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 » RockyTalky
»  » ANOTHER clarity question for the experts: Sorry.
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ANOTHER clarity question for the experts: Sorry. |
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| P: 6/3/2004 9:34:22 AM | |
moremoremore Ideal Rock Total Posts: 6,825 Last Post: 2/9/2009 Member Since: 3/15/2004 |
I was looking all over for a recent post on this...I think Dave had a perfect explanation but I can't find it...so I"ll ask again (sorry!) Is eye clean to the casual observer? I'm very confused and need a little clarification. I have a princess which is awesome...just got it last night and I love it and am keeping it...BUT, of course, when viewing it at home, it became clear to me that I can see the inclusions (little dark speckles in one area a little off of the white center to the bottom right of the white X) with my naked eye. I mean, I can see them when viewing the stone from about 6 inches away if I know where to look...is that the problem...I know where to look? Of course, they are in the worst place possible... I'm extremely disappointed that I looked but could not see this in the store...it's MY fault for not slowing down and looking through the loupe at the store (NOT THE VENDOR'S FAULT WHO I LOVE)... Is eye clean to the casual observer? Oh well, guess I'll have to move my upgrade date ahead 
______________________________ Stewart says: I'm good enough. I'm smart enough. And doggon'it, people like me. |
| Posted: 6/3/2004 9:34:22 AM | |
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There are 28 replies to this message. There are 28 replies on this page. |
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| P: 6/3/2004 9:35:07 AM | |
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moremoremore Ideal Rock Total Posts: 6,825 Last Post: 2/9/2009 Member Since: 3/15/2004 |
oops...to clarify....face up
______________________________ Stewart says: I'm good enough. I'm smart enough. And doggon'it, people like me. |
| Posted: 6/3/2004 9:35:07 AM | |
| P: 6/3/2004 9:45:19 AM | |
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moremoremore Ideal Rock Total Posts: 6,825 Last Post: 2/9/2009 Member Since: 3/15/2004 |
Found it...it is at a casual observing distance. Oh well. Let's see how long it takes me to go mad.
______________________________ Stewart says: I'm good enough. I'm smart enough. And doggon'it, people like me. |
| Posted: 6/3/2004 9:45:19 AM | |
| P: 6/3/2004 10:02:32 AM | |
verticalhorizon Ideal Rock Total Posts: 840 Last Post: 3/24/2006 Member Since: 3/9/2004 |
I had seen some very good VS2 and SI1 Princess rocks that had noticible includion, face up... IF you knew where to look. When I examined it, close up, sans loupe, it looked great. After I louped it, and saw it under a gemscope, I could tell where it was. AFTERwards, I could pick it out with the nekkid eye, but NO ONE coulda seen it without knowing where it was. Plus, NORMAL people don't stare at your ring for 3 minutes at a clip- 6 inches away from their head. I think your rock ROCKS! 
VH (aka GroomZilla) |
| Posted: 6/3/2004 10:02:32 AM | |
| P: 6/3/2004 10:40:00 AM | |
Pyramid Ideal Rock Total Posts: 2,914 Last Post: 11/11/2009 Member Since: 11/10/2002 |
I remember reading that it is with your head 18" away from the diamond in parallel lighting. Eye clean is also said to be how you see the stone before looking at it under a 10x loupe.
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| Posted: 6/3/2004 10:40:00 AM | |
| P: 6/3/2004 11:35:49 AM | |
Hest88 Ideal Rock Total Posts: 3,680 Last Post: 11/23/2009 Member Since: 1/22/2003 |
If it bothers you, it bothers you. I don't mind clear inclusions as much, but I really hate dark ones. Even if I can't see them just knowing that they're there bothers me!
