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My 1st Time: Old European Diamond Advice!

elizat

Ideal_Rock
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Mar 23, 2013
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Can you ask what she would prefer? To me, I'd want the nicer diamond every day of the week. I can't really see or get a feel for the faceting of the RC stone.

I also would not want to have only one option, but that's me. What happens if the RC stone comes back certified less than they estimate for grading? Are they willing to let you return it or get a price adjustment? I think over 10k is a lot without a certificate. I don't think I'd be comfortable.

I like the stone from Adam. It looks lively. He has a good eye. I'd ask about the color. Have him do a video in various lighting options.
 

Matilda

Shiny_Rock
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Oct 30, 2018
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467
No, I would not buy the RC diamond. Your future fiancé wanting that setting is not enough, in my opinion to take such a risk. It is uncertified and as @elizat mentioned a complicated situation once it gets graded. I also agree it is overpriced considering the lack of report, by ANY lab.

For $2900 you could get a similar custom made setting. Also it is likely she likes other settings, but perhaps only saw this. Settings are easy to change and less costly to do so. So even a temporary one may be worth it to allow her to design her own.

A potentially less great diamond is more of a big deal than a setting than can be adapted.


I really hope I am not coming across as rude, I am suddenly quite opinionated about this. I apologise if I offended you by my directness.
 

rockysalamander

Ideal_Rock
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Stick with Adam at OWD for the diamond. A lot of PS member know and trust him and his eyes. The RC shank is too thin for daily wear...there is simply not enough gold in a 1.4-1.6 mm shank to avoid wearing through or torquing.
 

lovedogs

Super_Ideal_Rock
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18,016
I 100% wouldn't go with the RC stone and setting. The setting is too delicate to be safe, and they are overcharging. Stick with Adam for sure.
 

Matilda

Shiny_Rock
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Oct 30, 2018
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467

Khall0204

Rough_Rock
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Jan 16, 2019
Messages
34
No, I would not buy the RC diamond. Your future fiancé wanting that setting is not enough, in my opinion to take such a risk. It is uncertified and as @elizat mentioned a complicated situation once it gets graded. I also agree it is overpriced considering the lack of report, by ANY lab.

For $2900 you could get a similar custom made setting. Also it is likely she likes other settings, but perhaps only saw this. Settings are easy to change and less costly to do so. So even a temporary one may be worth it to allow her to design her own.

A potentially less great diamond is more of a big deal than a setting than can be adapted.


I really hope I am not coming across as rude, I am suddenly quite opinionated about this. I apologise if I offended you by my directness.

You are not coming across as rude at all - seriously, I appreciate you taking interest in this situation. I didn't feel right taking the RC deal, and I feel that you all share my same thoughts. Here is another stone Adam has sent me. Seems like a great price for the size and color. All in all, I'd love your opinions on these two stones:

Option 1:
$9,800 - 2.19 L/SI2 GIA.
According to Adam: "It’s a very nice SI2. The inclusions are deep in the stone and look much “worse” in the videos."
Video: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1kgRTpmiOXUoMu52gdo_UuyRfKFozn4B8

Option 2:
$8,424. - 2.08 CT N/VS1.
Video of it - https://drive.google.com/open?id=1m0qwwZ16ondpK-en_Fy8YI9atfxnallk.
 

Khall0204

Rough_Rock
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Jan 16, 2019
Messages
34
@rockysalamander I hadn't noticed that the shank was so thin!

So a few other setting ideas:

https://www.instagram.com/p/Bi7Zrd7jHjx/. Perhaps his designer could change the top part of the shoulders to have a little diamond on either side like the RC. I realise it is different, just hopefully an inspiration idea.

http://www.loveaffairdiamonds.com/solitaires/. quite a few other photos of settings that could work.

Does your fiancé have Pinterest? Maybe you could look at settings together?

