Advice for the Purist..D IF or D VVS1?

[rocheapplied]

Hi everyone,
I love this forum!!!

Wanted to get everyone's opinion..My girlfriend has very small, petite hands *size 3 She's told me that she doesn't like "big" diamonds, but something more proportional to her fingers.

I've narrowed my search down to two options:

1) 0.41 carat (D / IF) 34.5 CA / 40.8 PA (Table Size 56, Pavilion Depth 61.6%, Star Facets 55%), 3.5% medium faceted. Triple EEE and AGS000
2) 0.50 carat (D / VVS1) 34.5 CA / 40.8 PA (Table Size 57, Pavilion Depth 61.3%, Star Facets 55%), 3.5% medium faceted. Triple EEE and AGS000
Triple EEE and AGS000

The purist in me wants to go for the D / IF. I haven't come across any 0.50 carat (D / IF) diamonds so far...(wondering how rare they actually are then). What would the forums recommendation be? Cost isn't an issue for me. Since I'm a purist, I would love an IF Diamond, but if there just isn't an inventory, wondering if I should just go the 0.50 carat route, as it is just a tad bigger, and it might look more proportional / better to her fingers..

Any help would be appreciated!

 

[Starfacet]

Personally, I'd prefer that the stone hits the half carat mark since the difference between IF and VVS is imperceptible to the naked eye. But then, I'd personally prefer a 75 pointer in VS clarity if it were me.

 

[lovedogs]

Personally, I'd prefer that the stone hits the half carat mark since the difference between IF and VVS is imperceptible to the naked eye. But then, I'd personally prefer a 75 pointer in VS clarity if it were me.

I could not agree more. I would personally much prefer a .75-1ct stone in VS/VVS clarity compared to a D/IF (which isn't different than VVS to the naked eye, as said above).

 

[OcnGypZ]

It's only IF up to 10x. So go with the .50. She has very small fingers - it's plenty of stone.

 

[farrahlyn]

If you want to see what .5ct will look like on her finger. .5ct on the left and .75ct on the right. i think .5ct is a really nice size on her but still, .75 doesnt look large or disproportionate either.


Also, are you positive in what a "big" diamond means to her? Big to her might mean 2ct you know? Or you could be absolutely right and she really did mean more in terms of wanting less than 1ct. Please dig into that a little bit more before you pull any triggers.

i do get wanting to go best of the best if she does want just a small stone. But i would go more for VVS or VS and look into a super ideal. the BEST of the BEST!

 

[LinSF]

I've got to warn you that not many women are really honest about the diamond size and wanting a ring to remain "petite" on them. I'd go larger and give a little in the clarity range. Trust me, she'll not scoff at a beautiful larger ring.

 

[flyingpig]

I've got to warn you that not many women are really honest about the diamond size and wanting a ring to remain "petite" on them. I'd go larger and give a little in the clarity range. Trust me, she'll not scoff at a beautiful larger ring.

Amen

 

[Matthews1127]

I concur with most of the above.
IF is not “pure”; the inclusions are not seen with the naked eye at 10x magnification.
You can score points with a super ideal diamond at VS-VVS clarity, at D-E color with excellent spread (not weight).
My advice: call HBD & discuss CBI between .50ct-.80ct with a spread that is equivalent to that of 0.20mm (give or take), compared to a traditional MRB. Super ideals face up whiter, and larger because of their superior CUT.
If you have an unlimited budget, you should be seeking the top dog.

https://www.hpdiamonds.com/

 

[yssie]

Do you live in the US?

If so - this, 100%:

Also, are you positive in what a "big" diamond means to her? Big to her might mean 2ct you know? Or you could be absolutely right and she really did mean more in terms of wanting less than 1ct. Please dig into that a little bit more before you pull any triggers.

And this, 100%:

I've got to warn you that not many women are really honest about the diamond size and wanting a ring to remain "petite" on them.

