the "alternative" (and more permanent) options for birth control...

 

[fire&ice]

I''m 45. Hubby is 46. I don''t want him to have the "procedure" because what if I were to die young? He may marry someone younger who may want to have children.

 

[confusedtoo]

everyones answers are so interesting.

it''s definitely good to get off the bc pills if you can. the alternatives aren''t as great in terms of convenience (not incl surgical options - but then, is that convenient?)

mara - i have to say i agree with your story about the restaurant. i can''t tell you how many times i have gone to restaurants that are NOT geared toward kids but have plenty of them running around screaming with their parents sitting there doing nothing. it''s infuriating for sure. i was not raised that way and i agree about kids today being too free - i see so many spoiled brats out there it''s ridiculous. and regarding the dog and being judgmental - so long as the dog was sitting there peacefully, i don''t think it''s odd. when i lived in california it was pretty common to see dogs sitting by their owners when the rest. offered outdoor (but true outdoor - not outdoor within the establishment or within a fenced area) seating. there is a big difference between a dog sitting there quietly and 5 kids running around and yelling.

maybe that would change when i become a parent - you just become immune to it somehow because you have to or else you go crazy - but to me, i realize that just because i gave birth it doesn''t mean i deserve to terrorize everyone else with an ill-behaved child. we''re all in this together. i find behavior like that incredibly selfish.

 

[Mara]

oh F&I...I totally agree that there was alot of emotion running aroud out there. but I could understand and identify with the people who were really upset re: the kids antics. I find that most of the time people do not say anything to parents with out of control kids, it is almost like you don't want to be rude to say 'you know what, your kid is irritating me'. they just kind of sit there and stew (like we were doing), so when it erupts, I can understand how it would be a bit 'over the top'. We just were sitting there open-mouthed back and forth on the whole thing...aka these people are just as intolerant as we are (kind of scary?!) and these kids are little devils! all we were thinking is.... can we just have a quiet dinner and watch My Fair Lady?!

re: the dog...the patio allows dogs and the dog was laying napping in a chair. The only time we even noticed the dog was when it growled at the little girl trying to 'pet' it...

personally for me i don't think kids should be taken out to restaurants or movies where others have to be subjected to them unless they can be well-behaved. at the other table i just remembered there was two ladies having dinner with about a 10 year old girl. she didn't make ONE PEEP the whole dinner and was super well-behaved..so well-behaved i almost forgot to mention her until now. my idea of the type of child that can be taken out in public. otherwise keep the children at home or take them out one by one in more child-friendly surroundings to teach them how to behave. i don't think 5 unruly kids at a laid-back restaurant with 99.9999% adults is the way to show your kids how to behave.

this may sound harsh to some people, but it's the way i was raised and the way greg was raised...i got disciplined alot when i misbehaved in public and my mom would have just put me in the car and taken me home if i made any ruckus at all.

also i raised Portia to be just like that quiet dog in the chair (minus the growling) so that we could take her out into public and people would not think 'oh that dog is incorrigible, why is it even allowed here? at that point we would have taken 100 of those small quiet dogs over 5 or even 1 of those loud kids.

 

[Jennifer5973]

Date: 8/1/2005 1:39:22 PM
Author: Mara

personally for me i don''t think kids should be taken out to restaurants or movies where others have to be subjected to them unless they can be well-behaved. at the other table i just remembered there was two ladies having dinner with about a 10 year old girl. she didn''t make ONE PEEP the whole dinner and was super well-behaved..so well-behaved i almost forgot to mention her until now. my idea of the type of child that can be taken out in public. otherwise keep the children at home or take them out one by one in more child-friendly surroundings to teach them how to behave. i don''t think 5 unruly kids at a laid-back restaurant with 99.9999% adults is the way to show your kids how to behave.

this may sound harsh to some people, but it''s the way i was raised and the way greg was raised...i got disciplined alot when i misbehaved in public and my mom would have just put me in the car and taken me home if i made any ruckus at all.

I agree 1,000%. There are times and places where having a child is NOT appropriate. As a DINK, I have had just about enough of MY rights being infringed upon. Eveything is "for the children" in our society and it''s getting on my nerves. If your kid can''t behave, take it home. Period. Parents need to discipline their children and take responsoibility for them. I was just in an upscale bistro for lunch last week and these two women were having lunch while the one woman''s kid was running all over, getting in people''s way (the place was packed)...people kept almost stepping on her, and she almost got whacked by the door twice. The mother didn''t care... but if that kid got hurt, she''d be suing the place and everything else. If the kid couldn''t sit still and eat, then she shouldn''t be there. Honestly, the kid needed a leash.

I have no problem with kids who are well-behaved being in most adult environments. Personally, I don''t agree with people dragging 3 month old infants out to bars at 10:30 PM (oh, we''ve seen plently of those) but if the kid is quiet, whatever.

I have rights too.

 

[Kaleigh]

I have kids but I agree a 100%. Thank god mine are very well mannered, but they are 15 and 17 now. Even they can''t stand to see kids acting crazy etc... I just give the parents dirty looks when I''m out trying to have a nice dinner and their brats are being unruly. I can''t stand that.

