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Including Inclusions...

P: 7/16/2003 10:12:09 AM
MichaelF Rough Rock Total Posts: 70 Last Post: 8/15/2003 Member Since: 7/2/2003	Well thanks to Mara and Leonid I think I'm on the right track... I located the following stone and have it on hold... Carat 1.273 Color G Clarity SI1 Measurements (mm) 7.04 - 7.06 x 4.28 Table % 55 Depth % 60.7 Crown Angle ° 34.8 Crown % 15.6 Pavilion Angle ° 40.8 Pavilion % 43 Polish Ideal Symmetry Ideal Girdle 1.0% to 1.4% Faceted Culet Pointed Fluorescence Negligible I'm getting an HCA on this stone of 1.3. I have it on hold and ready to ship to the appraiser, the cost of the stone is $7,030... While we work out a few details about the setting, I would like your opinions on the stone and in particular the inclusions as noted on the GIA... I realize it must be difficult from this report to determine if the stone is 'eye clean', I guess the appraiser will give me a better feel for that... I'm more concerned about their location and the fact that they appear to wrap around the girdle... Is this a concern? Thanks, Michael
Posted: 7/16/2003 10:12:09 AM

There are 12 replies to this message. There are 12 replies on this page.

P: 7/16/2003 10:20:42 AM
Giangi Ideal Rock Total Posts: 2,530 Last Post: 10/29/2006 Member Since: 1/23/2003	Hello Michael, You're mentioning a GIA report, but an AGS DQD is showing up. Also, it's waaaaaaaaaaaay too small... I can't even read cut/color/clarity grades... Plus, judging diamond's inclusions from a plot is almost worthless. Plots are 2-dimensional, while inclusions are three dimensional. Unless you're looking at an HRD report, which tries to show the inclusions (especially feathers) outline, one can judge the importance of the characteristics, nor it's color (again, unless it's HRD). It's safe to say that usually inclusions located on the sid are less visible and preferable, but each stone should be valued on it's own. Each diamond has different inclusions and, believe it or not, sometimes those 'carbon spots' which are actually dark crystals, can be difficul to discern if located in certain positions that make them look like reflections. _____________ Omnia Mea Mecum Porto. Giangi
Posted: 7/16/2003 10:20:42 AM

P: 7/16/2003 10:30:09 AM
MichaelF Rough Rock Total Posts: 70 Last Post: 8/15/2003 Member Since: 7/2/2003	Giangi, Thanks... Not use to uploading on this forum and I didn't want to put too large an image... Here's a .png reduced to a lesser degree... I suppose it is sort of moot though from what you are saying the stone needs to be seen so baring no other red flags I should have it sent out to the appraiser... Your thoughts on the overall value assuming the inclusions are not an issue? Thanks, Mike
Posted: 7/16/2003 10:30:09 AM

P: 7/16/2003 10:32:38 AM
Giangi Ideal Rock Total Posts: 2,530 Last Post: 10/29/2006 Member Since: 1/23/2003	Inclusions are in a very nice position and should easily be covered by a prong. Sounds really a gorgeous stone and a great value! I'm sure everyone will be amazed by its beauty. _____________ Omnia Mea Mecum Porto. Giangi
Posted: 7/16/2003 10:32:38 AM

P: 7/16/2003 11:00:46 AM
niceice Ideal Rock Total Posts: 1,792 Last Post: 7/22/2008 Member Since: 1/29/2003	---------------- On 7/16/2003 10:20:42 AM Giangi wrote: Plus, judging diamond's inclusions from a plot is almost worthless. Plots are 2-dimensional, while inclusions are three dimensional. ---------------- So true. A picture is worth a thousand words... Ask the seller to provide you with clarity photographs which show the primary grademaker inclusions in detail so that you know what to expect when you loupe the stone for yourself. It shouldn't be a problem for the seller to take these clarity photographs for you, it doesn't take much time, both Jonathan at http://www.goodoldgold.com and ourselves do it for clients all the time, routinely in fact for every diamond that we offer for sale... It would be easier not to do so, but the fact is that people have no idea what to expect off of the plot alone and should expect no less... Even most of the diamond sellers on Ebay post pictures of the product they are selling, why buy off paper alone? Wouldn't you expect to see the inclusions within the diamond you purchase when buying from a store? Why would you buy differently simply because you are buying a diamond on-line? Not all SI-1 clarity stones are created equal, that stands for all clarity grades, they are ranges of quality, get the pics! Todd L. Gray, President NiceIce.com
Posted: 7/16/2003 11:00:46 AM

