Can I get some opinions on this ruby?

[Shijitake]

Unheated ruby, half carat, just over 5 x 4, $1500. Comes with a GIA certificate. I know it's purplish, that's what I want. Is that a large window? Is the price too high?

 

[voce]

It is a large window, but that's kinda the look. I think it's a little high, given the purplish color and window.

 

[Acinom]

The stone might be quite dark in real life. These are probably taken in optimal lighting.
Could you ask the vendor to make some pics on his hand in daylight?

 

[Shijitake]

She said it's a bit darker irl. I'm thinking of just buying it and seeing it for myself since I've been back and forth with her for 5 days now. I feel bad pestering her for another picture. It's stated to be from Burma and is pigeon blood by the GIA. Does that justify the price a bit more? (she offered a small discount)

 

[voce]

Does the GIA report say Burma for the origin? If not, I wouldn't pay the premium.
Have you seen the GIA report for yourself? I have noticed some sellers on Etsy claim things about their stones that the GIA report they show contradicts. Like, I've seen one seller from Israel claim the GIA does not accept treated stones, when the report specifically says that the diamond in question has been heated treated and probably irradiated to alter the color. When dealing with a seller new to me I would be more cautious.

 

[Shijitake]

Yup, she gave the report number and on the site itself it says it's from Burma

 

[voce]

I would be reluctant to pull the trigger, because a) the ruby is small, probably only half a carat or less and b) I personally dislike uneven color face-up. I think I see two distinct colors between the center of the gem and the edges, which makes me not love it.

Did you give up your blue sapphire hunt? Did you suddenly become a ruby convert (as I did )?

 

[Shijitake]

I noticed the uneven color too and thought it was an optical illusion or whatever, since purplish sapphires and rubies I've seen are usually so in the center. I might still get it if the stats are worth the price because I want an unheated burmese pigeon blood and this is within my budget. Others are just way too high. If you think this price is within reason I'd get it for a viewing.

I haven't given up on the blue yet, I just put it off so I can buy my ideal with a big, big budget. I just happened to find rubies I really like. I like every blue sapphire so it's hard to choose, so I will wait til I have big money and search for "the one" I don't know if it's the one, but I have my eyes on Jeff White's emerald cut.

 

[Mrs_Strizzle]

Are you sure you don't want to do the same thing and save for your dream ruby, especially since you already have one (one you weren't instantly in love with)? I say this from the standpoint of a collector of 15 years with many hundreds of stones but only a small percentage that are worthy of being set. I definitely would do things differently if I could rewind.

 

[voce]

Do you mind linking the GIA cert? You haven't really shared the stats like all 3 dimensions of the gem and carat weight.

From pics only my best estimate of the weight is between 0.33 and 0.5, but it may be more or less than that, since eyeballing it only gets you so far. Alternatively, you can give us a $/ct if you're unwilling to share the report.

P.S. I like browsing and saw these budget friendly gems. Thought you might like looking at them.
https://skyjems.ca/collections/certified-gemstones/products/giass0103
https://skyjems.ca/collections/certified-gemstones/products/gias8056
https://skyjems.ca/collections/certified-gemstones/products/gias8059

If I had dough, I would get https://skyjems.ca/collections/certified-gemstones/products/gias8016 if I could get a recut on it. The color is stunning imho.

 

[Shijitake]

I'm trying to keep the lurkers at bay the 3rd dimension is just over 2 mm. I don't know if anyone would be interested in this, but I'm not taking any chances. Maybe I'll buy it for a viewing and I'll give you all the stats and even the link.

Mrs Strizzle, someday I would like a ruby like renwea's or voce's on her profile (it's absolutely stunning, voce) regardless of where it's from, or classified as Burmese, etc. For now I want a burmese pigeon blood, doesn't matter what size. A larger one would break the bank, so I'll take what I can get.

I look at my ruby and pad every day now. It hasn't been very sunny here lately but when it is I get to see that ruby glow . It's a special treat.

 

[Shijitake]

Here's a good view of the side

 

[dk168]

Too dark and not enough pink for my liking, however that's personal preferences.

DK

 

[Shijitake]

Thanks for the input!

 

[qubitasaurus]

It sounds too thin to me. I would pass, even with a cab I would want it to be more than 2 mm thick.

 

[Shijitake]

Thanks for the feedback qubi, and thanks voce, Acinom, Mrs Strizzle and dk too.

I decided to buy it for a viewing. I got a small discount and shipping is low.

I know I've been told not to buy stones that will fill in until I get my ideal, and this isn't getting approval, but I think the ideal that I want is going to be through the roof high. I found a nice one already set with diamonds but it's 25k+. So I'm going to take a look at it in person and see if I want to keep it. I think this is the only thing I want to fill in and I'll be happy just to have a Burmese pigeon blood.

In case you're curious about stats
https://www.etsy.com/listing/587197...-51ct-cushion-cut-ruby?show_sold_out_detail=1

 

[junebug17]

@Shijitake,I can see why this stone ticks a lot of boxes for you...I can't wait to hear what you think of it when you see it in person!

 

[renwea]

Im excited to see real life pictures too. Post lots of them!

 

[Shijitake]

If it weren't for that window lol. Fingers crossed it isn't too bad.

