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»  » Twinning wisp/ surface graining?
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Twinning wisp/ surface graining? |
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| P: 4/29/2009 3:07:24 PM | |
jkc350z Rough Rock Total Posts: 36 Last Post: 5/23/2009 Member Since: 4/8/2009 |
In what ways do twinning wisps and surface graining effect a diamond in terms of overall appearance, fire, brilliance, durability, etc. Any and all info will help...thanks!
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| Posted: 4/29/2009 3:07:24 PM | |
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There are 13 replies to this message. There are 13 replies on this page. |
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| P: 4/29/2009 3:08:27 PM | |
Lorelei Ideal Rock Total Posts: 34,273 Last Post: 11/25/2009 Member Since: 4/30/2005 |
Date: 4/29/2009 3:07:24 PM Author:jkc350z In what ways do twinning wisps and surface graining effect a diamond in terms of overall appearance, fire, brilliance, durability, etc. Any and all info will help...thanks! I will post some info which will help, the above are not durability issues. Here you go, this link explains and has photos for you. http://www.goodoldgold.com/4Cs/Clarity/InclusionGallery/  Nothing is more sacred as the bond between horse and rider...no other creature can ever become so emotionally close to a human as a horse. When a horse dies, the memory lives on because an enormous part of his owner's heart, soul, very existence dies also...but that can never be laid to rest, it is not meant to be... - Stephanie M Thorn |
| Posted: 4/29/2009 3:08:27 PM | |
| P: 4/29/2009 3:18:30 PM | |
Todd Gray Ideal Rock Total Posts: 596 Last Post: 11/24/2009 Member Since: 1/20/2009 |
Date: 4/29/2009 3:08:27 PM Author: Lorelei I will post some info which will help, the above are not durability issues. / I disagree. While surface graining is not a durability issue, a twinning wisp has the "potential" to be a durability issue as it is a striation / twisting of the crystal structure of the gem. Consult an independent Gemologist to determine the extent and potential risk of the twinning wisp - some are an issue and some really are not. I actually reviewed a GIA lab report the other day for an SI-1 clarity diamond that was graded SI-1 due to an extensive twinning wisp formation which was spiraling out from the center of the diamond out towards the perimeter of the stone... It was quite impressive! The concept that puzzled me was the comment "additional twinning wisps not shown" under the comments section of the report because the plotting diagram showed the twinning wisp as being rather extensive and my thought was "you mean to tell me that there is more than this going on in this stone?!?! And the lab didn't feel that something like a twinning wisp was worth indicating on the plotting diagram? This is of course because it was a twinning wisp and not something like "additional (small) clouds or pinpoints not shown... Maybe it's just me being, uh, particular. __________________________ |
| Posted: 4/29/2009 3:18:30 PM | |
| P: 4/29/2009 3:26:43 PM | |
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Lorelei Ideal Rock Total Posts: 34,273 Last Post: 11/25/2009 Member Since: 4/30/2005 |
Date: 4/29/2009 3:18:30 PM Author: Todd Gray Date: 4/29/2009 3:08:27 PM Author: Lorelei I will post some info which will help, the above are not durability issues. / I disagree. While surface graining is not a durability issue, a twinning wisp has the 'potential' to be a durability issue as it is a striation / twisting of the crystal structure of the gem. Consult an independent Gemologist to determine the extent and potential risk of the twinning wisp - some are an issue and some really are not. I actually reviewed a GIA lab report the other day for an SI-1 clarity diamond that was graded SI-1 due to an extensive twinning wisp formation which was spiraling out from the center of the diamond out towards the perimeter of the stone... It was quite impressive! The concept that puzzled me was the comment 'additional twinning wisps not shown' under the comments section of the report because the plotting diagram showed the twinning wisp as being rather extensive and my thought was 'you mean to tell me that there is more than this going on in this stone?!?! And the lab didn't feel that something like a twinning wisp was worth indicating on the plotting diagram? This is of course because it was a twinning wisp and not something like 'additional (small) clouds or pinpoints not shown... Maybe it's just me being, uh, particular. Thats interesting Todd, I have never heard that before! So what is the best advice in that case when trying to help posters with TW, warn them that these might be a durability issue and to get a pro to check it out? Nothing is more sacred as the bond between horse and rider...no other creature can ever become so emotionally close to a human as a horse. When a horse dies, the memory lives on because an enormous part of his owner's heart, soul, very existence dies also...but that can never be laid to rest, it is not meant to be... - Stephanie M Thorn |
| Posted: 4/29/2009 3:26:43 PM | |
| P: 4/29/2009 3:30:44 PM | |
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jkc350z Rough Rock Total Posts: 36 Last Post: 5/23/2009 Member Since: 4/8/2009 |
do they extensively affect the light performance of a stone?
