8yr Relationship Ready for the next step - Advice Needed

[thoughts]

Hi All,

My girlfriend and I have been dating for 8 years since college and it's finally time for me to make this official. I did my research last year and saved money and finally went diamond shopping today. I've looked at online places like bluenile, but am unsure about shopping for something so important online.

I have a friend who used to be a gemologist who took me to his friend still in the business. My basic questions are if I'm getting a good deal or if I can do better shopping at an online retailer. I really want the best that I can afford. My budget is $8500 for the stone and setting. Out of the diamonds my friend's retailer showed me, I chose a 1.01 carat H VS2 for $7500 with a platinum pave setting with 0.35 ct tw. for $1000 (very similar to http://www.bluenile.com/diamond-engagement-ring-platinum_17875). The stone is GIA certified and the report information is below as well as a pdf attached.

So what do you all think? Should I continue looking? Is this a great deal? Please help me out because this is all new to me and I'd like to give my long-time girlfriend the best I can; she deserves it. Thanks in advance!

Round Brilliant
Measurements: 6.35 - 6.37 x 3.99 mm
Carat Weight: 1.01 carat
Color Grade: H
Clarity Grade: VS2
Cut Grade: Very Good

Proportions:
Depth: 62.7%
Table: 59%
Crown Angle: 36.5°
Crown Height: 15.0%
Pavilion Angle: 41.0°
Pavilion Depth: 43.0%
Star Length: 55%
Lower Half: 80%
Girdle: Thin to Slightly Thick, Faceted (4.5%)
Culet: None

Finish:
Polish: Excellent
Symmetry: Excellent
Fluorescence: None

Comments:
Internal graining is not shown.

 

[slg47]

I would look for an excellent cut grade.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Gosh, I hate to say it, but I would not buy that stone. It is too deep and the diameter is less than a 1 ct. stone should be. One carat stones should be at least 6.4mm up to 6.5mm. I would insist on GIA excellent cut because it is a very broad range with some stones better than others. So going down to very good usually means there is a problem.

In reality, you will find a far better selection of high quality diamonds online than you will at local jewelers because they generally don't specialize in ideal/excellent cut diamonds. Therefore, they just don't have the selection that some of the online vendors have. I have personally bought diamonds from Good Old Gold and WhiteFlash. Both carry excellent stones and have a huge number of positive reviews on this site. There are several others as well. If it is important to you to buy from a traditional jewelry store, I will say that Good Old Gold is a family-owned store in Long Island, NY.

The only problem I am seeing is that the ideal cut 1 carat H VS2's are running around $8000-8500, so you'd either have to go to H SI1 or I VS2 to meet your budget in an ideal cut stone. And cut is the most important factor influencing the beauty of the diamond.

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2676039.htm (1.04 H VS3, 6.5mm, $8501)

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2673406.htm

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2696778.htm (1.09 I VS2, 6.6mm, $7769)

 

[hearts-arrows_girl]

I would continue looking. The 1.09 from Whiteflash that Diamondseeker posted is what I would pick. It's in your budget and has a nice diameter. Good luck and congrats on moving forward in the relationship.

 

[thoughts]

Thanks for the advice. I'd rather know now that the stone isn't worth it than after I bought it. Two other questions: When I click on the above links, the prices are different than described and what is the general consensus of James Allen? They allow appointments to view 3 diamonds in person and since this is a big purchase, I think that's a good compromise between purchasing online.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

If James Allen is local to you, then that would be fine. I can look on there quickly and see if they have any good ones.

The WF prices I gave were the ones with the pricescope member/wire payment discount. It shows up on my page because I clicked on their site from the PS diamond search. James Allen also offers a PS discount. James Allen has a variety of qualities but does have some excellent/ideal cut stones. I will link some for you to look at in a minute.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Okay, here would be my top three choices from James Allen. I would request that they email you the idealscope images so we can take a look at them before you go see the diamonds. As you can see, all three of these are better than the one you saw at the jewelry store as they all will have a larger diameter. Try to always stay less than 62.3% on the depth (and 60-62 is even better) because too deep can make the stones diameter small for the weight.

Best two choices (all H VS2):

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/H-VS2-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1452886.asp 1.06, 6.55-6.59 mm, $7580

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/H-VS2-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1443975.asp 1.02, 6.53-6.56 mm, $7400

This one would be my last choice because it is a little smaller than the other two:

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/H-VS2-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1461110.asp 1.01, 6.4 mm, $7150

 

[thoughts]

diamondseeker,

I really appreciate all the advice and help. I live in NYC so James Allen's office is a 20 minute train ride away from where I work. Those first two stones you linked look great. I'll get started on setting up an appointment. Hopefully, those stones will still be available. If not, I hope I can come back on and ask for advice on which 3 I should see in person from their website.

