Thoughts on elongated antique cushion

[eac4me]

Been lurking around lately but it's finally time for me to post!
For background, my boyfriend and I have been seriously searching for an elongated antique cushion with the following specs:
Cut: Elongated antique-style cushion (1.17-1.25 lw ratio)
Carats: ~3
Color: G+
Clarity: Eye clean (VS2+ generally)
Culet: None-medium
Budget: Up to $36k for the loose stone

After searching for the past month, we unfortunately found few real contenders. Everything we saw had something off....color too yellow, shape too square, not eye-clean, etc. My boyfriend was getting frustrated, and time is running out for us to decide.

We then started ignoring the carat weight and searching by measurements. That's when we found this stone:
Shape: Cushion Brilliant
Measurements: 9.18 x 7.85 x 4.11
Carat: 2.07
Color: G
Clarity: VS2
Polish: X
Symmetry: VG
Fluorescence: None
Table: 56%
Depth: 52.4%
Culet: Small

We were very concerned about it looking too shallow, but we just saw it in person and WOW. It really sparkles with huge chunks of light and has the perfect chunky faceting. It just doesn't have the high crown I was initially looking for. That said, it looks just as big (if not bigger) face-up than the 3 carats we saw, and it's priced significantly below our budget.

eac4me video

• eac4me
• Apr 21, 2017

Given that this stone hits all of our specs except for the carat weight, and is priced significantly lower than anything else we have seen (and those stones don't hit the other requirements), do you think we should move forward with this? If not, we probably have another 2-4 weeks to find something else before he needs the ring made!

Please let me know. All of your thoughts/opinions are welcome!

 

[tyty333]

Did you look at it under lots of different lighting conditions outside of jewelers lighting? It does look
shallow. Request and ASET image so we can look at light return.

 

[dollyanjuli]

Im always the voice of dissent on shallow cushions- if you saw it in person and it was everything you are looking for, and to you it sparkles like crazy, thats really all that matters. How would you be setting it? If you put it on a white piece of paper, what do you see- does it have giant windows? That would be my only hesitation. Cushions are just so hard to nail down.

From the video I actually think it doesn't show TOO much windowing, compared to its depth. It will not ASET out well I will tell you that. Leon Mege has a few shallow antique cushions on his website , some in settings with videos. Take a look, and also see if you can see in person an antique cushions that is not so shallow (in the mid to high 60's is what most of the non-branded stones are) and compare. Good luck!

 

[diagem]

Don't know if it's what people call too shallow but in the video posted it seems to be doing the right job. It looks like a promising, beautiful Old Mine Brilliant to me. Since you are on a strict time limit I wouldn't reject so fast.

Good luck...

ps, who cares what the ASET says...

 

[poshmommy]

I have no experience picking true antique cushions, but that shape is beautiful to me!

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Well, Yoram's opinon carries a lot of weight for me, but I can't quite see the facet pattern clearly in the center (it looks a little disorganized in the video). Did you take any close up shots?

I really want to see a well cut stone regardless of age. Here's an example I have in my pictures:

 

[diamondseeker2006]

I just reread your post and realized you said it does not have a high crown and that is a very important feature of an antique cushion, at least for me. A great antique cushion can take a long time to find. I really hate to see you rush.

 

[Diamondz1]

I was in your position about two years ago - looking for an antique cushion for months, getting exhausted by the search. Hang in there! I think the diamond you posted looks very pretty!

I wanted to post this too, though I'm not sure Adam still has it since it's from two years ago but, Old World Diamonds sent it as an option when I was looking (I passed because I wanted a more square cushion.) This is an elongated 2.02ct G-VS2 antique cushion.

For what it's worth I think the fact that you saw the cushion above and it wow'd you, says a lot. The cushion I ended up with has what many would consider a shallow crown but I think the stone is gorgeous. True antiques are weird animals, they don't always follow rules...

