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Diamond experts opinion please.....

P: 7/13/2006 4:44:48 PM
littleroman Rough Rock Total Posts: 46 Last Post: 8/24/2006 Member Since: 7/13/2006	Hello All, I have been reading your wonderful forum and must say I am very impressed with it. I was wondering if someone could offer opinions on my question. I am the type of person who normally studies and researches things for months before making a large purchase such as an engagement ring. However, due to some personal things that arose I was not able to do as much research as I would have liked prior to purchasing my fiance's engagement ring. She loves it and thinks it is the most beautiful ring she's ever seen (her words exactly) and that is really all that counts. However, it was a large purchase for me and I would like opinions on what they think this diamond would retail for. Here are the stats on it. I had it examined by an independant diamond laboratory and this is what they said it is : This diamond is extrememly eye clean and has no visible carbon inclusions. None. I couldn't even see any with a loop. It does have some small feathers but they are not near the edges and the diamond appraiser told me they will not affect the structural integrity in any way. He said all diamonds have feathers (except for perfect or near perfect I assume). Again, you all know way more than I do so I am just wondering what retail price you should expect to pay for a diamond like this. Thank you. shape & cut 9.38-9.40 x 5.52 mm Weight 3.02 carats proportions depth 58.8% table 61% girdle thin to medium cutlet very small finish polish... good symmetry...good clarity grade SI-2 Color Grade J Flourenscence Faint
Posted: 7/13/2006 4:44:48 PM

There are 61 replies to this message. There are 30 replies on this page.

P: 7/13/2006 4:46:28 PM
JulieN Ideal Rock Total Posts: 7,148 Last Post: 11/23/2009 Member Since: 7/25/2005	lab?
Posted: 7/13/2006 4:46:28 PM

P: 7/13/2006 4:50:04 PM
belle Ideal Rock Total Posts: 10,287 Last Post: 4/3/2008 Member Since: 11/19/2004	hey littleroman welcome to ps! you can do a search above using the 'pricescope your diamond' tool to find diamonds with similar specs. it sounds like your diamond did not come with a grading report, which would factor into the price as well but you should get a good general idea here. (.¸(`.¸¸.´)¸.) ¨`.¸ belle¸. ´¨ (¸.(¸.´ `.¸).¸)
Posted: 7/13/2006 4:50:04 PM

P: 7/13/2006 4:58:49 PM
littleroman Rough Rock Total Posts: 46 Last Post: 8/24/2006 Member Since: 7/13/2006	I already did a price search on pricescope and the diamonds that come up are AGS and GIA graded. This diamond did not come with a grading report. I got it examined by the Universal Gemelogical Laboratory. They did it all right in front of me. The guy that did it was a GIA gemologist graduate. I know UGL is not a reputable lab when comparing to GIA and AGS, but it was nice for me as I got to watch the whole process and they did it in front of me. The place I bought the ring gave me a 30 day money back guarentee no matter what. The owner told me get it checked out, if you are not happy bring it back to me and I will refund your money for any reason. I compared it to what other places were offering and his deal seemed to be the best by far. If I had more time I would have shopped more but circumstances didn't alow it.
Posted: 7/13/2006 4:58:49 PM

P: 7/13/2006 5:03:16 PM
JulieN Ideal Rock Total Posts: 7,148 Last Post: 11/23/2009 Member Since: 7/25/2005	Would you divulge your price? I have a number in mind, but there's way too many things that go into pricing for me to tell you what it should cost. It's hard enough to find an eyeclean 3 ct SI-2...that's for sure.
Posted: 7/13/2006 5:03:16 PM

P: 7/13/2006 5:04:50 PM
littleroman Rough Rock Total Posts: 46 Last Post: 8/24/2006 Member Since: 7/13/2006	If anyone could comment at all I would appreciate it on the dimensions, cut, etc. FYI, I don't think the UGL is a grading lab as some people expect it to be while buying diamonds. I think they are just appraisers which is how I used them. The main thing I wanted was for them to examine the diamond and make sure everything was legit i.e. nothing laser driled or filled, not mosienite, or anything crazy stuff like that. They put it under all the gadgets and assured me it was legit, no funny business !
Posted: 7/13/2006 5:04:50 PM

P: 7/13/2006 5:11:16 PM
littleroman Rough Rock Total Posts: 46 Last Post: 8/24/2006 Member Since: 7/13/2006	I have no problem with divulging a price, but I didn't want to initally because it may affect others opinions on what they think the diamond should be worth. When I say eye clean there is no visible carbon whatsoever. However if you take the diamond put it under good light, keep one eye closed and turn the diamond this way, that way this way that way, you can see a feather which is white. I don't know if that really is eye clean then, but it was to me. I 'm just looking for anyone's opinion on the stone from the data listed above. If they see anything good bad or ugly and could point it out that would be great. Thanks.
Posted: 7/13/2006 5:11:16 PM

