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I could use some help.....

P: 10/29/2003 8:51:43 AM
pt_mrocker Rough Rock Total Posts: 3 Last Post: 10/29/2003 Member Since: 10/29/2003	My girlfriend and I started looking at engagement rings this past week, and we really fell in love with the Hearts on Fire diamond from a local jeweler. However the pricetag and my budget didn't really work out to well. We really liked the diamond because of the fire and brilliance that it had compared to anything else that we have looked at. I didnt see the color or clarity of the diamond, but it was selling for around $3500 for a .5 carot diamond and i thought that was really high. Can you tell me what you guys think out there. Also I began browsing around this sight and found the hearts and arrows diamonds from sites like whiteflash, and the a cut above diamonds. Anyone have an idea of how these two stones compare, I don't think my girlfriend is stuck on the Hearts on Fire name but we would like to get a diamond that really fires and if it means getting the hearts on fire I will do that, but if it is possible to get a diamond the fires at the smae level else where I would definatly be interested. Also I was told by another jeweler that the hearts on fire diamonds are always shown loose because they loose their brillinace when they are set, anyone know if this is true either. Basically what I am looking for is the nicest quality .5 carot diamond low color d-f, clairty vs1-si1, with a lot of fire. I am new to the diamond world too, what other things should I consider when buying a diamond, or from buying from an online store?? Thanks and I hope to hear back from all of you
Posted: 10/29/2003 8:51:43 AM

There are 15 replies to this message. There are 15 replies on this page.

P: 10/29/2003 9:05:06 AM
magna2 Cut Rock Total Posts: 319 Last Post: 2/9/2004 Member Since: 9/22/2003	pt_mrocker, The "Hearts on Fire" is a branded Hearts and Arrow diamond - and a very expensive one. My recommendation would be to buy other lesser known brand H&A or non-branded H&A diamonds. For a 0.5 ct H&A diamond, you can find many in the 1700 - 2200 range based of course on color and clarity.
Posted: 10/29/2003 9:05:06 AM

P: 10/29/2003 9:15:37 AM
dimonbob Ideal Rock Total Posts: 660 Last Post: 10/30/2009 Member Since: 12/13/2000	Welcome to the forum pt_mrocker "Also I was told by another jeweler that the hearts on fire diamonds are always shown loose because they loose their brillinace when they are set, anyone know if this is true either." That is not a true statement! He was just blowing smoke to sell you an inferior product. Any diamond after it is set and is a little dirty will loose some of its brilliance. It will also get back its brilliance once it is clean. I think you will be pleasantly surprised when you see the A CUT ABOVE brand diamond. dimonbob, GG whiteflash.com
Posted: 10/29/2003 9:15:37 AM

P: 10/29/2003 9:36:52 AM
aljdewey Ideal Rock Total Posts: 8,236 Last Post: 2/11/2008 Member Since: 11/25/2002	Hi, PT: You can absolutely get a diamond of equal quality for a LOT less than the HOF diamond. You want a diamond that sparkles? Then you need to focus on CUT. It's the cut of the HOF diamond that makes it sparkle compared to other diamonds. There are several vendors here which offer super-ideal cut diamonds that will perform as well as the HOF for a lot less. Honestly, I'd recommend you go to G/H color---they face up COMPLETLY white and represent a huge price point break. Also, go toward the SI-1.....in less than 1 ct, the SI-1 will likely be totally clean to the unaided eye and represents a much better value. If you can fill us in on your budget, I'm sure several of us would help you find a few stones to consider. _____________________ Note: Chainsaw Not Sold Separately.
Posted: 10/29/2003 9:36:52 AM

P: 10/29/2003 9:47:04 AM
Pricescope Administrator Total Posts: 8,265 Last Post: 1/5/2008 Member Since: 1/1/2000	Bob: ---------------- On 10/29/2003 9:15:37 AM dimonbob wrote: The A CUT ABOVE brand from Whiteflash is an equal or superior diamond and is more affordable. Yes, I am tooting my own horn but I am also telling the truth. ---------------- I know you meant well but please try to be more objective... Pricescope
Posted: 10/29/2003 9:47:04 AM

