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»  » Gen Y hit hardest by job losses...do you see these feelings of entitlement?
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Gen Y hit hardest by job losses...do you see these feelings of entitlement? |
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| P: 1/16/2009 12:14:37 PM | |
TravelingGal Ideal Rock Total Posts: 11,346 Last Post: 11/25/2009 Member Since: 12/29/2004 |
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28663645/ I found this article very interesting, especially because 10 years ago, Gen Xers were seen as a bit spoiled and lazy. I do see a lot of Gen Y in the copies I've worked at who seem to have this ideal that they wanted to find jobs that were meaningful and where they could be happy instead of paying your dues and grunting your way up. Of course, there are plenty of Gen Yers whose work ethic could put some Gen X and boomers to shame. What do you think, Gen Y? What's the mentality amongst you and your peers? Is it really tough to get jobs out there? And if so, does that surprise you? _______________________ Travel quote of the week: "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines, sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover." -Mark Twain |
| Posted: 1/16/2009 12:14:37 PM | |
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There are 21 replies to this message. There are 21 replies on this page. |
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| P: 1/16/2009 1:06:55 PM | |
AmberGretchen Ideal Rock Total Posts: 7,046 Last Post: 11/11/2009 Member Since: 1/6/2005 |
Well, me and my group of friends aren't exactly typical, but I think its both - by that I mean, I've noticed that many of my friends do seem to feel entitled to good jobs and good salaries early on in their careers, but at the same time, they bust their butts to get them and to stay in them. I do think the job market was incredibly tough this year. I was in a group of people finishing graduate school - all getting our PhDs in engineering, physical, chemical, and life sciences, and interviewing for a specific type of job - we practiced for the interviews together. These people were all super bright, had done really impressive work at top schools - Berkeley, MIT, Harvard, Stanford, etc... - and many of them did not end up with jobs. While I think a small amount of that was due to overconfidence in a few cases, a lot of it was just due to how rough the market was. The company I got my dream job with (I was actually incredibly lucky to receive 2 job offers) didn't hire AT ALL into their offices on either coast this year.
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| Posted: 1/16/2009 1:06:55 PM | |
| P: 1/16/2009 1:11:23 PM | |
geckodani Ideal Rock Total Posts: 7,177 Last Post: 11/22/2009 Member Since: 6/25/2008 |
I think that ANYONE out of work is having a hard time finding a job, regardless of generation. But yes - among me and my peers, it does seem especially grim for those of us starting out. I have 2 BAs - and answer phones in an office. Working for people without college educations in many cases. I was folding flyers the other day thinking, "Oh, so THIS is why I spent 5 years in college... Prior to that I was at Starbucks...It's tough for all of us, I think. ETA: Does it surprise me? No. But it does often make me wonder if I shouldn't have gone to trade school instead of pursuing my BAs.  Run turkey, RUN! (Little man in the avatar is my nephew.) |
| Posted: 1/16/2009 1:11:23 PM | |
| P: 1/16/2009 1:19:18 PM | |
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geckodani Ideal Rock Total Posts: 7,177 Last Post: 11/22/2009 Member Since: 6/25/2008 |
Okay... I read the rest of the article (had just skimmed it). I think that ANYONE that's holding out for "something better" - is stupid. Regardless of what generation they are. Especially in this economy. I despise my job. It could pay better and I get treated like crap. But you know what - it's a JOB. And it pays the bills. So - here I am. Would I love something else? Yes. Am I entitled to something else - No. No one is entitled to a better anything - you have to work for it, and hope that the opportunities are there. Those that went through college and high school and never worked and then just assumed that a job would be handed to them on a silver platter - Well, welcome to the real world. Run turkey, RUN! (Little man in the avatar is my nephew.) |
| Posted: 1/16/2009 1:19:18 PM | |
| P: 1/16/2009 1:23:54 PM | |
musey Ideal Rock Total Posts: 11,179 Last Post: 11/24/2009 Member Since: 9/30/2006 |
I and most of my friends were born between 1981-1985, and no one that I know if is out of work or working a job that they feel is 'useless.' We are all doing something that feels valid to our careers, regardless of whether we 'love' the job(s), they are still stepping stones in the direction that we want to go (rather than 'eh, it pays the bills' types of jobs). Maybe the job market is better in LA than other places?  I don't know. Or maybe it is just that we expected to do grunt work starting out no matter what, because of the career track we all chose.ETA: Almost all of us are doing pay-your-dues grunt work and getting paid dirt, but I think in our chosen careers (we have people headed for film production, advertising, acting, songwriting and e-commerce in our close group) it is expected. My brother went to school to do computer programming, and got a mid-level job with microsoft just out of college (about 5.5 years ago). Maybe our career paths would be similar to him having to work in the mail room at microsoft and eventually working his way up to be a programmer...?