A woman in the US in 2019 finds herself in the unenvious position of being damned if she does (admit to wanting a sizable diamond engagement ring) and damned if she doesn’t. If she does admit to it then she appears materialistic, which violates our cultural mores of humbleness and focus on “what matters” - these days it’s very uncool to value Things over Experiences! But if she doesn’t admit to it... she gets a smaller diamond than she wants, which stings especially when the size she secretly wanted was achievable, practically and fiscally.

So this woman says what she thinks she ought to - “I don’t want it to be too big, that’s ostentatious and gaudy!” - and hopes that her beloved knows her well enough to read between the lines (or decides that “petite” and “delicate” includes a bigger stone than she indicated she wanted because he wants to spoil her with a bigger stone)...

And her beloved listens to her words and takes them at face value and - everyone’s disappointed.

If you live in the US, or if she’s from
The US... Please do more digging before buying!

 

[bludiva]

Hi everyone,
I love this forum!!!

Wanted to get everyone's opinion..My girlfriend has very small, petite hands *size 3 She's told me that she doesn't like "big" diamonds, but something more proportional to her fingers.

I've narrowed my search down to two options:

1) 0.41 carat (D / IF) 34.5 CA / 40.8 PA (Table Size 56, Pavilion Depth 61.6%, Star Facets 55%), 3.5% medium faceted. Triple EEE and AGS000
2) 0.50 carat (D / VVS1) 34.5 CA / 40.8 PA (Table Size 57, Pavilion Depth 61.3%, Star Facets 55%), 3.5% medium faceted. Triple EEE and AGS000
Triple EEE and AGS000

The purist in me wants to go for the D / IF. I haven't come across any 0.50 carat (D / IF) diamonds so far...(wondering how rare they actually are then). What would the forums recommendation be? Cost isn't an issue for me. Since I'm a purist, I would love an IF Diamond, but if there just isn't an inventory, wondering if I should just go the 0.50 carat route, as it is just a tad bigger, and it might look more proportional / better to her fingers..

Any help would be appreciated!

Here is a mock up to give an idea of those stones on a size 3 finger. I think either looks beautifully proportionate so it is really up to what she prefers. I would not pay the premium for IF personally, in other words if she prefers a ~.4 over a ~.5 I'd still go with VS-VVS and use the savings for something else. But that's me.




Good luck!

 

[lydial]

On the same high performance diamonds / CBI note, here is a 0.7 that is a D VS2 and is completely and utterly spotless and amazing to look at:

https://www.hpdiamonds.com/en-us/diamonddetail/HPD9377

 

[lovedogs]

On the same high performance diamonds / CBI note, here is a 0.7 that is a D VS2 and is completely and utterly spotless and amazing to look at:

https://www.hpdiamonds.com/en-us/diamonddetail/HPD9377

 

[Starfacet]

On the same high performance diamonds / CBI note, here is a 0.7 that is a D VS2 and is completely and utterly spotless and amazing to look at:

https://www.hpdiamonds.com/en-us/diamonddetail/HPD9377

This!!!

 

[TimMD]

On the same high performance diamonds / CBI note, here is a 0.7 that is a D VS2 and is completely and utterly spotless and amazing to look at:

https://www.hpdiamonds.com/en-us/diamonddetail/HPD9377

I agree hard to go wrong with this stone!

 

[AV_]

I have a slight purist streak & the same ring size...

- would ask WWW if they might have a small-ish D color around, or can make one (VS or better, VVS or better - it would make little difference in this size); they did a D/FL not long ago & know the breed...

-

Then,

There exist too many rounds & the perfectly made others stand out - the same question could be asked for one such thing WWW


2c

 

[Starfacet]

High Performance Diamonds makes nice settings too!

 

[Morenita21]

Hi everyone,
I love this forum!!!

Wanted to get everyone's opinion..My girlfriend has very small, petite hands *size 3 She's told me that she doesn't like "big" diamonds, but something more proportional to her fingers.