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| Posted: 4/29/2009 3:30:44 PM | |
| P: 4/29/2009 3:37:24 PM | |
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Todd Gray Ideal Rock Total Posts: 596 Last Post: 11/24/2009 Member Since: 1/20/2009 |
Date: 4/29/2009 3:26:43 PM Author: Lorelei Thats interesting Todd, I have never heard that before! So what is the best advice in that case when trying to help posters with TW, warn them that these might be a durability issue and to get a pro to check it out? Exactly. Here is the definition of twinning wisp posted on NiceIce.com (my site): The term Twinning Wisps, also known as Intergrowth, is used to describe the formation of inclusions which have twisted together within a twinning plane. The formation might include a variety of inclusions such as pinpoint size diamond crystals, fractures, crystals, feathers and clouds. The formation often looks like white striping within the diamond similar to stretch marks on skin. Twinning wisps are most often found in fancy shape diamonds such as pear shapes, heart shapes and triangles because they are often fashioned from twinned crystals, however twinning wisps can appear within other diamond shapes as well depending on the quality of the diamond rough that was used to make the stone. Date: 4/29/2009 3:30:44 PM Author: JKC350Z do they extensively affect the light performance of a stone? They can, but it largely depends on the extent and location of the twinning wisp... This concept holds true for any inclusion thought, right? 
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| Posted: 4/29/2009 3:37:24 PM | |
| P: 4/29/2009 3:46:13 PM | |
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Lorelei Ideal Rock Total Posts: 34,273 Last Post: 11/25/2009 Member Since: 4/30/2005 |
Thanks Todd!
Nothing is more sacred as the bond between horse and rider...no other creature can ever become so emotionally close to a human as a horse. When a horse dies, the memory lives on because an enormous part of his owner's heart, soul, very existence dies also...but that can never be laid to rest, it is not meant to be... - Stephanie M Thorn |
| Posted: 4/29/2009 3:46:13 PM | |
| P: 4/29/2009 4:21:04 PM | |
DiaGem Ideal Rock Total Posts: 3,927 Last Post: 11/21/2009 Member Since: 10/21/2004 |
Date: 4/29/2009 3:18:30 PM Just as any other inclusions can..., but I must add that durability issues due to the majority of internal inclusions are pretty rare issues.Author: Todd Gray Date: 4/29/2009 3:08:27 PM Author: Lorelei I will post some info which will help, the above are not durability issues. / I disagree. While surface graining is not a durability issue, a twinning wisp has the 'potential' to be a durability issue as it is a striation / twisting of the crystal structure of the gem. Consult an independent Gemologist to determine the extent and potential risk of the twinning wisp - some are an issue and some really are not. I actually reviewed a GIA lab report the other day for an SI-1 clarity diamond that was graded SI-1 due to an extensive twinning wisp formation which was spiraling out from the center of the diamond out towards the perimeter of the stone... It was quite impressive! The concept that puzzled me was the comment 'additional twinning wisps not shown' under the comments section of the report because the plotting diagram showed the twinning wisp as being rather extensive and my thought was 'you mean to tell me that there is more than this going on in this stone?!?! And the lab didn't feel that something like a twinning wisp was worth indicating on the plotting diagram? This is of course because it was a twinning wisp and not something like 'additional (small) clouds or pinpoints not shown... Maybe it's just me being, uh, particular. In my opinion..., 99.9% of twinning wisp inclusions are not a durability issue. ********************** |
| Posted: 4/29/2009 4:21:04 PM | |
| P: 4/29/2009 4:47:23 PM | |
strmrdr Ideal Rock Total Posts: 23,296 Last Post: 10/9/2009 Member Since: 11/1/2003 |
I agree with both diagem and Todd. It can be a sign of strain, used to be you didn't have to worry to much because if it made it off the cutters wheel when it would be ok. Today with laser bruting and blocking it can be more of an issue as rough that used to be uncuttable is being cut. It is however not a huge issue and usually they are fine. ........... Karl has joined the diamond trade and is now posting as Karl_K |
| Posted: 4/29/2009 4:47:23 PM | |
| P: 4/29/2009 5:58:42 PM | |
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DiaGem Ideal Rock Total Posts: 3,927 Last Post: 11/21/2009 Member Since: 10/21/2004 |