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| Posted: 1/16/2009 1:23:54 PM | |
| P: 1/16/2009 1:26:23 PM | |
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geckodani Ideal Rock Total Posts: 7,177 Last Post: 11/22/2009 Member Since: 6/25/2008 |
Date: 1/16/2009 1:23:54 PM Author: musey I and most of my friends were born between 1981-1985, and no one that I know if is out of work or working a job that they feel is 'useless.' We are all doing something that feels valid to our careers, regardless of whether we 'love' the job(s), they are still stepping stones in the direction that we want to go (rather than 'eh, it pays the bills' types of jobs). Maybe the job market is better in LA than other places? I don't know.I'm in Michigan, where things are pretty grim with the auto downturn and whatnot, so the part of the country you're in definitely plays a part, IMO. Only one of my friends is in a job related to his career - the rest of us took whatever we could and are just grateful to have a job. 
Run turkey, RUN! (Little man in the avatar is my nephew.) |
| Posted: 1/16/2009 1:26:23 PM | |
| P: 1/16/2009 1:33:10 PM | |
Tacori E-ring Ideal Rock Total Posts: 16,103 Last Post: 11/24/2009 Member Since: 8/15/2005 |
I was at a playdate today and the two other mom's DHs work in sales at the same company. They were complaining b/c there bonuses are smaller, perks less, everything restructured...One mom said "if they keep this up they are going to lose a lot of employees." I asked if she thought that people would REALLY leave a good paying job in this economy and she replied a good salesman ALWAYS has a job. Not sure if this is true but she obvious feels entitled.
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| Posted: 1/16/2009 1:33:10 PM | |
| P: 1/16/2009 2:02:11 PM | |
Haven Ideal Rock Total Posts: 6,092 Last Post: 11/25/2009 Member Since: 2/16/2007 |
It looks like Generation Y was born between 1977 and 1994, so I'm a part of it, as I was born in 1980. I only know my own field, which is secondary education, and the job market is tough right now. But it has always been tough. We get nearly 1,000 applications for every one opening in English or history. The numbers are better for math and science, closer to 300 per every opening, but it's still tough. However, it's been that way for at least seven years, and I'm not sure that the economy has had an effect on that. It's not like you can decide today to become a teacher, and apply for a job tomorrow. At least, not in Illinois. I work with many Generation Y educators, and all of us are overeducated and underpaid (as are our older colleagues). We are TEACHERS. We chose our profession because it would lead to a meaningful, self-fulfilling career. I don't feel that I have to apologize for that, or that it means I have a sense of entitlement. Do I expect to make a lot of money? No. My salary is public knowledge, and it's not impressive. We start kids right out of college with a BA at $46,000, and those right out of college with an MA/MEd at $56,000. We only pay about $2,000 to $3,000 more per year for each year of experience. I knew that. I accepted it. Could I have earned my two master's degrees in some other field that would have led to more money? Of course. But I'm happy with my choice. However, I make choices based on what is personally fulfilling for me, and not how much money I'll make, and I'm proud of that. I also make lifestyle/spending choices based on what will give me the most options and freedom in my personal and professional life. I don't think it's anything I need to apologize for, or feel badly about. And I definitely don't think it makes me entitled. I think another issue is that younger workers who aren't mired in debt and hefty monthly payments might feel like they have more flexibility because they do not need as much to keep up their lifestyle. I don't really feel badly for people whose lifestyles depended entirely upon hanging on to their jobs. If they were living right at or above their means, that was a choice, and not a great one. I would feel desperate about finding ANY job ASAP, too, if I bought a house and cars and things I couldn't really afford. I don't mean to sound cold or horrible, and I certainly don't want to see people homeless and hungry. However, I don't think an economic downturn that forces people to reassess their spending habits and lifestyles is the worst thing in the world. ********************************************************** |
| Posted: 1/16/2009 2:02:11 PM | |
| P: 1/16/2009 2:09:21 PM | |
AprilBaby Ideal Rock Total Posts: 2,268 Last Post: 11/24/2009 Member Since: 7/17/2008 |
I am surprised that Gen Y is having as hard a time finding jobs because us Baby Boomers are losing ours and being replaced by cheaper Gen Y's!