 

[confusedtoo]

we should start the DINK society and petition for our rights.

i went to see ''hustle and flow'' the other night - DEFINITELY a film for adults - and the couple in front of me had their three kids running in and out of the movie and then sitting there for the last 20 minutes of the film. it was unreal.

it really is insane how geared towards children society is but then society wants to take no responsibility for how these kids actually turn out or how they behave.

i was at a show once where a couple had their two children with them - babies - one looked to be about a year, the other about 3 or 4 and they had NO ear protection for their kids and the show was really loud. the singer of the band even said something like he hoped they were protected from the stage but the parents weren''t listening - they were just excited that the band was mentioning them! so i DID say something and they yelled at ME. this also happened to me when i saw a guy smoking a cigarette and dumping the ashes onto the ground in a forest area around griffith park in la (la is so dry that this is really scary - there are no smoking signs everywhere.) in both instances i tried to be polite but it didn''t matter. it''s sad and you can say live and let live but when people are endangering their children''s hearing, endangering national parks or just plain annoying everyone else around them with their rude behavior... how is this ok?

 

[fire&ice]

A lot of this has to do with degrees & women who become bullet proof. I have been in restaurants (nice - but not special) where my friends children have behaved brilliantly. They still got looks. I''ve been to "joints" that should be kid friendly and the mother got "looks". In many respects, it''s a no win situation. Suck it up - a kid is going to stare at you. You wouldn''t believe the people who get offended by this.

Clearly, this mother didn''t have a clue. And, yes - funny it should have been mentioned before it got to "break bad" mode. I''m not condoning her actions - just that mothers can be bullet proof because people will have issues with children in restaurants regardless of their behaviour or venue. I''ve personally witnessed this. HELLO, do you have an issue with the kid coloring?

Honestly, I have no issues with parents taking their children to MOST restaurants. Babysitter''s are not a dime a dozen - and to do something spur of the moment is near impossible. Kids are kids. They aren''t perfect little adults. It''s a rare occassion that a children bothers me in most places. Quite frankly, I''ve never seen a child act up at a movie theatre. But, the last movie we went to AN ADULT was text messaging the entire time - it was really distracting - a little buzz/ring - the phone would light & tick tick tick away on the stupid phone. To me, that was an adult acting like a clueless child. At least I chalk the clueless child to being just that.

 

[Mara]

Whether it's an adult or a child behaving badly, to me it does not matter, neither should be allowed. Kids in the movies is a big pet peeve of mine when they can't behave. They talk, they kick your chairs, they ask questions...seriously is Saturday evening when the theatre is packed the best time to take Bobby to see a PG-13 movie? I don't think so. Maybe Sunday at 11:30am, first showing, would be more appropriate. Oh and don't even get me started on things like the ballet or the symphony. Do I want to pay $75 a ticket to hear Bobby asking his mom every 2 minutes what is going on in the show??

Parents do become more bullet-proof but also I think that sometimes they think that their kids or THEY have more rights than other people do. Just because you have a kid does not mean if the babysitter cancels that it's appropriate to take Bobby out to the restaurant with you. Maybe you should STAY HOME. Sorry but when you popped out that child, you should have realized that your 'rights' as a fun-loving adult were seriously encroached on. Maye you don't get to go out and have fun as much as possible or be as spontaneous. This is one of the reasons we aer unsure about kids. Because I would NOT want to be that parent who takes their kid to an inappropriate place just because I felt the need to get out.

The problem IMO is that our world used to be a child-friendly society, this was back when everyone was having kids, aka our parents. People regarded kids as funny, or don't know any better or this or that, and were looked upon with an indulgent smile. However, that world is changing. No one recognizes that more than my generation, where we are supposed to be thinking about having children (or have them already) according to our parents and are not yet or choosing not to at all. Therefore you now have a large amount of people who are not giving those same indulgent smiles, but rather are looking at those children with a more intolerant eye. aka If I decide not to have kids, WHY would I ever want to be subjected to someone else's badly behaving child?

However, the parents who do have kids still are living in that old child-friendly mental society. And I see a huge gap rising between people like DINKS who are less tolerant of Bobby picking his nose and smearing it on the tablelcoth and the parents who have kids like Bobby. People with kids feel like others should make way for them and their brood because being a mother or having children is like the 'ultimate' of life; and people who choose not to have kids end up feeling like their rights are being encroached on by the entitled attitude of the mom with 3 kids at the mall or the restaurant or movie theatre.

Who's right or wrong? Neither, but IMO both should be at least AWARE of the other, and again I don't have a problem with a kid at a movie or a restaurant IF THEY CAN BEHAVE. If not, then don't bring them out! It's not rocket science. No one should have to even politely ask you to control your children. But yet it seems like many parents cannot grasp that and therefore it leads to more intolerance from others like us.

 

[moremoremore]

This is getting too intense for me to read LOL...But I just had to share...

I'm not sure I want kids. They annoy me. But, they are kids and I'm sure I also did annoy plenty of people....So I let a lot of things go....

My sister is very wealthy. She gives those two children (5 and 3) anything they want. Also, my parents were very strict...and we were physically punished if we got out of line... It started when her first was born and he had some very minor health issues- all he did was cry so they carried him constantly and always tried to just make his happy. She insists on "love with limits"....Yeah, that's not working out... SO, I meet her and her husband and the two kids for dinner...at a noisy Italian restaurant...a chain called Bertuccis...WELL, I was humiliated. I wanted to crawl under a rock and die...People were staring and glaring and I felt very uncomfortable disciplining their children in front of them. I couldn't wait to leave. I felt horrible for those around us...I am very tolerant of kids. They are kids. We used to be kids. BUT, this was just ridiculous. No discipline at all. It was clearly my sister and her husband's fault. They were oblivious to it all.

 

[kbaker]

When I started this thread, I was thinking that people would post about their decision--to reproduce or not to reproduce. I was hoping to get feedback from others letting me know if they regret their decision or are still strong. Plus, I love to hear about all the vacations, padded bank accounts, sleeping in and having breakfast in bed!

Any of that info out there?
Thanks guys!