 

[OCgirl]

diamondseeker,

I really appreciate all the advice and help. I live in NYC so James Allen's office is a 20 minute train ride away from where I work. Those first two stones you linked look great. I'll get started on setting up an appointment. Hopefully, those stones will still be available. If not, I hope I can come back on and ask for advice on which 3 I should see in person from their website.

I think you can call them to put them on hold. But there's a limit to how long they'll hold for you.

 

[sna77]

diamondseeker,

I really appreciate all the advice and help. I live in NYC so James Allen's office is a 20 minute train ride away from where I work. Those first two stones you linked look great. I'll get started on setting up an appointment. Hopefully, those stones will still be available. If not, I hope I can come back on and ask for advice on which 3 I should see in person from their website.

If you live in NYC you have other options too.

Good Old Gold is on Long Island and ID Jewelry is in the diamond district. All 3 will have access to many of the same stones

 

[thoughts]

OCGirl, thanks for the quick tip. I called and put the first two stones on hold and got the ball rolling on setting up an appointment. They'll hold the stones until I see their gemologist.

I can select another one to see in person. Diamondseeker, is that 3rd link the one you'd suggest? I looked at it using the Virtual Loupe and I wasn't too sure of it. Is there something on the website whether slightly above my price range that you would select instead? My girlfriend is petite, so it doesn't have to be the biggest stone I can get.

Thanks all!

 

[thoughts]

diamondseeker,

I really appreciate all the advice and help. I live in NYC so James Allen's office is a 20 minute train ride away from where I work. Those first two stones you linked look great. I'll get started on setting up an appointment. Hopefully, those stones will still be available. If not, I hope I can come back on and ask for advice on which 3 I should see in person from their website.

If you live in NYC you have other options too.

Good Old Gold is on Long Island and ID Jewelry is in the diamond district. All 3 will have access to many of the same stones

Would there be any benefit to going to one of these places over James Allen?

 

[sna77]

diamondseeker,

I really appreciate all the advice and help. I live in NYC so James Allen's office is a 20 minute train ride away from where I work. Those first two stones you linked look great. I'll get started on setting up an appointment. Hopefully, those stones will still be available. If not, I hope I can come back on and ask for advice on which 3 I should see in person from their website.

If you live in NYC you have other options too.

Good Old Gold is on Long Island and ID Jewelry is in the diamond district. All 3 will have access to many of the same stones

Would there be any benefit to going to one of these places over James Allen?

GOG has an upgrade policy--not sure if the others do. Also, the setting may matter. You have more choices with GOG and ID Jewelry (they are both Vatche dealers for example). You probably want to buy the stone from where you buy the setting from...

 

[OCgirl]

OCGirl, thanks for the quick tip. I called and put the first two stones on hold and got the ball rolling on setting up an appointment. They'll hold the stones until I see their gemologist.

I can select another one to see in person. Diamondseeker, is that 3rd link the one you'd suggest? I looked at it using the Virtual Loupe and I wasn't too sure of it. Is there something on the website whether slightly above my price range that you would select instead? My girlfriend is petite, so it doesn't have to be the biggest stone I can get.

Thanks all!

How about this one:

1.01 ct G VS2 $7,970 (slightly above your budget) http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/G-VS2-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1459044.asp
I ran the HCA and it scores 1.6!
The GIA cert also says it has a maple leave inscription. That leads me to think it's a Canadian diamond

I think you can get a better color (or bigger) stone if you are willing to look for an eye-clean SI1 stone. I see quite a few G or F SI1 stones in your price range. Personally I would prioritize color over clarity for a stone this size because you can find plenty of super eye-clean stones in the 1 ct range. I own a G SI1 stone and I love it.

 

[OCgirl]

For example:

1.16 ct G SI1 $7,880 HCA: 1.5 http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/G-SI1-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1455234.asp
1.06 ct G SI1 $7,590 AGS0 http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/G-SI1-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1460873.asp

 

[diamondseeker2006]

The 3rd one I posted or the G VS2 that was posted would be about the same size, etc. So either one would be a good third choice. I posted what I thought were the best of the H VS2's that were close to $7500 to leave you enough money for the setting. I honestly think either of those first two stones will be wonderful as they both face up over 6.5mm and the color and clarity are very nice.

 

[thoughts]

I like the G VS2 slightly better than the H VS2 of the same size. I guess it comes down to whether you can tell the color difference between an H and a G when the diamond is set (in platinum or white gold). So, my question is should I consider G SI1 Diamonds or stay at H VS2? Again, I'd like to go for best quality/color over size.

