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P: 1/20/2005 10:37:34 AM
Nicolas Rough Rock Total Posts: 19 Last Post: 1/27/2005 Member Since: 12/29/2004	It's just a question, I m French. I see big hole between European site and American concerning diamond education. American sites provide a sum of informations about diamond cut, especialy ideal cut Before having found my diamond, I talked about with french diamond sellers and they often said that ideal is an american concept of marketing as well as the laser inscription or GIA renom I have bought a 0.6 round with a 61.5% table!!! You have well seen : it's far from ideal cut But it doesnt matter because it looks very good, much better than ideal cut i saw. I dont have laser inscription and dont want it because i dont want any advertisement on a symbol of eternity. I dont have GIA report because it doesnt provide more info than other (it may increase price even if diamaond is poor) but my diamond is not investment, it s for the one i want! dont care about resale value I just bought a diamond which looks nice And what i dont understand is : Why buying ideal (and often big) expensive gems and setting them in a common ring which all people have? Dont you think that rings doesnt need to be as beautiful as your diamond? and rare? It's just a question, dont hit me Edit : sorry for the error on the title : it's "...diamond set in a..."
Posted: 1/20/2005 10:37:34 AM

There are 23 replies to this message. There are 23 replies on this page.

P: 1/20/2005 10:55:06 AM
Avantika Rough Rock Total Posts: 53 Last Post: 3/15/2005 Member Since: 12/13/2004	And what i dont understand is : Why buying ideal (and often big) expensive gems and setting them in a common ring which all people have? Dont you think that rings doesnt need to be as beautiful as your diamond? and rare? What makes you think that one doesn't find the setting they buy beautiful? Maybe it's not pretty to you but they might love it! Just as you find your diamond to be beautiful another person might think it's not upto par. If you are happy with your diamond then that's great, why are you concerned about how others choose their diamonds?
Posted: 1/20/2005 10:55:06 AM

P: 1/20/2005 10:55:38 AM
Outlander Rough Rock Total Posts: 23 Last Post: 1/20/2005 Member Since: 1/15/2005	I buy what I like, ideal or not. Also, I think the majority of Americans do not buy ideal diamonds. Most don't know there is a difference. If you want to talk about marketing, it's the "4 C's". Even if you know nothing about diamonds, you know about the "4 C's". However, when you come to a place where most of the talk is about diamonds (here) you will find a different group of people with a different prespective on them. A prespective that goes beyond what all of the mass marketing is about. As for the setting, I have seen many different and unique ones that are made to compliment the diamond. No, there aren't alot of contemporary styles, but it's a very personal decision. I wear what I like, popular or unpopular. So, I'm wondering, since your diamond isn't "ideal" is it set in a common setting? It's just a question. Erin
Posted: 1/20/2005 10:55:38 AM

P: 1/20/2005 11:00:53 AM
Nicolas Rough Rock Total Posts: 19 Last Post: 1/27/2005 Member Since: 12/29/2004	What makes you think that one doesn't find the setting they buy beautiful? Maybe it's not pretty to you but they might love it! Just as you find your diamond to be beautiful another person might think it's not upto par. If you are happy with your diamond then that's great, why are you concerned about how others choose their diamonds? Sorry but I was sure that some would have reply like you! I m not judging what is beautifull or not but i m asking why most of people here are putting more importance on how and which diamond choosing than in the ring itself
Posted: 1/20/2005 11:00:53 AM

P: 1/20/2005 11:01:51 AM
Libster Ideal Rock Total Posts: 998 Last Post: 9/18/2009 Member Since: 10/21/2004	Bonjour Nicolas, That's about all I remember from French Class My diamond is far from ideal, but it's ideal to me! It's a warm "I" with a SI2 rating, and yes there is a black spot which I've come to love and often play "find the spot" when admiring my ring. As far as settings go, I'm not sure what your real question is. Everyone wants a setting that reflects who they are so you might find flashy or not so flashy, depending on the individual. What type of setting do you have? Would love to see it. ****************************** Diamonds.........Yield to Temptation!
Posted: 1/20/2005 11:01:51 AM

