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P: 5/28/2005 12:11:11 AM
ATOM Rough Rock Total Posts: 9 Last Post: 6/6/2005 Member Since: 5/27/2005	Hi, I have a problem with a seller who won't refund my money. After I paid and received the stone I was not happy with what I got. I sent it back and the seller stated it will take 60 to 80 days to receive the refund. 90 days later with no refund I contacted the seller. His response was as follows verbatim: Due to unforeseen market conditions in the jewelry industry, we have been forced to revise our return policy. Please be assured that we recognize and acknowledge your right to a refund, and we are intent on satisfying our obligations to you. At this point in time, we are able to offer you one of the following two refund options: (i) An Immediate Refund Payable in Diamonds. Under this option, you will receive an immediate refund of the purchase price, PLUS interest at the rate of 6% accruing from the date of purchase, PLUS an extra 20% of the purchase price, all payable in loose diamonds and/or diamond jewelry. If you choose this option, you will receive, along with the diamonds, a third-party independent gemological lab certification and an appraisal of the diamond value. (ii) A Cash Refund Payable in Installments. Under this option, you will receive a full refund of the purchase price, PLUS interest at the rate of 6% accruing from the date of purchase, all payable in cash in 24 equal monthly installments. Before my purchase this was never disclosed to me. Is this legal? Below is a site I found with someone in a similar situation with the same company. Please advise. Thank you. P.S. I bought a diamond ring from that company. Well, I don't know where to post my issue. I hope some ppl can help and give me advises Thank you again
Posted: 5/28/2005 12:11:11 AM

There are 26 replies to this message. There are 26 replies on this page.

P: 5/28/2005 1:15:38 AM
cascadejim Rough Rock Total Posts: 76 Last Post: 2/3/2006 Member Since: 11/29/2004	i don't think they can change the return policy after you return something and have agreed on the policy. If this involves more than a few $1k I would contact a lawyer and ask advice.
Posted: 5/28/2005 1:15:38 AM

P: 5/28/2005 1:29:07 AM
Dancing Fire Ideal Rock Total Posts: 10,218 Last Post: 11/21/2009 Member Since: 4/3/2004	i don't know is it legal but, i know that's B.S. who is this vendor? it is always harder to find a "mind clean" stone than a eye clean stone.
Posted: 5/28/2005 1:29:07 AM

P: 5/28/2005 2:40:48 AM
Mara Ideal Rock Total Posts: 27,906 Last Post: 11/22/2009 Member Since: 10/30/2002	This sounds like eBay to me! It also sounds as though they may be having cash flow issues? I agree, if it's a substantial amount of money, take it to a lawyer, otherwise it may not be worth the hassle... Lesson learned..! ________________________________ "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." -Albert Einstein
Posted: 5/28/2005 2:40:48 AM

P: 5/28/2005 2:14:46 PM
icemyster Cut Rock Total Posts: 111 Last Post: 10/6/2008 Member Since: 4/30/2005	Call your lawyer.....letters from lawyers have a way of getting things done...I have spent time in the legal field and you certainly can't change a refund policy after a purchase in made. Your puchase, at law, is a contract, and both you and the seller are bound to fulfill your duties under the contact...you paid...that was your duty...by contact you are allowed to return the stone for a refund, he needs to refund your money, that is his duty under the contract. Unless you missed fine print, a lawyers letter should close the book on this. For the record I am not a lawyer...yet. Make sure you consult a liscenced lawyer...he is the only one that can take any formal legal action to get your money back. Good Luck BMW The Ultimate Driving Machine
Posted: 5/28/2005 2:14:46 PM

