shape
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Help with 4 Ct diamond selection

sunlvr

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 24, 2013
Messages
23
Hello Experts-

I have narrowed down my search for a 15 year anniversary ring in the 4ct range to the following options.



I have specific questions on each of the options listed above that I would appreciate some feedback from the community, specifically the types of inclusions, and the cut of each.
Stone 1:
I have included a photo of the Diamond and the Twinning Wisps from the GIA report. The diamond is an SI2, but other than the twinning wisps that appear, the stone is extremely clean with no inclusions in the table. It is eye clean.
• The diamond is a 2.7 on the HCA scale, but 3X by GIA, any thoughts on the cut or concerns?
• AGA says it is a 1B, with Everything being a 1A except for crown angle at a 2A
• Any concerns with twinning wisps in general?
• Price/ct feels a bit high to me but it a local jewelers that owns the stone here in Boston (jewelers building)
o About 6.9% off of rap price of $11,600/ct for J-SI2 >4ct
• Any opinions on fluorescence with J color?






Stone 2:
I have included a photo of the GIA report clarity, again Twinning Wisps. The cavity on the girdle is also concerning to me. I have not seen this stone in person.
• The diamond rates as a 0.7 on the HCA scale
o Graded as a 3X GIA.
• AGA says it is a 1B,

• Any concerns with twinning wisps position on this stone? Or the cavity?

• Price/ct a bit better on the stone at 12% off of rap.
• Slightly better spread than stone one with a lighter weight (bonus)



Stone 3:
This stone is a bit smaller than the others, but overall it is a very nice cut and slightly better clarity rated, but has some inclusions in the table as shown form picture below. The stone is eye clean. See 40x photo.
• The diamond rates as a 0.7 on the HCA scale,
o Graded as a 3X on GIA cut.
o Any concerns with HCA numbers below 1?
• Spread is smaller than the other stones. Thoughts on a stone that is 9.9mm versus stones that are 10.4?
o I know it will show, but should a better cut diamond prevail?
• Lower costs than the others due to smaller than 4ct



Stone 4:
This stone is largest of the 4 stones at 4.4ct. Nice cut, 3X by GIA. But it has strong Blue fluorescence. Overall it is a very nice cut and slightly better clarity rated as an SI1, but has some inclusions in the table as shown from picture below.
• The diamond rates as a 1.9 on the HCA scale,
o Graded as a 3X on GIA cut.
• Stone is a 1B on cut from AGA with concerns around depth of the pavilion

• Clarity is rated as a SI1, but there are crystals in the table, but otherwise the report looks clean
o I have not seen the stone so perhaps the crystals are dark?
• Price/CT looks to be about 16% off of rap. What would be the reason for the discount? Strong Blue fluorescence? Depth?




So I appreciate any and all comments.

table.png

fh_2.jpg

clarity422.png

jsi13.png
 

sunlvr

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 24, 2013
Messages
23
Other Photos

Stone 4 Clarity:



Stone 1 Actual Photos:



Stone #3

4sij.png

photo_204.jpg

photo_205.jpg

1344835_round_excellent_cut_j_si1.jpg
 

ariel144

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 21, 2006
Messages
2,087
I'm not an expert on MRB's but when just looking at the numbers I like #3 and #4. Would like to see their ASETS and Idealscopes before spending all that money though. I also think the VSB Fl. would be a bonus as long as it doesn't affect the clarity.

I'm sure the MRB experts will weigh in on these stones.
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 11, 2006
Messages
58,547
As far as the specs go, I like #4. But a lot depends on the inclusions and whether the stone is completely eyeclean. The other factor is strong blue fluorescence which could be a very good thing as long as there is no haziness in the stone from the fluorescence. Some believe that is partly due to a combination of poor clarity and very strong fluoro, but I don't believe that an SI1 will be a problem. Still, that is something that will have to be assessed.

Can you get idealscope images of these stones? Who is the vendor?
 

04diamond<3

Ideal_Rock
Joined
May 31, 2007
Messages
3,672
diamondseeker2006|1361848583|3390536 said:
As far as the specs go, I like #4. But a lot depends on the inclusions and whether the stone is completely eyeclean. The other factor is strong blue fluorescence which could be a very good thing as long as there is no haziness in the stone from the fluorescence. Some believe that is partly due to a combination of poor clarity and very strong fluoro, but I don't believe that an SI1 will be a problem. Still, that is something that will have to be assessed.

Can you get idealscope images of these stones? Who is the vendor?

+1. We need an idealscope image. You don't need an aset for rounds, we really just need to see the idealscope. I also like #4
 

sunlvr

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 24, 2013
Messages
23
Hello-

The supplier does not have ideal scope image of stone #4 but was able to supply me with a 500x magnified view.

