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ť Help! Can't decide on this 3.03 carat, E color/SI1

Help! Can't decide on this 3.03 carat, E color/SI1

P: 12/22/2008 7:29:39 PM
dawgielover Rough Rock Total Posts: 10 Last Post: 8/21/2009 Member Since: 12/22/2008	We went to view this loose diamond a couple of days and these is the GIA report info; Round Brilliant 3.03 carat E Color SI1 clarity Very good Cut grade VG Polish G Symmetry No Flourescence 9.35-9.42 x 5.61 mm 57% table 59.8% depth med-thick, faceted girdle no cutlet Priced at $54k....Is it worth buying? Or should I wait? I looked under the loop and I'm still uneasy about the number of inclusions but otherwise, it's a gorgeous stone. Please advise. Thanks!! =)
Posted: 12/22/2008 7:29:39 PM

There are 21 replies to this message. There are 21 replies on this page.

P: 12/22/2008 7:33:47 PM
Stone-cold11 Ideal Rock Total Posts: 6,935 Last Post: 11/25/2009 Member Since: 9/9/2008	Probably not with the GIA VG in cut grade and only a G in symm. Do you have the pavilion and crown angles?
Posted: 12/22/2008 7:33:47 PM

P: 12/22/2008 7:52:15 PM
dawgielover Rough Rock Total Posts: 10 Last Post: 8/21/2009 Member Since: 12/22/2008	i believe it is 31.0 and 40.9
Posted: 12/22/2008 7:52:15 PM

P: 12/22/2008 7:52:41 PM
dawgielover Rough Rock Total Posts: 10 Last Post: 8/21/2009 Member Since: 12/22/2008	sorry it's 40.8
Posted: 12/22/2008 7:52:41 PM

P: 12/22/2008 8:08:58 PM
Stone-cold11 Ideal Rock Total Posts: 6,935 Last Post: 11/25/2009 Member Since: 9/9/2008	A little on the shallow side for the pavilion angles, this angle is likely to cause a darkening of the stone if you look at it closer, between 6 - 12 inches, did you notice that effect? Did you look at it outside of store lighting? I think it is a little too pricey for a VG cut, polish and G symm stone.
Posted: 12/22/2008 8:08:58 PM

P: 12/22/2008 8:52:58 PM
thing2of2 Ideal Rock Total Posts: 7,676 Last Post: 11/25/2009 Member Since: 1/1/2007	I would not buy that stone. The cut is not great and the price isn't good, either. I just did a search using the Pricescope search engine and there are several 3 carat round brilliants that are ideal cut for much less than $54k. What are your color and clarity parameters? If you are willing to buy a G/SI1, there is an AGS 0 3.00 carat diamond for $35k at Whiteflash. AGS is thought by many to be more strict than GIA, and an AGS 0 = ideal cut. There are many other GIA certed 3 carat diamonds as well. If you do get GIA I would get Excellent cut at the very least and run the numbers through the HCA found here: Holloway Cut Advisor Stick around and learn a bit about cut before purchasing such an expensive stone!
Posted: 12/22/2008 8:52:58 PM

P: 12/22/2008 11:22:50 PM
dawgielover Rough Rock Total Posts: 10 Last Post: 8/21/2009 Member Since: 12/22/2008	I would prefer to stay w/in D-F color range and VS2 or better. Thank you so much for replying! Much appreciated! I was hesitant about the stone and now I'm glad I came to this forum. My friend who is in the wholesale biz shown me the stone and said he was giving it to me at a good price. He suggested that he would go for color and carat size and sacrifice on clarity here.
Posted: 12/22/2008 11:22:50 PM

P: 12/22/2008 11:24:50 PM
dawgielover Rough Rock Total Posts: 10 Last Post: 8/21/2009 Member Since: 12/22/2008	i didn't notice the stone darkening but then again, I am a novice when it comes to diamonds. I saw the stone in an office setting with bright lights, no sunlight.
Posted: 12/22/2008 11:24:50 PM

P: 12/22/2008 11:30:55 PM
dawgielover Rough Rock Total Posts: 10 Last Post: 8/21/2009 Member Since: 12/22/2008	input all the data in the Holloway Cut advisor and it was rated a 1.2 - excellent in terms of visual performance. Light return is VG Fire, Scint, and spread is Excellent But the stone is outside the box of AGS ideal candidates as well as the GIA Excellent candidates.
Posted: 12/22/2008 11:30:55 PM

