1.5 VS1 versus 1.3 vvs1

[david james]

Hi all,
I cant decide two diamonds for engagement and would really appreciate some help from the experts here!
Both are round brilliant, one is a 1.5 D VS1, triple EX stone the other is a 1.32 D VVS1 triple EX stone. They priced similarly and I am thinking of getting one of these two. The 1.5 one is deeper so the diameter is only slightly bigger (7.3mm vs 7.05mm).

The 1.5 D stone seem to carry a number of inclusions for a VS1 stone (seem the attached image).

The geometry is 62.6%D, 58%T, 35.5 and 40.8 for the 1.5 while the 1.3 one is 61.6%D 58T 35.5 and 40.6. In terms of cut both are GIA triple EX. HCA however think the 1.3 stone to be excellent (1.7) while the 1.5 stone is a very good (2.7).
Any opinions welcome.
Thank you very much in advance!
David

 

[OoohShiny]

Do you have pictures of the actual stones or a link to the listings?

 

[david james]

They do not have the image of the actual diamond unfortunately. The dealer offers return service but wont be able to have two stones next to each other for me to compare

 

[tyty333]

What are the cost? Why do you have to settle between these two? The 1.3 looks like its a good choice but I'd want an idealscope or aset image on the
1.5. The inclusions in the 1.5 would not bother me (should be completely eye-clean).

 

[david james]

What are the cost? Why do you have to settle between these two? The 1.3 looks like its a good choice but I'd want an idealscope or aset image on the
1.5. The inclusions in the 1.5 would not bother me (should be completely eye-clean).

Thank you
Price-wise they are around 16K $. The 1.3 stone is a several hundred cheaper. I was quote a few and narrowed down to these two. Both stone are said to have H&A pattern but I dont know where to find idealscope or aset image....?

 

[defy525]

I think you should get adequate information before purchasing a diamond.
Ask the deal for photos, idealscope, aset, hearts and arrows images
If he cannot provide those images, there are still many online vendors to choose from

 

[valeria101]

The HCA makes the only bit of difference that matters to me.

 

[david james]

I think you should get adequate information before purchasing a diamond.
Ask the deal for photos, idealscope, aset, hearts and arrows images
If he cannot provide those images, there are still many online vendors to choose from

I dont live in US so the choice is limited... I can ask them for idealscope and aset images tho. I have a feeling my dealer source the stones form manufacturers and do not have the actual stone hence cant provide those extra information

 

[valeria101]

PS.

No need to comment on a VS1 or VVS inclusions plot !

____
Otherwise - should you be tempted by a VS2 or SI1 ...

- a higher number of inclusions on any means that each is smaller, therefore, likely less conspicuous. In some cases, a single larger object may be very subtle indeed (e.g. a feather off the table, sitting edge-up; I do like twinning whisps too - especially if not marked by other characteristics, etc.). Disclaimer: I do like these things in their own right ...

Just a thought. I would be looking for an E/SI1 H&A. Should there be an E/VS2 H&A around, I wouldn't even be looking - there is nothing left to the imagination by such grades ! [where by H&A I mean the old school breed, for whom HCA is dully asumed]

 

[defy525]

I dont live in US so the choice is limited...

I am not from US too. But most of the vendors ship the diamond for free. Do you have other concern like VAT or other kind of tax?

 

[david james]

PS.

No need to comment on a VS1 or VVS inclusions plot !

____
Otherwise - should you be tempted by a VS2 or SI1 ...

- a higher number of inclusions on any means that each is smaller, therefore, likely less conspicuous. In some cases, a single larger object may be very subtle indeed (e.g. a feather off the table, sitting edge-up; I do like twinning whisps too - especially if not marked by other characteristics, etc.). Disclaimer: I do like these things in their own right ...

Just a thought. I would be looking for an E/SI1 H&A. Should there be an E/VS2 H&A around, I wouldn't even be looking - there is nothing left to the imagination by such grades ! [where by H&A I mean the old school breed, for whom HCA is dully asumed]

Thank you for the comment . I wonder how much this HCA score (excellent vs. very good) make in terms of visual appearance...