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| Posted: 6/3/2004 11:35:49 AM | |
| P: 6/3/2004 11:39:25 AM | |
Brian Knox Cut Rock Total Posts: 337 Last Post: 2/5/2005 Member Since: 3/26/2004 |
Hi MMM, I caught a little flack last time I mentined this, but here it is again. Many people have to move up to a VS-2 clarity to have a "eye clean" diamond depending on the diamond and ones visual accuity and sensitivity to inclusions. With regard to the definition of "eye clean" : Because of the varying nature of individual visual accuity , personal preferences, and sensitivities, I submit that the only definition of "eyeclean" that is relevant is the defintion of the diamond wearer. Brian Knox |
| Posted: 6/3/2004 11:39:25 AM | |
| P: 6/3/2004 11:40:07 AM | |
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moremoremore Ideal Rock Total Posts: 6,825 Last Post: 2/9/2009 Member Since: 3/15/2004 |
Yes, I look at the ring and actually get angry..lol... BUT, it's still a beauty...it's not my 'forever' ring anyway...  ...I give it about a year...lol
______________________________ Stewart says: I'm good enough. I'm smart enough. And doggon'it, people like me. |
| Posted: 6/3/2004 11:40:07 AM | |
| P: 6/3/2004 1:38:13 PM | |
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moremoremore Ideal Rock Total Posts: 6,825 Last Post: 2/9/2009 Member Since: 3/15/2004 |
OK- here it is...I don't know how small it will come out...but if you look at the center of the stone....there is that white area....and in the center left of that white area is what I'm seeing...ALL THE TIME! UGH!! So...THIS is an Si1, huh? I thought nothing of it in the picture...:0 ______________________________ Stewart says: I'm good enough. I'm smart enough. And doggon'it, people like me. |
| Posted: 6/3/2004 1:38:13 PM | |
| P: 6/3/2004 2:47:22 PM | |
Daniela Ideal Rock Total Posts: 703 Last Post: 8/16/2006 Member Since: 10/2/2003 |
More, If it bugs you, it bugs you. End of story. Now ask yourself if you're willing to sacrifice a little bit of size, or a colour grade, in order to get a really clean stone. If the answer is yes, then send it back. If the answer is no, then maybe you can look for a better SI-1 or something, or you'll just have to live with the one you have. The other option, of course, is to cough up more cash and get a better clarity in the same size and colour! Ouch. Daniela Edited to add: That's kind of what my inclusion is like when I really look for it. And it bugs the heck out of me, hence my upcoming upgrade.
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| Posted: 6/3/2004 2:47:22 PM | |
| P: 6/3/2004 2:49:43 PM | |
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moremoremore Ideal Rock Total Posts: 6,825 Last Post: 2/9/2009 Member Since: 3/15/2004 |
LOL...I would be willing to go better, but I think GOG would kill themselves collectively if they had to continue to deal with me!
______________________________ Stewart says: I'm good enough. I'm smart enough. And doggon'it, people like me. |
| Posted: 6/3/2004 2:49:43 PM | |
| P: 6/3/2004 2:50:54 PM | |
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moremoremore Ideal Rock Total Posts: 6,825 Last Post: 2/9/2009 Member Since: 3/15/2004 |
oh yes...my husband would join the mass suicide also.
______________________________ Stewart says: I'm good enough. I'm smart enough. And doggon'it, people like me. |
| Posted: 6/3/2004 2:50:54 PM | |
| P: 6/3/2004 2:54:28 PM | |
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moremoremore Ideal Rock Total Posts: 6,825 Last Post: 2/9/2009 Member Since: 3/15/2004 |
Oh- and I wanted to make it really clear that I asked GOG to get me this stone. I had plenty of time to inspect it. This has nothing to do with GOG...I asked for this stone and I wanted this stone...just to make that clear!
______________________________ Stewart says: I'm good enough. I'm smart enough. And doggon'it, people like me. |
| Posted: 6/3/2004 2:54:28 PM | |
| P: 6/3/2004 2:56:10 PM | |
aljdewey Ideal Rock Total Posts: 8,236 Last Post: 2/11/2008 Member Since: 11/25/2002 |
---------------- Excellent points, Brian, but I also think it's important to note that fancies are a different animal. "Many people have to move up to a VS-2 clarity to have an 'eye-clean' diamond" may be more true of fancies and less true of rounds, and I think that's why you may have felt a bit of flack. In a well-cut round diamond, there is a very good chance of finding eye-clean SI diamonds. With emeralds or princess cuts, I'd suspect it's harder for SI quality to be eye-clean. _____________________ |
| Posted: 6/3/2004 2:56:10 PM | |
| P: 6/3/2004 3:01:27 PM | |
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moremoremore Ideal Rock Total Posts: 6,825 Last Post: 2/9/2009 Member Since: 3/15/2004 |
oops! I don't know how I missed that post brian! I think I would agree... I would also think an inclusion has a better chance of being hidden face up in a princess, no? There are all these little flashes and those facets..... My inclusion, of course, happens to be smack in the middle and right under the table apparently. I never bothered to look at the cert...WHO does that? lol ______________________________ Stewart says: I'm good enough. I'm smart enough. And doggon'it, people like me. |
| Posted: 6/3/2004 3:01:27 PM | |
| P: 6/3/2004 3:10:13 PM | |
researcher Ideal Rock Total Posts: 2,440 Last Post: 5/26/2008 Member Since: 4/27/2004 |
With so many of us perfectionists out there, I'm surprised most PS vendors haven't changed their phone numbers and emails several times just to avoid dealing with us again!
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| Posted: 6/3/2004 3:10:13 PM | |
| P: 6/3/2004 3:13:29 PM | |
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moremoremore Ideal Rock Total Posts: 6,825 Last Post: 2/9/2009 Member Since: 3/15/2004 |
seriously! I'm a GOOD PERSON..REALLY! LOL I don't mean to be difficult...it just ALWAYS works out that way... 