P: 12/23/2008 1:09:11 AM
thing2of2 Ideal Rock Total Posts: 7,676 Last Post: 11/25/2009 Member Since: 1/1/2007	Oh boy...it's basically always trouble around here when someone has a "wholesaler" friend! No offense to your friend, but if he were really a wholesaler he wouldn't be selling directly to you! Plus the price is VERY high on that diamond. For example, James Allen has a 3.00 E/SI1 for $47k. Do a little reading here on PS and you'll soon discover that it's all about CUT! An AGS 0, or AGS 0 parameters should really be what you're shooting for. And if you do get an AGS 0, a G or even an H will face up extremely white because of the superior performance. It's important to know your comfort range, but I would bet that you couldn't tell the difference between a well cut F/VS2 vs. an equally well cut, eye clean G/SI1. You can use the Pricescope search engine to search for 3 carats in your color and clarity range, but if I were you I would search for AGS 0, from D-G, and from IF-SI1. You can find great eye clean SI1's, and a G will face up extremely white. Here's the AGS 0 G I mentioned earlier for $35k: link You obviously have an awesome budget so I would just make sure to get the most beautiful, well-performing diamond you can, and set it in a gorgeous solitaire. Maybe a Leon Mege? If you do a search you can find some of his settings, and his simple solitaires are really gorgeous. But of course I love his pave settings, too! Good luck and let us know what you end up with!
Posted: 12/23/2008 1:09:11 AM

P: 12/23/2008 4:28:28 AM
Lorelei Ideal Rock Total Posts: 34,280 Last Post: 11/25/2009 Member Since: 4/30/2005	Date: 12/22/2008 8:08:58 PM Author: Stone-cold11 A little on the shallow side for the pavilion angles, this angle is likely to cause a darkening of the stone if you look at it closer, between 6 - 12 inches, did you notice that effect? Did you look at it outside of store lighting? I think it is a little too pricey for a VG cut, polish and G symm stone. Don't you mean the crown angle is shallow? The pavilion angle is in a good range, the crown is shallow. Dawgie welcome to Pricescope! You have an excellent budget and can do better than this diamond, the crown angle is too shallow. Everything else looks good but if the crown was a bit steeper between 34 and 35 degrees for example, this would help the diamond. Nothing is more sacred as the bond between horse and rider...no other creature can ever become so emotionally close to a human as a horse. When a horse dies, the memory lives on because an enormous part of his owner's heart, soul, very existence dies also...but that can never be laid to rest, it is not meant to be... - Stephanie M Thorn
Posted: 12/23/2008 4:28:28 AM

P: 12/23/2008 5:18:18 AM
Stone-cold11 Ideal Rock Total Posts: 6,935 Last Post: 11/25/2009 Member Since: 9/9/2008	Date: 12/23/2008 4:28:28 AM Author: Lorelei Date: 12/22/2008 8:08:58 PM Author: Stone-cold11 A little on the shallow side for the pavilion angles, this angle is likely to cause a darkening of the stone if you look at it closer, between 6 - 12 inches, did you notice that effect? Did you look at it outside of store lighting? I think it is a little too pricey for a VG cut, polish and G symm stone. Don't you mean the crown angle is shallow? The pavilion angle is in a good range, the crown is shallow. Dawgie welcome to Pricescope! You have an excellent budget and can do better than this diamond, the crown angle is too shallow. Everything else looks good but if the crown was a bit steeper between 34 and 35 degrees for example, this would help the diamond. It is a little shallow for that crown angle.
Posted: 12/23/2008 5:18:18 AM

P: 12/23/2008 5:32:41 AM
Lorelei Ideal Rock Total Posts: 34,280 Last Post: 11/25/2009 Member Since: 4/30/2005	Date: 12/23/2008 5:18:18 AM Author: Stone-cold11 Date: 12/23/2008 4:28:28 AM Author: Lorelei Date: 12/22/2008 8:08:58 PM Author: Stone-cold11 A little on the shallow side for the pavilion angles, this angle is likely to cause a darkening of the stone if you look at it closer, between 6 - 12 inches, did you notice that effect? Did you look at it outside of store lighting? I think it is a little too pricey for a VG cut, polish and G symm stone. Don't you mean the crown angle is shallow? The pavilion angle is in a good range, the crown is shallow. Dawgie welcome to Pricescope! You have an excellent budget and can do better than this diamond, the crown angle is too shallow. Everything else looks good but if the crown was a bit steeper between 34 and 35 degrees for example, this would help the diamond. It is a little shallow for that crown angle. A better balance would be a steeper crown, also the diamond is borderline and may not show any darkening due to obstruction. If the pavilion angle was shallower then possibly but I would be inclined to think the odds would be on not with this range. Nothing is more sacred as the bond between horse and rider...no other creature can ever become so emotionally close to a human as a horse. When a horse dies, the memory lives on because an enormous part of his owner's heart, soul, very existence dies also...but that can never be laid to rest, it is not meant to be... - Stephanie M Thorn
Posted: 12/23/2008 5:32:41 AM