 

[msop04]

I am not from US too. But most of the vendors ship the diamond for free. Do you have other concern like VAT or other kind of tax?

What is your budget for the diamond alone, and what are the taxes/VAT in your country? I feel like you can get way more diamond with a nice budget like $16K. Any reason for such high color and clarity -- is it cultural? If not, I'd strongly consider G/VS to maximize your budget. That's said, if you simply want great cut, white, eye clean diamond, you could really go H/SI and get much more for your money.

 

[david james]

What is your budget for the diamond alone, and what are the taxes/VAT in your country? I feel like you can get way more diamond with a nice budget like $16K. Any reason for such high color and clarity -- is it cultural? If not, I'd strongly consider G/VS to maximize your budget. That's said, if you simply want great cut, white, eye clean diamond, you could really go H/SI and get much more for your money.

Well some of my friends are getting Tiffany or Harry Winston. I feel those are overpriced so opted for a loose stone for value but I probably need to have equal or better stones on a typical HW. I am not sure what is the consequence of pursuing the "value" option all the way .

 

[msop04]

Well some of my friends are getting Tiffany or Harry Winston. I feel those are overpriced so opted for a loose stone for value but I probably need to have equal or better stones on a typical HW. I am not sure what is the consequence of pursuing the "value" option all the way .

Just FYI... not all Tiffany and HW stones are great, and yes, they are overpriced IMO. Some of those stones are not so great -- for example, Tiffany has a tendency to sell "steep/deep" stones that face up smaller than an ideal cut at the same carat weight. So, unless it is the wish of your FF to have the name at the sacrifice of size (and sometimes cut quality), I wouldn't even consider those.

You're on the right track by coming to Pricescope to find the best cut stone! As far as "value," I would only pay for the things you (and your FF) can appreciate with the eye -- CUT, COLOR, and SIZE. An eye clean stone is eye clean, regardless of it's a VVS1, VS2, or even a super clean SI! Most people are super happy with G color, and with a great cut, a G will appear brighter and much more sparkly than a poorly cut stone of higher color.

 

[valeria101]

I think HW go down to G/VS [you would want to check]. In reasonable circumstances - i.e. not taking someone's ring off their finger, I'd have to stare impolitely to tell the ends of their range apart. I'd say that the brand settings are the most recognizable, inasmuch, I'd match their quality (somewhat trickier than the matter of diamonds with grades) and not knock-off.

The E/VS (SI1) I have mentioned above is a personal quirk.

I used to mention Art of Platinum as a fine competitor to any such brand; not sure the prices are still such a 'bargain' !

 

[msop04]

OP, do you know what setting she'd like, or are you going to pick one out together?

 

[valeria101]

Re. HCA

I'd stop at 2.

Also, it is nice to see a crisp, symmetrical pattern at least on the face of a round brilliant, and in the mentioned range of proportions, there should be H&A 'arrows' (the 'hearts' pattern on the back tends to vary more with slight changes in proportions - I am not sure how the H&A brands do the cut-off for them... My criteria here are slightly looser, perhaps).

 

[david james]

Re. HCA

I'd stop at 2.

Also, it is nice to see a crisp, symmetrical pattern at least on the face of a round brilliant, and in the mentioned range of proportions, there should be H&A 'arrows' (the 'hearts' pattern on the back tends to vary more with slight changes in proportions - I am not sure how the H&A brands do the cut-off for them... My criteria here are slightly looser, perhaps).

Thank you very much. The 1.3 is leading by 1:0 at the moment. Looks like the 1.5 one is a little deep even it has a H&A badge....

 

[msop04]

I searched for stones that were eye clean, H or better, HCA < 2, and $14K USD or less (not sure what your taxes/VAT may be)...

