2.01ct SI2 with knot

[Kellyvenm]

hi all,
I’ve heard varying opinions and now am completely confused about the dangers, if any, of a knot. I’m looking at a 2.01 ct SI2 with a knot. It has a GIA report (2201023287). I don’t want to make the wrong decision and regret later.
Thanks in advance.
Kelly

 

[lovedogs]

From what I understand, knots are an issue, especially in lower clarity stones. I probably wouldn't risk it. @Karl_K you've written about the potential issues with knots before. Am I right in thinking they are more problematic / risky in an SI2 vs something higher (VS2+)?

 

[jp201845]

From what I understand, knots are an issue, especially in lower clarity stones. I probably wouldn't risk it. @Karl_K you've written about the potential issues with knots before. Am I right in thinking they are more problematic / risky in an SI2 vs something higher (VS2+)?

Usually knots that are the first inclusion listed on the plot you definitely stay away from but this particular diamond has a knot listed as the 3rd inclusion. As Lovedogs indicated @ Karl is the expert in this area. My opinion after looking at the GIA report all the proportions look promising so this stone needs further review. Request an Idealscope and Aset images for further evaluation but Karl is the one that knows best how to proceed on this one.

 

[Karl_K]

The knot is on the crown and is in the middle of the grade setting si2 feather.
That is a big no for me because it makes me cringe.

 

[Todd Gray]

Here's how the GIA defines a knot:


KNOT: A white or transparent diamond crystal that extends to the surface after fashioning.

 

[Kellyvenm]

The knot is on the crown and is in the middle of the grade setting si2 feather.
That is a big no for me because it makes me cringe.

Thanks Karl. Greatly appreciate your advice.

 

[Rockdiamond]

There are a few ways to look at knots.
"Mind Clean"- which is an issue for many internet shoppers- and it's not anyone's place to tell someone they are wrong for being concerned with something based on perceptions.
With a gazillion diamonds available online, the virtual lists can give so many options that it makes sense to avoid a stone for any reason at all.

But if we're speaking of reality-based assessment- there's absolutely no reason to eliminate a diamond based on the presence of a knot, for that reason solely. And although there are seemingly countless diamonds, on these lists- in reality, some stones are more special, and rare- SI2 diamonds are a good example.
When I purchase diamonds for DW, knowing her taste for size, and budget, SI2's are generally my go to.
If one is shopping SI2 diamonds, you may have to put up with things which a mind clean buyer will avoid.
The internet has so much useful information- but separating "mind clean" from reality based is something I think can be easily overlooked.

In the case of knots- and keeping in mind how many things are discussed online- can anyone point to a GIA graded SI2 or better knot that caused a durability issue..... ever?
I've never seen a diamond face an issue based on one.
And I've seen quite a few chipped and broken diamonds over the years.

 

[Karl_K]

GIA graded SI2 or better knot that caused a durability issue..... ever?

I have seen 2 in person which is why I changed my opinion from caution to no.

 

[Rockdiamond]

Interesting Karl- do you have specifics? Were both stone graded by GIA? Shape, size?
Did the knots just "pop out"?

 

[Karl_K]

Interesting Karl- do you have specifics? Were both stone graded by GIA? Shape, size?
Did the knots just "pop out"?

I dont recall all the details, all I was really interested in was the hole left by the knots not being there and how they were filled with crud.
They were gia graded si or higher one was a RB .5ct maybe .6tct an EC around 1ct as best I can recall.
Both were insurance salvage.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Knot and cavity are the two words that I don't wanna see on the lab report.

 

[Rockdiamond]

Karl- all due respect but maybe your memory is cloudy- how long ago was this? Without more info and you having seen the diamonds before and after it’s just not reliable info. I honestly believe that it’s creating doubt for consumers unnecessarily. Remember, a polished diamond undergoes far more stress on the polish wheel than a consumer can introduce. As as said, if someone wants to avoid any stone for any reason, that’s their prerogative. But as representatives of the trade we really need to choose our warnings carefully IMO.

 

[Karl_K]

David I find your reply very insulting.
You can disagree with my opinion all you want but to question my right to have that opinion is out of line.

 

[kmoro]

It is good to hear differing views, as far as I’m concerned. I would avoid a knot if it was me ... I’m not sure when I formed this opinion ... it may have been based on something @Karl_K said ... the thing is ... why get a diamond with a knot if you don’t have to? Sure the pressure of the wheel is a good point, but even the fact that diamonds can get chipped (something we all agree on) shows that there are events that can be catastrophic to the diamond after the wheel. I also avoid feathers on the girdle. Maybe this means rejecting some diamonds unnecessarily, but it’s my money and I’d just rather not spend it on a diamond with a knot ... also not shy about sharing that opinion with others ... ultimately, someone else’s purchase is not my responsibility, but if they ask for opinions, I think it’s best that all sides are provided ... so I am glad that @Rockdiamond added an opinion that I haven’t heard yet, and I also would hate for @Karl_K to stop posting his opinions. Please keep those opinions coming!

 

[Rockdiamond]

IMO -and by forum rules- trade members need to be extremely careful before knocking a stone. As I have repeatedly said- anyone can avoid any diamond for any reason they want. But trade members need to follow stricter parameters. I regret that my reply insulted Karl- whom I consider a friend. But almost 50 years as a grader and trader bring me to my conclusions.
Just because I’ve never seen a knot “pop out” in all these years doesn’t mean it can’t happen- but I’ve never even heard or read of an occurrence. I’d need far more evidence and details to change my opinion on this.

 

[Kellyvenm]

Thank you everyone for your valued opinions and feedback. It does sound like it's a rather complex issue and there are varying opinions and thoughts on the matter... even though it doesn't necessarily make it feel any more certain about the decision! Best to avoid I think... again thanks everyone for taking the time to flesh out the issues.... and here I thinking that picking a diamond would be a piece of cake.. apparently knot!

 

[WinkHPD]

apparently knot!

Thank you for the morning laugh. And thank you to other posters for providing clarity with your opinions (rim shot).

One interesting thing about knots in the crown, especially on the table, it’s possible their edges can be seen in certain lighting. I mentioned this in a thread about a VS1 knot here.

https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/worried-about-knot-in-diamond.248440/#post-4541883

Wink