P: 1/20/2005 11:06:05 AM
Nicolas Rough Rock Total Posts: 19 Last Post: 1/27/2005 Member Since: 12/29/2004	Date: 1/20/2005 10:55:38 AM Author: Avalon     So, I'm wondering, since your diamond isn't 'ideal' is it set in a common setting?  It's just a question. I understand what you mean. The ring is under construction by a jeweler and is not common. BUT, not common because of the choice of my girlfriend! I prefered classic setting like the real Tiffany 6 prongs. I m only asking if We are not educated by marketing too much?
Posted: 1/20/2005 11:06:05 AM

P: 1/20/2005 11:09:22 AM
Avantika Rough Rock Total Posts: 53 Last Post: 3/15/2005 Member Since: 12/13/2004	Sorry but I was sure that some would have reply like you! Yeah couldn't disappoint you :) I m not judging what is beautifull or not but i m asking why most of people here are putting more importance on how and which diamond choosing than in the ring itself I don't think people give it any less importance. It's a two-step process. First you try to find the best diamond you can for your budget, who wouldnt! Then you search for a setting you think would be most pretty to show your diamond. That said, the choices differ from this point. Some people love the simple solitaire, some love side stones, pave etc. I think i spent equal time deciding on which diamond and which setting to pick. I don't think anyone would pick a beautiful diamond and decide that's it i'll just set into anything 'cause i've spent enough time on this. I think the setting is important and you can see how much time people spend finding settings just by reading some of the posts.
Posted: 1/20/2005 11:09:22 AM

P: 1/20/2005 11:12:00 AM
Libster Ideal Rock Total Posts: 998 Last Post: 9/18/2009 Member Since: 10/21/2004	Date: 1/20/2005 119:22 AM Author: Avantika Sorry but I was sure that some would have reply like you! Yeah couldn't disappoint you :) I m not judging what is beautifull or not but i m asking why most of people here are putting more importance on how and which diamond choosing than in the ring itself I don't think people give it any less importance. It's a two-step process. First you try to find the best diamond you can for your budget, who wouldnt! Then you search for a setting you think would be most pretty to show your diamond. That said, the choices differ from this point. Some people love the simple solitaire, some love side stones, pave etc. I think i spent equal time deciding on which diamond and which setting to pick. I don't think anyone would pick a beautiful diamond and decide that's it i'll just set into anything 'cause i've spent enough time on this. I think the setting is important and you can see how much time people spend finding settings just by reading some of the posts. If I hadn't been there with hubby for the ring purchase that is just what he would have done..."that's it i'll just set into anything cause i've spent enought time on this." LOL He really can't understand what all the fuss is over "bling"! ****************************** Diamonds.........Yield to Temptation!
Posted: 1/20/2005 11:12:00 AM

P: 1/20/2005 11:13:59 AM
Nicolas Rough Rock Total Posts: 19 Last Post: 1/27/2005 Member Since: 12/29/2004	Date: 1/20/2005 111:51 AM Author: Libster Bonjour Nicolas, That's about all I remember from French Class If i said "i'm french" it's not for hearing this kind of reply but for showing that there a difference concerning DIAMOND I don't care about what you think knowing about 60 millions of people (I can't do it myself) I don't critize anybody or country! right? I m just asking about diamond and settings Concerning the ring, it is hard to show it here because it's not ready yet
Posted: 1/20/2005 11:13:59 AM