______________________________ Stewart says: I'm good enough. I'm smart enough. And doggon'it, people like me. |
| Posted: 6/3/2004 3:13:29 PM | |
| P: 6/3/2004 3:14:08 PM | |
solange Ideal Rock Total Posts: 871 Last Post: 8/23/2008 Member Since: 2/20/2004 |
GOG has such an excellent reputation. I think Jonathan would rather do what he has to to make you happy and that may include looking for a stone that is really eye clean. It really seems to bother you so maybe this is just not the stone for you. Or maybe it is. Seems you have a lot of doubts when you should be glowing. I think most highly regarded vendors would rather go the extra length to see a customer happy even if it is a great inconvenience. I never bought from GOG but I get the impression that Jonathan is that kind of person. There is a jewelry convention in Las Vegas this week and most of the vendors will be there. Maybe if Jonathan is there, he will have the opportunity to find you a stone more to your liking rather than one you may want to upgrade in a year. Best of luck whatever you decide to do. But a diamond is a luxury,especially one like yours, and you should be ecstatic with it so I hope things work out in that either you accept it for what it is or make a change that will give you joy.
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| Posted: 6/3/2004 3:14:08 PM | |
| P: 6/3/2004 3:32:25 PM | |
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moremoremore Ideal Rock Total Posts: 6,825 Last Post: 2/9/2009 Member Since: 3/15/2004 |
THANKS EVERYONE!!!! OK- back to reality...AM I STUPID??? I doubt I could find a princess that I think is as perfect as this one (sans inclusions)....The inclusion visible through the table is really minute...As a wise researcher and verticleH said...if you didn't notice it until you louped it (well, maybe I did see a little something there), then no one else will. I'm going to have a setting made to hide that pesky pavillion...and love my stone...  ... Sincerely, CYBIL
______________________________ Stewart says: I'm good enough. I'm smart enough. And doggon'it, people like me. |
| Posted: 6/3/2004 3:32:25 PM | |
| P: 6/3/2004 3:38:45 PM | |
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researcher Ideal Rock Total Posts: 2,440 Last Post: 5/26/2008 Member Since: 4/27/2004 |
I'm glad I honestly think you have a winner, but like I said in the other thread, you need to LOVE your stone, and if you don't I'd explore other options. I think the option of a new setting is your best bet, but you can always contact GOG and see if they can come up with another diamond that would suit you better. Good luck with everything--and throw away that stupid loupe! LOL
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| Posted: 6/3/2004 3:38:45 PM | |
| P: 6/3/2004 3:55:22 PM | |
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headlight Ideal Rock Total Posts: 656 Last Post: 8/19/2009 Member Since: 11/2/2003 |
Moremoremore -- you do what I do, and that is hyperfocus on your stone! Stop tormenting yourself and focus on the stone's virtues. Which, BTW, having that little spec of whatever can be looked upon as a virtue because it is your own personal identifying mechanism for when you take your stone to be cleaned, prongs inspected, re-set, etc. I have the same thing in my stone and NO ONE can see it. I'm the only one who knows it is there. If you got this stone from GOG, I'm sure it is a beauty. Enjoy it!
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| Posted: 6/3/2004 3:55:22 PM | |
| P: 6/3/2004 4:11:45 PM | |
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moremoremore Ideal Rock Total Posts: 6,825 Last Post: 2/9/2009 Member Since: 3/15/2004 |
Yeah!!! Headlight!!!! Why don't you come and play here more than that "other" site...hehehehehe
______________________________ Stewart says: I'm good enough. I'm smart enough. And doggon'it, people like me. |
| Posted: 6/3/2004 4:11:45 PM | |
| P: 6/3/2004 7:15:34 PM | |
Dancing Fire Ideal Rock Total Posts: 10,224 Last Post: 11/23/2009 Member Since: 4/3/2004 |
This is the stone I purchased. Moremoremore I have a similar kind of questions about SI 1 stones. in my case was for rb, which is easier to find a eye clean than your princess. i guess the question is we si1 owners, are we expecting too much? in my case, from the side view, i can definitly spot the inclusions with my naked eyes. but face up, i just can't spot any(without a loupe) even though there is one rigth in the middle of the table also the gia plot looks pretty bad. i was sort of in the same situtation, i was thinking of going with an I vs1 stone. but jonathan told me it was sold,the stone that i purchase was a better buy, i think we all hear lots of stories about eye clean si stones, but these owners probably were talking about <1ct. RB's but when you go over 2+ ct., in a princess cut, are you asking the impossible? we all want a si1 stone with vs clarity. if you run a search under my name, there should be some reply that might answer some of your questions. it is always harder to find a "mind clean" stone than a eye clean stone. |
| Posted: 6/3/2004 7:15:34 PM | |
| P: 6/3/2004 7:46:59 PM | |
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moremoremore Ideal Rock Total Posts: 6,825 Last Post: 2/9/2009 Member Since: 3/15/2004 |
Hi Vtigger....I'll do a search and see what comes up....I definitely think that most consumers have the wrong idea about Si1s....But I think it's very possible...and more frequent...to hav face up REALLY eye clean Si1....With mine, the inclusions happen to be very concentrated and smack in the middle of the whitest part of the stone...the middle...lol...Well, my husband just yelled at me...so I'm done..I'm keeping it.  (but I don't care what he says, there's no way I could have noticed this in the store...I should have asked to see it under the miscroscope)...And again, for the third time...I want everyone to be clear that this is not GOG's failure. It was mine. This was an internet stone I asked them to call in...I saw it and wanted to purchase it...As for seeing inclusions through the pavillion, I don't care much...I noticed that in the store...but it's much more visible at home but who cares really...I'm going to have the setting modified to hide it!