"Time is not what you think. Dying? Not the end of everything. We think it is. But what happens on earth is only the beginning." -Mitch Albom, The Five People You Meet in Heaven |
| Posted: 1/16/2009 2:09:21 PM | |
| P: 1/16/2009 4:01:15 PM | |
Linda W Ideal Rock Total Posts: 10,443 Last Post: 11/24/2009 Member Since: 2/15/2006 |
Date: 1/16/2009 2:09:21 PM Author: AprilBaby I am surprised that Gen Y is having as hard a time finding jobs because us Baby Boomers are losing ours and being replaced by cheaper Gen Y's! Very well said AprilBaby!!!!!!  . I can't even begin to tell you, how many of my Baby Boomer friends have lost their jobs.
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| Posted: 1/16/2009 4:01:15 PM | |
| P: 1/16/2009 4:08:45 PM | |
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Haven Ideal Rock Total Posts: 6,092 Last Post: 11/25/2009 Member Since: 2/16/2007 |
Date: 1/16/2009 2:09:21 PM Author: AprilBaby I am surprised that Gen Y is having as hard a time finding jobs because us Baby Boomers are losing ours and being replaced by cheaper Gen Y's! That's really a shame. Doesn't it cost companies/businesses more to hire inexperienced or less experienced people and train them? ********************************************************** |
| Posted: 1/16/2009 4:08:45 PM | |
| P: 1/16/2009 4:14:38 PM | |
neatfreak Ideal Rock Total Posts: 13,477 Last Post: 11/24/2009 Member Since: 2/17/2007 |
Date: 1/16/2009 4:08:45 PM Author: Haven Date: 1/16/2009 2:09:21 PM Author: AprilBaby I am surprised that Gen Y is having as hard a time finding jobs because us Baby Boomers are losing ours and being replaced by cheaper Gen Y's! That's really a shame. Doesn't it cost companies/businesses more to hire inexperienced or less experienced people and train them? Depends. Their older salaried employees might be making a ton more per year than they need to pay the youngins, so if there is a low amount of training involved it might end up being cheaper to hire younger people...
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| Posted: 1/16/2009 4:14:38 PM | |
| P: 1/16/2009 4:20:23 PM | |
Elmorton Ideal Rock Total Posts: 3,750 Last Post: 11/23/2009 Member Since: 7/6/2007 |
I'm not really sure what the numbers are to support this, but many of my friends grew up with a lifestyle their parents didn't have as a child and then landed jobs that are much higher paying than how their parents started out. Since I'm actually "paying my dues" (I'm an adjunct professor, so I get the leftover classes, work at an incredibly cheap rate, and then I get paid dirt to tutor - but hopefully putting in my time will get my feet in the door and lead to a tenured position once the baby boomers in the department retire), I sometimes feel like a complete loser compared to many of my friends who would up in better paying jobs and are a lot more financially stable in this lousy economy - so yeah, maybe there is a sense of entitlement at play there. But, I accept that I chose a field that is highly competitive - as did DH - so we're both very happy to have our jobs, and our mentality has been to work as hard as we can so that our employers feel that we're a value to have. Regardless of industry, I don't know a Gen Y soul who wishes for a different job or is even remotely thinking about looking for something better. Most of the conversations I've had with pals lately start with "So...is your job safe?" It's tough for everyone.