P: 5/29/2005 12:04:29 AM
ATOM Rough Rock Total Posts: 9 Last Post: 6/6/2005 Member Since: 5/27/2005	Hi, Everybody! Thanks for the messages. I am still trying to solve my problem without a lawyer yet. I might need one but I don't want to spend money if it's not neccessary. Yesterday night I sent an email to the company and am waiting to get a reply. I just know I didn't do anything wrong. I returned the ring and asked to get my refund. I emailed to tell him that I can't accept any of the proposals he gave and he told me to get an attonery suddenly. I'm just asking for my money back because I've already returned the diamond ring. How that seller can do buisiness like that I cannot understand. Why would they want to go through an attorney? Wouldn't they lose much more money this way? Plus, if I posted bad reviews about his company, he will lose more money. I don't want to tell his company's name yet as I'm trying one more time to reason with him. If he still does not refund my money I will definitely take stronger courses of action and definitely get their name out to as many places as I can. I have recently found that company was once complained about on this site. If only I had seen that thread before buying the ring from him. I feel so bad theese days. so much stress... still need ppl's helps and advised. Thanks so much
Posted: 5/29/2005 12:04:29 AM

P: 5/29/2005 12:45:00 AM
windowshopper Ideal Rock Total Posts: 2,023 Last Post: 7/25/2006 Member Since: 7/11/2004	This is what you need to do: 1- write an email and letter saying the same thing: stating all the events and dates, what the policy was at the time of your purchase etc. Say that you want your money returned immediately. THEN go online and look upp Better Business Bureau in whatever your state is............file a compllaint online. ( You would be amazed at the power of filing such a complaint..........I have had great success) Then if you pay by credit card you call the c.c. company asap and ask customer service how to get the credit card co to go after the company. If you did not pay by c.c., still contact your bank and ask for assistance explaining your situation--often they can write a letter and advise you! GEt going ...................at least if you have to employ a lawyer you have taken action
Posted: 5/29/2005 12:45:00 AM

P: 5/29/2005 4:44:25 AM
ATOM Rough Rock Total Posts: 9 Last Post: 6/6/2005 Member Since: 5/27/2005	Hi,Windowshopper! Thank you for your advice. I think what you wrote will help me a lot. I've already filed a complaint with the BBB in the state the company is located in. I'll also write to my local area BBB too. I will also try to contact to my bank also. Thanks again! Have a nice holiday!
Posted: 5/29/2005 4:44:25 AM

P: 5/29/2005 7:11:01 PM
lop Ideal Rock Total Posts: 2,651 Last Post: 9/7/2009 Member Since: 6/14/2003	Agreed -- this sounds like a company in trouble. I would take action as quickly as possible, or it may be too late if they go out of business. I would NOT accept a long term payment.
Posted: 5/29/2005 7:11:01 PM

P: 5/30/2005 2:39:28 AM
ATOM Rough Rock Total Posts: 9 Last Post: 6/6/2005 Member Since: 5/27/2005	Hi, thanks for all the advice. I know I should get a lawyer but I'm afraid iit would cost more than I paid. I'll also tell that company's name to let ppl know about how that compnay does business. I definitely don't want others to go through what I am going through. I think that compnay's policy is unblelievbale and inreputable. Today I got a reply and he said: "Hi, Please have your attorney contact us or choose one of the two options I gave you. There is nothing else we can do at this time. We may be in a better situation next year.Thanks" Mmmmm.. he still doesn't consider his customer who is not satisfied! If his company can hire the attorney... then wouldn't they have money? Strange they can hire and pay money to the attorney but can't pay my refund which may be cheaper than that. I've just replied to him so I am again waitting for his reply. I'll definitely take further action. BTW this is the email I wrote. Does it look okay? I tried to include advice I got here and in other forums and people I've ask. If you have some advice Please tell me. "I can understand if your company is having cash flow issues at the moment, however this should not matter as I returned the merchandise in February before your policy changed. Please understand that 2 years is too long a time period for the payments. If your company is having issues returning my refund which is a relatively small sum compared to other jewelery purchases how am I to know if you will even be here 2 years from now? I hope you understand my situation as well. I will consider contacting an attorney among other courses of action, however in the meantime here is what I would like to do: 1 - Could you please send me the email address and phone number where I can contact the president of your company. And his full Name. 2 - Could you please send me contact information for your company's attorney 3 - Please proceed with the monthly payments as you proposed: >(ii) A Cash Refund Payable in Installments. Under >this option, you will receive a full refund of the purchase price, PLUS >interest at the rate of 6% accruing from the date of purchase, all payable >in cash in 24 equal monthly installments. I would like the payments starting from the end of February when my ring was returned. I also want your company to schedule the payment with your bank so that the monthly payments are made automatically every month and deposited directly into my account. 4 - I would like your company to also provide a legally binding promissory note and security interest, with a default provision in the case that a payment is not made on time. Please send me the original promissory note with appropriate signatures and I will send a copy back if it is approved. Please let me know if your company will be able to do as stated above. As always, my main goal is to just get my refund as quickly as possible. I will continue to persue this, but in the meantime would like to receive at least part of my refund. I believe your company is sincere in wanting to honor the refund and beginning the monthly payments will help secure my belief. Thank you, If his company doesn't agree then I can contact to both police in my state and his state to claim and will start to put bad review in everywhere and let ppl knows his company's name. Even I may try to contact with media such as radio station<in his company's area>, News Network(national and local), Newspaper, Message bords, ActionLines, Consumer support Association,Organaization, etc. Do you have any idea that how much cost if I have a lawyer? I know I can go to a small court. Once again thank you for reading my messages and giving me advises.
Posted: 5/30/2005 2:39:28 AM

