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 David R. Boggess? Using appraisers who buy/sell jewelry?

P:  8/18/2008 3:21:46 PM  
panda08
panda08

Ideal Rock
Total Posts: 543
Last Post: 9/30/2009
Member Since: 7/30/2008
 
I'm in Southern California and have been trying to find an appraiser who can provide a comprehensive appraisal that includes a total cut analysis with Sarin, etc. with the latest technology.  The ones I have emailed from the independent appraiser list have either not responded to my questions about the technology they use or cannot provide the services I'm looking for.  I found David R. Boggess from the National Association of Jewelry Appraisers' website.  His website appears impressive and he has access to a lot of the technologies I am looking for.  HOWEVER, he buys and sells jewelry and thus, is not independent.  Does anyone have any experience with him?  If I use a non-independent appraiser, should I approach the process differently than if I use an independent one?  Thanks!





Posted:  8/18/2008 3:21:46 PM

 There are 8 replies to this message.  There are 8 replies on this page.

P: 8/18/2008 7:29:23 PM
AndyMN
AndyMN

Rough Rock
Total Posts: 46
Last Post: 5/23/2009
Member Since: 6/2/2008
 
Have you considered sending the diamond and/or setting to one of the appraiser-contributors from Pricescope?  They have a pretty loyal following here.  I've noticed that Neil Beaty, in particular, posts quite a bit, is located in Denver and has all the latest measuring tools, etc.

Andrew Furman
Continental Diamond
Minneapolis, Minnesota

Posted:  8/18/2008 7:29:23 PM
P: 8/19/2008 12:48:32 AM
:)
:)

Ideal Rock
Total Posts: 1,864
Last Post: 6/1/2009
Member Since: 7/25/2006
 
I live in So Cal and shipped mine to Richard Sherwood in Sarasota.  He uses plenty of high tech toys and is extremely good. 

I would also be happy to use Dave Atlas (Oldminer) or Neil Beaty (Denver Appraiser)

Posted:  8/19/2008 12:48:32 AM
P: 8/19/2008 8:33:18 AM
oldminer
oldminer

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Some appraisers successfully wear two hats depending on the job they are doing for their client.  Others just can't distinguish one job from another.  What you and others need who want an objective opinion is to find an appraiser capable of doing the correct job for you without bias.

In my own case, I have never been a retailer.  I used to be a wholesaler of modern, antique reproduction and authentic estate jewelry along with old cut diamonds and many colored gems.  I only sold to the trade.  However, I bought on opportunity primarily from dealers , but often from members of the public.  All during that period, my firm was appraising jewelry and rarely did one operation come into conflict with the other.  We did not offer to buy items unless we were asked if we were interested from appraisal clients.  Rarely did we perform an appraisal and then buy the items.  I'd simply prefer to buy outright and save the client the appraisal fee.  It takes less time and costs everyone less.

The typical consumer can't take a diamond or a piece of jewelry bought somewhre else to an "appraiser-retailer" and be fully confident of getting a truly unbiased appraisal.  Sure, a few appraisers of that sort exist who just simply are honest and fair, but there are far more who will tell you to return the item and buy a better one from them.  Vendors fear that every appraiser-retailer is like this, but not every last one is a rotten apple.  The problem is the majority can't be unbiased and have created a lot of fear.

Reputation goes a long way in choosing who to trust for an appraisal.  Overall, nothing is a substitute for many years of doing the right things.  Avoiding appraiser-retailers when you need unbiased appraisals on new items is a good idea, but the concept that an appraiser can't be an honest buyer is not a correct perception in most instances and especially where the appraisal of newly purchased items is concerned. 

David S. Atlas

GG(GIA), ASG, Sr. Mbr. NAJA

www.datlas.com





Posted:  8/19/2008 8:33:18 AM
P: 9/4/2008 9:00:17 PM
Darthkim
Darthkim

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Total Posts: 85
Last Post: 9/6/2009
Member Since: 8/25/2008
 
Hi panda08,

Did you end up finding an appraiser in OC? I just came across David Boggess website, and his duality has me a little bit concerned.

I'm still waiting for my ring to arrive.

Here are the people i came up with for my appraisal.

Patrick Davis - http://www.certifiedjewelryappraiser.com/
Nancy Stacy - http://www.jewelry-appraisal.com/

I believe nancy posts on PS, i just happen to click on her link in one of the Appraisal Threads.

Hope to find someone in OC, but if not, a drive to LA it is...

Posted:  9/4/2008 9:00:17 PM
P: 9/4/2008 10:51:44 PM
panda08
panda08

Ideal Rock
Total Posts: 543
Last Post: 9/30/2009
Member Since: 7/30/2008
 
Date: 9/4/2008 9:00:17 PM
Author: Darthkim
Hi panda08,


Did you end up finding an appraiser in OC? I just came across David Boggess website, and his duality has me a little bit concerned.


I'm still waiting for my ring to arrive.


Here are the people i came up with for my appraisal.


Patrick Davis - http://www.certifiedjewelryappraiser.com/

Nancy Stacy - http://www.jewelry-appraisal.com/


I believe nancy posts on PS, i just happen to click on her link in one of the Appraisal Threads.


Hope to find someone in OC, but if not, a drive to LA it is...