P: 1/20/2005 11:15:42 AM
JohnQuixote Ideal Rock Total Posts: 5,212 Last Post: 5/24/2008 Member Since: 9/9/2004	Hello Nicolas. I think there are many people in America who feel the same way you do. However, this website is for people who like to learn about the science and measurements of diamonds. Ideal cut: There are measurements that are proven to have reliable visual results. It is well known that there are beautiful diamonds that may not be ideal cut. Some people just like to know all the specifics (especially when buying on the internet) while others will rely on their eyes alone. Laser inscription doesnt have anything to with the cut of a diamond. Its just something that has been made available to people. Some people want an inscription. Some people dont. The GIA is changing their system to provide more information on cut to the public. There are other labs (AGS especially) that already provide this information to those who want it. One value of these reports is that they help people have a basis for comparison on the internet or in other places where you cannot see the diamonds side by side. Another value is that many people like to have a pedigree for such a large investment. Again, some people want them. Some people dont. It is all very personal just as the setting is. You are correct. The simple solitaire tradition is common in America for a first ring. I believe many people buy a simple setting for an engagement ring because it is what they can afford, or because they dont know exactly what their future spouse will like best yet. In any event, it is all very personal (just like which wine people prefer, yes?) I hope these thoughts are helpful. John __________________________ John Pollard Whiteflash Director of Education 2004-2007
Posted: 1/20/2005 11:15:42 AM

P: 1/20/2005 11:20:32 AM
Outlander Rough Rock Total Posts: 23 Last Post: 1/20/2005 Member Since: 1/15/2005	Of course we are affected by marketing. It can be a negative affect as well though. I don't know how far reaching (to France?) the DeBeers 3-stone marketing concept is, but I can tell you that because of it and the sudden saturation of 3-stone rings, I will not buy a ring with 3 diamonds! I like diamonds and there are many fine looking 3-stone rings, but I won't buy one now because that's all you hear about. Anyway, I do hope we get to see your ring after it's done! Erin
Posted: 1/20/2005 11:20:32 AM

P: 1/20/2005 11:28:31 AM
Nicolas Rough Rock Total Posts: 19 Last Post: 1/27/2005 Member Since: 12/29/2004	Date: 1/20/2005 11:15:42 AM Author: JohnQuixote Hello Nicolas. I think there are many people in America who feel the same way you do.  However, this website is for people who like to learn about the science and measurements of diamonds. Ideal cut:  There are measurements that are proven to have reliable visual results.  It is well known that there are beautiful diamonds that may not be ideal cut.  Some people just like to know all the specifics (especially when buying on the internet) while others will rely on their eyes alone. Laser inscription doesnt have anything to with the cut of a diamond.  Its just something that has been made available to people.  Some people want an inscription.  Some people dont. The GIA is changing their system to provide more information on cut to the public.  There are other labs (AGS especially) that already provide this information to those who want it.  One value of these reports is that they help people have a basis for comparison on the internet or in other places where you cannot see the diamonds side by side.  Another value is that many people like to have a pedigree for such a large investment.  Again, some people want them.  Some people dont. It is all very personal just as the setting is. You are correct.  The simple solitaire tradition is common in America for a first ring.  I believe many people buy a simple setting for an engagement ring because it is what they can afford, or because they dont know exactly what their future spouse will like best yet. In any event, it is all very personal (just like which wine people prefer, yes?) I hope these thoughts are helpful. There are John but i think that somebody have forgotten it's only a symbol (even if diamonds are very beautifull for most of us) and pedigree mean nothing (after purchasing of course) My impressions when I read topics are that sometimes people buy a pedigree.
Posted: 1/20/2005 11:28:31 AM

P: 1/20/2005 11:45:28 AM
JohnQuixote Ideal Rock Total Posts: 5,212 Last Post: 5/24/2008 Member Since: 9/9/2004	You are correct Nicolas, except that the pedigree does have meaning to some people - but there is nothing wrong with that. There are many opinions and many personalities. Think about watches. Some people want an expensive watch or a name brand like Rolex. Others don't need a name brand, but they search for a watch with a guarantee of quality...And other people just want one that will tell them the time (a symbol of timekeeping) I am one of those people who is fascinated by both the beauty and the measurements of a diamond - which is why I am involved. We have had many discussions on this forum like this one. One that comes to mind is this one (click for link) asking about whether diamonds are seen as symbols of love or symbols of status. There are many opinions and many sets of values. John __________________________ John Pollard Whiteflash Director of Education 2004-2007
Posted: 1/20/2005 11:45:28 AM

P: 1/20/2005 11:49:08 AM
belle Ideal Rock Total Posts: 10,287 Last Post: 4/3/2008 Member Since: 11/19/2004	oh boy, better get a brifke if you're going to read this link john posted. (.¸(`.¸¸.´)¸.) ¨`.¸ belle¸. ´¨ (¸.(¸.´ `.¸).¸)
Posted: 1/20/2005 11:49:08 AM

