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 » RockyTalky
»  » New Here - Thank You All
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New Here - Thank You All |
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| P: 11/4/2003 12:15:19 AM | |
wanderlost Cut Rock Total Posts: 124 Last Post: 9/15/2004 Member Since: 11/3/2003 |
Howdy. I'd really like to thank the active members of this community for sharing their experiences (in both proposals and with vendors). I've only found this site today, after reading through the myriad of corporate sites (adiamondisforever.com, stafford, etc.) and learning very little I've found a trove of exactly what I need here. I really have enjoyed and greatly profited from the knowledge that has been freely dispensed to all who have inquired. Here's my story  ...I have a wonderful girl who I've been dating for nearly four years now, she's just amazing. I enjoy surprising her with presents (esp. after having done surveillance shopping with her....  ) and am coming closeto buying the biggest one yet. In short, half the trouble has been finding something simple enough, yet unique to suit who she is... We found that last Christmas in a mall (non-chain?) store - a setting that seemed to defy explanation, a no- backed tension setting (between two small bars - I'll include a sketch later) that had us peering through the case until we were scared off by the salesperson approaching us and asking if we wanted to see it  As for a stone, I am grateful to the emphasis put on cut here, as I had been a clarity junkie (due to my life-long experience in coins and sport collectibles [alright alright... baseball cards - but vintage ones]. I believe I'm looking for something in the .72-.89 ct, G, VVS1 - VS2 (yes this is broad however I'm still coming to terms with not searching for a flawless and instead looking for a superior cut (fire! fire!). [btw... G is as colored as I could do without fluorescence as the setting will be white metal - see below] I hope I haven't violated an unspoken rule of not ghosting the forum until I had gained a more complete knowledge, but I promise to be a quick study. Specifically I wonder - a. This being a very tricky setting, I am looking to have a very good craftsman do the work (both set the stone and craft the ring). I am awaiting an email from the original store, however I would like to price it elsewhere (recommendations would be appreciated). b. Again with such a tricky setting durability of materials comes into play - 14k white gold was a first thought, however I know that 18k with palladium or a platinum alloy may be better. c. (Last one for now... thank you very much patient readers) As the stone will be held only by the girdle - will H&A (*lol* - I'd never heard of this before today, and may be stuck on it now, esp. if....) be visible from the underside at an angle (to some degree) / will light show those hearts on her finger - or are H&A simply an indication of perfect cut, visible under magnification/light equipment but not necessarily to the beholder (besides the obvious advantage of more light refracting out of the stone?) Thank you very much for your input - I promise not to start a slew of threads and educate myself more next time PS. I won't pretend it's not a consideration, but it's low on my scale... (until my bargaining brain chimes in at least) - Price. I don't really have a budget set. I've graduated college without debt and see this as a wonderful, one-time purchase. I realize any ring, any stone would mean the same, however, I want to give her something extraordinarily special  - something she can gaze into and not see the bottom - something that is asperfect ...... ok... getting a little carried away there  bigsmile:] |
| Posted: 11/4/2003 12:15:19 AM | |
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There are 16 replies to this message. There are 16 replies on this page. |
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| P: 11/4/2003 7:47:38 PM | |
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wanderlost Cut Rock Total Posts: 124 Last Post: 9/15/2004 Member Since: 11/3/2003 |
sorry for bumping my own post.... I'm just hoping to get a few replies to the questions at the bottom of the previous message. I've read through the last few months of messages now, and still can't find recommendations for jeweler-craftsmen (does anyone at goodoldgold or dirtcheapdiamonds do this work?). Also I'd still like feedback with reference to the metals that I've considered using for this setting (though I believe that the palladium would be a better choice in white gold as less problems have been reported and it seems to stay 'white' longer (indefinitely? in a 10% alloy?)), and whether Hearts would be visible say at 30* angle off of vertical - so they would be visible in this setting which bears a faint resemblance to boonerings' avatar.... One last question too.... (again, having to do with the setting instead of the stone...  ) if you were 'crazy' and did a Idealscope / Firescope / BrillianceScope reading with the stone being held by a perfectly parallel pair of tweezer prongs (which in a way would simulate a tension setting) - how would this affect the readings? As the figure under 'Basic Principle and Use' shows... there should be no difference in transmission of 'black' into the stone (I believe this represents direct overhead light), however, at least on the two tangents, transmission of (red) light through everything above the girdle (star/bezel/upper girdle) would be diminished resulting in less output (on the opposite tangent? resulting in darker spots next to both of these 'prongs?') help would be greatly appreciated in this regard.....