I didn't wind up using Boggess because of my concerns about whether he'd be truly unbiased. I emailed Patrick Davis but he never responded to me. I did not come across Nancy Stacy in my search. I initially contacted Gina D'Onofrio, who was very friendly and helpful but unfortunately could not fit me into her schedule. In the end, I used Geoffrey Nelson, who's in Pasadena and part of a group of appraisers known as Jewelry Judges. Their website is www.jewelryjudge.net.






Posted:  9/4/2008 10:51:44 PM
P: 9/5/2008 1:35:16 AM
Darthkim
Darthkim

Rough Rock
Total Posts: 85
Last Post: 9/6/2009
Member Since: 8/25/2008
 
Thanks Panda08.

I'll give them a try.

May I ask how much it came out to?

Posted:  9/5/2008 1:35:16 AM
P: 9/5/2008 2:23:27 AM
panda08
panda08

Ideal Rock
Total Posts: 543
Last Post: 9/30/2009
Member Since: 7/30/2008
 
Date: 9/5/2008 1:35:16 AM
Author: Darthkim
Thanks Panda08.


I'll give them a try.


May I ask how much it came out to?


You're welcome! It was $125.






Posted:  9/5/2008 2:23:27 AM
P: 10/17/2008 7:56:28 PM
dboggess
dboggess

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Total Posts: 1
Last Post: 10/17/2008
Member Since: 10/15/2008
 

I have been a jewelry appraiser for over 25 years, and the first 10 years I did not buy or sell jewelry.  After I began to buy and sell jewelry, I realized that my appraisals became much more accurate.  One of the things that consumers don't realize is that if a jewelry appraiser does not buy or sell, they have no direct connection to market prices.  Appraisers that don’t buy and sell use “pricing theories” and market research to determine the value of the jewelry they appraise since they have never actually bought hundreds of diamonds from wholesalers or made every kind of jewelry dozens of times that they appraise.  When you have a “vested financial interest” in knowing exactly what something cost and you are buying and selling that commodity on a daily basis is when you really learn its value.  There is no question that someone who is actually in the business of buying and selling jewelry is in a much better position to determine the value of jewelry than someone who does not. 

Another issue that consumers don’t think about is that many “independent” jewelry appraisers have a bias themselves.  There is a lot of financial pressure for jewelry appraisers to “conform” to the industry.  The higher an appraiser appraises; the more business he or she is likely to get from jewelry stores.  If you are an appraiser and you always appraise everything a little higher than you know it’s really worth and you don’t point out too many “problems”, you will always have happy customers.  Both the individual you just appraised the jewelry for and the jewelry store where they purchased it.  Consumers like hearing they got a good deal, so this strategy works perfectly.  There is a joke in the jewelry appraisal business that goes something like this; “Who’s the best jewelry appraiser in the eyes of the consumer and the local jewelry stores, the one that appraised the item for the highest value”.  No one likes to talk about it, but its standard operating procedure for many “independent” appraisers.  If an appraiser starts to actually tell his clients the “real average” selling price of the item as opposed the inflated value, or points out that one of the side diamonds is chipped, etc., then the store that sold it is going to get upset, and that store will likely never refer business to that “independent” appraiser.  Over 50% of an independent jewelry appraiser’s business comes from referrals or direct business with jewelry stores, and that is an obvious conflict of interest.  It is in the “independent” appraiser’s best interest to always appraise high and not point out problems in the items they appraise.

Basically there is a bias in both directions.  Jewelry appraisers that buy and sell have a possible bias if they allow their greediness to get in the way of telling the truth.  “Independent” appraisers (non-buying and selling appraisers) are potentially biased because their livelihood is at stake if they criticize the jewelry they appraise or if they don’t appraise high enough to keep their stores happy.

I pride myself on telling everything.  If the client gets a fair deal, I tell them they did, even if I could have sold it for less.  And on top of that, if the client asks me what I would have sold it for, I don’t tell them.  If the client wants to make another appointment to come in and see me as a “jewelry seller” that is fine, but not during an appointment that is set up for appraising something they have purchased somewhere else.  I am not willing to risk my reputation, my business, or legal action over one piece of jewelry.  I work out of an office that has no jewelry on display or photographs of jewelry anywhere.  My office looks more like a laboratory.  All my jewelry is kept in a locked safe.  Even the people that come to my office for the sole purpose of buying jewelry from me often ask if I even have any jewelry to sell.  So, the environment in my office is not condusive to selling jewelry.

A
s far as having a concern about an appraiser’s bias, in my opinion that has to be handled on a case by case basis regardless of whether the appraiser buys or sells jewelry.  If the appraiser is an honest person, then there will be no bias.  The real problem for the consumer is determining if an appraiser is trustworthy and if he/she will do their job correctly without any bias.  I think my track record of working for nearly every single top tier jewelry retailer in this country speaks for itself.  My office walls are lined with letters of recommendation from top jewelry retailers.  Companies like Tiffany & Co. Bvlgari, Nordstrom, Neiman Marcus take their business very seriously.  15 years after I began to sell jewelry and buy jewelry from the public, these top jewelry retailers still refer me business.  If major companies such as these that send me their clients are not worried about me having a “bias” then it would seem to me that consumers can be confident that I have no “bias”, but more importantly I’m probably very good at my job.  The life-long personal business strategy of being honest almost to a fault and always striving to be the best Gemologist I can be has always worked me as evidenced by a client list that few if any jewelry appraisers in this country can match.

- David Boggess

Posted:  10/17/2008 7:56:28 PM

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