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| Posted: 1/16/2009 4:20:23 PM | |
| P: 1/16/2009 4:29:14 PM | |
kcoursolle Ideal Rock Total Posts: 10,344 Last Post: 10/14/2009 Member Since: 1/21/2006 |
Date: 1/16/2009 2:09:21 PM Author: AprilBaby I am surprised that Gen Y is having as hard a time finding jobs because us Baby Boomers are losing ours and being replaced by cheaper Gen Y's! Yes you would think this, but because of stock market issues many older folks are delaying retirement. Gen Y's are often the first to go when lay offs come and DH's company has seen this a great deal. Almost everyone let go was between 25-35.
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| Posted: 1/16/2009 4:29:14 PM | |
| P: 1/16/2009 4:34:44 PM | |
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Elmorton Ideal Rock Total Posts: 3,750 Last Post: 11/23/2009 Member Since: 7/6/2007 |
Date: 1/16/2009 4:14:38 PM Author: neatfreak Date: 1/16/2009 4:08:45 PM Author: Haven Date: 1/16/2009 2:09:21 PM Author: AprilBaby I am surprised that Gen Y is having as hard a time finding jobs because us Baby Boomers are losing ours and being replaced by cheaper Gen Y's! That's really a shame. Doesn't it cost companies/businesses more to hire inexperienced or less experienced people and train them? Depends. Their older salaried employees might be making a ton more per year than they need to pay the youngins, so if there is a low amount of training involved it might end up being cheaper to hire younger people... DH's workplace just had layoffs, and it was one older person and one younger person. From my understanding, it simply came down to production - both folks weren't bringing in numbers, and their job duties could be spread throughout a department. A friend of his was employed by the same company, different location, and the wave of layoffs sent all the newest hires out the door (including DH's friend). We've been hearing about layoffs going both ways - doing buyouts for the long-time employees and then salary freezes for the new hires or hiring freezes. I hate to say this, but if I were in charge of a company, I don't think I'd lay off my cheapest laborers - I'd go straight to production numbers, and I have a feeling that the greatest effect would be on baby boomers (who are getting paid the most) since one would suppose that this group tends to have a much harder time adopting the technologies which are bringing in greater revenue. While this may mean good news for Gen Y-ers in terms of job aqcuisition, the bigger picture is terrifying to me. If companies start laying off huge numbers of baby boomers, what is going to happen with health care (both for individuals and in terms of how health care is run?). How will all of this change retirements and pension plans?
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| Posted: 1/16/2009 4:34:44 PM | |
| P: 1/16/2009 4:41:32 PM | |
oobiecoo Ideal Rock Total Posts: 1,978 Last Post: 11/25/2009 Member Since: 9/10/2007 |
I know DH and many of his peers and siblings feel kind of cheated. Throughout our lives we were told "go to college, get a degree... any degree... and you'll make it!" Well its definitely not the case especially in this economy. DH had to go back to school to get his masters because the job outlook for his degree was very limited with low pay... but no one told him that when he was growing up. We're lucky he has a good job right now with decent pay. It has nothing to do with EITHER of his degrees but it definitely doesn't make sense to quit and look somewhere else right now with the economy.
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| Posted: 1/16/2009 4:41:32 PM | |
| P: 1/16/2009 4:44:53 PM | |
monarch64 Ideal Rock Total Posts: 9,557 Last Post: 11/24/2009 Member Since: 8/12/2005 |
Huh. All this time I've thought I was Gen X....I was born in '77 so I'm right on the border, I guess. I think I did have a sense of entitlement when I was in college, but that was back in '96-2000 when the economy was in better shape. I worked in high school, worked through college, and landed a great job as soon as I graduated and was promoted three weeks later. I never had a problem finding a job until 2007, I was laid off twice in a year and I was shocked and dismayed by how extremely difficult it had become to find employment. I honestly had always taken employment for granted, if that is the same as entitlement I suppose you could say I used to feel entitled. God knows I don't feel that way anymore!!!