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| Posted: 11/4/2003 7:47:38 PM | |
| P: 11/4/2003 8:44:16 PM | |
Mara Ideal Rock Total Posts: 27,911 Last Post: 11/22/2009 Member Since: 10/30/2002 |
ahh well i can't answer all your questions but here is some food for thought.
tension rings are tricky. as far as i know, there really aren't tons of people who can craft a tension ring, it takes special materials. that said, you may want to check into some of the pre-existing tension settings that places like Gelin & Abaci and Steven Kretchmer have (www.mickeyroof.com sells SK I think), and see if any of those are close to what you were thinking of the setting looking like. from a 'custom' perspective, both SK and GA may do custom work, I really am not sure. that said, tensions are so hard to find and to find people to do them, that you may want to do a pre-made if you have a really hard time finding someone to custom it. you don't want any random person crafting or setting a tension. that's a recipe for disaster.
we are getting my fiance a tension set diamond ring for his wedding ring. we are using absolutetitanium.com and probably someone like whiteflash for the stone. important to find out also is if whoever you will work with will set YOUR stone if you don't buy from them. some places will not. we found out that whiteflash would sell us the stone but not set the ring, they don't do tension. So its things like this you will discover as you start to call around and ask questions more (as you are!).
from a metal perspective, i am not familiar with palladium, I am not a fan of white gold for e-rings, esp ones that will be worn all the time as the alloy wears off and you need work to keep WG looking nice. also platinum nicks and scratches easily, so again, hard to say. we are going with titanium because of its durability and cheapness (then we can get a cooler stone!).
on the H&A question--i think some people have said that they can see hints of the arrows sometimes in their ring, but don't be fooled into thinking that H&A means you can gaze down into the ring and see perfect arrows and hearts beaming at you. you'd probably only see arrows under real mag, and you will only ever see the hearts under a H&A Viewer. So in real life scenarios...maybe hints of the arrows but nothing sharp...but not the hearts. H&A is a mark of a symmetrical diamond (and usually very well cut).
i'm not even touching that Bscope/tweezer question!
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| Posted: 11/4/2003 8:44:16 PM | |
| P: 11/4/2003 9:13:25 PM | |
pulp_princess Cut Rock Total Posts: 184 Last Post: 3/5/2005 Member Since: 8/24/2003 |
Hi there, and welcome! I'll try and answer your questions as best I can until some experts come along. For a), I hear Mark Morrell is an exceptional craftsman. I'm sure he (or any other good craftsman) can suggest the best material to create the ring. This is his website: http://www.mwmjewelry.com Other craftsmen: Ray at www.tradeshop.com, or Juan at www.van-graff.com Juan does very nice detailing, but it sounds like nice clean lines might be the main feature, in which case, Mark would be a good choice. Juan is getting away from creating jewellry to work on other projects so he would not be a good choice if you have a deadline. For b), I think you should have the craftsman recommend the metal depending on the design. And finally, c), due to four botched repairs of the same setting (no, I'm not bitter! ), I don't have a diamond and couldn't tell you. I have seen arrows in top views of photographs but I don't think many people have photographed the bottom view of a diamond. It's an interesting thought though!For the question in your second post, you'll have to ask someone with the instrumental toys. Good luck!
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| Posted: 11/4/2003 9:13:25 PM | |
| P: 11/4/2003 9:19:37 PM | |
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pulp_princess Cut Rock Total Posts: 184 Last Post: 3/5/2005 Member Since: 8/24/2003 |
Mara reminded me of something. She made a really good point that you need someone who is familiar with tension settings, and I haven't seen Juan or Mark do a tension setting. Not that they haven't done it, but I've never seen it. I do know Juan works with white gold/palladium alloys though.