P: 7/13/2006 5:16:16 PM
littleroman Rough Rock Total Posts: 46 Last Post: 8/24/2006 Member Since: 7/13/2006	I didn't know didley about cut when I bought it and still don't do those #'s look OK ? Any info provided will be greatly appreciated. If I can I will upload a picture later.
Posted: 7/13/2006 5:16:16 PM

P: 7/13/2006 5:18:54 PM
JulieN Ideal Rock Total Posts: 7,148 Last Post: 11/23/2009 Member Since: 7/25/2005	The large table+low depth means it has low crown height. It may return more white light and less colored light.
Posted: 7/13/2006 5:18:54 PM

P: 7/13/2006 5:20:39 PM
littleroman Rough Rock Total Posts: 46 Last Post: 8/24/2006 Member Since: 7/13/2006	Don't know what the pavillion angle is. Julie I don't know why you wouldn't tell me what a retail price should be for this stone.
Posted: 7/13/2006 5:20:39 PM

P: 7/13/2006 5:22:03 PM
JulieN Ideal Rock Total Posts: 7,148 Last Post: 11/23/2009 Member Since: 7/25/2005	Oh. Just by stats, no report, I'm thinking 17.5K. BUT, I have no idea if the stones I'm pulling the price from is eye-clean, has durability issues, etc. It'd be irresponsible of me to price something I have never seen.
Posted: 7/13/2006 5:22:03 PM

P: 7/13/2006 5:27:01 PM
littleroman Rough Rock Total Posts: 46 Last Post: 8/24/2006 Member Since: 7/13/2006	Thanks Julie. I will see if I can scan the report with the graph and also append a picture of the stone to it.
Posted: 7/13/2006 5:27:01 PM

P: 7/13/2006 5:27:59 PM
littleroman Rough Rock Total Posts: 46 Last Post: 8/24/2006 Member Since: 7/13/2006	BTW it is a round brilliant diamond.
Posted: 7/13/2006 5:27:59 PM

P: 7/13/2006 5:29:12 PM
littleroman Rough Rock Total Posts: 46 Last Post: 8/24/2006 Member Since: 7/13/2006	Without seeing the stone I know it's very difficult. I am just asking based on the above. thanks.
Posted: 7/13/2006 5:29:12 PM

P: 7/13/2006 5:39:46 PM
littleroman Rough Rock Total Posts: 46 Last Post: 8/24/2006 Member Since: 7/13/2006	The place I bought it from also has a Lifetime Warranty upgrade where I can upgrade it at any time for the life of the diamond. Not that she would do that but I think that maybe says something. Do all places give this ?
Posted: 7/13/2006 5:39:46 PM

P: 7/13/2006 5:41:30 PM
JulieN Ideal Rock Total Posts: 7,148 Last Post: 11/23/2009 Member Since: 7/25/2005	many do.
Posted: 7/13/2006 5:41:30 PM

P: 7/13/2006 7:05:01 PM
Dancing Fire Ideal Rock Total Posts: 10,224 Last Post: 11/23/2009 Member Since: 4/3/2004	littleroman i think you're playing with FIRE !!! buying a 3ct stone without a AGS or GIA lab report. ask the vendor for a sarin scan.if well cut... this stone should measure close to 9.35mm in diameter X 5.70mm depth. it is always harder to find a "mind clean" stone than a eye clean stone.
Posted: 7/13/2006 7:05:01 PM

P: 7/13/2006 9:14:49 PM
littleroman Rough Rock Total Posts: 46 Last Post: 8/24/2006 Member Since: 7/13/2006	As far as mind clean goes, it is very mind clean for me and her. It's eye clean, and structural sound so it's mind clean to us. I just wanted to see if I got a fair price. Does anyone else have any comments ? IF any of the diamond experts could give me an analysis on what I should expect to pay for something like this I would appreciate it. I just want to make sure I got a fair price. Thank You.
Posted: 7/13/2006 9:14:49 PM

P: 7/13/2006 9:27:09 PM
diamondseeker2006 Ideal Rock Total Posts: 17,609 Last Post: 11/18/2009 Member Since: 1/11/2006	Here, but these are GIA or AGS which would make them higher: 3.37 $25,541. http://www.bluenile.com/diamonds_details.asp?__fun_frm=i&pid=LD00134794&filter_id=0 3.04 $21,253. http://www.bluenile.com/diamonds_details.asp?__fun_frm=i&pid=LD00301018&filter_id=0 ~~~ When in doubt...don't.~~~
Posted: 7/13/2006 9:27:09 PM