Oh wow, I absolutely love that OWD setting...
 

leukolenos

Brilliant_Rock
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Mar 27, 2016
Messages
825
You are not coming across as rude at all - seriously, I appreciate you taking interest in this situation. I didn't feel right taking the RC deal, and I feel that you all share my same thoughts. Here is another stone Adam has sent me. Seems like a great price for the size and color. All in all, I'd love your opinions on these two stones:

Option 1:
$9,800 - 2.19 L/SI2 GIA.
According to Adam: "It’s a very nice SI2. The inclusions are deep in the stone and look much “worse” in the videos."
Video: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1kgRTpmiOXUoMu52gdo_UuyRfKFozn4B8

Option 2:
$8,424. - 2.08 CT N/VS1.
Video of it - https://drive.google.com/open?id=1m0qwwZ16ondpK-en_Fy8YI9atfxnallk.

I would ask to see them next to each other on video. They are both nice but I'm having a hard time focusing since they're taken at slightly different distances.


edited to add...I think I like the N. BUT...I still would want to see them right next to each other, in profile, etc. And rotating not just back and forth.
 
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Matilda

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Oct 30, 2018
Messages
467
I really like the 2.01 ct N stone. It has life and seems to throw off a few more flashes than the 2.19ct. It also seems "whiter" to me than the L stone. I would ask Adam which one he believes is less tinted as he has potentially constant access to it.
Perhaps if Adam could take a few videos of the stone also in an outside setting as well as a dim lighting situation, that could help see the diamonds' performances.

Also these may be worth a look:

https://ivyandrose.com/t/all-jewelry/all-rings/engagement-ring-settings

they also do custom design. Even without sing them just browsing through settings gives ideas for me at least!

also these rings are already to be sold but the first ring has a nice setting:

http://oldworlddiamonds.com/jewelry.php?sort=weight&maxpage=0&section=1&category=1
 
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foxinsox

Ideal_Rock
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Jul 18, 2015
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4,061
David Klass has replicated that vintage setting that RC are claiming is their patent pending for someone else here already. It’s genuinely not unique to them. The PSer who had it made kindly posted a screenshot of the CADs which I’m posting here if you want to adapt them.
8642CE4A-FC2A-40C4-A536-96FF52477D35.jpeg
 

Bonfire

Ideal_Rock
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Feb 22, 2014
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4,232
As you are probably aware by now, you are in extremely good hands working with Adam at OWD. He’s a man of great patience, he has an extensive inventory and is competitively priced. I’m glad you are leaning away from RC for several reasons. I agree with the other posters that recommend more video comparisons, various lighting conditions etc.
It’s great that you are looking at stones over the 2ct mark, I mean come on who doesn’t want a larger stone?! But, you need to see some OECS IRL with your own eyes to judge your and your partner’s color tolerance and how old cuts perform.
I also think it would be wise to open the discussion with your partner. She should to be involved in some of these choices. (Bigger stone- lower color or smaller stone-higher color for example). These are important decisions, after all this is a ring she will look at 100 times a day! (And that’s being conservative!). You get my point. We’re here to help anyway we can! Good luck, you’re doing everything right so far!;)2
 

leukolenos

Brilliant_Rock
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Mar 27, 2016
Messages
825
I'm going to agree with both of you, and say that based on the videos I have, the N looks a bit more "white," and is leading the charge. Here's a closer video of the L that really shows off the inclusions.
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1zKOagTFDdPdajexOPysMJ0ozty_en-32

Thanks for posting that. Yes I agree... I don't prefer the L color enough to tolerate those inclusions (to my eyes and preferences). Adam is probably right that they are less bad in normal viewing, but I think for an engagement stone you may not want that. It would bother me.
I think the N is chunky and delightful.

@foxinsox very helpful! Personally I don't see how it's possible to put a patent on an antique design which was not designed by or unique to RC. I guess "patent pending" doesn't mean patent granted though. I'm sure David would do a great job on that setting.
 

elizat

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Mar 23, 2013
Messages
3,999
I like the n between the two you are looking at with adam.
 

rockysalamander

Ideal_Rock
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May 20, 2016
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5,105
Thanks for posting that. Yes I agree... I don't prefer the L color enough to tolerate those inclusions (to my eyes and preferences). Adam is probably right that they are less bad in normal viewing, but I think for an engagement stone you may not want that. It would bother me.
I think the N is chunky and delightful.

@foxinsox Personally I don't see how it's possible to put a patent on an antique design which was not designed by or unique to RC. I guess "patent pending" doesn't mean patent granted though. I'm sure David would do a great job on that setting.