"Go confidently in the direction of your dreams. Live the life you have imagined." Henry David Thoreau |
| Posted: 1/16/2009 4:44:53 PM | |
| P: 1/16/2009 4:46:26 PM | |
diamondseeker2006 Ideal Rock Total Posts: 17,609 Last Post: 11/18/2009 Member Since: 1/11/2006 |
We have friends in the baby boomer range who cannot find jobs. Our son has an hourly job that pays really low, but his view (and ours) is that it is better than no job at all! There just aren't many jobs out there for young college grads unless they chose a specialty such as teaching or nursing. Actually, I think there are unemployed people in all age brackets and I am afraid we are nowhere near the end of this spiral. We have a teacher shortage here, particularly for math, science, and special ed. But our starting pay for a BA is about $30,000 and Master's is about $33,000. Thankfully the cost of living is low, but it is hard for young adults to make it on that kind of money or less.
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| Posted: 1/16/2009 4:46:26 PM | |
| P: 1/16/2009 4:53:29 PM | |
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diamondseeker2006 Ideal Rock Total Posts: 17,609 Last Post: 11/18/2009 Member Since: 1/11/2006 |
Date: 1/16/2009 4:34:44 PM Author: Elmorton DH's workplace just had layoffs, and it was one older person and one younger person. From my understanding, it simply came down to production - both folks weren't bringing in numbers, and their job duties could be spread throughout a department. A friend of his was employed by the same company, different location, and the wave of layoffs sent all the newest hires out the door (including DH's friend). We've been hearing about layoffs going both ways - doing buyouts for the long-time employees and then salary freezes for the new hires or hiring freezes. I hate to say this, but if I were in charge of a company, I don't think I'd lay off my cheapest laborers - I'd go straight to production numbers, and I have a feeling that the greatest effect would be on baby boomers (who are getting paid the most) since one would suppose that this group tends to have a much harder time adopting the technologies which are bringing in greater revenue. While this may mean good news for Gen Y-ers in terms of job aqcuisition, the bigger picture is terrifying to me. If companies start laying off huge numbers of baby boomers, what is going to happen with health care (both for individuals and in terms of how health care is run?). How will all of this change retirements and pension plans? I don't see huge numbers of baby boomers being laid off. I think some will, but there is such thing as age discrimination and they can't just lay off all the highly paid workers to save money. It wouldn't be particularly good for the companies, either, to lose all the experienced workers. In my husband's company, they'll offer early retirement to certain people over 55 or so, though. My husband is really hoping they'll consider offering that to him a little early! (But I think he needs to work til 60 at least!!!!  )
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| Posted: 1/16/2009 4:53:29 PM | |
| P: 1/16/2009 5:59:36 PM | |
WishfulThinking Ideal Rock Total Posts: 1,429 Last Post: 11/23/2009 Member Since: 1/10/2007 |
I'm in the group of college students graduating this spring, and many of us are already looking for jobs. We're all having trouble. I have classmates who are hoping to land a non-entry level job at a large corporation in finance or marketing just with a B.A., which I thought was interesting, and to me at least sounded sort of entitled. Then again, these girls also come from privileged backgrounds and are used to getting what they want. I'm sure they have connections as well, but I'm not sure if even that is enough to float you in this economy. Personally, I haven't applied yet but I am fully expecting to do some time waitressing... or perhaps flipping burgers? I'm not even kidding. If it can pay even some of the bills and its what's available, I'll take it. And I'll work damn hard at it, too. I am also prepared [like the woman in the article] not be able to find work *at all*, even doing jobs I'm definitely overqualified for, and while the idea terrifies me, I've been raised never to expect anything and if that's the case I will figure something out. I do know a lot of people my age who were NOT raised the same way. I do have to say that while I get that we're all being told to go out there and give it our best shot and succeed, if the people featured in that article heard that dribble in college it was a teeeensy bit silly to really believe it. That's what your school is *supposed* to tell you. After all, it justifies your paying money to go there if you'll have a bright future. 