P: 7/13/2006 9:33:48 PM
ladykemma Ideal Rock Total Posts: 2,194 Last Post: 6/16/2007 Member Since: 1/2/2006	Date: 7/13/2006 5:18:54 PM Author: JulieN The large table+low depth means it has low crown height. It may return more white light and less colored light. roman do you have the table and depth reversed, i hope?
Posted: 7/13/2006 9:33:48 PM

P: 7/13/2006 9:34:14 PM
littleroman Rough Rock Total Posts: 46 Last Post: 8/24/2006 Member Since: 7/13/2006	Diamond Seeker thank you for the effort; however, above I had already stated in my posts above that I had already done that. This is not a GIA stone and wanted to know a fair retail price for this item based on the info I provided above.
Posted: 7/13/2006 9:34:14 PM

P: 7/13/2006 9:46:48 PM
diamondseeker2006 Ideal Rock Total Posts: 17,609 Last Post: 11/18/2009 Member Since: 1/11/2006	Roman, the diamonds I quoted do have certificates, but I chose diamonds that purposely did not have ideal cuts for you to compare. So subtract a few hundred dollars and you have an idea. Online databases are the only way people here can estimate prices for you, unless one of the vendors decides to offer an opinion. It looks like around $20,000 is typical for a good cut 3 carat J SI2 with a certificate. ~~~ When in doubt...don't.~~~
Posted: 7/13/2006 9:46:48 PM

P: 7/13/2006 10:35:04 PM
littleroman Rough Rock Total Posts: 46 Last Post: 8/24/2006 Member Since: 7/13/2006	Regarding depth and table these are the stats: Depth 58.8% Table 61%
Posted: 7/13/2006 10:35:04 PM

P: 7/13/2006 10:47:27 PM
ladykemma Ideal Rock Total Posts: 2,194 Last Post: 6/16/2007 Member Since: 1/2/2006	Date: 7/13/2006 10:35:04 PM Author: littleroman Regarding depth and table these are the stats: Depth 58.8% Table 61% edited: nevermind
Posted: 7/13/2006 10:47:27 PM

P: 7/13/2006 11:04:00 PM
littleroman Rough Rock Total Posts: 46 Last Post: 8/24/2006 Member Since: 7/13/2006	Lady McKenna - what does your post above mean ? Did you make a mistake ? Thanks,
Posted: 7/13/2006 11:04:00 PM

P: 7/14/2006 4:25:16 AM
Dancing Fire Ideal Rock Total Posts: 10,224 Last Post: 11/23/2009 Member Since: 4/3/2004	Date: 7/13/2006 9:14:49 PM Author: littleroman As far as mind clean goes, it is very mind clean for me and her. It's eye clean, and structural sound so it's mind clean to us. I just wanted to see if I got a fair price. Does anyone else have any comments ? IF any of the diamond experts could give me an analysis on what I should expect to pay for something like this I would appreciate it. I just want to make sure I got a fair price. Thank You. you have a stone with no lab report,no IS picture,no sarin or helium scan.without more information,nobody is willing to stick their neck out. it is always harder to find a "mind clean" stone than a eye clean stone.
Posted: 7/14/2006 4:25:16 AM

P: 7/14/2006 4:45:00 AM
JulieN Ideal Rock Total Posts: 7,148 Last Post: 11/23/2009 Member Since: 7/25/2005	List of independent appraisers in NY: http://www.pricescope.com/appraisers_NY.aspx Sample of services (under David Wolf): Cut Evaluation Tools OGI Ideal Scope Cut Info in Report CROWN ANGLE CROWN HEIGHT PAVILION DEPTH AVG GIRDLE DEPTH TABLE% TOTAL DEPTH% OLD AGA CUT GRADE Justin Krall of Manhattan Appraisers is also well reviewed on PS (I didn't see him on the list?)
Posted: 7/14/2006 4:45:00 AM

