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ť Are all diamonds in the US blood free?

Are all diamonds in the US blood free?

P: 2/9/2005 11:41:17 PM
ilovebling Rough Rock Total Posts: 71 Last Post: 7/24/2006 Member Since: 12/24/2004	My friend just sent me this sad sad link on amnesty international about "blood diamonds" http://www.amnestyusa.org/amnestynow/diamonds.html Made me want to cry and not want diamonds anymore! but after researching further it seems like most diamonds in the USA are "conflict free" because of a certification called the Kimberly Process - http://www.globalpolicy.org/security/issues/diamond/2001/0706diam.htm I really hope this is true! I was so upset for awhile until I read more into this. Does anyone have more insight on this?
Posted: 2/9/2005 11:41:17 PM

There are 15 replies to this message. There are 15 replies on this page.

P: 2/9/2005 11:57:33 PM
pqcollectibles Ideal Rock Total Posts: 3,441 Last Post: 6/18/2005 Member Since: 2/23/2003	Yep the Kimberly process is for real. Bad people find a way to get around it by washing diamonds thru legit countries for a bill of lading from that country. Those diamonds do find their way into the system somewhere, but typically not in the higher end market. Most PS Vendors are dealing in the higher end of the market. The major Vendors here tend to work thru long established channels. People they know personally as suppliers. You can feel fairly confident that diamonds you may consider from reputable Vendors have been purchased from reliable sources that follow the Kimberly process all the way from the mine to the jeweler's show case. Why use a big word when a diminutive word would be succinct! ____________________________________________________________ Just a regular person trying to be helpful. Consult a Pro prior to purchase!
Posted: 2/9/2005 11:57:33 PM

P: 2/10/2005 12:01:37 AM
Garry H (Cut Nut) Ideal Rock Total Posts: 11,587 Last Post: 11/25/2009 Member Since: 8/16/2000	Is any oil, gold or dollar note you ever touched blood free? Garry Holloway FGAA DipDT HCA and Ideal-scope developer http://www.ideal-scope.com and http://www.HollowayDiamonds.com.au
Posted: 2/10/2005 12:01:37 AM

P: 2/10/2005 12:10:56 AM
ilovebling Rough Rock Total Posts: 71 Last Post: 7/24/2006 Member Since: 12/24/2004	Date: 2/10/2005 121:37 AM Author: Garry H (Cut Nut) Is any oil, gold or dollar note you ever touched blood free? Possibly not but it's hard to not buy oil and use money in our society; buying diamonds is a luxury, not a necessity! Thanks PQ! I'm glad I don't have to feel guilty about my diamond purchases now. :)
Posted: 2/10/2005 12:10:56 AM

P: 2/10/2005 12:14:32 AM
strmrdr Ideal Rock Total Posts: 23,296 Last Post: 10/9/2009 Member Since: 11/1/2003	If it bugs there is always Canadian diamonds. They cost slightly more but they havent been in terrorists hands. ........... Karl has joined the diamond trade and is now posting as Karl_K
Posted: 2/10/2005 12:14:32 AM

P: 2/10/2005 8:22:36 AM
Lord Summerisle Ideal Rock Total Posts: 859 Last Post: 11/19/2009 Member Since: 12/14/2004	This is John... John drives an SUV... This is the gas john puts in his SUV this is the executive... that bought he fuel that john put in his SUV these are the countries..... Ahem... _____________________ I Post Therefore I Am I am no Expert (I'm not a drip under pressure ;) ) Seek Someone who is for better info
Posted: 2/10/2005 8:22:36 AM

P: 2/10/2005 6:17:53 PM
Emeraldgirl Cut Rock Total Posts: 470 Last Post: 3/29/2005 Member Since: 11/11/2004	There's also the Argyle diamond mine in Australia they are conflict free but they do bleed you dry to pay for them. When the doors of perception are cleansed people will see things as they truely are - Jim Morrison At times one remains faithful to a cause only because its opponents do not cease to be insipid. - Friedrich Nietzsche
Posted: 2/10/2005 6:17:53 PM