P: 12/23/2008 5:43:00 AM
Stone-cold11 Ideal Rock Total Posts: 6,935 Last Post: 11/25/2009 Member Since: 9/9/2008	A better balance would be a steeper crown, also the diamond is borderline and may not show any darkening due to obstruction. If the pavilion angle was shallower then possibly but I would be inclined to think the odds would be on not with this range. That is your opinion. Some like a BIC, for its light return and spread, how would I know what she like? I also asked her to check since she saw it, I didn't. I just want her to check to make sure she takes that into account. I based my recommendation on the fact that it is only a VG in cut and polish and G in symm, which is much more pricey than online.
Posted: 12/23/2008 5:43:00 AM

P: 12/23/2008 5:45:48 AM
Lorelei Ideal Rock Total Posts: 34,280 Last Post: 11/25/2009 Member Since: 4/30/2005	Date: 12/23/2008 5:43:00 AM Author: Stone-cold11 That is your opinion. I also asked her to check since she saw it, I didn't. Indeed. If you are going by the usage warnings chart then it is borderline, any obstruction is not as likely to be an issue as if the pavilion was similarly shallow. "That is your opinion. Some like a BIC, for its light return and spread, how would I know what she like?" Nothing wrong with liking a BIC at all, what I am saying is I doubt that the diamond will show obstruction issues due to it being borderline on the chart, usually you find this more with shallow shallow combos. Nothing is more sacred as the bond between horse and rider...no other creature can ever become so emotionally close to a human as a horse. When a horse dies, the memory lives on because an enormous part of his owner's heart, soul, very existence dies also...but that can never be laid to rest, it is not meant to be... - Stephanie M Thorn
Posted: 12/23/2008 5:45:48 AM

P: 12/23/2008 5:51:02 AM
Stone-cold11 Ideal Rock Total Posts: 6,935 Last Post: 11/25/2009 Member Since: 9/9/2008	Date: 12/23/2008 5:45:48 AM Author: Lorelei Indeed. If you are going by the usage warnings chart then it is borderline, any obstruction is not as likely to be an issue as if the pavilion was similarly shallow. Then warn her and let her look and see to make sure right?
Posted: 12/23/2008 5:51:02 AM

P: 12/23/2008 5:56:19 AM
Lorelei Ideal Rock Total Posts: 34,280 Last Post: 11/25/2009 Member Since: 4/30/2005	Date: 12/23/2008 5:51:02 AM Author: Stone-cold11 Date: 12/23/2008 5:45:48 AM Author: Lorelei Indeed. If you are going by the usage warnings chart then it is borderline, any obstruction is not as likely to be an issue as if the pavilion was similarly shallow. Then warn her and let her look and see to make sure right? Look I see what you are saying SC. But going by the chart, it is borderline and not as in a shallow shallow combo where we can say yes, this diamond will have obstruction issues, there is far more of a grey area here, my concern is for those who might not know what to look for and be possibly put off what might be a good stone by not being sure in what they are seeing. Nothing is more sacred as the bond between horse and rider...no other creature can ever become so emotionally close to a human as a horse. When a horse dies, the memory lives on because an enormous part of his owner's heart, soul, very existence dies also...but that can never be laid to rest, it is not meant to be... - Stephanie M Thorn
Posted: 12/23/2008 5:56:19 AM

P: 12/23/2008 7:07:31 AM
Stone-cold11 Ideal Rock Total Posts: 6,935 Last Post: 11/25/2009 Member Since: 9/9/2008	Date: 12/23/2008 5:56:19 AM Author: Lorelei Date: 12/23/2008 5:51:02 AM Author: Stone-cold11 Date: 12/23/2008 5:45:48 AM Author: Lorelei Indeed. If you are going by the usage warnings chart then it is borderline, any obstruction is not as likely to be an issue as if the pavilion was similarly shallow. Then warn her and let her look and see to make sure right? Look I see what you are saying SC. But going by the chart, it is borderline and not as in a shallow shallow combo where we can say yes, this diamond will have obstruction issues, there is far more of a grey area here, my concern is for those who might not know what to look for and be possibly put off what might be a good stone by not being sure in what they are seeing. And in the end you are warning her off based on what you think is standard TIC parameters. Isn't that double standard?
Posted: 12/23/2008 7:07:31 AM