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| Posted: 1/16/2009 5:59:36 PM | |
| P: 1/16/2009 6:23:23 PM | |
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AmberGretchen Ideal Rock Total Posts: 7,046 Last Post: 11/11/2009 Member Since: 1/6/2005 |
Date: 1/16/2009 5:59:36 PM Author: WishfulThinking I'm in the group of college students graduating this spring, and many of us are already looking for jobs. We're all having trouble. I have classmates who are hoping to land a non-entry level job at a large corporation in finance or marketing just with a B.A., which I thought was interesting, and to me at least sounded sort of entitled. Then again, these girls also come from privileged backgrounds and are used to getting what they want. I'm sure they have connections as well, but I'm not sure if even that is enough to float you in this economy. Personally, I haven't applied yet but I am fully expecting to do some time waitressing... or perhaps flipping burgers? I'm not even kidding. If it can pay even some of the bills and its what's available, I'll take it. And I'll work damn hard at it, too. I am also prepared [like the woman in the article] not be able to find work *at all*, even doing jobs I'm definitely overqualified for, and while the idea terrifies me, I've been raised never to expect anything and if that's the case I will figure something out. I do know a lot of people my age who were NOT raised the same way. I do have to say that while I get that we're all being told to go out there and give it our best shot and succeed, if the people featured in that article heard that dribble in college it was a teeeensy bit silly to really believe it. That's what your school is *supposed* to tell you. After all, it justifies your paying money to go there if you'll have a bright future. Wishful - I think those girls are in for a rude awakening, especially in this economy... I have more hope for you though - I think that you will land on your feet, especially with such a down-to-earth attitude, plus we all know that you are very bright and hardworking. I really think that people like that tend to rise to the top, even in a bad economy, and even if it doesn't happen right away.
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| Posted: 1/16/2009 6:23:23 PM | |
| P: 1/16/2009 6:34:45 PM | |
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WishfulThinking Ideal Rock Total Posts: 1,429 Last Post: 11/23/2009 Member Since: 1/10/2007 |
Date: 1/16/2009 6:23:23 PM Author: AmberGretchen Date: 1/16/2009 5:59:36 PM Author: WishfulThinking I'm in the group of college students graduating this spring, and many of us are already looking for jobs. We're all having trouble. I have classmates who are hoping to land a non-entry level job at a large corporation in finance or marketing just with a B.A., which I thought was interesting, and to me at least sounded sort of entitled. Then again, these girls also come from privileged backgrounds and are used to getting what they want. I'm sure they have connections as well, but I'm not sure if even that is enough to float you in this economy. Personally, I haven't applied yet but I am fully expecting to do some time waitressing... or perhaps flipping burgers? I'm not even kidding. If it can pay even some of the bills and its what's available, I'll take it. And I'll work damn hard at it, too. I am also prepared [like the woman in the article] not be able to find work *at all*, even doing jobs I'm definitely overqualified for, and while the idea terrifies me, I've been raised never to expect anything and if that's the case I will figure something out. I do know a lot of people my age who were NOT raised the same way. I do have to say that while I get that we're all being told to go out there and give it our best shot and succeed, if the people featured in that article heard that dribble in college it was a teeeensy bit silly to really believe it. That's what your school is *supposed* to tell you. After all, it justifies your paying money to go there if you'll have a bright future. Wishful - I think those girls are in for a rude awakening, especially in this economy... I have more hope for you though - I think that you will land on your feet, especially with such a down-to-earth attitude, plus we all know that you are very bright and hardworking. I really think that people like that tend to rise to the top, even in a bad economy, and even if it doesn't happen right away. Sometimes my slightly mean streak comes out and I hope they enter the real world with a more realistic view of how things work. That said, their parents seem to be [at least trying] to hand them a great job just like they handed them everything else in life. Thank you, Amber. It's a little scary going out there right now! The student loan thing is killer, too, and I know a lot of people our age have to deal with that in addition to the awful job market, which is a pretty big expense piled on top of all the other expenses.
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| Posted: 1/16/2009 6:34:45 PM | |
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