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2.0ct e-diamond – too big or expensive (vs avg)?

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DiamondDumbie

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2 ct engagement diamond – too big or expensive (vs average size or cost)?



OK… I have questions related to an e-diamond “average” size and cost, as well as how this “average” relates to certain age groups who get engaged.



First, let me say that I knew nothing about buying a diamond a month ago. However, I have recently learned a lot from this forum and other sources. I now feel confident about shopping and buying a diamond based on the Four C’s. However, now that I have found a diamond, I am now questioning my confidence about buying a diamond “for an engagement ring”. Basically, I am not certain if this too big or too much money for an engagement ring based on the information pertaining to the “average” engagement diamond size and cost.



Since this pertains to me, I should clarify that we are in our late 30’s, live in California, career is stable and my financial matters are not a limitation for this purchase - per se. At the same time, I do not want to surprise my girlfriend with a diamond that is too big or expensive based on what may be “reasonable” for an engagement ring. I do understand reasonable is a relative term and it depends on the individuals taste, finances, etc, etc. Nevertheless, I will feel horrible if she is shocked (in a bad way) that I spent 10-4 times the average cost for her engagement ring. The worst thing that could happen is we return it and she helps me pick out something that makes more sense. However, that seems like torture. Can you imagine? “Surprise! Take a look at this great diamond; now let us return it for something smaller”.



To get started, I began looking at 2.0 carat diamonds because this seemed to be the size of diamond our close friends were buying (or receiving) for their engagements. I never thought twice about it, but this size just seemed to be a common size amongst our friends who also happen to be in the 30-something age group. Therefore, I assumed this size was a good starting point and worked on the other C''s to come up with my selection. I should also mention none of my friends are trust fund babies and all of them are average hard working individuals who earned everything they have worked for. That is why I assumed 2.0 carats was typical, average or normal.



However, I have recently noticed in this forum along with several diamond articles that the “average” engagement diamond is $3,000 - $7,000 for .5 – .75 carats. After reading this, I was surprised to see this average based on the size of our friend''s e-diamonds. Therefore, I am asking myself, is this “average” size and cost dictated by the “average” age people get engaged?



It is reasonable to believe the largest percentile of engagements occur with individuals who are in their early or mid 20’s. Typically, at this age, a large percent of people are just starting out with their careers or have not purchased their house or their financial issues are still unsettled. No offense to any young newly engaged couples because I too was there fifteen years ago.



Therefore, I was interested to know if there is there an “average” size and cost for engagement rings per age groups, perhaps individuals in their 30’s who are already home owners with stable careers and finances.



I feel like this is over-thinking and I should just go with my gut. However, I really want the surprise to be a great experience and not one that could possible cause her anxiety about my stupid spending for a diamond engagement ring. This is one of the tough parts about making this experience a surprise. To me, it is only money and you can always earn more. However, at the same time, I do not want to go into this purchase feeling like an idiot that I am buying something she will feel compelled to return because of her own guilt or sensibility. If a larger more expensive e-diamond is not out of the ordinary for some individuals who have earned the ability to splurge, then I will not worry about my selection.



So here are the two diamonds that I am considering. I am leaning towards unique versus the more favorable round and princess cuts. I am not thrilled about buying a brand diamond but this one kept grabbing my attention.



I appreciate any opinions, advice, suggestions, recommendations or comments you might share.



Tycoon Diamond
(both are @ $30,000 out the door with a solitaire platinum ring)

Rectangle Cut
2.02 F VS2
8.18 x 6.38 x 4.39
Extremely Thin - Medium
Table 77%
Depth 68.5%
Polish & Symmetry – Very Good
Fluorescence - None

Square Cut
2.04 F Si1
7.44 x 7.43 x 3.75
Thin – Slightly Thick
Table 75%
Depth 50.5%
Polish & Symmetry – Very Good
Fluorescence - None
 

Miranda

Ideal_Rock
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I think 2 cts. is a great size. I wouldn''t worry too much about the norm, though. Have you talked to her about the size and style she may like?
 

DiamondDumbie

Rough_Rock
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No, I have not talked to her about the size, style, shape, etc. This ring is a surprise. However, we are already talking about sneaking off for a destination wedding (tropical of course), so she realizes a ring is part of the plan. I do have a great idea what style she likes. Besides, if I asked her what she wants, then this would be too easy.

