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 » RockyTalky
»  » Knock Off Settings
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Knock Off Settings |
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| P: 5/12/2005 5:18:45 PM | |
Smith Rough Rock Total Posts: 43 Last Post: 6/21/2005 Member Since: 4/28/2005 |
I'm trying to understand the tradeoffs involved with choosing a knock off setting. The pro to a knock off setting is price. What are the cons to consider with a knock off setting?
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| Posted: 5/12/2005 5:18:45 PM | |
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There are 8 replies to this message. There are 8 replies on this page. |
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| P: 5/12/2005 5:28:40 PM | |
valeria101 Ideal Rock Total Posts: 14,048 Last Post: 4/30/2006 Member Since: 8/29/2003 |
Without the brand, it is up to you to insure quality. Otherwise, most things can be done - it is not that jewelry brands hold some sort of technical advantage over other jewelers. Some intricate jewelry designs might imply that, but it is really unusual. That saying it in one word, as far as I understand. Ana "The greatest experts are only as good as the sum total of what they have seen." [Souren Melikian] |
| Posted: 5/12/2005 5:28:40 PM | |
| P: 5/12/2005 5:57:04 PM | |
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Smith Rough Rock Total Posts: 43 Last Post: 6/21/2005 Member Since: 4/28/2005 |
Date: 5/12/2005 5:28:40 PM Author: valeria101 Without the brand, it is up to you to insure quality. Otherwise, most things can be done - it is not that jewelry brands hold some sort of technical advantage over other jewelers. Some intricate jewelry designs might imply that, but it is really unusual. That saying it in one word, as far as I understand. Thanks -- I read a lot of previous posts via the search tool, and many of agree with you that you need to check the quality. I know what that means (sort of) for diamonds from reading this site and others, but I have no idea what to look for setting quality??
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| Posted: 5/12/2005 5:57:04 PM | |
| P: 5/12/2005 6:22:48 PM | |
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Finally Decisive! Cut Rock Total Posts: 469 Last Post: 1/13/2008 Member Since: 10/10/2004 |
I think a good way to judge a "knock off" setting is to look around and see whether other PS-ers have bought and loved it it. For example, the Tiffany imitation settings from places like Superbcert and Dirt Cheap Diamonds have been bought by a ton of PS-ers and everybody always raves about how identical and perfect they are, and great workmanship etc. On that same note, lots of people have had places like Whiteflash imitate a setting with spectacular results. You can't really get a guarantee of the same quality as the brand-name setting (which is why you pay the big bucks for the brand name) but perhaps its possible to guage through PS whether others have had success with that setting. What "knock off" setting are you considering?
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| Posted: 5/12/2005 6:22:48 PM | |
| P: 5/15/2005 8:41:17 AM | |
part gypsy Ideal Rock Total Posts: 1,758 Last Post: 11/24/2009 Member Since: 11/7/2004 |
The quality can be the same, better or worse than the name brand, just depending who is doing the work. The other con is that it may not look exactly the same as the piece you are considering. If you want an exact duplicate (versus something inspired by) the more conservative route is to get the original.
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| Posted: 5/15/2005 8:41:17 AM | |
| P: 5/15/2005 9:56:47 PM | |
RockDoc Ideal Rock Total Posts: 2,509 Last Post: 6/17/2007 Member Since: 8/16/2000 |
Con? The first three letters of conscience. This you have to live with. I suppose some of this depends on how you'd feel if your original conception of design was "stolen" by someone else. Put yourself in the position of the designer, and see if you'd feel enraged by having someone reproduce your original design. In the situation where the seller or designer charges unconscienable prices or demands that the diamond you want set must be sold by them, it is very easy to take the alternative course offered in the knock off world. I think also a lot of it is how unique the design actually is, and how well it's executed. Rockdoc
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| Posted: 5/15/2005 9:56:47 PM | |
| P: 5/16/2005 12:15:57 AM | |
strmrdr Ideal Rock Total Posts: 23,296 Last Post: 10/9/2009 Member Since: 11/1/2003 |
Considering how much down right illegal activity goes on in the designer "name" setting business I wouldnt buy from more than a few of them just on general principals. I hate illegal price fixing with a passion and those that engage in it even more so. Some info on what to look for in settings is here: http://www.pricescope.com/idealbb/view.asp?topicID=18307 ........... Karl has joined the diamond trade and is now posting as Karl_K |
| Posted: 5/16/2005 12:15:57 AM | |
| P: 5/16/2005 11:20:59 AM | |
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Smith Rough Rock Total Posts: 43 Last Post: 6/21/2005 Member Since: 4/28/2005 |
Strmrdr, thanks for pointing me to that great thread!