This one stood out because it's large @ 7.89 mm, HCA 0.6 (all Excellents per HCA), and it had SBF (which I love and will make it appear even whiter in some lighting). The SBF didn't appear to have any negative effect on the stone -- JA can check for you. The inclusions were twinning wisps that are on the edge of the stone, so it will be eye clean. $13,690
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...g-color-si1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-2772603

 

[Snowdrop13]

Here you go, super ideal cut, nice colour and clarity:

https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3858600.htm

 

[david james]

OP, do you know what setting she'd like, or are you going to pick one out together?

A simple classic setting. If she prefers a different one we can probably re-set it.

 

[msop04]

A simple classic setting. If she prefers a different one we can probably re-set it.

That will be beautiful. For 6 prong, I recommend the CVB "Jovyn" in platinum (or whatever metal she prefers). Caysie (of CVB) can modify the setting and prongs as you/she likes. Of course, I am biased because I have the Jovyn (modified with petite tab prongs) as shown in my avatar.

Other nice 6 prong solitaires the Vatche U-113, Brian Gavin's Tiffany Half Round (if she dislikes a knife edge), and VC's 6 prong varieties.

 

[msop04]

Here you go, super ideal cut, nice colour and clarity:

https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3858600.htm

Here's another super ideal from WF (1.61 H/SI1 ACA @ 7.57 mm) $14,280:
https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3634977.htm
I'm not certain, but I think all ACA's are "eye clean" per WF

 

[msop04]

All great stones suggested!

Here is a price comparison:
$15,120 1.46 ct G/VS1 ACA (7.28 x 7.3 mm)
$14,280 1.61 ct H/SI1 ACA (7.57 x 7.53 mm)
$13,690 1.77 ct G/SI1 JA (7.89 x 7.85 mm)

This shows size comparisons on a size 6 finger:

1.46 ACA vs. 1.61 ACA (9% size difference)


1.46 ACA vs. 1.77 JA (20% size difference)


1.61 ACA vs. 1.77 JA (9% size difference)


Hope this helps!

 

[david james]

Thank you all for recommending different stones.
Need to work out if miss is happy with an ideal cut but lower grading stone... especially when she chats with her peers. I guess here comes the culture aspect....

 

[Snowdrop13]

These are higher graded stones, if anything- nobody, not Tiffany or HW will have anything remotely as beautiful. They are just slightly lower in colour and clarity- which will likely not be visible.

 

[msop04]

Thank you all for recommending different stones.
Need to work out if miss is happy with an ideal cut but lower grading stone... especially when she chats with her peers. I guess here comes the culture aspect....

They won't be able to tell an E from a G, and if it's eye clean, then... What they will notice is how she has a larger ROCK that will sparkle like a disco ball! LOL

 

[OoohShiny]

Another option - a 1.71 H SI1 CBI stone
http://www.hpdiamonds.com/en-us/diamonddetail/HPD8977

@Wink would be able to do a live Skype chat/video if you wanted to see it in 'real life', or as with WF/JA/BGD, you can order the stone and then assess it in the comfort of your own home and next to other stones in stores local to you

If you don't like it, you're only out the cost of shipping (and possibly insurance - check both with the vendor!).

 

[msop04]

Another option - a 1.71 H SI1 CBI stone
http://www.hpdiamonds.com/en-us/diamonddetail/HPD8977

@Wink would be able to do a live Skype chat/video if you wanted to see it in 'real life', or as with WF/JA/BGD, you can order the stone and then assess it in the comfort of your own home and next to other stones in stores local to you

If you don't like it, you're only out the cost of shipping (and possibly insurance - check both with the vendor!).

Great find, OoohShiny! ...it's on hold now. Maybe that's a mistake?

 

[OoohShiny]

Great find, OoohShiny! ...it's on hold now. Maybe that's a mistake?

11 minutes for a lurker to snap something up? That's gotta be a record, surely!

Although the OP is online so hopefully it is he who has reserved it


(I can't remember if it was on hold when I found it! lol)