Currently, these two are currently on hold for me (but of course can change):

$7580 - 1.06 carat H VS2 - 6.55*6.59*4.04 - HCA: 1.5 -
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/H-VS2-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1452886.asp

$7400 - 1.02 carat H VS2 - 6.56*6.53*3.99 - HCA: 1.2 - (this last one has a maple leaf inscription)
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/H-VS2-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1443975.asp

Looking for a 3rd.

 

[OCgirl]

I like the G VS2 slightly better than the H VS2 of the same size. I guess it comes down to whether you can tell the color difference between an H and a G when the diamond is set (in platinum or white gold). So, my question is should I consider G SI1 Diamonds or stay at H VS2? Again, I'd like to go for best quality/color over size.

Currently, these two are currently on hold for me (but of course can change):

$7580 - 1.06 carat H VS2 - 6.55*6.59*4.04 - HCA: 1.5 -
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/H-VS2-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1452886.asp

$7400 - 1.02 carat H VS2 - 6.56*6.53*3.99 - HCA: 1.2 - (this last one has a maple leaf inscription)
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/H-VS2-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1443975.asp

Looking for a 3rd.

I think only you can answer that question. Some people can't tell the difference between two color grades. Some people can tell the difference between one color grade. And even if you can *tell* the difference, which one do you *prefer* (e.g. paying extra for slight color difference that your eyes can catch)? One thing a lot of people stress here is D is not *better* or *higher quality* than an H, it's what you prefer. Color is a personal choice. I personally like my diamonds as colorless as possible and in most cases I can see the color difference, but that doesn't mean everyone is like me.

I think if you haven't seen many diamonds in person or compare different colors and clarities in person, it's good to look at a different color and decide if you think going up in color is worth it for you.

 

[vintagelover229]

If you are in driving distance to GOG I really would go look there first. They can show you a ton of different stones-different colors/clarity/cuts and educate you on what you need to know. Doesn't mean you have to buy it there but it at least will give you a base line to know what you can get-and they have top of the line service and are a family run store.

Here is a link to Jonathans youtube channel to check out. Google color and it will pull up comparisons.

http://www.youtube.com/user/DiamondInfoMan?ob=0

(here is the color search for you)
http://www.youtube.com/user/DiamondInfoMan/search?query=color


Hearts and arrows compared to the August vintage round
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zgcvxvyX1cY&feature=plcp&context=C38a974dUDOEgsToPDskI2apKCr6DQfQoQLmV-Ml5x


Also if you want something beautiful and still ideal cut I would check out their August vintage rounds. Those babies are unique and are stunners.

I know you weren't looking at J in color (check out the color comparison video on youtube and also do a search on PS about them) but this is a nice size and if it's eye clean-a really good buy

http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/9163/

Here is an example of the AVR
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/9167/

 

[diamondseeker2006]

The two you have on hold are going to be hard to beat for your budget, really. In excellent cut stones, it will be almost impossible to tell a G from an H face up. I have both and can say that with certainty. I think H VS2 is a good balance of color and clarity. And of course they would be fine in a platinum or white metal setting. We have many I and J stones on the forum set in white metals. I would still choose those over either of the third choices.

 

[thoughts]

Thanks again for all the replies. You all are super helpful. Since I do get a 3rd stone to view from James Allen, I figure it would be best to see a different color in person (in this case G). Now should I stretch my budget a bit to stay in the same VS2 quality or should I go down to SI1 quality and still be able to get a great stone? (budget is set for a reason although I wouldn't mind spending a little extra if it's really worth it in the long run).

I'm watching the Good old gold videos, so I may end up figuring out this answer before someone else posts. I'll give them a call tomorrow to see if I can drop in on Saturday just to take a look at their inventory and learn some stuff. I'd still visit James Allen before making my final decision.

Who knew this would be so tough

 

[cloundysuny]

lol,very useful for me.

 

[thoughts]

I watched a ton of those videos and they were really helpful. All those diamonds were beautiful. I called Good Old Gold and have an appointment set up for tomorrow.

In the meantime, I decided that for the 3rd stone with James Allen to go with a different color and clarity (G SI1) so I can see if I notice any difference. I might end up being happy with an H color and SI1 clarity; not sure.

I'm checking out the website and have only been considering GIA graded stones. Should I include AGS stones? Any ones that stand out as the best of that color/clarity combo?

 

[vintagelover229]

AGS/GIA are the top grading IMO and that's who may people are using now a days. From my understanding AGS hasn't been around as long but it's standards (and many of them train) with GIA.

You are safe with those ones. If you get EGL there may be a difference if you sent it to GIA/AGS for regrading and it might come back a few color/clarity grades different (although it depends on the lab where it's done. There are many EGL labs).

An expert will chime in better detail but your safe with either GIA or AGS

I'm SO excited for you to go to GOG! If you buy a ring please come back and post details and pictures but most of all HAVE FUN!!