I've narrowed my search down to two options:

1) 0.41 carat (D / IF) 34.5 CA / 40.8 PA (Table Size 56, Pavilion Depth 61.6%, Star Facets 55%), 3.5% medium faceted. Triple EEE and AGS000
2) 0.50 carat (D / VVS1) 34.5 CA / 40.8 PA (Table Size 57, Pavilion Depth 61.3%, Star Facets 55%), 3.5% medium faceted. Triple EEE and AGS000
Triple EEE and AGS000

The purist in me wants to go for the D / IF. I haven't come across any 0.50 carat (D / IF) diamonds so far...(wondering how rare they actually are then). What would the forums recommendation be? Cost isn't an issue for me. Since I'm a purist, I would love an IF Diamond, but if there just isn't an inventory, wondering if I should just go the 0.50 carat route, as it is just a tad bigger, and it might look more proportional / better to her fingers..

Any help would be appreciated!

While I do appreciate IF or D color, I have to tell you that no one will know this, not even her as long as it is 100% eye clean and in the colorless or near colorless range. With respect to her saying she doesn’t want a big diamond, I think most women would feel uncomfortable (because of social pressure) to really be up front about the size she really wants. I would personally stay within your budget and find something you can afford and equally important, something she will love. I must say, I have yet to find a woman that questions if her diamond is too large.....

 

[Vascariz]

IMO get a ACA D IF 0.5.

Then upgrade it every few years.

The growth of pure love. It's important it reflects who you are and your values.

Go with your gut as you know yourself and her the best.

But what ppl said is true. The difference is in the mind more than the eye as it'll be hard (not impossible) to differentiate a D IF to a F VS1 with the naked eye in normal lighting. And you paying alot more for that D IF.

 

[mermaid]

I've got to warn you that not many women are really honest about the diamond size and wanting a ring to remain "petite" on them. I'd go larger and give a little in the clarity range. Trust me, she'll not scoff at a beautiful larger ring.

I can only say that I agree with this! Also, your girlfriend may have size three fingers, but if she has to resell later (to upgrade), she'll have a harder time with .50 vs. .75-1.00.

 

[cflutist]

I personally would prefer a D/E VVS diamond. Under 10x D/IF is already imperfect because it has surface blemishes that a D/FL (yes HPD/CBI crafted a 3+ D/FL for a PSer awhile ago) does not have.

Blemishes occur after a diamond’s formation, during the cutting, mounting, and wearing of a polished diamond. Extra facets, polish lines (thin parallel grooves and ridges) or burns (from excessive heat on the polishing wheel during cutting) are examples of blemishes introduced during the manufacturing process. Nicks, scratches, chips and abrasions are examples of blemishes introduced during the handling, mounting or wearing of a diamond. Chips are shallow openings where part of the diamond was broken off, most often at the girdle edge.

With VVS1 there may be a pinpoint or two, very very difficult to see with 10x. A VVS2 may have more pinpoints or a very tiny clear crystal.

Check out HPD'S website as others have suggested.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

I am in agreement that I would absolutely have .5 at the minimum. VS1 and higher will be extremely clean even with a loupe.

In addition to suggestions already made, here are three superideal cuts from Whiteflash in D color and VVS2-VS1 from .58-.76, all of which I'd rather have over a .40-.50 D IF-VVS1. None of these will be considered too big in the US.

https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/compare/?idnos=4089767,4015026,3988032

 

[Rhea]

I was talking about this with a friend yesterday. I don't think that it's that women purposely mislead on the size of the stone that they'd like. They just have no idea. For many it's their first time owning or wearing something so expensive and dainty and sweet looks good plus they had no idea what diamonds cost and it's currently way more expensive than anything they own. But then, as my friend said, you get used to is and the diamonds shrink, fast.

I have a small circle of 4 friends. 3 of us have husbands who bought stones with really good colour and clarity stats. All 3 of us, and the respective husbands, have said that they wish they lowered the stats and gone bigger, years later that's all any of the women really care about, the size. The most newly married (2 years) is already planning a 10 year anniversary upgrade and has been since her wedding. We're in the UK and all have 0.45-0.66.