P: 1/20/2005 11:52:11 AM
pearcrazy Ideal Rock Total Posts: 1,438 Last Post: 11/27/2008 Member Since: 5/16/2004	Date: 1/20/2005 11:13:59 AM Author: Nicolas Date: 1/20/2005 111:51 AM Author: Libster Bonjour Nicolas, That's about all I remember from French Class If i said 'i'm french' it's not for hearing this kind of reply but for showing that there a difference concerning DIAMOND I don't care about what you think knowing about 60 millions of people (I can't do it myself) I don't critize anybody or country! right? I m just asking about diamond and settings Concerning the ring, it is hard to show it here because it's not ready yet Nicolas, Libster was trying to be friendly when she posted a greeting in your language. She was imlying nothing about your people or your country. In getting offended you are implying that you think you know the mindset of a country of 300 million. Relax please. To each his own. I won't offend you by trying to speak to you French lest I get it wrong and offend you again. Being an American, I am pleased when foreigners attempt to speak to me in my native language, so I won't be offended by your mistakes in English. Concerning diamonds and what setting, it is all a matter of what is important to the buyer- no? Some people like their plain settings even if there are many, many of them out there. They are all unique and special to the wearer. Those who buy ideal cut diamonds usually do so because they are typically the most brilliant and sparkly. If they compared their ideal cuts to an average cut diamond, they should be able to see a difference- that is what they are after -"better than just average" even if average is nice to look at. A GIA inscription is not an advertisement but rather a means of identification, much like the vin number on an automobile. "Have you ever noticed, anyone going slower than you is an idiot, and anyone going faster than you is a maniac"--George Carlin
Posted: 1/20/2005 11:52:11 AM

P: 1/20/2005 11:56:38 AM
fortheloveofdiamonds Ideal Rock Total Posts: 1,279 Last Post: 7/4/2006 Member Since: 10/8/2004	Date: 1/20/2005 11:13:59 AM Author: Nicolas Date: 1/20/2005 111:51 AM Author: Libster Bonjour Nicolas, That's about all I remember from French Class If i said 'i'm french' it's not for hearing this kind of reply but for showing that there a difference concerning DIAMOND I don't care about what you think knowing about 60 millions of people (I can't do it myself) I don't critize anybody or country! right? I m just asking about diamond and settings Concerning the ring, it is hard to show it here because it's not ready yet Nicolas, Don't get your panties in a bunch. Libster was not trying to criticize you or your country, she was merely being polite and recognizing your culture. I myself am French and appreciate when people "try" to communicate with me in my native tongue. Don't be so sensitive.
Posted: 1/20/2005 11:56:38 AM

P: 1/20/2005 11:57:18 AM
codex57 Ideal Rock Total Posts: 1,492 Last Post: 1/21/2008 Member Since: 12/18/2004	Getting a GIA cert (or some other respected cert) helps me when I go get my ring insured. The more numbers I have to back it up, the less chance the insurance company can try and fob off some crappy diamond on me if it ever needs to be replaced. The same explanation goes for the lasere inscription and ideal cut specs I guess.
Posted: 1/20/2005 11:57:18 AM

P: 1/20/2005 12:03:25 PM
Nicolas Rough Rock Total Posts: 19 Last Post: 1/27/2005 Member Since: 12/29/2004	Date: 1/20/2005 11:52:11 AM Author: pearcrazy Nicolas, Libster was trying to be friendly when she posted a greeting in your language.  She was imlying nothing about your people or your country.  In getting offended you are implying that you think you know the mindset of a country of 300 million.It has never been the subject so I won't be offended by your mistakes in Engllish. you're so pleased Concerning diamonds and what setting, it is all a matter of what is important to the buyer- no?  Some people like their plain settings even if there are many, many of them out there.  They are all unique and special to the wearer.  Those who buy ideal cut diamonds usually do so because they are tipically the most brilliant and sparkly. Yes I know, and I dont judge the choice (and anything!) But I find that people often put more attention in diamond than in setting. Maybe I m wrong
Posted: 1/20/2005 12:03:25 PM