______________________________ Stewart says: I'm good enough. I'm smart enough. And doggon'it, people like me. |
| Posted: 6/3/2004 7:46:59 PM | |
| P: 6/3/2004 9:39:51 PM | |
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Dancing Fire Ideal Rock Total Posts: 10,224 Last Post: 11/23/2009 Member Since: 4/3/2004 |
---------------- more more more, I know your problem, your problem is harder to satisfy your mind than your eyes. like i said on the other board, i'm sure a lot of people would love to have your problem. you have a beautiful stone. it is always harder to find a "mind clean" stone than a eye clean stone. |
| Posted: 6/3/2004 9:39:51 PM | |
| P: 6/4/2004 12:10:19 PM | |
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solange Ideal Rock Total Posts: 871 Last Post: 8/23/2008 Member Since: 2/20/2004 |
I did purchase an SI2 stone from Whiteflash which is perfectly eye clean. It is 4.10 carats so it was hard to find. I can easily spot the inclusions with a 10 power loupe but although I know where they are, I cannot find them with the naked eye nor could the appraiser or anyone else. The stone does have several small, scattered inclusions but it is perfectly eye clean from all angles except perhaps the bottom. I did not check that and that is hidden by the mounting. I did have to wait a few months because this was not a stone in Whiteflash's inventory or on the multiple listing. Lesley had it sent to them and Brian the cutter assured me it was eye clean. It is possible to get an eye clean SI stone but if the small visible inclusions do not bother you and the stone has other attributes, you may have gotten better value because the stone was not perfectly eye clean.
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| Posted: 6/4/2004 12:10:19 PM | |
| P: 6/4/2004 12:32:46 PM | |
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moremoremore Ideal Rock Total Posts: 6,825 Last Post: 2/9/2009 Member Since: 3/15/2004 |
I think I did get a good price based on that fact. But sadly, I am once again sick over this...I can't stand myself...but I emailed GOG about another stone. I really would love another F si1...but now I'm so put off by Si1s. We'll see. Thanks everyone.
______________________________ Stewart says: I'm good enough. I'm smart enough. And doggon'it, people like me. |
| Posted: 6/4/2004 12:32:46 PM | |
| P: 6/4/2004 1:05:13 PM | |
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researcher Ideal Rock Total Posts: 2,440 Last Post: 5/26/2008 Member Since: 4/27/2004 |
You poor thing! I hope you don't get too discouraged by SI1's. My stone is an SI1 as you know, but the inclusions are not under the table, are clear/white, and are so minute that no one I showed the stone to when it was unmounted could see them with an unaided eye (and we turned the stone in every direction and had it in every light). I think there are plenty of SI stones out there that are TRULY eye clean but you just didn't happen to get one. If you do decide to go for another stone, check out the plot first--it really reveals a lot. And knowing how great Jonathan is, I'm sure he will go out of his way to make sure your next stone is so eye clean you won't believe it's an SI at all! I wish you were happier about your stone as it's so lovely, but I completely understand your situation. Keep us posted on your diamond search progress! TGIF!!! 
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| Posted: 6/4/2004 1:05:13 PM | |
| P: 6/4/2004 4:55:07 PM | |
Shay37 Ideal Rock Total Posts: 3,343 Last Post: 8/30/2008 Member Since: 3/2/2004 |
More, don't feel bad about this at all. You have to be happy with your diamond. I am one of those people who can see inclusions quite easily. You could, however, line up five different colors and I would have a hard time telling you the color without a cheat sheet. (I just cannot see the color) So, while I won't pay for color, I will pay for clarity. Totally understand your dilemma, but I would do the same thing and return the stone and try for another that is eye clean. Good luck and best wishes. Shay ______________________________My therapist loves me. His name is Brian the Cutter. |
| Posted: 6/4/2004 4:55:07 PM | |
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