P: 5/30/2005 3:39:34 AM
Dancing Fire Ideal Rock Total Posts: 10,218 Last Post: 11/21/2009 Member Since: 4/3/2004	Date: 5/30/2005 2:39:28 AM Author: ATOM Hi, thanks for all the advice. I know I should get a lawyer but I'm afraid iit would cost more than I paid. I'll also tell that company's name to let ppl know about how that compnay does business. I definitely don't want others to go through what I am going through. I think that compnay's policy is unblelievbale and inreputable. Today I got a reply and he said: 'Hi, Please have your attorney contact us or choose one of the two options I gave you. There is nothing else we can do at this time. We may be in a better situation next year.Thanks' they won't be in business next yr. i guarantee you're not the only customer they owe money to.i hope it's not a large sum of money that you're trying to recover. it is always harder to find a "mind clean" stone than a eye clean stone.
Posted: 5/30/2005 3:39:34 AM

P: 5/30/2005 5:22:49 AM
ATOM Rough Rock Total Posts: 9 Last Post: 6/6/2005 Member Since: 5/27/2005	To Dancing Fire Yeah, I now know that this compnay is not doing well. So I am afraid that even if I haired a lawyer, that compnay might bankrupt and may be not able to get anything from it. So I try not to get a lawyer yet. I wish there would be a lawyer who works as free...like Action-Line. If that company doesn't agree with what I wrote then, I will contac to Local Action-Line, contact to law-enforcement officeals at local & state level. And, today I found the site of Government Fraud Complaints Centers<Federal n State>,national Fraud Info and etc. I can contact with them later! Also FBI web site has Internet Crime Compliant Center. Thanks
Posted: 5/30/2005 5:22:49 AM

P: 5/30/2005 11:59:06 AM
fire&ice Ideal Rock Total Posts: 7,827 Last Post: 3/30/2009 Member Since: 7/22/2002	I'm no attorney - but by agreeing to take the payments - aren't you essentially agreeing to their terms? Don't you have a friend that is a lawyer who could just send a demand for payment nasty gram? I've never been charged. They are pushing the issue with the attorney because they are betting you won't get one. Definitely having cash flow problems. And, maybe a leap of faith - but they could be on the brink of bankruptcy - making good faith efforts.
Posted: 5/30/2005 11:59:06 AM

P: 5/31/2005 12:17:14 PM
codex57 Ideal Rock Total Posts: 1,492 Last Post: 1/21/2008 Member Since: 12/18/2004	Unless you simply hire a lawyer to write a threatening letter, it might cost more in attorney fees than it's worth. I'd make a lawyer a last resort (other than drafting a letter on the lawyer's letterhead as a scare tactic). Scare tactic might not be all that effective depending on how bad the seller's cash flow problems are.
Posted: 5/31/2005 12:17:14 PM