 

[pokerface]

If the stone actually looks like the picture, it is not worth $1500. You state that you want a purplish stone, but also that you are looking for pigeon blood red color. Pigeon blood red color is not purplish. And I don't care what the cert says, that is not a pigeon blood or top quality color stone. $1500 is a lot of money to spend on a "meh" ruby. You seem to be dropping a lot of money on stones before developing the proper evaluation skills. I highly recommend honing your eye with less expensive purchases. The internet can be a minefield for an inexperienced consumer, and you are really never going to get a good deal unless you know what to look for. Such education takes time. https://www.gemobsessed.com/jewelry-trends/the-problem-with-pigeons-blood/

 

[Mrs_Strizzle]

Thanks @pokerface ,that is a very interesting article. It certainly does seem that the term is thrown around wildly.

 

[Shijitake]

I've done some research on pigeon blood and this is what I found. Every lab from AGL, GRS, lotus, you name it, is more lenient to give the name pigeon blood to any pretty ruby. I found many rubies that were deemed pigeon blood. If pigeon blood is supposed to be rare, how can there be so many? So I decided if I was going to buy a PB, I'll buy one with a cert from GIA, because they are more strict about what qualifies as one. Most of the rubies I found with a GIA cert that was titled PB, didn't have it on the cert. So I decided I wanted a GIA cert that specifically said on the comments that it is a pigeon blood ruby. I've read the article you posted before and it basically says what I've found.

Every time I look up what pigeon blood ruby was, I found "a ruby with some purple or pink". It didn't help one bit. I saw a lot of rubies with purple or pink. Some were PB, some were not. It didn't make sense. So I looked up what qualifies as pigeon blood and found an article (which I have to find again) that said pigeon blood is a term that the British (I think, I can't remember) gave the rubies the Burmese people deemed the "best color". The "best color" according to them, is a red ruby with some percentage of purple. Why purple? Because on the opposite end of the spectrum from purple is yellow/gold. They cancel each other out. So when they set the ruby into the pure gold that they used (natural gold is usually about 22 karats), it was such a bright yellow color that it cancelled out the purple and the purplish ruby appeared pure red.

This was a satisfying answer and that's what I decided to base my search off of. I plan to find a jeweler and check this stone on 22k gold.

 

[pokerface]

Here is the article you are referencing: http://secretsofthegemtrade.com/authors-articles/what-color-is-pigeons-blood/. You will notice both stones pictured in the article are much more red than the stone you've selected. People with an eye for rubies will see purple in stones that would be undetectable to the layperson. For example, here is a true pigeon blood red stone, with a nearly imperceptible amount of purple. I understand that it can be frustrating when you are excited about a stone and others do not share your enthusiasm. All I can say is there seems to be a disconnect between your book knowledge of rubies and your application of the knowledge to real stones. You will notice that not one person here commented that they think you should buy the stone. If you're happy, you're happy, but be aware that you are likely overpaying for a mediocre gem, despite the GIA cert.

 

[Shijitake]

"All I can say is there seems to be a disconnect between your book knowledge of rubies and your application of the knowledge to real stones."

Well of course, I've never really seen an actual pigeon blood ruby irl, and a lot of articles don't help. I haven't found any article or guide on what exactly to look for. None of the articles online about it says that the purple is very faint, so I didn't take that into account. I figured the GIA would be best on knowing what really is pigeon blood.

I see some good amount of purple in this supposed PB https://www.topgem.co.uk/index.php/shop/unheated-ruby/untreated-rubies/1146964.html

I know no one said "buy the ruby" but I bought it for a viewing (and also mentioned I got a 15% discount) since I've been pestering the vendor for photos and other questions for almost a week (and the shipping was cheap).

What would you recommend on a search for real actual pigeon blood?

 

[chrono]

I see some good amount of purple in this supposed PB https://www.topgem.co.uk/index.php/shop/unheated-ruby/untreated-rubies/1146964.html

But there is no lab declaring it as PB, only the vendor's description.

 

[Shijitake]

But there is no lab declaring it as PB, only the vendor's description.

That's what I don't understand. He has many other rubies, and some with less purple. So why is that one PB?

 

[chrono]

1. Any vendor can claim whatever they want
2. Coloured gemstone photography accuracy can be challenging.

Just because a stone is less purple doesn't automatically make it PB. It has to have the intensity of colour (saturation) as well.

 

[pokerface]

I would recommend waiting until you have the budget. You simply cannot get a reasonably sized, natural, unheated/untreated true pigeon blood red ruby for $1500.

 

[voce]

I think a lot of argument here rests on one assumption. That this ruby looks irl exactly what the picture looks like. This is an unreasonable assumption to make.

The pictures are clearly purplish red, not pigeon blood. However, lest the people at GIA are idiots they should have some reason to state pigeon blood in the report itself. I hope this is an issue where the seller's camera is not picking up the true color.

Speaking from personal experience, a crappy camera can make all the difference. See my post regarding buying a new camera to photo my ruby e-ring in the Catch-all thread.

My thought is that the photo is probably not true to life color. No way to tell until we get hand shots when Shijitake receives it. We should withhold the debate until then.

 

[chrono]

Shown here is red with no orange and no purple. Within this pure red, there is variation in tone and saturation. Even within this pure hue, only a very small group falls under PB. Even if the colour (hue, tone, and saturation is fantastic), too much extinction can "kill" the look of a gemstone.

This article explains Hue, Tone, Saturation, and cutting. You'll need to view many stones in person to gain the experience to tell the finer nuances apart.

http://m.gemewizard.com/view_article.php?id=167