P: 2/10/2005 7:50:27 PM
strmrdr Ideal Rock Total Posts: 23,296 Last Post: 10/9/2009 Member Since: 11/1/2003	Date: 2/10/2005 8:22:36 AM Author: Lord Summerisle This is John... John drives an SUV... This is the gas john puts in his SUV this is the executive... that bought he fuel that john put in his SUV these are the countries..... Ahem... For 2003 the countries the US imported the most oil from: Canada (17%) Saudi Arabia (14.5%) Mexico (13%) Venezuela (11%) Most of the stuff from Mexico and Venezuela is what is used for most Gasoline. The saudi oil is used for all 3 depending on grade. The Canadian oil is mostly used in manufacturing and most US oil is used for industrial and heating use. Roughly 39% of the total usage was US oil. Gas costs for a $1.59 price point: Expense Amount Production cost 15˘ to 60˘ Producer profit 53˘ to 8˘ Refining cost 13˘ Marketing cost 5˘ Transportation cost 15˘ Retailer cost 6˘ Refiner, marketer, transp. & retailer profit 10˘ US Taxes 19˘ Average state taxes 23˘ TOTAL $1.59 ........... Karl has joined the diamond trade and is now posting as Karl_K
Posted: 2/10/2005 7:50:27 PM

P: 2/12/2005 9:48:21 PM
denverappraiser Ideal Rock Total Posts: 4,618 Last Post: 11/25/2009 Member Since: 7/21/2004	I absolutely agree that the pedigree of diamonds and other materials we consume is an important part of being a good world citizen. There is more to diamonds than simply a pretty pebble and I very much like to see my money go to support the good guys. Almost much everyone agrees with this sentiment but its remarkably difficult to work out the details. Buying Canadian stones is a popular tactic but Botswana (known as the country that diamonds built) is a stable, growing and successful nation that treats both their citizens and their businesses fairly and is actually serves as a model for the remainder of Africa. By avoiding all African diamonds because of pirates in Sierra Leone, you are withdrawing your support from people who, I think, are quite deserving of your business. Its like avoiding Canadian products because there are Central American drug lords who do business on the same continent. By buying online, you are withdrawing a part of your participation in the local community and are enriching an anonymous seller at the expense of your neighbors. By avoiding sales tax, you are skipping your share of support for police, fire and other public services. This doesnt mean that you should shop at a local store that treats you badly but finding the right balance is important if youre going to be a socially responsible consumer. Buying old stones that were mined decades ago is another popular approach and it means that the current crop of African criminals werent involved in the production but there may have been other problems. The Australians and the Canadians stole their land from the previous residents after all, and they werent very nice about it. The behavior of the British East India Company was less than sterling and the African mining companies have very spotted histories. Just how much history can you get on a stone and do you really want it? Its a difficult set of questions. The Kimberly process works pretty well for newly mined diamonds but its definitely not without its problems. Personally, I think its the best thing going and its worth supporting. Every stone legally imported into the United States must comply and you can be reasonably confident of the sources if you buy from a legitimate dealer. The US government and the diamond industry as a group are very serious about solving this problem and theyve made tremendous progress. Neil Beaty GG(GIA) ISA NAJA Independent Appraisals in Denver There's never a crowd when you go that extra mile.
Posted: 2/12/2005 9:48:21 PM

P: 2/13/2005 11:45:56 AM
Lord Summerisle Ideal Rock Total Posts: 859 Last Post: 11/19/2009 Member Since: 12/14/2004	Date: 2/10/2005 7:50:27 PM Author: strmrdr Date: 2/10/2005 8:22:36 AM Author: Lord Summerisle This is John... John drives an SUV... This is the gas john puts in his SUV this is the executive... that bought he fuel that john put in his SUV these are the countries..... Ahem... For 2003 the countries the US imported the most oil from: Canada (17%) Saudi Arabia (14.5%) Mexico (13%) Venezuela (11%) Most of the stuff from Mexico and Venezuela is what is used for most Gasoline. The saudi oil is used for all 3 depending on grade. The Canadian oil is mostly used in manufacturing and most US oil is used for industrial and heating use. Roughly 39% of the total usage was US oil. Gas costs for a $1.59 price point: Expense Amount Production cost 15¢ to 60¢ Producer profit 53¢ to 8¢ Refining cost 13¢ Marketing cost 5¢ Transportation cost 15¢ Retailer cost 6¢ Refiner, marketer, transp. & retailer profit 10¢ US Taxes 19¢ Average state taxes 23¢ TOTAL $1.59 sorry... I just found those type of ads amusing really... in the same way i laughed when i got Season 6 of Buffy the Vampire Slayer - and each vid had a 'piracy funds Terrorism' notice at the start... and i think 'Naw it dinne! It buys that bloke John a couple of pints after a trip to the local car boot sale.' _____________________ I Post Therefore I Am I am no Expert (I'm not a drip under pressure ;) ) Seek Someone who is for better info
Posted: 2/13/2005 11:45:56 AM