P: 5/31/2005 5:22:43 PM
NoonersMom Cut Rock Total Posts: 353 Last Post: 6/16/2005 Member Since: 12/14/2004	Get a lawyer to write the nasty letter. Time is of the essence. It sounds like they are having financial issues. If you would like to see a nice chunk of your change returned, do not wait! I had a friend who had an issue with a mix up over the storage of his motorcycle. The storage place was being unreasonable, I recommended contacting someone. He contacted a lawyer, lawyer wrote a nasty letter, situation was reasonably resolved within a few days. Cost of the lawyer to write a letter....$200. That seems like a small price to pay when it may bring immediate results in returning thousands of dollars. Good luck! Keep us posted.
Posted: 5/31/2005 5:22:43 PM

P: 6/1/2005 4:24:05 AM
ATOM Rough Rock Total Posts: 9 Last Post: 6/6/2005 Member Since: 5/27/2005	Now, I decided to let ppl know the seller's name. Please BEWARE of Romancing The Stone Inc. (RTC Inc). I wished that I had a chance to know this website before purchacing from this seller. I've seen that this compnay has some more different name. Now I am looking for them to tell ppl. When I found them I will tell you guys. You can read this airticles to http://www.pricescope.com/idealbb/view.asp?mode=viewtopic&topicID=13242 The salesperson, he wrote some messages Diamond4All is his handlename. And, this seller is the member of E-bay too. ID name is Custom_Diamond I have checked the seller's webpage, I guess refund part has been taken, and CEO name too. No question asked return policy<----------------- this policy was taken now!! This seller hasn't known that I've known this site and had a complaint here before. I would write bad reviews to anywhere from now on to share my experiance with this seller.
Posted: 6/1/2005 4:24:05 AM

P: 6/1/2005 2:44:19 PM
Bella Rough Rock Total Posts: 13 Last Post: 6/29/2006 Member Since: 9/9/2004	Even if you can't afford a lawyer, can you go to your City's main library (or even a legal library if your courts have one) and do a little research on filing your own claim, perhaps in small claims court? Some states have small claims courts that discourage the use of lawyers anyway (either they're not allowed, or the parties must bear their own attorneys fees, even if they win). Also, if there is a state department of commerce, the company may have to be registered there - the department's records would then give you the company's president's name, address, etc. I'm not a lawyer but I have had (unfortunately) to use my state's small claims court for another purpose, and I found the process to be tailored for the average Joe and relatively unintimidating. In any event, good luck with your efforts, whatever they may be.
Posted: 6/1/2005 2:44:19 PM

P: 6/1/2005 6:02:40 PM
bopitaddict Cut Rock Total Posts: 132 Last Post: 4/21/2006 Member Since: 12/1/2004	Date: 5/30/2005 11:59:06 AM Author: fire&ice I'm no attorney - but by agreeing to take the payments - aren't you essentially agreeing to their terms? Don't you have a friend that is a lawyer who could just send a demand for payment nasty gram? I've never been charged. They are pushing the issue with the attorney because they are betting you won't get one. Definitely having cash flow problems. And, maybe a leap of faith - but they could be on the brink of bankruptcy - making good faith efforts. not legal advice either, but i agree with fire & ice on the agreement thingy... it's sad when large companies can push around the consumer by hiding behind their 'lawyers'... if only you could find a group of people who have had similar situations to show that they habitually do this kind of thing... best of luck with getting your refund.
Posted: 6/1/2005 6:02:40 PM

P: 6/2/2005 4:06:45 AM
ATOM Rough Rock Total Posts: 9 Last Post: 6/6/2005 Member Since: 5/27/2005	Hello, everybody! Could you give me advice on where I can post my bad experience and share my story with other ppl? As I wrote, I don't want other ppl to have the same experience that I am having. Since I am new here, is there a place on these forums where I can post a new thread about my experience and the company's information? I'd like to post my experience, but I don't want to break any forum rules or offend any people. Does anyone know of other forums where I can share my experience? Thank you so much for all your help and advice. I've been exchanging emails with David at RTS, Inc and have had no progress. I think it's obvious that he does not care about his customers and no matter what I say or how I try to reason with him, he is not going to listen. Although I've asked him repeatedly to refund my money all at once he continues to refuse and just directs all action to his attorney. In our last exchange he said his attorney will be sending me an agreement. I'll review the agreement, but am certain I won't agree to any terms other than a full refund. 24 months is just too long. Everyone here has been so helpful and I've found out a lot of good information. I've been trying to find out more information about refund policies. Has anyone heard of such a refund policy where the seller would pay back the buyer monthly instead of all at once? RTS, Inc has been so stubborn in insisting on doing this through an attorney, I'm left wondering why. I've even asked him directly... but all he did was tell me to get a lawyer and directed me to his lawyer. I found another webpage of this seller: http://www.directjewelysource.com Thanks again all
Posted: 6/2/2005 4:06:45 AM