Date: 4/29/2009 4:47:23 PM Thanks Karl for agreeing...Author: strmrdr I agree with both diagem and Todd. It can be a sign of strain, used to be you didn't have to worry to much because if it made it off the cutters wheel when it would be ok. Today with laser bruting and blocking it can be more of an issue as rough that used to be uncuttable is being cut. It is however not a huge issue and usually they are fine. I just think adding unnecessary concern to the many factors consumers need to worry about doesnt help... What do you mean by uncuttable is being cut due to lasers? ********************** |
| Posted: 4/29/2009 5:58:42 PM | |
| P: 4/29/2009 6:10:13 PM | |
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strmrdr Ideal Rock Total Posts: 23,296 Last Post: 10/9/2009 Member Since: 11/1/2003 |
Date: 4/29/2009 5:58:42 PM Author: DiaGem Date: 4/29/2009 4:47:23 PM Thanks Karl for agreeing...Author: strmrdr I agree with both diagem and Todd. It can be a sign of strain, used to be you didn't have to worry to much because if it made it off the cutters wheel when it would be ok. Today with laser bruting and blocking it can be more of an issue as rough that used to be uncuttable is being cut. It is however not a huge issue and usually they are fine. I just think adding unnecessary concern to the many factors consumers need to worry about doesnt help... What do you mean by uncuttable is being cut due to lasers? Here is one thread with more information: http://www.pricescope.com/idealbb/view.asp?topicID=36144 ........... Karl has joined the diamond trade and is now posting as Karl_K |
| Posted: 4/29/2009 6:10:13 PM | |
| P: 4/29/2009 6:28:11 PM | |
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DiaGem Ideal Rock Total Posts: 3,927 Last Post: 11/21/2009 Member Since: 10/21/2004 |
Date: 4/29/2009 6:10:13 PM Karl..., I always feel safer using old-school techniques when possible (like sawing, bruiting or shaping)..., I dont realy like or trust lasers (as long as they are hot points).Author: strmrdr Date: 4/29/2009 5:58:42 PM Author: DiaGem Date: 4/29/2009 4:47:23 PM Thanks Karl for agreeing...Author: strmrdr I agree with both diagem and Todd. It can be a sign of strain, used to be you didn't have to worry to much because if it made it off the cutters wheel when it would be ok. Today with laser bruting and blocking it can be more of an issue as rough that used to be uncuttable is being cut. It is however not a huge issue and usually they are fine. I just think adding unnecessary concern to the many factors consumers need to worry about doesnt help... What do you mean by uncuttable is being cut due to lasers? Here is one thread with more information: http://www.pricescope.com/idealbb/view.asp?topicID=36144 Lasers help you maximize your division options as you plan..., but based on my experience..., if its not realy necessary/ a must..., I'll take the saw blades and the polishing wheel any day over lasers. ********************** |
| Posted: 4/29/2009 6:28:11 PM | |
| P: 4/29/2009 6:40:20 PM | |
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strmrdr Ideal Rock Total Posts: 23,296 Last Post: 10/9/2009 Member Since: 11/1/2003 |
Date: 4/29/2009 6:28:11 PM Author: DiaGem Karl..., I always feel safer using old-school techniques when possible (like sawing, bruiting or shaping)..., I dont realy like or trust lasers (as long as they are hot points). Lasers help you maximize your division options as you plan..., but based on my experience..., if its not realy necessary/ a must..., I'll take the saw blades and the polishing wheel any day over lasers. Interesting thanks. What would be interesting to know is what percentage of diamonds are lasered and what percentage are not. ........... Karl has joined the diamond trade and is now posting as Karl_K |
| Posted: 4/29/2009 6:40:20 PM | |
| P: 4/30/2009 7:48:25 AM | |
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DiaGem Ideal Rock Total Posts: 3,927 Last Post: 11/21/2009 Member Since: 10/21/2004 |
Date: 4/29/2009 6:40:20 PM I imagine the smalls (high %'s) enjoy the efficiency of the laser technology..., but not for durability issues....Author: strmrdr Date: 4/29/2009 6:28:11 PM Author: DiaGem Karl..., I always feel safer using old-school techniques when possible (like sawing, bruiting or shaping)..., I dont realy like or trust lasers (as long as they are hot points). Lasers help you maximize your division options as you plan..., but based on my experience..., if its not realy necessary/ a must..., I'll take the saw blades and the polishing wheel any day over lasers. Interesting thanks. What would be interesting to know is what percentage of diamonds are lasered and what percentage are not. 
********************** |
| Posted: 4/30/2009 7:48:25 AM | |
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