P: 1/20/2005 12:05:39 PM
JohnQuixote Ideal Rock Total Posts: 5,212 Last Post: 5/24/2008 Member Since: 9/9/2004	Date: 1/20/2005 11:498 AM Author: belle oh boy, better get a brifke if you're going to read this link john posted. Ahh. Memory Lane... You know I'll think of you every time a diamond parcel paper thingy is mentioned, Belle. John __________________________ John Pollard Whiteflash Director of Education 2004-2007
Posted: 1/20/2005 12:05:39 PM

P: 1/20/2005 12:11:35 PM
pearcrazy Ideal Rock Total Posts: 1,438 Last Post: 11/27/2008 Member Since: 5/16/2004	Yes I know, and I dont judge the choice (and anything!)You seem to be judging the choice to me! But I find that people often put more attention in diamond than in setting. Maybe I m wrong You are not wrong, but you must realize that since the diamond usually costs much more than the setting that people put lots attention into such a costly purchase. I fixed my typographical errors for you, thanks for pointing them out. They are errors in typing and not spelling, however. "Have you ever noticed, anyone going slower than you is an idiot, and anyone going faster than you is a maniac"--George Carlin
Posted: 1/20/2005 12:11:35 PM

P: 1/20/2005 12:14:55 PM
Nicolas Rough Rock Total Posts: 19 Last Post: 1/27/2005 Member Since: 12/29/2004	Date: 1/20/2005 12:11:35 PM Author: pearcrazy I fixed my typographical errors for you, thanks for pointing them out. They are errors in typing and not spelling however. Just kidding
Posted: 1/20/2005 12:14:55 PM

P: 1/20/2005 1:55:03 PM
valeria101 Ideal Rock Total Posts: 14,048 Last Post: 4/30/2006 Member Since: 8/29/2003	Don't think a diamond can tell which side of the Atlantic it is sitting on There are such things as the "Antwerp cut" and the cut grading of HRD... both ranked by the same principle as the AGS ideal (range of crown and pavilion angles that is) only the standards are looser. Tolkowsky was not American either... only it so happen that most diamonds are bought in the US so there's bound to be more competition and stricter standards to go with it and more mass production (e.g. those ring settings). Anyway, don't think 62% table makes a diamond butt ugly - it does take more than that... Meaning... I don't really see the problem Ana "The greatest experts are only as good as the sum total of what they have seen." [Souren Melikian]
Posted: 1/20/2005 1:55:03 PM

P: 1/20/2005 2:46:03 PM
Libster Ideal Rock Total Posts: 998 Last Post: 9/18/2009 Member Since: 10/21/2004	Date: 1/20/2005 11:13:59 AM Author: Nicolas Date: 1/20/2005 111:51 AM Author: Libster Bonjour Nicolas, That's about all I remember from French Class If i said 'i'm french' it's not for hearing this kind of reply but for showing that there a difference concerning DIAMOND I don't care about what you think knowing about 60 millions of people (I can't do it myself) I don't critize anybody or country! right? I m just asking about diamond and settings Concerning the ring, it is hard to show it here because it's not ready yet Nicolas, I meant no offense to you at all and apologize if you were offended by my greeting. ****************************** Diamonds.........Yield to Temptation!
Posted: 1/20/2005 2:46:03 PM

P: 1/20/2005 2:47:36 PM
belle Ideal Rock Total Posts: 10,287 Last Post: 4/3/2008 Member Since: 11/19/2004	Date: 1/20/2005 125:39 PM Author: JohnQuixote Date: 1/20/2005 11:498 AM Author: belle oh boy, better get a brifke if you're going to read this link john posted. Ahh.  Memory Lane...  You know I'll think of you every time a diamond parcel paper thingy is mentioned, Belle. (.¸(`.¸¸.´)¸.) ¨`.¸ belle¸. ´¨ (¸.(¸.´ `.¸).¸)
Posted: 1/20/2005 2:47:36 PM

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