P: 7/14/2006 6:23:22 AM
Lorelei Ideal Rock Total Posts: 34,228 Last Post: 11/23/2009 Member Since: 4/30/2005	Roman welcome to PS. There are so many variables with pricing a diamond, especially without a cert and even more so with it being a larger diamond. It is going to be very difficult for any of us to really help you with it and what you should have or could have paid. I think the best idea you can get is to use Belle's suggestion of using the PS your diamond tool to try if you can to find non certed 3 carats with same colour and clarity or to knock a few thousand of a GIA certed or AGS diamond which is similar, a bit more off EGL certed. There isn't enough info regarding the cut quality to really tell what you have, other than it isn't an ideal cut but could be a nice make with more white light as it has a larger table and the depth is a bit on the shallow side. However it could well be a very pretty diamond, we PSers tend to be number nuts here! I think your best bet is to get a professional independant appraisal as well as the UGL lab one to get an impartial opinion ,if you are prepared to spend $150 to find out what you truly have and a ball park price of what your diamond is worth if it means that much to you. But it is probably best to look at it this way. It is easy to second guess your purchase and worry if you spent too much or got a bargain - really your diamond is worth whatever you paid for it if it brings you and your fiance happiness! It sounds as if you found a nice SI2 especially in that size if all you can see is a white feather in some lights. But if you are hoping we are going to say " oh 3 ct non certed J SI2......you should have paid $18k," no one is going to be able to do that Especially without a cert you could have an L i1 even, not always the case but the grading could be off. Maybe one of our expert vendors or appraisers can chime in to help you more, but they would be reluctant to price a stone they haven't seen I would think, but might be able to give you a better idea than us prosumers! As Dancingfire says no one really wants to stick their neck out here! My best advice is if you both love the diamond - and you obviously do - and don't wish to return it - enjoy it and call it good! Congrats on your engagement! Nothing is more sacred as the bond between horse and rider...no other creature can ever become so emotionally close to a human as a horse. When a horse dies, the memory lives on because an enormous part of his owner's heart, soul, very existence dies also...but that can never be laid to rest, it is not meant to be... - Stephanie M Thorn
Posted: 7/14/2006 6:23:22 AM

P: 7/14/2006 6:26:02 AM
coda72 Ideal Rock Total Posts: 1,096 Last Post: 11/21/2009 Member Since: 3/1/2005	Since, no one will answer your questions directly, I will. Keep in mind I'm no expert, especially on round brilliants, but I have been on here for over a year and read a lot of the posts. Most people don't like to answer questions when people come on here, and they have already bought a stone. They don't want to make the person feel bad if the stone isn't well-cut. I can't tell you what you should have paid for your diamond, but I can tell you that your diamond isn't a hearts and arrows cut or an AGS 0, which is what most people on this forum want. These diamonds command a higher price than other diamonds. If you're happy with it, and your fiance is happy with it, then don't worry about the diamond. But it sounds to me like you have some buyer's remorse, or you wouldn't have posted on here. If you're still within your return period, and you want to return the diamond, take a look at the tutorials on this site and then maybe you'll feel a little more confident picking out your next diamond.
Posted: 7/14/2006 6:26:02 AM

P: 7/14/2006 9:41:16 AM
littleroman Rough Rock Total Posts: 46 Last Post: 8/24/2006 Member Since: 7/13/2006	Thank you all for your responses. As someone said " no one is looking to stick their neck out ". I'm not asking anyone too, just asking if i was in the right bal park with my price that is all. I'm not looking to hold anyone to anything. As for buyers remorse, there is none at all. Honestly, I am very happy with my purchase. In fact I think I got a freat deal but as i indicated I know little about diamonds. I would have liked to have educated myself better as I usually do when making a purchase that large. However, circumstances didn't allow for that. I am trying to learn more now and was just looking to see if I got a good deal or not. I am a bargainer and deal finder and did pound the pavement for the stone I got. BTW I paid for the ring. Which I think compared to others I had seen was a very good price. When I was looking, other places were showing me 2.0 CT with visible carbon for $12,500 and these were places that were reccommended to me by other people. The place I bought the ring from seems to have a great reputation, I checked them out and they were extremely professional. The owner told me get it checked out, if you are not happy bring it back to me and I will refund your money for any reason. Anyway, I just wanted to make sure I was in the right ballpark.
Posted: 7/14/2006 9:41:16 AM

P: 7/14/2006 9:47:28 AM
Lorelei Ideal Rock Total Posts: 34,228 Last Post: 11/23/2009 Member Since: 4/30/2005	That is extremely cheap for a 3 ct J SI2. Is this diamond clarity enhanced? Just curious as to the very very low price. I found one earlier - a non certed F SI2 which was $21k. We always have to bear in mind that no one in the diamond industry - or any industry come to that is giving anthing away and if it was worth more it would have sold for more, but if you like it then yes- you got a good deal. Nothing is more sacred as the bond between horse and rider...no other creature can ever become so emotionally close to a human as a horse. When a horse dies, the memory lives on because an enormous part of his owner's heart, soul, very existence dies also...but that can never be laid to rest, it is not meant to be... - Stephanie M Thorn
Posted: 7/14/2006 9:47:28 AM

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