There's a really good under 1 carat thread.
https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/under-1ct-diamonds.25028/

Don't let us talk you into anything. Get whatever you want. 0.41 D IF may be a excellent choice for you. What your girlfriend wants matters more than what we say we'd like to receive. Frankly I don't think it matters what size you start at, there's a very good chance that she'll want larger later in life no matter what if the women I know are anything to go by.

 

[gm89uk]

The difference is in the mind more than the eye as it'll be hard (not impossible) to differentiate a D IF to a F VS1 with the naked eye in normal lighting. And you paying alot more for that D IF.

Small correction that it'll be hard (not impossible) to differentiate between a D VS1 to an F VS1 and impossible to differentiate between D IF and D VS1.

IF is only so at the standard set by the reporting lab and I feel clarity is far over emphasised here, but where you place value, may not be where she does. IF is an illusion, based on your standard. colour, carat and cut are not, but firm qualities.

Before proposing, my wife knew nothing about diamonds or value. She's a size 4.25 roughly equivalent US size. We were walking past a jewelry store and she said please don't get anything big, low budget, nothing bigger than this (and pointed at a 2ct diamond), which is extremely unusual to find in the UK). Instant heart sink! She wasn't really thinking specifically but just pointed to to closest thing she saw but food for thought.

Another thought is if you are thinking an upgrade may be an option in the future, stick with an F. As you go up on carat it'll be exponentially more expensive to have to get a D in a higher colour. If her eyes are adjusted to a D she may struggle to drop later on. Also in a 0.5 carat, it is increasingly hard to spot colour differences relative to larger carats.

 

[mrs-b]

Hi @rocheapplied - and welcome!

So - here's the hard news. Go with me on this....

Guys always talk about the stats. They want to give their girls 'the best'. But in diamonds, size is also a factor of 'best'. And the same guys who buy the diamond don't actually wear it. Part of it looking 'best' is the diamond looking 'right' proportionately to the finger.

This aspect is HUGE. Don't over look it. The diamond has to be in proportion to her finger. You will not have bought her the BEST if it doesn't also look perfect on her finger. Remember, you are buying her an aesthetic accessory.

After years and years of looking at diamonds on tiny fingers, my sincere opinion is that .5ct is too small for a size 3 finger. And an IF is more to the benefit of those taking your money than to you - and of no help at all to your girl.

VS1 is a beautiful clarity. Clean from every angle, it will do what you want it to do visually, without gouging your pocket unnecessarily. And most diamonds are a LOT less clean than that. Go to a VVS2 is you must, but - seriously - more than that and you're buying a classification, not a level of useable or visible clarity. And as others above have said, IF is still not truly flawless - it's just a way of classifying a diamond.

There are many women on PS with size 3 fingers. One leaps to mind who used to wear a (roughly) 1.6ctw 3 stone ring. Looked fab on her. The center stone alone was .78ct and she had plenty of room either side for substantial side stones. While I'm not suggesting you go this route, my point is that a .75ct stone is not going to be big on her. And remember, ring photos focus on the ring. In real life, put into the real world, those tiny little things cut right down to scale in a hurry, and 5mm is suddenly...only 5mm. You're also assuming she will ALWAYS be a size 3 (highly unlikely) - so think more broadly than you're doing right now.

As for color, I prefer an E to a D, as I find D's somewhat sterile - and I AM color sensitive and like a nice, white stone. D is not necessarily 'best'. Taste and preference is everything when buying a piece of diamond jewelry. The grading attached to a diamond is based on a sliding scale, but there is no best or worst at either end. There is only 'what appeals to you'. Remember, if you go far enough DOWN the scale, you'll ultimately hit the yellows, and then you're in the really BIG money. So don't be fooled by the grading thing - it's a mode of convenient referral, not an aesthetic imperative.