 

[thoughts]

I'll definitely be posting a picture of what ever I end up going with. My current plan of action is to go to GOG tomorrow and learn and see what they have available. I will still go to my appointment with James Allen and see the 3 stones I select. After, I'll decide whether to continue with GOG or James Allen. I'm really hoping GOG's prices are competitive as I'd rather have a physical store I can go to and possibly get future jewelry from.

As for the 3rd stone, as I said above I'm going to try to see the best available G-SI1 in my price range. I didn't limit it to GIA only and the AGS stones seemed to be better in this grade. Which of the following would be better or is there a better one available on James Allen?

$7590 - 1.06 carat G SI1 - 6.48*6.52*4.06 - HCA: 2.2 -
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/G-SI1-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1460873.asp

$7310 - 1.02 carat G SI1 - 6.47*6.49*3.97 - HCA: 1.2 -
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/G-SI1-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1460878.asp

 

[OCgirl]

I'll definitely be posting a picture of what ever I end up going with. My current plan of action is to go to GOG tomorrow and learn and see what they have available. I will still go to my appointment with James Allen and see the 3 stones I select. After, I'll decide whether to continue with GOG or James Allen. I'm really hoping GOG's prices are competitive as I'd rather have a physical store I can go to and possibly get future jewelry from.

As for the 3rd stone, as I said above I'm going to try to see the best available G-SI1 in my price range. I didn't limit it to GIA only and the AGS stones seemed to be better in this grade. Which of the following would be better or is there a better one available on James Allen?

$7590 - 1.06 carat G SI1 - 6.48*6.52*4.06 - HCA: 2.2 -
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/G-SI1-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1460873.asp

$7310 - 1.02 carat G SI1 - 6.47*6.49*3.97 - HCA: 1.2 -
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/G-SI1-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1460878.asp

For SI graded stones, the trick is you have to make sure they are eye clean TO YOU. Most jewelers call viewing it from 6 - 9 inches with no visible inclusions eye clean. To me eye clean means 3 inches aways. I don't want to see inclusions if I hold my stone closer. You can find plenty of SI1 grades stones that are completely eye clean (or with prongable inclusions). With that said, you can ask JA about their opnions on those two stones? They can provide you "eye clean" assessments.They both look pretty eye clean from the image but that's not the best way to judge I suppose. I like the image of the first one better but I think the image for the second one is slight tilted, making it look less symmetrical.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Well that is great that you are going to GOG! Did you tell them what you are looking for? Because they might have needed to call in a couple of stones for you to look at. I had already looked at their inventory and did not see anything that met your specs and price. My diamond ring is from there and I do love GOG! But they can get in almost anything you want, if they know in advance. The advantage to buying from them is that you can have them as a jeweler for life. Whereas James Allen is basically an internet diamond seller. You pay a little more for the jewelry store and the services they provide.

This one for your third JA stone:

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/G-SI1-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1460878.asp

Has about the same diameter as the other and costs less. Twining wisps are often invisible to the eye.

 

[YACN]

I may be wrong here but wouldn't you also be required to pay sales tax at GOG? I'm not sure what the sales tax is in NY but it seems like on a purchase of $8500 that it wouldn't be trivial. I know GOG has a fantastic reputation (and rightfully so from everything I've read) but, for me personally, being able to spend a few hundred extra on the stone or setting would make me lean towards buying online and out of state.

 

[OCgirl]

I may be wrong here but wouldn't you also be required to pay sales tax at GOG? I'm not sure what the sales tax is in NY but it seems like on a purchase of $8500 that it wouldn't be trivial. I know GOG has a fantastic reputation (and rightfully so from everything I've read) but, for me personally, being able to spend a few hundred extra on the stone or setting would make me lean towards buying online and out of state.

I'm sure he can look at it in the store and have GOG ship it to him (an out-of-state address). And since GOG does not have Nexus in the state he resides in (I assume) then he won't get charged sales tax. Some of the east coast states are so close anyway so it's like getting the benefit of both: a "local" jeweler and not paying sales tax.

 

[thoughts]

The sales tax is something I was worrying about. If I went with James Allen, I was planning on having it shipped out of New York so I wouldn't have to worry about tax. Knowing I can do that with GOG as well makes things a bit better. I'm really rooting for GOG!

Also, for the 3rd stone, I went with the second one I listed above. So the final 3 stones in price order are:

$7310 - 1.02 carat G SI1 - 6.47*6.49*3.97 - HCA: 1.2 -
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/G-SI1-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1460878.asp

$7400 - 1.02 carat H VS2 - 6.56*6.53*3.99 - HCA: 1.2 - (this one has a maple leaf inscription)
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/H-VS2-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1443975.asp

$7580 - 1.06 carat H VS2 - 6.55*6.59*4.04 - HCA: 1.5 -
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/H-VS2-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1452886.asp