P: 12/23/2008 7:13:10 AM
Lorelei Ideal Rock Total Posts: 34,280 Last Post: 11/25/2009 Member Since: 4/30/2005	Date: 12/23/2008 7:07:31 AM Author: Stone-cold11 Date: 12/23/2008 5:56:19 AM Author: Lorelei Date: 12/23/2008 5:51:02 AM Author: Stone-cold11 Date: 12/23/2008 5:45:48 AM Author: Lorelei Indeed. If you are going by the usage warnings chart then it is borderline, any obstruction is not as likely to be an issue as if the pavilion was similarly shallow. Then warn her and let her look and see to make sure right? Look I see what you are saying SC. But going by the chart, it is borderline and not as in a shallow shallow combo where we can say yes, this diamond will have obstruction issues, there is far more of a grey area here, my concern is for those who might not know what to look for and be possibly put off what might be a good stone by not being sure in what they are seeing. And in the end you are warning her off based on what you think is standard TIC parameters. Isn't that double standard? No. And no need for terms such as double standard, you could have stated your question just fine without using that, and it would have come across better. We can debate and disagree ( or should be able to) without using accusatory terms. I doubt that the diamond will show obstruction issues, according to the chart as I said previously it is a borderline case and therefore in my opinion not likely to be an issue, especially with the pavilion angle in the range it is. A shallower pavilion it could happen, with the 40.8 pavilion = not so likely. You said the pavilion angle at 40.8 is likely to cause darkening when viewing the stone close up. I am doubtful that it would and according to the usage warning chart for the HCA which you are probably basing this on, it is borderline which to me means it is less likely when considering all the info to show obstruction than it would show this effect. Nothing is more sacred as the bond between horse and rider...no other creature can ever become so emotionally close to a human as a horse. When a horse dies, the memory lives on because an enormous part of his owner's heart, soul, very existence dies also...but that can never be laid to rest, it is not meant to be... - Stephanie M Thorn
Posted: 12/23/2008 7:13:10 AM

P: 1/4/2009 2:19:09 PM
dawgielover Rough Rock Total Posts: 10 Last Post: 8/21/2009 Member Since: 12/22/2008	Happy New Year!! I wanted to thank everyone who provided their expertise and took the time to respond to all my questions!! Much appreciated!! You were all so helpful and we've decided not to go forward with the stone. I can thank you enough and I am so glad I found pricescope!! I am educating myself on diamonds via reading pricescope and I'm lovin it! Sorry I can't reply to the crown/pavillion angle conversation, I'm not a professional (yet), haha My apologies for not responding earlier, I was away on vacation. We are now starting from scratch...but hopefully with some patience, diligence and luck, it'll be much easier to find!! Another question to ask is, is it better to wait another 4 months for diamond prices to drop? or it better to purchase it now?
Posted: 1/4/2009 2:19:09 PM

P: 1/4/2009 2:30:28 PM
dawgielover Rough Rock Total Posts: 10 Last Post: 8/21/2009 Member Since: 12/22/2008	Thing2of2 - I checked Leon Mage's work and it is gorgeous!! Thank you for the recommendation! I was looking into the Old Bond Street setting ( a 2 mm platin, channel, with pave sidestones) from DeBeers initially...but then I fell in loved with this setting from Mimi So. Which is basically the Old Bond Street setting with micro pave diamonds all around. I'm probably not describing it well, but here's an image; http://www.artofplatinum.com/4images/details.php?image_id=278 This is almost the same, I think...
Posted: 1/4/2009 2:30:28 PM

P: 1/5/2009 5:39:46 AM
Lorelei Ideal Rock Total Posts: 34,280 Last Post: 11/25/2009 Member Since: 4/30/2005	Date: 1/4/2009 2:19:09 PM Author: dawgielover Happy New Year!! I wanted to thank everyone who provided their expertise and took the time to respond to all my questions!! Much appreciated!! You were all so helpful and we've decided not to go forward with the stone. I can thank you enough and I am so glad I found pricescope!! I am educating myself on diamonds via reading pricescope and I'm lovin it! Sorry I can't reply to the crown/pavillion angle conversation, I'm not a professional (yet), haha My apologies for not responding earlier, I was away on vacation. We are now starting from scratch...but hopefully with some patience, diligence and luck, it'll be much easier to find!! Another question to ask is, is it better to wait another 4 months for diamond prices to drop? or it better to purchase it now? Welcome back and I hope you had a wonderful vacation! Glad to help you! As to pricing no one knows what will happen so if you find a rock you like, now is as good a time as any IMO to purchase, especially with larger top make diamonds being in limited supply with high demand. Nothing is more sacred as the bond between horse and rider...no other creature can ever become so emotionally close to a human as a horse. When a horse dies, the memory lives on because an enormous part of his owner's heart, soul, very existence dies also...but that can never be laid to rest, it is not meant to be... - Stephanie M Thorn
Posted: 1/5/2009 5:39:46 AM

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