If comparison is your thing - and terms like 'the best' are inherently comparative - remember, it's hard to be 'the best' when your ring is substantially below average size. But to her - .4 may be perfect. Or 2ct may be perfect. In the case of all things aesthetic 'The Best' is the thing that most closely approaches what she wants - and nothing else.

** Whenever I put 'the best' in parentheses, it was to indicate that this is a subjective term, not a silly or worthless one. But I would stress beyond measure - HER version of best, and YOUR version of best are almost certainly different things. Make sure your opinion doesn't overpower hers in working out what's best to HER. Remember, this is her party - in that she has to wear it for the rest of her life. After you go 'Ta daaaa!' - your role with this ring is done and hers is only just beginning.

Good luck!

 

[yssie]

@mrs-b - you’ve hit on so many excellent points - I’m just going to link all newcomers with this question to your post here!

 

[TweetyBird23]

Hi @rocheapplied - and welcome!

So - here's the hard news. Go with me on this....

Guys always talk about the stats. They want to give their girls 'the best'. But in diamonds, size is also a factor of 'best'. And the same guys who buy the diamond don't actually wear it. Part of it looking 'best' is the diamond looking 'right' proportionately to the finger.

This aspect is HUGE. Don't over look it. The diamond has to be in proportion to her finger. You will not have bought her the BEST if it doesn't also look perfect on her finger. Remember, you are buying her an aesthetic accessory.

After years and years of looking at diamonds on tiny fingers, my sincere opinion is that .5ct is too small for a size 3 finger. And an IF is more to the benefit of those taking your money than to you - and of no help at all to your girl.

VS1 is a beautiful clarity. Clean from every angle, it will do what you want it to do visually, without gouging your pocket unnecessarily. And most diamonds are a LOT less clean than that. Go to a VVS2 is you must, but - seriously - more than that and you're buying a classification, not a level of useable or visible clarity. And as others above have said, IF is still not truly flawless - it's just a way of classifying a diamond.

There are many women on PS with size 3 fingers. One leaps to mind who used to wear a (roughly) 1.6ctw 3 stone ring. Looked fab on her. The center stone alone was .78ct and she had plenty of room either side for substantial side stones. While I'm not suggesting you go this route, my point is that a .75ct stone is not going to be big on her. And remember, ring photos focus on the ring. In real life, put into the real world, those tiny little things cut right down to scale in a hurry, and 5mm is suddenly...only 5mm. You're also assuming she will ALWAYS be a size 3 (highly unlikely) - so think more broadly than you're doing right now.

As for color, I prefer an E to a D, as I find D's somewhat sterile - and I AM color sensitive and like a nice, white stone. D is not necessarily 'best'. Taste and preference is everything when buying a piece of diamond jewelry. The grading attached to a diamond is based on a sliding scale, but there is no best or worst at either end. There is only 'what appeals to you'. Remember, if you go far enough DOWN the scale, you'll ultimately hit the yellows, and then you're in the really BIG money. So don't be fooled by the grading thing - it's a mode of convenient referral, not an aesthetic imperative.

If comparison is your thing - and terms like 'the best' are inherently comparative - remember, it's hard to be 'the best' when your ring is substantially below average size. But to her - .4 may be perfect. Or 2ct may be perfect. In the case of all things aesthetic 'The Best' is the thing that most closely approaches what she wants - and nothing else.

** Whenever I put 'the best' in parentheses, it was to indicate that this is a subjective term, not a silly or worthless one. But I would stress beyond measure - HER version of best, and YOUR version of best are almost certainly different things. Make sure your opinion doesn't overpower hers in working out what's best to HER. Remember, this is her party - in that she has to wear it for the rest of her life. After you go 'Ta daaaa!' - your role with this ring is done and hers is only just beginning.

Good luck!

@mrs-b Thanks for that excellent response. Your input and diamond wisdom have influenced so many novice diamond buyers on their journey, myself included (in the direction of WF)!

 

[Matthews1127]

Hi @rocheapplied - and welcome!

So - here's the hard news. Go with me on this....