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| Posted: 5/16/2005 11:20:59 AM | |
| P: 5/16/2005 2:21:31 PM | |
niceice Ideal Rock Total Posts: 1,792 Last Post: 7/22/2008 Member Since: 1/29/2003 |
A lot of it depends on what you are asking to be designed... If you are asking a jeweler to completely reproduce somebody else's original creation, that is illegal and immorral. However this can be a gray line of sorts in our industry because many of the designers have knocked each other off to the point where it is practically impossible to determine the true origin of some designs... The "Tiffany" knife edge sold by many of us is not original to anybody really, it is a fairly common setting that has been made by thousands of jewelers for years and is only called a "Tiffany" because of public perception. The unique scroll pattern on the side of a Tacori ring however is an original patented design that is enforceable and heavily protected to the sound of 25 or so beating drums held by a team of attorneys employed by Tacori to protect their interests... Can somebody make a similar concept? Yes, providing that they do not incorporate the same design pattern going around the ring. Sit in a room full of designers and you'll hear "that isn't an original design, he/she stole that from Jeff Cooper, Tacori, Judith Conway, Judy Evans, D. Vatche, Peter Storm" blah, blah, blah... but look through some books showing jewelry from the Victorian era and a lot of it starts to look pretty familiar. Is it ethical to take a picture of a ring "designed" by another person and ask another jeweler to make it for you? Is it ethical to burn a copy of a DVD that you rent at the local video store? Ethical to load a copy of Microsoft Office on four different computers? No, No, No... But you can pay to have a studio shoot an original film for you and it can be similar in concept and you can pay to have a person or company custom design a software platform for you providing that they do not copy the code from Microsoft or impliment any of their proprietary concepts into the design of your new software. Some people will say "If I can get the same thing for less from somebody else then I'm entitled to do it" and you're right... But are you really getting the same thing? And will it really cost less? The cost of developing a designer setting is spread across the number of rings sold by the designer... The profit is usually set by the designer in an attempt to maintain the integrity of their brand name across the world - we're not very happy about having somebody tell us how much we have to sell something for, but that is another topic - anyway, when you pay to have a ring "knocked off" you are paying all of the design cost and the cost of that is spread across "one" item that may or may not match the original you are hoping to copy depending on the interpretation of the jeweler making the ring for you... If you present your fiance with a knock off of a designer ring and part of the appeal of the original ring was the recognitiion of the brand name amongst her friends or the flow of a certain curve in the ring or a unique little object embedded into the design that was not duplicated exactly in the design of the new ring, well... then you've just spent a lot of money for nothing but the pleasure of disappointing your fiance with what may be perceived as a cheap knock off... Cheap in her eyes, not in your pocketbook... Lots of rings look "similar" but we have a lot of in-store clients who are intently focused on the production of one designer over another despite the similarity of the designs and this is why we bring up this point... The two girls who were in the other day and drooling over a Tacori piece wouldn't look twice at a very similar piece that they were shown from the line of a sales rep. who was in the store despite the cost of the ring being about half of the Tacori piece... It weighed less and was not as well made, but it "looked" real similar... The girls were in love with the whole idea of the Tacori piece and they walked into the store that way, all we did was show it to them... So the concept of knock-off's runs deeper than ethics, quality or price - it is largely about perception and the only people who can answer the question for you to that regard is you and your fiance. Talk about the ring and decide what is important to the two of you. Todd L. Gray, President |
| Posted: 5/16/2005 2:21:31 PM | |
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