P: 10/29/2003 10:26:29 AM
dimonbob Ideal Rock Total Posts: 660 Last Post: 10/30/2009 Member Since: 12/13/2000	Thanks Leonid, Done dimonbob, GG whiteflash.com
Posted: 10/29/2003 10:26:29 AM

P: 10/29/2003 10:36:30 AM
aljdewey Ideal Rock Total Posts: 8,236 Last Post: 2/11/2008 Member Since: 11/25/2002	Bob, hate to say it, but the revision isn't much better. As an aside, I think you're doing yourself more harm than good in being so promotional. Consumers here really appreciate the non-promotional nature of the forum, and WF certainly is touted by enough satisfied customers that you shouldn't feel the need to do this, in my opinion. I just find it disappointing.....I expect better from you guys. _____________________ Note: Chainsaw Not Sold Separately.
Posted: 10/29/2003 10:36:30 AM

P: 10/29/2003 10:47:02 AM
Arlington Cut Rock Total Posts: 179 Last Post: 6/24/2004 Member Since: 8/6/2003	I don't think his edited response is that bad. I actually would agree with his statement. I bought an A CUT ABOVE and was very pleasantly surprised. It easily outperformed the diamonds I had seen at the local jewelers.
Posted: 10/29/2003 10:47:02 AM

P: 10/29/2003 11:00:23 AM
pt_mrocker Rough Rock Total Posts: 3 Last Post: 10/29/2003 Member Since: 10/29/2003	Hey everyone, Thanks for the help so far. I am looking for a diamond that really sparkles, thats what was our initial attraction to the hearts on fire. I would like to stay around the $2000 range on the diamond, plus or minus $500 would be fine though. Basically I would like to get the best fire and sparkle for the buck. Probably around the .5 ct. range. So anything helping would be great on where to look, or some specific stones would be nice too, I would appreciate any help i can get. Can you also fill me in on how the table and crown angles effect things and what i should be looking for with the most fire. Thanks a lot
Posted: 10/29/2003 11:00:23 AM

P: 10/29/2003 11:00:28 AM
magna2 Cut Rock Total Posts: 319 Last Post: 2/9/2004 Member Since: 9/22/2003	---------------- On 10/29/2003 10:47:02 AM Arlington wrote: I don't think his edited response is that bad. I actually would agree with his statement. I bought an A CUT ABOVE and was very pleasantly surprised. It easily outperformed the diamonds I had seen at the local jewelers. ---------------- While it may be a factual statement, I think what aljdewey is saying that it still comes across as self-serving.
Posted: 10/29/2003 11:00:28 AM

P: 10/29/2003 2:44:01 PM
pqcollectibles Ideal Rock Total Posts: 3,441 Last Post: 6/18/2005 Member Since: 2/23/2003	Diamond Bob has countless, non "promotional" postings, giving of his time and expertise to educate folks on the Forum. We all write things that sound one way to us because we know what's in our own minds and hearts. When other people read what we have written is when we learn how it sounds to them. I think Diamond Bob's comment was well intentioned. Buyers can find comparable quality for less money on Price Scope. Including Good Old Gold's, and Nice Ice's, SuperbCert's, and many other Vendors hand selected branded and unbranded Hearts and Arrows diamonds. The PS, H&A diamonds will perform as beautifully as the big name, higher priced, retail lines. PT,..... You will have no problem finding a great CUT, .5 carat diamond, that will knock her socks off for much less than the HoF price you were quoted. Use the search engine on the PS home page, click the Hearts and Arrows box, enter your size, color, and clarity ranges and take a look at the list that is available. I personally entered .45 to .6 carat, G and H color, VS2 to SI1, and got 55 diamonds ranging in price from $975 to $1660. You can adjust your search accordingly and see what kind of results you get. Why use a big word when a diminutive word would be succinct! ____________________________________________________________ Just a regular person trying to be helpful. Consult a Pro prior to purchase!
Posted: 10/29/2003 2:44:01 PM