P: 7/16/2003 11:58:49 AM
Giangi Ideal Rock Total Posts: 2,530 Last Post: 10/29/2006 Member Since: 1/23/2003	Thank you Robin and Todd! We seem to agree on several points today! Great minds think alike! _____________ Omnia Mea Mecum Porto. Giangi
Posted: 7/16/2003 11:58:49 AM

P: 7/16/2003 1:03:21 PM
Mara Ideal Rock Total Posts: 27,936 Last Post: 11/25/2009 Member Since: 10/30/2002	Nice looking plot actually--from what you can tell...it's a WF stone yes? Definitely try to get closeups of the inclusions in the stone. Did you ask the vendor what their opinion was on the inclusions and if the stone was eye-clean? WF should tell it like it is...they have a good rep on here. Good luck and definitely use the independent appraiser as your eyes since you cannot see the stone for yourself yet. Let us know how things turn out. Congrats! The sound sounds lovely! I'm partial to G's myself... and an ACA should knock your socks off. I am currently saving up for a little one myself... ________________________________ "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." -Albert Einstein
Posted: 7/16/2003 1:03:21 PM

P: 7/16/2003 3:03:56 PM
MichaelF Rough Rock Total Posts: 70 Last Post: 8/15/2003 Member Since: 7/2/2003	Actually, we've agreed on an appraiser 10 miles from here. They'll ship it to him at their cost and I get to walk through the appraisal. Then it will be returned for setting, then back to the appraiser for a final look-see. Then the cash flies and I walk with the ring... I'll call today about the eye clean issue, and post an update... Michael
Posted: 7/16/2003 3:03:56 PM

P: 7/16/2003 3:06:10 PM
MichaelF Rough Rock Total Posts: 70 Last Post: 8/15/2003 Member Since: 7/2/2003	Mara... Yes... I forgot... It is a White Flash stone... Michael
Posted: 7/16/2003 3:06:10 PM

P: 7/16/2003 3:55:16 PM
Mara Ideal Rock Total Posts: 27,936 Last Post: 11/25/2009 Member Since: 10/30/2002	It's great you have found an indi appraiser so close to you!! Definitely go down and check the stone out and get it appraised, that is an excellent way to see the stone, approve it with your eyes and then get the final approval from the appraisal. I am sure all will be satisfactory...best of luck and keep us updated! ________________________________ "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." -Albert Einstein
Posted: 7/16/2003 3:55:16 PM

P: 7/16/2003 6:16:25 PM
MichaelF Rough Rock Total Posts: 70 Last Post: 8/15/2003 Member Since: 7/2/2003	I'm starting to get excited... I spoke with Brian at WF this afternoon and he pulled the stone and inspected it. He said that the inclusion runs verticaly down and along the angle of the pavillion more so than horizontilly across the toward the table. He sounded fustrated trying to figure out the AGS diagram and ended up putting it under a microscope to see the inclusions. There are really one on the one side and it shows from the underside as it rund through the depth of the stone. Does any of that make sense? Any how, he said is definately "eye clean" and even hard to detect fully with a 10X loop because of location and direction of the feather. Brian is taking some magnified pics for me and I'll post them for y'all to oogle... We advanced to discussions of a custom setting for the stone and things are progressing very nicely... So far I'm rather impressed with the level of service and attention I'm getting... Michael
Posted: 7/16/2003 6:16:25 PM

P: 7/16/2003 6:33:43 PM
Mara Ideal Rock Total Posts: 27,936 Last Post: 11/25/2009 Member Since: 10/30/2002	Well it's a good sign that Brian the cutter had to loupe the stone to figure out the inclusions!!! Did you ask about covering the inclusions with a prong? From the AGS report it looks like it wouldn't be a problem... Can't wait to see the closeups. ________________________________ "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." -Albert Einstein
Posted: 7/16/2003 6:33:43 PM

P: 7/17/2003 8:35:10 AM
MichaelF Rough Rock Total Posts: 70 Last Post: 8/15/2003 Member Since: 7/2/2003	Mara, I don't think there will be prongs... The setting we are designing is inspired by a tension setting. The ring will twist and split as it rises over the top of her finger, the ends of the ring with go to either side of the stone. Brian thinks he may wish to add a platinum basket under the stone for security, it will be added in such a way that it will be invisible to the eye. The current thinking would be to turn the stone so that portion of the girdle is up against the band where it is set. I think this might actually end up covering more than a prong dont you? Im attaching a photo of the original tension setting that was the inspiration for the design. Brian is also sending photos of a similar setting WF Designed for me to look at, I'll post them when they arrive along with the magnified images of the stone... Michael
Posted: 7/17/2003 8:35:10 AM

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