I see no design patent requested or issued for Nicole Wegman or Ring Concierge in the US PTO database. Unless it was requested under a pseudonym or other name (which is certainly possible). Given that images of her design have been published for over a year, it would be unlikely to get design patent granted now if she were to apply tomorrow. Copyright is granted upon the creation of a unique work. She could make a copyright claim if the piece is sufficiently creative and artistic and not the utilitarian aspects of jewelry design. She has not registered copyright since 1978 either. You don't have to register a design to make a legal claim of infringement, but it helps greatly in the courts. Given its vintage origins, it might be a hard fight to say any other maker infringed...but, I'm not an attorney.
 

rockysalamander

Ideal_Rock
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5,105
:love:Here's how the DK version looked when it was done. I think the member made a few modifications from the RC design, including to use a single diamond in the shoulder and make the shank wider at 1.8 mm.
upload_2019-1-22_20-24-53.png
 

leukolenos

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
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Mar 27, 2016
Messages
825
:love:Here's how the DK version looked when it was done. I think the member made a few modifications from the RC design, including to use a single diamond in the shoulder and make the shank wider at 1.8 mm.
upload_2019-1-22_20-24-53.png

Really lovely!
 

Niffler

Rough_Rock
Joined
Dec 17, 2018
Messages
32
Here is a video of it: https://drive.google.com/open?id=0Bw2U048_tIpWVlBJdlFWN2NHQlhramRJcEE5UGNjWEI1M0U4

For the stone, I feel that the price may be a bit high based on some of the OWD options I've seen. However, my SO is so in love with this setting, that I'm wondering if I should proceed as I know that's what she wants? I asked about potentially sending RC a stone and having it set, and they informed me that they do not set customer supplied stones...

Just popping in to ask if this is a new policy of theirs? I hope they are not just saying so to make a sale. I've seen several of their signature antique settings be made for customer supplied stones, some with non-diamonds as well.

https://www.instagram.com/p/BosIR_Zjvjz/

^This is a RC setting posted on the OWD instagram page with one of Adam's diamonds just last October.

Anyway, I am no expert but, just from my time reading about diamonds on this forum, I would trust Adam's stones over RC any day. I've seen RC post diamonds on their instagram page with really questionable cut quality :/
 

leukolenos

Brilliant_Rock
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Just popping in to ask if this is a new policy of theirs? I hope they are not just saying so to make a sale. I've seen several of their signature antique settings be made for customer supplied stones, some with non-diamonds as well.

https://www.instagram.com/p/BosIR_Zjvjz/

^This is a RC setting posted on the OWD instagram page with one of Adam's diamonds just last October.

Anyway, I am no expert but, just from my time reading about diamonds on this forum, I would trust Adam's stones over RC any day. I've seen RC post diamonds on their instagram page with really questionable cut quality :/

I agree, I’ve seen some really yuck looking stones posted on their page!

Honestly I don’t know- I know they set that one recently and I’ve had a friend inquire about having them set a stone, which they agreed to at the time (within the last year).

Bigger issues to me are:
-the setting is still too thin/delicate
-exceptionally expensive
-spotty/lackluster customer service
 

Khall0204

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 16, 2019
Messages
34
I just replied to my RC contact, and shared the OWD social post with them, and here is the response I received:

“In the past we have set client provided stones when they are heirlooms and handed down however, due to volume, we are not setting any provided stones at this time.”

I think that determines who I’ll be going with for my stone selection and setting.
 

rockysalamander

Ideal_Rock
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Messages
5,105
I just replied to my RC contact, and shared the OWD social post with them, and here is the response I received:

“In the past we have set client provided stones when they are heirlooms and handed down however, due to volume, we are not setting any provided stones at this time.”

I think that determines who I’ll be going with for my stone selection and setting.
Good choice. I'd reach out to Davib Klass in LA to get a setting quote also.
 

Niffler

Rough_Rock
Joined
Dec 17, 2018
Messages
32
I just replied to my RC contact, and shared the OWD social post with them, and here is the response I received:

“In the past we have set client provided stones when they are heirlooms and handed down however, due to volume, we are not setting any provided stones at this time.”

I think that determines who I’ll be going with for my stone selection and setting.

