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ť Thinking of making a purchase - what do you think?

Thinking of making a purchase - what do you think?

P: 7/6/2007 8:09:15 AM
Carats Rough Rock Total Posts: 75 Last Post: 4/11/2009 Member Since: 2/2/2007	1.70 Round Brilliant EGL 7.64-7.60 x 4.77 mm VS1, H Fluoro: Moderate Blue Depth: 62.6% Width: 57% Crown Height: 15% Pavilion Depth: 44% Girdle: Medium, faceted Polish: Very Good Sym: Very Good Cutlet: None In terms of inclusions, there is one small line at the bottom half which one can absolutely not see looking at it face up, much less with a loop. How much should I be happy paying for this stone? What would be a bargain? Is this a good stone overall? Should I be concerned about anything? The stone looked (face value) good to me (but who knows)...
Posted: 7/6/2007 8:09:15 AM

There are 10 replies to this message. There are 10 replies on this page.

P: 7/6/2007 8:22:21 AM
avlis Cut Rock Total Posts: 237 Last Post: 8/20/2008 Member Since: 10/22/2006	i think that "line" you are seeing is actually the reflection of the girdle in the pavilion, not an inclusion. i like the medium flouro with the H color. of course the EGL tag slightly make me raise an eyebrow. also the HCA doesn't like it much with a 4.6. "4.6 - Good - Only if price is your main criterion" as for how much you should be happy with paying for that stone.. well.. i would take THIS H VS1 at $14k. it is perfectly cut, scores a "1.2 - Excellent within TIC range" on the HCA, and its a GIA cert from GoG which means great service and lifetime trade up, and although it is slightly lighter that the stone you have listed, it is the same diameter.
Posted: 7/6/2007 8:22:21 AM

P: 7/6/2007 12:18:32 PM
Carats Rough Rock Total Posts: 75 Last Post: 4/11/2009 Member Since: 2/2/2007	Any other comments/opinions? I need to make a decision about this pretty soon. Why does it rate it only as a "good"?
Posted: 7/6/2007 12:18:32 PM

P: 7/6/2007 1:02:30 PM
Regular Guy Ideal Rock Total Posts: 5,318 Last Post: 11/24/2009 Member Since: 7/7/2004	Carats, Tough call. Avlis has done the analysis for you...but you'd pay probably a 50% premium to get his. But...it's probably apples & oranges for color & clarity, not to mention the important cut (for which *that* premium is inversely intuitively more modest). Your comps put this at $9200, give or take $700. Bottom line, whichever option you choose, EGL or non...no reason not to get one that scores well on the HCA, as you cohort cblankesj was able to find. The one you found can be OK...but why not ask them to bring in one that scores well, and compare? They're not hard to find. Ira (Ruffles have Ridges) Z. ____________ If you're looking for diamond shopping tips...this (along with this update) might do the trick! however...caution: known to have been regarded as armed and dangerous
Posted: 7/6/2007 1:02:30 PM

P: 7/6/2007 1:16:18 PM
Carats Rough Rock Total Posts: 75 Last Post: 4/11/2009 Member Since: 2/2/2007	Date: 7/6/2007 1:02:30 PM Author: Regular Guy Carats, Tough call. Avlis has done the analysis for you...but you'd pay probably a 50% premium to get his. But...it's probably apples & oranges for color & clarity, not to mention the important cut (for which *that* premium is inversely intuitively more modest). Your comps put this at $9200, give or take $700. Bottom line, whichever option you choose, EGL or non...no reason not to get one that scores well on the HCA, as you cohort cblankesj was able to find. The one you found can be OK...but why not ask them to bring in one that scores well, and compare? They're not hard to find. Hmmm...I definitely agree, why not get one that scores well on HCA. The way that we have gone about this process makes it a little more difficult - we are working with a jeweler in the diamond distrct that has been showing us diamonds one by one. most of them look great to me but everytime we come back and put them on pricescope we realize that something could be better about the stone for the price - as a result we've gotten more specific with her about what we want. Initially she was showing us stones with terrible clarity - we told her no on this and now the stones we have been shown are much much much more eye clean. Now with this HCA rating, what are some specifics we should tell her we are looking for to increase the probability that it will score well with HCA? The depth and table seemed fine so apparently there are other characteristics this algorithm is taking into account...I just want to be able to tell the jeweler don't show us anything with X,Y,Z so that we can cut all of the bad diamonds out of this process one by one (and save some time:))
Posted: 7/6/2007 1:16:18 PM