P: 6/5/2005 3:55:09 AM
ATOM Rough Rock Total Posts: 9 Last Post: 6/6/2005 Member Since: 5/27/2005	Hi,I contacted to Action-Line in my area. It will help me but so far I just try to write my complain to Some agancies such as State's Office of Consumer Protection in both area, JVC. I will contact to some agancies in NY too. I told him what I have done and he just said "This is your right as a consumer" I know he is wasting his time and he doesn't really care about his customer who isn't happy with his business. He just wanna keep my money and sell his diamonds that's all. Until someone force him to pay, he isn't going to pay, I guess.
Posted: 6/5/2005 3:55:09 AM

P: 6/5/2005 10:09:59 AM
Rascal49 Ideal Rock Total Posts: 4,350 Last Post: 7/16/2007 Member Since: 7/25/2004	Atom, just a thought, but try your local law school. Often there are "clinics" that are run by law professors or lawyers in the specialized areas that supervise law students in actually working on real life cases they take in. Perhaps someone there can help you or just give you some advice. Also, you can file a report on http://www.ripoffreport.com/. That way, if anyone searches for this company's name, your complaint will be one of the top hits. It is a way to tell the internet community about this particular company and to document your case. Perhaps he won't like his company being complained about so much around the internet that he just might "find" some money or at least become easier to work with. It's worth your time in my opinion. Good luck and please keep us informed! ________________________________ Michelle AKA Stretch4 I intend to live forever... so far, so good.
Posted: 6/5/2005 10:09:59 AM

P: 6/5/2005 11:19:41 AM
perry Ideal Rock Total Posts: 1,782 Last Post: 11/16/2009 Member Since: 9/19/2004	ATOM: If a company is in financial trouble time is of the essance on your actions. A Lawyer writing the proper letter may allow you to collect later on if not right away; while your email may get you next to nothing. I have only once hired a lawyer to write a letter for me (I actually provided a draft). It was the cheapest thing I ever did even though the situation involved no money. Just the knowledge that you have retained a lawyer is often a huge assett. The company involved "changed their tune" immediately. I think the letter only cost me $40 - but that was 15 years ago. Today I would expect to pay about $100. Perry
Posted: 6/5/2005 11:19:41 AM

P: 6/6/2005 4:14:40 AM
ATOM Rough Rock Total Posts: 9 Last Post: 6/6/2005 Member Since: 5/27/2005	To Stretch4 and Perry Hello and Thank you for your advice. Stretch4, thank you for the link. I will report to ripoffireport. I think this seller wants to keep my money and wants me to choose their loose diamonds instead. I think I've done all that has been suggested so far I guess it is time to get a lawyer to write a letter to this company as everyone has suggested. Hopefully it will help. I have gotten so much stress from this company and wanna move on quickly! I told the seller that I've contacted many agencies and he would be contacted. He just replyed "This is your right to do as a consumer".. but apparently he doesn't think I have the right to a prompt refund. He doesn't have any respect for his customers and I've never ever got apology from him about this case or changed policy. I really want to get this incident out to as many places that I can. I don't think this company deserves to be in business and hope my story will warn potential customers about this company's less than honest business practices. Mahalo=Thank you Atom
Posted: 6/6/2005 4:14:40 AM