4ct500x_image.jpg
 

sunlvr

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 24, 2013
Messages
23
Here is the hearts and arrows of the 3.66 stone.
Any thoughts?

1366981__3.png

1366981__0.png

_109.png

h_amp_a.png
 

ariel144

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 21, 2006
Messages
2,087
Well, if the stone was going on my finger I would want the larger one with VSB fl. The faceting looks lovely from the pic, but is that "graining"? Can they send it to an appraiser that can do the idealscope on it? What did they say about the VSBF??? Does it have a milky or oily appearance which can be caused by strong fl. or graining?
 

sunlvr

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 24, 2013
Messages
23
Hello-

The 4.42 ct was described as:

"Wow" and amazing and I can not explain the amount of brilliance and fire the stone has."
said the STBF is enhancing the color.


Why is the strong blue fluorescence intreguing? The GIA report does say "internal graining not shown". Is that a negative?

Thank you for your help.

Here are a few more photos:

315707__5_.jpg

315707__3_.jpg
 

tarung81

Rough_Rock
Trade
Joined
Feb 28, 2013
Messages
9
For lower colors like H-I-J colors the fluorescence can actually help making the face up look a lot whiter... I have seen this a lot in my experience... A good explanation is provided in another forum DiamondReview and link is provided below: http://www.diamondreview.com/forum/topic/2021-fluorescence-good-bad-or-ugly/ ... In this explanation, you will also find the GIA study regarding fluorescence which found "diamonds that were described as strong FL or very strong FL were, on average, reported to have a better color appearance than less FL stones"

The only thing you have to worry about for Very Strong Fluorescence is if the stone doesn't look milky or cloudy... From the pictures you sent, I would guess this won't be a case! However the best judgement again should be given by your "reliable supplier" who is actually seeing the stone in person and in natural light. Camera's can change the color the stone sometimes...I know this from experience of taking pictures myself even in natural daylight lighting!

One thing I noticed with stone #4, 500x image is "whitish internal graining" running across the table of stone... Again, because its 500x, I am not sure if is such a big thing... However, I will factor this as a negative and could be another reason for larger discount.
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 11, 2006
Messages
58,547
The magnified image of #4 shows that it is a nicely cut stone, but I believe I'd have to have an independent appraiser evaluate it to be certain the VSBF and internal graining don't have negative effects on the diamond. Do you have a long enough return period to have it sent to an independent appraiser?
 

04diamond<3

Ideal_Rock
Joined
May 31, 2007
Messages
3,672
It looks good...The idealscope could have been taken better, but the cut looks great. I'd still be interested in seeing an idealscope of the 4ct.
 

ariel144

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 21, 2006
Messages
2,087
About your question J color and VSBF...most long time PSrs prefer med., strong or very strong blue fl. because in some lighting it gives the stone a blue color and more personality..not to mention making a lower colored stone face up more white. As you probably know, natural blue diamonds are some of the most rare and expensive colored diamonds you can buy.

Here is a lovely example of strong blue or med. blue fl. in a GIA I colored (EGL USA H color) OEC ...it is one of my favorite stones ever...hubba hubba is right. :naughty: Watch the videos on page 2.

http://jewelsbyericagrace.smugmug.com/Jewelry/Rings-Antique-Vintage/356ct-Loose-Old-European-Cut/19804036_Qxwpx5#!i=1556541783&k=jngbGmt

J color is still in the colorless range and probably the best deal in a diamond that will likely not show color face up.

The VSBF will lower the cost of the stone. Since that 4.42 c. stone is getting raving reviews from the vendor, I doubt seriously if the graining and VSBF are having any negative effect.

Here is a J 5c honker antique cushion with no fl. and it is lovely:

[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/leon-mege-antique-cushion.140739/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/leon-mege-antique-cushion.140739/[/URL]
pg 3 she states:

"So at the end of the day and after months of searching we decided to go ahead with Leon''s stone and I just love it. The J doesn''t bother me at all and mostly it looks icy white and I only notice a tiny bit of warmth very occasionally from certain angles (my e-ring is an E and there is a very slight difference but really not very much)." -
See more at: [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/leon-mege-antique-cushion.140739/page-3#sthash.UzllYiH7.dpuf']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/leon-mege-antique-cushion.140739/page-3#sthash.UzllYiH7.dpuf[/URL]

hope this helps!
 

lucybeixie

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 31, 2010
Messages
24
Im also looking for a 4ct .. does anyone know who is the vendor?
thanks
 

derbygal

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Oct 15, 2010
Messages
2,182
That 4.42 looks amazing on the hand!
 
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