P.S. How do you set the line spacing to single within a PS thread? I typed this in Word, copied and pasted it into my thread. The double spacing is perplexing and annoying. Sorry about that.
 

fanboy

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Messages
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I think 2 carats is an excellent size: it''s big enough such that it will never feel small, and it''s not so big that it will appear too ostentatious or gaudy.

1.5-2+ carats seems the norm for young professionals. In NYC, most of the 20-something women I see on the street wearing engagement rings appear to have stones that are in that range.

That all being said, $30k sounds like an awful lot for the specs you provided. Last I checked, a 2 carat D VVS2 asscher cut diamond on Blue Nile was ~$16k. As far as I know, princess cuts are not worth twice the price of an asscher.
 

Gypsy

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Date: 7/24/2007 7:21:21 PM
Author: fanboy
I think 2 carats is an excellent size: it''s big enough such that it will never feel small, and it''s not so big that it will appear too ostentatious or gaudy.

1.5-2+ carats seems the norm for young professionals. In NYC, most of the 20-something women I see on the street wearing engagement rings appear to have stones that are in that range.

That all being said, $30k sounds like an awful lot for the specs you provided. Last I checked, a 2 carat D VVS2 asscher cut diamond on Blue Nile was ~$16k. As far as I know, princess cuts are not worth twice the price of an asscher.

Fanboy, the diamond is a Tycoon Cut. Branded which means mark up. I have no idea what 2 carat Tycoons go for in D VVS grades, so I can''t help there.

But I do think the size is a great one for your age, social group, and financial status. What are the MM measurements on the stones?
 

SuzyQZ

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2 ct engagement ring for a woman in her 30''s who lives in California is PERFECT!

Not too big, not too small... It''s PERFECT!!

I live in Southern California and my dental hygienist has a 2 ct diamond ring that she just bought for herself!!! I''ve seen teachers, policewomen, stay at home mom''s and secretaries all with rings in the 2ct range.

I got a 1.47 princess cut diamond when I got married and I''ve wanted a bigger size diamond ever since! Don''t get me wrong, I love my ring because that is what my hubby picked out, but the truth is, we could have afforded a bigger diamiond, but he liked the "size" of this stone so that''s what he bought.
2.gif


It is a strange fenomenon how a diamond that initially seems so big, can somehow become quite average, practically overnight (here on PS we call it diamond shrinkage syndrome or DSS for short).

Anyway, if you can afford a 2ct and she doesn''t have size 2 fingers, I say go for it!!!
36.gif
 

fanboy

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Date: 7/24/2007 7:33:56 PM
Author: Gypsy


Fanboy, the diamond is a Tycoon Cut. Branded which means mark up. I have no idea what 2 carat Tycoons go for in D VVS grades, so I can''t help there.

But I do think the size is a great one for your age, social group, and financial status. What are the MM measurements on the stones?
Right, but take a look at the two particular stones the OP is describing. They are both F color; one is VS2 and the other is SI1. In comparison, 2 carat Royal Asschers in D VVS sell for ~$30-35k; as we all know, the RAs carry a very heft premium. In order to make sense of the pricing of the two diamonds the OP describes, you''d have to believe that the Tycoon cut commands a premium much, much, greater than what a RA can.
 

jayreneepea

Brilliant_Rock
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I''m also in So Cal in my late 30''s (well alright, very early 40''s
9.gif
) and I can say that 2 carats is not too big!! It''s just perfect! She will be pleasantly surprised!
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Okay then. Good point Fanboy. In that case I would:

I would call Joe Escrobar in Campbell CA, a good jeweler PSers use (myself included from the referrals here) who carries the Tycoon Cut.

I would ask for their "BEST PRICE " on a similar ring. Use those exact words. If their prices are comparible, you know it's the premium. If they aren't comparable, you know you've got room to negotiate, or need to find a different vendor.

Have you seen Crisscut diamonds BTW? They are kinda similar to Tycoons. Just thought I'd put it out there.
 

baby monster

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A suprise is a nice thing but she'll have to wear the ring every day, so it makes sense to me to let her pick out the stone and the setting. If she has particular taste in jewelry then it will be difficult (not impossible) for you to get exactly what she wants. As much as women like to think that men can read our minds, it doesn't actually happen. Of course, you'll be able to reset and to upgrade but why not have something she wants right off the bat.
 