 

[eac4me]

Hi everyone - thanks so much for all of your responses! I just saw the stone again in daylight (albeit a cloudy day). I took a few more photos and videos, including the profile so you guys can see the [lack of] crown. My phone had an incredibly difficult time focusing on the stone, so apologies if it's not the clearest quality.
Hopefully this gives you all some idea...please let me know what you think! We need to make a decision on this stone this week, so your opinions are much appreciated

eac4me3

• eac4me
• Apr 24, 2017

eac4me2

• eac4me
• Apr 24, 2017

 

[ac117]

Hi everyone - thanks so much for all of your responses! I just saw the stone again in daylight (albeit a cloudy day). I took a few more photos and videos, including the profile so you guys can see the [lack of] crown. My phone had an incredibly difficult time focusing on the stone, so apologies if it's not the clearest quality.
Hopefully this gives you all some idea...please let me know what you think! We need to make a decision on this stone this week, so your opinions are much appreciated

eac4me3

• eac4me
• Apr 24, 2017

eac4me2

• eac4me
• Apr 24, 2017

You're seeing the stone in person, which I would personally trust more than photos/videos. Do YOU love it? That's what matters most ultimately bc you're going to be looking at it every day! You do know it's shallow and doesn't have much of a crown...it also looks to have areas with less light return at the north and south of the stone. But again, this all doesn't matter if it doesn't bother you.

 

[LLJsmom]

True, you need to love it. But do you love it because you haven't compared it with enough other stones? I agree with DS. The center is too disorganized for my tastes. Ther could be more chunky flashes of light if it were more organized. I love the one from Adam at OWD. I would ask for real life video of it. Adam can send that to you to see IRL too. Again I agree that I would not rush it either. But if you know an dwont be at peace if you don't buy this, then go for it. Although I will say it's a lot of money not to give yourself enough time to do your due diligence. I don't think any vendor should rush you. Good luck!

More specifically, I don't like how you keep seeing a couple large facets in the center turn on and off, and then the north and south areas seem to show splintery reflections. Adam's stone seems to show more evenly cut large facets in all directions in the center. I see a more distinct Maltese cross and I prefer that reflection pattern to just the east-west reflection pattern of the stone you have.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

I don't think the one you are looking at would be in the category of what we'd call a well cut cushion. It has large face up area due to being shallow and having no crown. But those are important for the beauty of the diamond. You can certainly do better on cut and beauty. But if you are buying solely for size, then this may be your best bet.

 

[marymm]

Well, I really like the cushion - the overall shape is beautiful; the faceting (to me) is pleasing; I don't see any significant windowing [like dollyanjuli above, I'd recommend placing the stone on a white piece of paper as another way to check for windows]; and I find the profile has a nice shape despite the shallow depth. The videos show the stone is bright, and the larger/smaller facet arrangement in this stone works (to my eyes). The center pattern is a bit disorganized but not unpleasingly so (to me).

If the stone ticks all of your prereqs, I'd go for it myself.

If you have any doubts, pass.

 

[eac4me]

Wow, thanks everyone for your feedback! I truly appreciate everyone's responses, especially Diagem for providing your professional expertise. I've reached out to all of the vendors commonly mentioned on PS, and none of them (including OWD) have anything that fits my parameters. No time for a custom cut given my boyfriend would like to propose in the near future, and we all know how long that process can take. Maybe for the upgrade!

I would like to point out that comparing the faceting of the diamond in Adam's professional rotating video isn't exactly a fair comparison to my amateur iphone video. These stones are cut by the same cutter as several popular PS vendors, and I feel pretty confident that these are well cut, albeit "non-branded" stones. Unless anyone has something else that fits my parameters exactly, and given the lack of other options right now, let's please stick to only considering these two stones at hand.

Anyway, we've narrowed it down to these two options. The first stone is the one mentioned above. The second stone weighs 0.4 carats more and is two color grades higher, but at the ABSOLUTE TOP of the budget. The lxw measurements are almost exactly the same but obviously greater depth.

In your opinion, do you think the higher colored/higher crown stone is worth paying up for and maxing out the budget? I've included a few videos directly comparing the two.