Guys always talk about the stats. They want to give their girls 'the best'. But in diamonds, size is also a factor of 'best'. And the same guys who buy the diamond don't actually wear it. Part of it looking 'best' is the diamond looking 'right' proportionately to the finger.

This aspect is HUGE. Don't over look it. The diamond has to be in proportion to her finger. You will not have bought her the BEST if it doesn't also look perfect on her finger. Remember, you are buying her an aesthetic accessory.

After years and years of looking at diamonds on tiny fingers, my sincere opinion is that .5ct is too small for a size 3 finger. And an IF is more to the benefit of those taking your money than to you - and of no help at all to your girl.

VS1 is a beautiful clarity. Clean from every angle, it will do what you want it to do visually, without gouging your pocket unnecessarily. And most diamonds are a LOT less clean than that. Go to a VVS2 is you must, but - seriously - more than that and you're buying a classification, not a level of useable or visible clarity. And as others above have said, IF is still not truly flawless - it's just a way of classifying a diamond.

There are many women on PS with size 3 fingers. One leaps to mind who used to wear a (roughly) 1.6ctw 3 stone ring. Looked fab on her. The center stone alone was .78ct and she had plenty of room either side for substantial side stones. While I'm not suggesting you go this route, my point is that a .75ct stone is not going to be big on her. And remember, ring photos focus on the ring. In real life, put into the real world, those tiny little things cut right down to scale in a hurry, and 5mm is suddenly...only 5mm. You're also assuming she will ALWAYS be a size 3 (highly unlikely) - so think more broadly than you're doing right now.

As for color, I prefer an E to a D, as I find D's somewhat sterile - and I AM color sensitive and like a nice, white stone. D is not necessarily 'best'. Taste and preference is everything when buying a piece of diamond jewelry. The grading attached to a diamond is based on a sliding scale, but there is no best or worst at either end. There is only 'what appeals to you'. Remember, if you go far enough DOWN the scale, you'll ultimately hit the yellows, and then you're in the really BIG money. So don't be fooled by the grading thing - it's a mode of convenient referral, not an aesthetic imperative.

If comparison is your thing - and terms like 'the best' are inherently comparative - remember, it's hard to be 'the best' when your ring is substantially below average size. But to her - .4 may be perfect. Or 2ct may be perfect. In the case of all things aesthetic 'The Best' is the thing that most closely approaches what she wants - and nothing else.

** Whenever I put 'the best' in parentheses, it was to indicate that this is a subjective term, not a silly or worthless one. But I would stress beyond measure - HER version of best, and YOUR version of best are almost certainly different things. Make sure your opinion doesn't overpower hers in working out what's best to HER. Remember, this is her party - in that she has to wear it for the rest of her life. After you go 'Ta daaaa!' - your role with this ring is done and hers is only just beginning.

Good luck!

What I said....and THIS!! ^^^
ALL OF THIS.
Cheers, @mrs-b!! Likewise, Whiteflash is also an amazing super ideal vendor worth exploring!
https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/search/

 

[Pimberly]

I originally thought I only wanted F or better, too, and that I didn’t care much about size because I have a small finger (haven’t had my ring sized yet but I know my finger is smaller than a 4). I ended up going with a 1.2 carat I color and am happy with that. The 1.2 is proportional to my small finger and doesn’t look too big to me. If my resources were unlimited I would have definitely gone bigger. I ended up caring way more about size than color which surprised me. Also, getting an IF is totally pointless and the easiest thing to sacrifice.

 

[kmoro]

I went for D VVS2 for symbolic reasons and because I’m not all about wearing a huge diamond every day. I would have gone for FL or IF if that meant a diamond was truly flawless, but it doesn’t. VVS is virtually flawless as well.
Although you have plenty of good budget advice, this is what I think every time someone says they find D colour sterile, besides that everyone has their own opinion ... the white is stunning and beautiful, if you ask me.

 

[Pimberly]

I think Ds are absolutely stunning. But would I rather have a .4 D than a 1.2 I? No way. I’d definitely love a 1.2 D, though!!