DiamondDumbie

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Date: 7/24/2007 7:33:56 PM
Author: Gypsy

Date: 7/24/2007 7:21:21 PM
Author: fanboy
I think 2 carats is an excellent size: it''s big enough such that it will never feel small, and it''s not so big that it will appear too ostentatious or gaudy.

1.5-2+ carats seems the norm for young professionals. In NYC, most of the 20-something women I see on the street wearing engagement rings appear to have stones that are in that range.

That all being said, $30k sounds like an awful lot for the specs you provided. Last I checked, a 2 carat D VVS2 asscher cut diamond on Blue Nile was ~$16k. As far as I know, princess cuts are not worth twice the price of an asscher.

Fanboy, the diamond is a Tycoon Cut. Branded which means mark up. I have no idea what 2 carat Tycoons go for in D VVS grades, so I can''t help there.

But I do think the size is a great one for your age, social group, and financial status. What are the MM measurements on the stones?
Fanboy,

Thank you for your input. 20-something wearing 2.0ct?!?! That surprises me because of the average cost and size everyone reports. However, I suppose NYC has their standards over-the-top like it is in LA, so I can see this being the norm. That is why these averages throw me for a loop. Based on the average size and cost, there must be a plethora of "1ct or less" diamonds being sold to offset the over-the-top cities and social groups. Otherwise, how can the average cost and size be less than $7k and .75ct?

However, I did a search on BlueNile with the specs of my two Tycoon diamonds, but I searched round and princess cuts since they do not sell the Tycoon cut. Using 2.0-2.05, F, VS2-Si1, Ideal, No-Flour... the rounds ranged $29-25k and the princess ranged $22-20. This tells me the cost for these Tycoons are within "reason". However, the Tycoon cannot be classified as Ideal because nobody knows what an Ideal Tycoon cut looks like. Considering the Tycoon is marked-up as a branded diamond, it still is within the BlueNile prices of an ideal round and that is what I would purchase if I chose the round cut. In addition, these Tycoon diamonds are retail store prices and not internet prices.



Gypsy,

Yes, you are correct. Tycoon diamonds are branded & patented, so they mark-up their diamonds. I am not a fan about how they mark-up brand diamonds but I also wanted to have something unique versus the popular round and princess cuts. Therefore, I am willing to spend the extra coin. I also looked at the pink diamonds. Wow! Talk about a mark-up!!

I listed the measurements in my thread. Since I am a newbie, please let me know if this is not what you meant. Also, thank you for your input.

Rectangle Cut
2.02 F VS2
8.18 x 6.38 x 4.39

Square Cut
2.04 F Si1
7.44 x 7.43 x 3.75



 

decodelighted

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Averages can be very misleading. The average house runs about $200K ... how 'bout yours? The average car costs 25K ... yours?

Believe me -- she's NOT gonna be, "Oh no - you spent __x the national average on my ring!"
2.gif
She never needs to know the specifics at all really ... unless you have her get the appraisal & insurence for the ring.

Short answer: 2 carats is very respectable for late 30's/California. NOT obscene or overdone ... as you already KNOW because it's the size common amongst your social group.

HOWEVER -- I do think you might regret spending 30K on a 2 carat Tycoon cut. Sure it's "different" ... but different isn't always a "good" thing. Sometimes it's just "different". Do you really think she'll like the (IMO) somewhat chaotic, confusing, dark look of a Tycoon?

Have you considered CUSHION cuts? You could probably get a 2.5 -3 carat cushion cut for 30K .... Or maybe a Tiffany Lucida?? (They're doing very pretty new settings for those stones now, with side baguettes - in case you don't prefer the former mod setting.)

Just some other ideas ...


ETA: When I was in college (20 yrs ago) ... the girls from Long Island had a fave chant that went something like "Nothing less than TWO will do". I can't imagine what that # must be today ... but 3+ carats doesn't seem uncommon amongst the 20's-30's professional set in the Tristate area. Sure, folks across the country are getting what they can afford, but I doubt many established 30s professionals who can afford 30K easily are choosing .75 e-rings just because that's "average" though!
2.gif
 

fanboy

Shiny_Rock
Joined
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Messages
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Well, yeah, NYC is a bit over the top. But I suspect it''s a trend consistent with big east coast cities in general; DC and Boston don''t seem to be much different.