P: 7/6/2007 1:18:16 PM
Carats Rough Rock Total Posts: 75 Last Post: 4/11/2009 Member Since: 2/2/2007	Also what are the implications of scoring poorly on HCA? I mean to me the stone looked pretty, sparkly, etc, just as much as all the others we saw...
Posted: 7/6/2007 1:18:16 PM

P: 7/6/2007 1:23:55 PM
belle Ideal Rock Total Posts: 10,287 Last Post: 4/3/2008 Member Since: 11/19/2004	clarity shouldn't be a big issue if you are looking at well cut diamonds. well cut diamonds sparkle so much that you can't see the inclusions. if you are seeing inclusions with your naked eye, viewing the stone face up, the diamond isn't well cut. of course if you are just trying to maximize size at the expense of sparkle, then cut won't matter as much and clarity then becomes more important. you just need to prioritize what you want most. (.¸(`.¸¸.´)¸.) ¨`.¸ belle¸. ´¨ (¸.(¸.´ `.¸).¸)
Posted: 7/6/2007 1:23:55 PM

P: 7/6/2007 2:06:16 PM
Regular Guy Ideal Rock Total Posts: 5,318 Last Post: 11/24/2009 Member Since: 7/7/2004	Date: 7/6/2007 1:18:16 PM Author: Carats Also what are the implications of scoring poorly on HCA? I mean to me the stone looked pretty, sparkly, etc, just as much as all the others we saw... Good question. Based on my use of it vs clinical evaluation, I really abuse it. Still, it's your money. Compare. Can you tell a difference? If you can't ignore it. If you're shown them one by one, it may be hard to. When in doubt...maybe don't recreate the wheel. Experts here agree it's a helpful indicator. Based on this substantial evidence, I use it as a sub for cut. Best to substantiate yourself, indeed. Then...or alternately...two thoughts. 1) Taken from Nice Ice: Total depth between 59 - 61.8% Table diameter between 53 - 57% Crown angle between 34.3 - 34.8 degrees Pavilion angle between 40.6 - 40.9 degrees Girdle: thin, medium or slightly thick (or combination thereof) Culet: GIA none or AGS pointed Polish: GIA Excellent or AGS Ideal Symmetry: GIA Excellent or AGS Ideal or consider... you'll spend $8K or above? b) do they have a computer. Let them run it throught the HCA, and call you when they find one that works. How much do you have to spend for them to just do this for you? A couple of ideas, anyway. Ira (Ruffles have Ridges) Z. ____________ If you're looking for diamond shopping tips...this (along with this update) might do the trick! however...caution: known to have been regarded as armed and dangerous
Posted: 7/6/2007 2:06:16 PM

P: 7/6/2007 2:24:51 PM
Carats Rough Rock Total Posts: 75 Last Post: 4/11/2009 Member Since: 2/2/2007	Date: 7/6/2007 2:06:16 PM Author: Regular Guy Date: 7/6/2007 1:18:16 PM Author: Carats Also what are the implications of scoring poorly on HCA? I mean to me the stone looked pretty, sparkly, etc, just as much as all the others we saw... Good question. Based on my use of it vs clinical evaluation, I really abuse it. Still, it's your money. Compare. Can you tell a difference? If you can't ignore it. If you're shown them one by one, it may be hard to. When in doubt...maybe don't recreate the wheel. Experts here agree it's a helpful indicator. Based on this substantial evidence, I use it as a sub for cut. Best to substantiate yourself, indeed. Then...or alternately...two thoughts. 1) Taken from Nice Ice: Total depth between 59 - 61.8% Table diameter between 53 - 57% Crown angle between 34.3 - 34.8 degrees Pavilion angle between 40.6 - 40.9 degrees Girdle: thin, medium or slightly thick (or combination thereof) Culet: GIA none or AGS pointed Polish: GIA Excellent or AGS Ideal Symmetry: GIA Excellent or AGS Ideal or consider... you'll spend $8K or above? b) do they have a computer. Let them run it throught the HCA, and call you when they find one that works. How much do you have to spend for them to just do this for you? A couple of ideas, anyway. Well I can't tell, but I'm no diamond expert so I don't trust my own judgement. Almost everything looks nice to me. So all in all, is there any factor that HCA takes into account that I should be telling my jeweler so that she only picks diamonds that would score better on HCA. It will be tedious to go back and forth between the store and the computer. We are looking to have a ring ready within 2 weeks.
Posted: 7/6/2007 2:24:51 PM