P: 10/29/2003 2:51:18 PM
aljdewey Ideal Rock Total Posts: 8,236 Last Post: 2/11/2008 Member Since: 11/25/2002	---------------- On 10/29/2003 10:47:02 AM Arlington wrote: I actually would agree with his statement. I bought an A CUT ABOVE and was very pleasantly surprised. ---------------- It's not that I disagree with his statement....the diamond brand he mentioned, as well as several other H&A diamonds here, could easily compete with the HOF diamond. I disagree only with the fairly obvious self-promotion. It would have been enough to say that the superideal diamonds commonly found through PS vendors could easily compete with the HOF. _____________________ Note: Chainsaw Not Sold Separately.
Posted: 10/29/2003 2:51:18 PM

P: 10/29/2003 2:51:50 PM
Mara Ideal Rock Total Posts: 27,912 Last Post: 11/23/2009 Member Since: 10/30/2002	I love HOF stones too but not for the markup!! We saw them first...our first stones and were in love. But of course then we walked away from the jeweler and reality set in. For $10k I could have had a 1ct H SI HOF or similar, not even talking about the setting! For that same amount, I got a 1.35c diameter G VS1 stone with a custom made platinum eternity style ring with about .75c of baby diamonds in it. Much better! If you can afford to pay the markup and she doesn't mind getting a smaller stone, go for it. But knowing now what she loves (e.g. hearts and/or arrows and/or well cut!) then use that knowledge to shop and find her a Hearts and Arrows stone that is unbranded but still has the pretty little images for her to view, and is MUCH CHEAPER than HOF. HOF has a markup of around 40% over regular H&A stones, its all about the branding. As the others noted, $2k will get you alot. You could probably even get something like a .65c G SI1 or similar and it will look spectacular if the cut is right... I have a G stone and I adore the whiteness of it. A well-cut H&A stone will have fire AND brilliance, and probably be exactly what a HOF looks like. Compare the IS and H&A images, I doubt you will see a difference. I'm a size girl so I will ALWAYS try to get the biggest size possible...your girl may not be the same, if .5c is the size she wants, then use that $2k to get a better setting and higher color or some fun diamonds on the side or something. You will find many vendors on Pscope who sell great H&A stones, without the HOF markup...and all the same great imagery and reports. Good luck! ________________________________ "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." -Albert Einstein
Posted: 10/29/2003 2:51:50 PM

P: 10/29/2003 2:53:23 PM
aljdewey Ideal Rock Total Posts: 8,236 Last Post: 2/11/2008 Member Since: 11/25/2002	---------------- On 10/29/2003 11:00:28 AM magna2 wrote: While it may be a factual statement, I think what aljdewey is saying that it still comes across as self-serving. ---------------- Thanks, Magna.....that's exactly what I'm saying. There shouldn't be the need for that, especially here where there are so many satisfied customers. Vendors should realize that it's much more meaningful when the let their customers speak for them. _____________________ Note: Chainsaw Not Sold Separately.
Posted: 10/29/2003 2:53:23 PM

P: 10/29/2003 4:04:48 PM
pt_mrocker Rough Rock Total Posts: 3 Last Post: 10/29/2003 Member Since: 10/29/2003	Thanks for your help so far everyone. When looking for a diamond that really sparkles I understand that the cut is important, so how do i determine what angles in the crown and pavillion will provide an optimum sparkle??? Also what online dealers are good places to shop from, looking at customer support, and price. Thanks PT
Posted: 10/29/2003 4:04:48 PM

P: 10/29/2003 4:25:05 PM
Arlington Cut Rock Total Posts: 179 Last Post: 6/24/2004 Member Since: 8/6/2003	You can use the Holloway Cut Adviser (click the "cut adviser" link in my message or on the top of the page) to help you evaluate the proportions of a diamonds. You can also visit Dave Atlas' company's website Accredited Gem Appraisers where he has a do-it-yourself cut grading tool. I used both quite frequently in my search. You can also find his cut charts on the tutorial on this site. I suggest you read it carefully! As for vendors, the ones previously mentioned by aljdewey seem to have very happy customers here. I guess I would also thrown in niceice.com. Personally, I bought from Whiteflash and am very happy.
Posted: 10/29/2003 4:25:05 PM

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