Have you considered a Royal Asscher or a diamond that is slightly shy of 2 carats (~1.95)? I''m biased, because I picked a Royal Asscher, but I also wanted something unique--both appraisers and every jeweler that''s seen the stone have raved about it. If you stay slightly shy of the 2 carat mark, you can save a great deal.

The other thing I noticed was the very large face-up dimensions of the diamonds you listed. 7.4 x 7.4 mm for a 2 carat square-cut diamond? I''m not familiar with the Tycoon cut though, so maybe that''s just how they''re proportioned. Do other 2 carat Tycoon diamonds you''ve seen have similar measurements?
 

DiamondDumbie

Rough_Rock
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Date: 7/24/2007 8:03:31 PM
Author: Gypsy
Okay then. Good point Fanboy. In that case I would:

I would call Joe Escrobar in Campbell CA, a good jeweler PSers use (myself included from the referrals here) who carries the Tycoon Cut.

I would ask for their ''BEST PRICE '' on a similar ring. Use those exact words. If their prices are comparible, you know it''s the premium. If they aren''t comparable, you know you''ve got room to negotiate, or need to find a different vendor.

Have you seen Crisscut diamonds BTW? They are kinda similar to Tycoons. Just thought I''d put it out there.

THANK YOU!! I will call Joe asap.

I have heard about the Crisscut and scene pictures on the internet. At this point, I chose to go with the Tycoon because it grabbed my attention the minute I walked into the store and I have not been able to talk myself into another style cut. However, my girlfriend might have other ideas. Fortunately, we are not locked into my selection if she wants something else we can return the ring and find her what she wants. However, I think she will really like the Tycoon. It just seems like the style she would love.
 

FacetFire

Brilliant_Rock
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Messages
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I have never seen that cut before, but wow, I love it! I think it looks classy and classic, yet unique and striking! I think 2 carats in that cut would be amazing and perfect for a 30-something woman in CA. Just make sure we get to see pics! :)
 

Lynn B

Ideal_Rock
Joined
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Messages
5,609
I''m a round brilliant girl, and I have a 2+ carat stone. I think your GF will ADORE a diamond in that size range, and if you can afford it - then I say, "Why not?!" Of course, around here, we do love being diamond enablers...
2.gif
1.gif
9.gif


Anyway, as I mentioned, I am partial to RBs... so I would ask that you at least CONSIDER that shape. They are classic and timeless. Have you seen a well-cut round in that size in person? To my eyes, there is little that''s more captivating or gorgeous.

But whatever you choose, I''m sure she''ll love it! Have fun. She''s a lucky girl!
 

decodelighted

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Here''s a clearer pix ...

tycoonfacets.jpg
 

decodelighted

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Have you seen the rectangular Tiffany Lucida, Diamonddumbie?

lucidarect.jpg
 

FacetFire

Brilliant_Rock
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Check this out...drool!

Tycoon_Square_Aspira.JPG
 

FacetFire

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
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And a more elongated version...yum!

Tycoon_Solitaire.JPG
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Messages
58,547
Those diamonds are beautiful, and like emerald and asscher cuts, they are probably deeper and appear smaller than round stones of the same weight. So I think 2 cts. would be very nice.

I just wanted to add that the "average" diamond price is really irrelevant to a particular individual. What really matters is the size of the diamonds her close friends and sisters wear. Those are the people who''ll be comparing rings, like it or not. So since you said your circle of friends are getting 2 ct. rings, that is definitely a safe bet.
 

shlo_mo_shun

Rough_Rock
Joined
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I really think going off of what friends and social circle is getting is a pretty good idea. If I were getting married in 8-10 more years and living in SoCal, yeah, 1.5-2 would be what I would look for. Location and age seem to be the two overriding factors, and there is a large variance depending on either of those. You would fall into the ''larger'' size on both age and location, so i''d say 2c falls nicely into the upper range of ''right'' for your type of person. And falling into the upper range is a nice place to be.