P: 7/6/2007 3:28:03 PM
Regular Guy Ideal Rock Total Posts: 5,318 Last Post: 11/24/2009 Member Since: 7/7/2004	Hmmmmm Carats, Maybe just re-read my last post. In particular, note: "How much do you have to spend for them to just do this for you?" Do you owe something to this particular jeweler. Depending I would refuse to, as you say... Date: 7/6/2007 2:24:51 PM Author: Carats It will be tedious to go back and forth between the store and the computer. See what happens when you tell them to just look up the cert, input the info, and if it gets 0 - 2, you'll come down. *Otherwise, you won't.* That's what I told JA. That's how the HCA is supposed to be used. To screen out options, and then to review among what's left. You say: So all in all, is there any factor that HCA takes into account that I should be telling my jeweler so that she only picks diamonds that would score better on HCA. If you believe the HCA, it just accounts numerically for what the jeweler is supposed to be doing for you without this tool. They're a jeweler. They're supposed to be doing this already. We understand the pavilion angle is a primary indicator, based on it's having the biggest effect. But, the HCA is supposed to work to take modifications of the pavilion into account. So, reading above, they can widen the search up beyond the info I provided from Nice Ice. I'd just tell them to "do their best" to find an ideal stone (they should know about the principles of ideal and light return, or drop them), and then have them check it themselves against the HCA. How wacky is this idea? P.S. edited to add...you said you've got two weeks. Any reason to give them any more than 2 business days to produce? Ira (Ruffles have Ridges) Z. ____________ If you're looking for diamond shopping tips...this (along with this update) might do the trick! however...caution: known to have been regarded as armed and dangerous
Posted: 7/6/2007 3:28:03 PM

P: 7/6/2007 4:03:51 PM
Ellen Ideal Rock Total Posts: 22,894 Last Post: 11/6/2009 Member Since: 1/13/2006	Carats, did you inquire about the J SI1 I linked you to? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "It is also important for the State to inculcate in its subjects an aversion to any 'conspiracy theory of history' for a search for 'conspiracies' means a search for motives and an attribution of responsibility for historical misdeeds." -Murray N. Rothbard, in The Anatomy of the State John Swinton [1829-1901] Chief Editorial Writer of the New York Times (Considered "the Dean of his Profession" by his peers), when asked to toast an 'Independent Press' in a gathering at the National Press Club, circa 1880 "There is no such thing in America as an independent press unless it is in the country towns. You know it, and I know it. There is not one of you who dare express an honest opinion. If you express it you know beforehand that it would never appear in print. I am paid... for keeping my honest opinions out of the paper I am connected with. Others of you are paid similar salaries for doing similar things.... The business of the New York journalist is to distort the truth, to lie outright, to pervert, to vilify, to fawn at the feet of Mammon, and sell his country and race for his daily bread, or for what is about the same thing, his salary. You know this, and I know it and what foolery to be toasting an 'independent press.' We are tools, and the vassals of rich men behind the scenes. We are jumping-jacks. They pull the strings and we dance. Our time, our talents, our lives, our possibilities, all are the property of other men. We are intellectual prostitutes."
Posted: 7/6/2007 4:03:51 PM

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