On a different forum, there are at least two RC Signature Antique settings with moissanite stones and one with a lab grown diamond all within the last year and those stones were not sourced by RC themselves. I just double checked to make sure I wasn't remembering incorrectly. So, they are still not being fully transparent about past policies on setting customer supplied stones as it was not just an exception they made for heirlooms. It makes me feel like they accept stones from customers if they know from the start that they won't be able to sell you one themselves.

I also think you are making a good choice by moving away from RC. I think you'll be much happier working with more trustworthy vendors. Better diamonds, better prices, better setting quality!
 

foxinsox

Ideal_Rock
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Jul 18, 2015
Messages
4,061
:love:Here's how the DK version looked when it was done. I think the member made a few modifications from the RC design, including to use a single diamond in the shoulder and make the shank wider at 1.8 mm.
upload_2019-1-22_20-24-53.png
Ooh that turned out so nicely :love:
 

lovedogs

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jul 31, 2014
Messages
18,016
On a different forum, there are at least two RC Signature Antique settings with moissanite stones and one with a lab grown diamond all within the last year and those stones were not sourced by RC themselves. I just double checked to make sure I wasn't remembering incorrectly. So, they are still not being fully transparent about past policies on setting customer supplied stones as it was not just an exception they made for heirlooms. It makes me feel like they accept stones from customers if they know from the start that they won't be able to sell you one themselves.

I also think you are making a good choice by moving away from RC. I think you'll be much happier working with more trustworthy vendors. Better diamonds, better prices, better setting quality!

That kind of transparency/honesty issue is *exactly* why I would stay away from them. I feel like they just aren't being honest for the sake of making a sale.
 

Khall0204

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 16, 2019
Messages
34
Okay, PC team. I need some feedback based on the to OWD stones I mentioned above. Here are a few companions shots and videos showcasing the differences between the N and the L.

Solo Videos:
$8,000: 2.08 N/VS1 - https://drive.google.com/open?id=1m0qwwZ16ondpK-en_Fy8YI9atfxnallk.
$9,800: 2.19 L/SI2: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1zKOagTFDdPdajexOPysMJ0ozty_en-32

Comparison Pictures / Videos - N on the left, L on the right.
IMG_4715.jpeg IMG_4714.jpeg

Screen Shot 2019-01-23 at 1.38.20 PM.png

Lighting Condition 1: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1j8QJNZic8MqjVy_u0TNDWTx43SC8qHGv
Lighting Condition 2: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1PXT4qhRKecSOv7chHk3M6cIkULvDpVKP

The associate I'm working was having trouble showing the stones in an outside environment as they're on the 18th floor, so this is what I'm working with now. For the price, I think I'm going to try the N. The great thing about Adam is that I have 10 days to look over the stone and then I can send it back for a refund or to have it set.
 

elliefire99

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Oct 12, 2018
Messages
584
Hmmm... As others have mentioned, a rotating video would be much easier to compare BUT based on these, I definitely prefer the N. The L looks a little dead in the center to me (though it could just be the filming angle). And almost $2000 dollars less is nothing to sneeze at.
 

Khall0204

Rough_Rock
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Jan 16, 2019
Messages
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Hmmm... As others have mentioned, a rotating video would be much easier to compare BUT based on these, I definitely prefer the N. The L looks a little dead in the center to me (though it could just be the filming angle). And almost $2000 dollars less is nothing to sneeze at.

Yea, I may ping him again and ask for more shots, but it seemed like this was the best he could do. I'm also envisioning the stone in a setting similar to this (which is from CVB), in yellow gold.

FullSizeRender.jpeg

Im not sure how the stone color will be effected by the setting, but I love the antique vibe it puts off. RC was my SOs favorite setting but then she saw the OWD IG post Maltida posted above and made a comment about how gorgeous it was.

I feel like this setting almost blends the RC and the OWD setting, and creates something unique and beautiful. I'm just trying to find more angles of it.
 

Bonfire

Ideal_Rock
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4,232
That will make a simply stunning ring! Wow! :love: Looking forward to hearing your thoughts when you receive the N colored stone.
 

Khall0204

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 16, 2019
Messages
34
That will make a simply stunning ring! Wow! :love: Looking forward to hearing your thoughts when you receive the N colored stone.

I haven't made the purchase yet, as I would love any and all additional feedback, but right now I think it's a strong contender to at least take a look at.
 
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