 

[LLJsmom]

eac, I am so sorry. I don't like either of them. Maybe it's just the way they have made the videos or my poor vision. Based on just these videos, I honestly wouldn't choose either. Maybe others who have better eyesight or are more visually discerning can choose between the two.

For what it's worth, I think with these, it's easier to just put the unmounted stones between the fingers of the top of a closed hand and tilt and rotate the stone.

 

[MarionC]

Neither of these stones "speaks" to me, but if you are in love with one of them, that's all that matters.
Personally I would wait until I had done more research. I think you will find here that many people love the crisp faceting patterns that give a stone it's unique personality, and I am not seeing that in the photos or videos.
Maybe they are present but have not been captured by the camera yet.

This is such a big decision. Since you are in hurry, could he propose with something else?

 

[Diamondz1]

For some reason I didn't realize that you're looking for a *modern* cut antique cushion. Now I'm with you.

Ok, I don't know which diamond is which in the videos so this will be interesting:
Video 1: Prefer the stone on the bottom
Video 2: Prefer the stone on the top
Video 3: Prefer the stone on the right

I don't think it's necessary to go to the top of the budget unless the expensive diamond knocks you out. (Unless that's the diamond I picked in all the videos, lol!) I don't think you'll see a difference in color. 40 points could make a visual difference in size but since you said the l/w ratios are almost the same, that's not a factor either. Whatever you save can be used on the setting/wedding band/wedding...

Are these stones from Leon? They remind me a lot of some things I saw with him, way back when, and I too got that "it's beautiful!" feeling in person that I could not convey in photos.

 

[Diamondz1]

Whoops, I'll correct myself: you said the l/w RATIOS are the same, not the MEASUREMENTS. So it's possible the higher carat weight stone also appears larger, though I don't really see it in the videos...

 

[eac4me]

@Diamondz1 yes, I'm looking for a "modern" antique cushion! I'm sorry if that was unclear. Both of these stones were cut and graded within the past 6 months by a very prominent cutter. From my understanding, this cutter cuts for "in person beauty," not necessarily for the ASET image and technical specs. Old school, yes.

Like @Diamondz1 said about her experience, I don't think these photos/videos do the stones justice. They were taken in the typical terrible fluorescent office lighting (with the addition of an LED lamp), not in a jewelry store where all diamonds sparkle. My jeweler said this is purposely the worst lighting so you can compare stones accurately and know what you're buying. Hopefully that's true?!

@Diamondz1, you actually picked the less expensive stone 2/3 times! And the lxw ratio are both 1.17 AND the measurements are approx. the same. The less expensive stone is .05mm taller and wider, so it may actually give a slightly larger face-up appearance.

To be honest, in person I was leaning towards the less expensive stone given the value, especially since the more expensive one didn't "blow me away" by comparison. But looking back at all the videos, the more expensive one definitely photographed whiter most of the time. I'm just not sure it's worth the massive price premium (the age old "paper value" versus "perceived value" dilemma), and I don't know if I'll even notice the G color when it's by itself and set in a ring?

Sincerely appreciate your response!!

 

[Diamondz1]

It's possible that you'll see a difference between and E and G side-by-side but a G should still be really white. I doubt you'll notice any color once it's set. Videos can be misleading; perhaps your face/hand/phone/overhead lighting was closer to one stone, causing it to appear a certain way.

Does your vendor have a solid upgrade policy? If so, that's another reason to consider the G. You could keep an upgrade in mind for the future. Down that road, when you don't have time constraints, you can search for the perfect diamond as an upgrade and spending less now means you'll be able to put more towards the upgrade later.

Your jeweler saying they deliberately use terrible lighting is hysterical. Leave it to a sales person to come up with these things! Despite thinking that comment was straight-up salesmanship, I do believe that shopping with your own eyes, for "in-person beauty" as your jeweler said, is also important. ASETs and technical specs have their place too but, beauty isn't always a science.