P: 2/13/2005 11:47:31 AM
perry Ideal Rock Total Posts: 1,782 Last Post: 11/16/2009 Member Since: 9/19/2004	Neil, and others, gives a good starting outline on the various issues: Just what do you mean by "blood free," and how important is it to american society. Neil mentions that the canadian and austrailan diamond properties were taken from the native populations. The same can be said for the vast majority of America - taken away from the native population. Those who feel the need to use ilicit drugs. I can't immagine a more bloody commodity in the world. Almost all american money (bill form) will test positive for illicit drugs because of the volumn of illicit drug trade in america. Does this mean that the use of money itself is not "blood free." Not all blood is blead directly. Most of the damage is by the bleading your soul and values due to choices many people are forced into by their job or other situations. How many here have had ajob where they were asked to compromise their personal integrity somehow. All too common. I have worked hard to find a job where that is minimized from other jobs, but I can't say that I have found the perfect job on that score yet (which is why I am working to build my own side business). I am less concerned about the small % of diamonds that are somehow tainted with direct violence during their chain between the ground and the current end customer than I am about the other items in society. By the way, someone injures themselves, or helps another who is injured, and their diamond jewelry gets covered with blood. does that make it a blood diamond?
Posted: 2/13/2005 11:47:31 AM

P: 2/13/2005 11:55:39 AM
innerkitten Ideal Rock Total Posts: 2,923 Last Post: 11/23/2009 Member Since: 8/2/2003	Ilovebling, Yep some probably find there way into the market. You might notice that if you post a question like this on Pricescope that alot of people especially venors and some buyers are going to defend the diamond industry. You might be better off getting the facts on a site like amnesty internatianal. Hope I haven't insulted anyone but it does seem to be the case.
Posted: 2/13/2005 11:55:39 AM

P: 2/13/2005 12:49:08 PM
denverappraiser Ideal Rock Total Posts: 4,618 Last Post: 11/25/2009 Member Since: 7/21/2004	innerkitten, It's true that the most informed people on the diamond trade tend to be insiders in the industry and our active consumers. This surprises you? Here's the AI position on the matter. They recommend that consumers should patronize jewelers and suppliers who participate in the Kimberly Process. Not only have they not come up with a better plan, they actually claim credit for the KP in their press releases. They quite specificaly do NOT recommend blanketly avoiding the purchase of African diamonds or any other African products because this action damages exactly the people they want to help. Neil ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Perry, I didn't pick on the Canadians and the Australians because they are more guilty of social crimes than most other countries. I chose them because they are diamond producing countries that are regularly presented as 'blood free'. Neil Beaty GG(GIA) ISA NAJA Independent Appraisals in Denver There's never a crowd when you go that extra mile.
Posted: 2/13/2005 12:49:08 PM

P: 4/16/2005 12:53:57 PM
oshilig Rough Rock Total Posts: 12 Last Post: 4/27/2005 Member Since: 4/16/2005	I believe it was Nelson Mandella who said that if people stopped buying African diamonds the economies of most southern African countries would collapse. However, it is important to have some level of conciousness when it comes to the origin of your diamond. The Kimberly Process isn't perfect, but it's all we've got right now, and a good step forward.
Posted: 4/16/2005 12:53:57 PM

P: 4/16/2005 1:42:34 PM
innerkitten Ideal Rock Total Posts: 2,923 Last Post: 11/23/2009 Member Since: 8/2/2003	Yes your right diamonds are not a necessity and yes you can always buy Canadian if you want to. I think the Kimberley process is great and yeah you might want to do some research of your own too. You will get different answers depending on who you ask.
Posted: 4/16/2005 1:42:34 PM

P: 4/16/2005 3:05:29 PM
sparklish Cut Rock Total Posts: 103 Last Post: 8/16/2005 Member Since: 3/7/2005	I agree, getting the best information on blood diamonds is to go straight to the source. http://www.kimberleyprocess.com/ It has some good FAQs. If your retailer can't tell you where it's from, consider looking elsewhere, or, as some suggested, buying Canadian, Australian etc. When we were looking at Canadian stones, they were not more expensive than others. Also many changes in the industry are influenced by the wants of buyers, so asking about it is a good thing. I'm not sure what the discussion on oil, or the fact that Canadian land was seized from First Nations etc. has to do with the question regarding blood diamonds. While it's true we're all consumers and likely have some non-fair trade things in our homes, or perhaps live in a country that was seized from others, it doesn't mean that we should just give up on social justice. It's not in for a penny in for a pound. Being conscious about blood diamonds and not buying them can help avoid the terrible torture and atrocities faced in counties like Sierra Leone and is one step towards greater, fairer trade. Better a small step than nothing at all.
Posted: 4/16/2005 3:05:29 PM

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