As for the diamond and the setting. I used to be firmly in the ''guy should pick it out and present it whole'' camp, but have flipped opinions through talks with my girlfriend and my own search.
One retailer made an interesting comment on this that sort of stuck with me. They said, ''the stone is for you, the setting is for her.''
If you know her style, you should be able to pick out a kind of stone she would like. From a symbolic standpoint, the stone is the important part of the e-ring anyways, while from a visual standpoint, the band can take just about any stone and make it reflect her style and tastes. Pour yourself into finding just the perfect stone, and be 100% sure of your purchase of that portion. Then, just get it simply set in like a tiffany setting or something like that.
After the proposal, you two can shop together for the actual setting as she wants it. She is, after all, going to be wearing it every day, so the way your perfect stone actually looks on her finger should be up to her to have some say over.

To me, that''s the ''have your cake and eat it too'' approach. for a mere $300 extra, I get to have the 100% surprise factor of her not knowing it''s coming, and she gets to have the exact setting she wants. I don''t feel like I was left out of the selection process because after all, I did select the stone completely on my own, and I know she will love it once it''s set, cause she''s going to pick out the setting.
Just my .02 feel free to disregard.
 

Miranda

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Messages
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Date: 7/24/2007 7:09:54 PM
Author: DiamondDumbie
No, I have not talked to her about the size, style, shape, etc. This ring is a surprise. However, we are already talking about sneaking off for a destination wedding (tropical of course), so she realizes a ring is part of the plan. I do have a great idea what style she likes. Besides, if I asked her what she wants, then this would be too easy.

P.S. How do you set the line spacing to single within a PS thread? I typed this in Word, copied and pasted it into my thread. The double spacing is perplexing and annoying. Sorry about that.
A surprise?!?! How fun! I have to ask, though, does she like surprises
28.gif
???? I noticed in another post that you refered to LA. If you are there (or near there) 2 cts. will not be too large. A good friend of mine from LA was just engaged with a three stone consisting of a 3 ct. radiant and two 1 carat side stones. I''m in OC most folks around me have been married for a little while and are starting families. Their erings range consistently from 1.5 to 2 cts. Of course there is the occasional 5 cts. or .5 cts. Good luck with your search.
 

DiamondDumbie

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Date: 7/24/2007 8:40:14 PM
Author: decodelighted
Have you seen the rectangular Tiffany Lucida, Diamonddumbie?

I have not looked at the Tiffany Lucida. It is incredible. However, based on the number of available fancy cuts, branded cuts and standard shape cuts, I could be looking forever and may never figure out what to select. Too many options for my brain! I am too analytical and anal. I would spend 1,000s of hours trying to learn everything there is to know about every single diamond before making my selection. My girlfriend may not wait another five-ten years for me to complete this massive task.
 

DiamondDumbie

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Date: 7/24/2007 8:44:27 PM
Author: FacetFire
And a more elongated version...yum!
This is what I have in mind...
 

DiamondDumbie

Rough_Rock
Joined
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Date: 7/24/2007 9:40:32 PM
Author: shlo_mo_shun
I really think going off of what friends and social circle is getting is a pretty good idea. If I were getting married in 8-10 more years and living in SoCal, yeah, 1.5-2 would be what I would look for. Location and age seem to be the two overriding factors, and there is a large variance depending on either of those. You would fall into the ''larger'' size on both age and location, so i''d say 2c falls nicely into the upper range of ''right'' for your type of person. And falling into the upper range is a nice place to be.


As for the diamond and the setting. I used to be firmly in the ''guy should pick it out and present it whole'' camp, but have flipped opinions through talks with my girlfriend and my own search.
One retailer made an interesting comment on this that sort of stuck with me. They said, ''the stone is for you, the setting is for her.''
If you know her style, you should be able to pick out a kind of stone she would like. From a symbolic standpoint, the stone is the important part of the e-ring anyways, while from a visual standpoint, the band can take just about any stone and make it reflect her style and tastes. Pour yourself into finding just the perfect stone, and be 100% sure of your purchase of that portion. Then, just get it simply set in like a tiffany setting or something like that.
After the proposal, you two can shop together for the actual setting as she wants it. She is, after all, going to be wearing it every day, so the way your perfect stone actually looks on her finger should be up to her to have some say over.

To me, that''s the ''have your cake and eat it too'' approach. for a mere $300 extra, I get to have the 100% surprise factor of her not knowing it''s coming, and she gets to have the exact setting she wants. I don''t feel like I was left out of the selection process because after all, I did select the stone completely on my own, and I know she will love it once it''s set, cause she''s going to pick out the setting.
Just my .02 feel free to disregard.

Well said! And great advice. Thank you!!
 
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