P: 6/6/2005 10:23:45 AM
pearcrazy Ideal Rock Total Posts: 1,438 Last Post: 11/27/2008 Member Since: 5/16/2004	Date: 6/1/2005 4:24:05 AM Author: ATOM Now, I decided to let ppl know the seller's name. Please BEWARE of Romancing The Stone Inc. (RTC Inc). I wished that I had a chance to know this website before purchacing from this seller. I've seen that this compnay has some more different name. Now I am looking for them to tell ppl. When I found them I will tell you guys. You can read this airticles to http://www.pricescope.com/idealbb/view.asp?mode=viewtopic&topicID=13242 The salesperson, he wrote some messages Diamond4All is his handlename. And, this seller is the member of E-bay too. ID name is Custom_Diamond I have checked the seller's webpage, I guess refund part has been taken, and CEO name too. No question asked return policy<----------------- this policy was taken now!! This seller hasn't known that I've known this site and had a complaint here before. I would write bad reviews to anywhere from now on to share my experiance with this seller. I read all of that thread start to finish. So, this is the same company? Does anyone know if Dublingirl ever got a resolution to her problem? It seem like that seller has a problem giving refunds. "Have you ever noticed, anyone going slower than you is an idiot, and anyone going faster than you is a maniac"--George Carlin
Posted: 6/6/2005 10:23:45 AM

P: 6/6/2005 11:36:56 AM
fire&ice Ideal Rock Total Posts: 7,827 Last Post: 3/30/2009 Member Since: 7/22/2002	Date: 6/6/2005 10:23:45 AM Author: pearcrazy Date: 6/1/2005 4:24:05 AM Author: ATOM Now, I decided to let ppl know the seller's name. Please BEWARE of Romancing The Stone Inc. (RTC Inc). I wished that I had a chance to know this website before purchacing from this seller. I've seen that this compnay has some more different name. Now I am looking for them to tell ppl. When I found them I will tell you guys. You can read this airticles to http://www.pricescope.com/idealbb/view.asp?mode=viewtopic&amp;topicID=13242 The salesperson, he wrote some messages Diamond4All is his handlename. And, this seller is the member of E-bay too. ID name is Custom_Diamond I have checked the seller's webpage, I guess refund part has been taken, and CEO name too. No question asked return policy&lt;----------------- this policy was taken now!! This seller hasn't known that I've known this site and had a complaint here before. I would write bad reviews to anywhere from now on to share my experiance with this seller. I read all of that thread start to finish. So, this is the same company? Does anyone know if Dublingirl ever got a resolution to her problem? It seem like that seller has a problem giving refunds. Not as far as we know. It was a nightmare for her. She was the one that was accused of fraud. If I recall correctly, Atom & Dublingirl wasn't the only ones who have posted about several facets of this company in a negative light.
Posted: 6/6/2005 11:36:56 AM

P: 1/26/2006 10:39:44 PM
Sicksadandsorry Rough Rock Total Posts: 4 Last Post: 7/13/2006 Member Since: 1/26/2006	I have found at least 2 other cases just like Dublin girl's and Atom's through this forum. Now you can add me to the ranks. We received a ring via ebay that was seriously found, not the grade it was presented as. I immiediately contacted them to let them know that we wanted to return the ring ASAP, within their 7 day time frame. they gave me hell, accusing us of swapping their diamonds. They gave me some hoops to jump through before they would issue an RA#. I fulfilled them and they finally gave me the RA#. We returned the ring well before the 7 days was up. Since them, well, we just can't seem to contact these people. They don't answer the phone, return calls, respond to e-mails. I have no doubt that they will pull the same scam with us as well. I have not heard of anyone ever getting their money back from these guys. We will get a lawyer if we have to just on principle. Certainly if we all combine our efforts their must be something that can be done. They go by 3 company names that I know of: Direct Jewelers Source Perfect Jewel, Inc. Romancing the Stone
Posted: 1/26/2006 10:39:44 PM

P: 1/27/2006 1:18:12 PM
MiniMouse Ideal Rock Total Posts: 1,013 Last Post: 11/5/2007 Member Since: 12/1/2004	Sicksadandsorry, I feel really bad for you having gone through such an awful experience like ATOM. It's awful that certain vendors work in such unscrupulous ways. It's good that you've shared your experience and mentioned the vendor names used, so that others avoid giving them any business. I hope you manage to get your money back. Keep us posted. Good luck!
Posted: 1/27/2006 1:18:12 PM

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