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| Posted: 11/4/2003 9:19:37 PM | |
| P: 11/5/2003 5:09:54 AM | |
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wanderlost Cut Rock Total Posts: 124 Last Post: 9/15/2004 Member Since: 11/3/2003 |
Fortunately/Unfortunately - the ring has to be white. I've read the Titanium thread and have nixed it (at least for the time being). I have only minor worries that the stone could be damaged by the titanium, however, I don't feel the color is right and unless she and I were to agree on titanium bands (and as this is currently an unmentioned (but [previously discussed) suprise.....)... White gold with palladium, perhaps the briefly mentioned 19k white gold (proprietary alloy?) and a platinum alloy (however it would need to be a much lower percentage than normal for platinum to make up for metal softness as well as again, color.) I realize this setting is going to need a level of engineering (and artistry) that I'm somewhat concerned that it could be the rate-determining step in putting together a ring. I have no doubt though that a experienced artisan would be able to create something that exceeds my concept for the ring right now. [and again - if you know who this person is please chime in ]This whole thing is just a part of the (great) experience of buying a ring..... plus - uniqueness can rival beauty (and can get more looks than size)... then again.... looking through some of the rocks over at goodoldgold... it's AMAZING that something can have such a fantastic cut, outstanding clarity (IF?!) and still be in the 3+ ct. range (mind boggling)... must have been hot & heavy where that one came from 
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| Posted: 11/5/2003 5:09:54 AM | |
| P: 11/5/2003 8:54:24 AM | |
Giangi Ideal Rock Total Posts: 2,530 Last Post: 10/29/2006 Member Since: 1/23/2003 |
Hiya!  A few general guidelines about tension settings: The possibility of tension setting a diamond depends on the type of inclusions and their locations, feathers along the girdle edge or inclusions on the side would not be a good idea... The girdle thickness has to be thick enough to handle the stress. That said, remember that most tension settings professionals work with SI 1 or better clarity diamonds... And not all of them are suitable, as I wrote above. Also, as I stated in the titanium thread, be sure to get a recognised one... Tension settings are very tricky and need to be done by people who have the necessary skills... Depending on your budget and tastes, I would suggest checking out Gelin & Abaci, Steven Kretchmer and Niesseng. These are very well recognised and stand behind their product. Very important, most of them offer a resizing policy. As a personal note, I have to add that Tension settings are my favorite... They're just perfect. All you do notice is the stone... Simply beautiful!
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| Posted: 11/5/2003 8:54:24 AM | |
| P: 11/6/2003 4:18:33 PM | |
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wanderlost Cut Rock Total Posts: 124 Last Post: 9/15/2004 Member Since: 11/3/2003 |
One more bump (TTT) to see if I can get the rest of these questions answered. Thanks for your help
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| Posted: 11/6/2003 4:18:33 PM | |
| P: 11/7/2003 7:22:09 AM | |
diamond dazed Rough Rock Total Posts: 92 Last Post: 2/11/2004 Member Since: 9/30/2003 |
Hi, I don't post much, but read a lot, but have to jump in here as I also have seriously considered a tension setting. After reading every bit of information out there (and several horror stories), I would absolutely not consider anything other than a Steven Kretchmer, or a Niessing tension setting, or possibly Gelin and Abaci (though copyright issues, and ethics come into play when considering the later -- search for Steven Kretchmer's post on diamondtalk.com). The processes that Niessing and Kretchmer use are both complicated and patented, and the only sure way to know your diamond is secure. I visited several local B&M stores in search of tension settings, and a few had their own tension settings. Although they *look* exactly like the Kretchmer and Niessing's, there are horror stories about people losing stones out of the imitators. Kretchmer and Niessing's do not fail. Period. The others may -- many have. I was also shocked that many of the local places said, "Oh we can make one of those for you," as if it were a simple thing. I would urge you to NOT go with a custom made one, but spend the extra $$$ (and they are pricey -- starting around $1800, I think) to get one that will be absolutely secure. Kretchmer and Niessing are artisans, and their settings are stunning, as well. I was also going to mention that I don't believe that white gold is an option (at least with Kretchmer), for some reason it doesn't have the same properties that yellow gold and platinum do that allow them to "spring back." (I could be wrong, that's just what I seem to remember). Tension settings are awesome, your fiance's ring will be gorgeous. Good luck with your search. Kris 'I ask not for a larger garden, but for finer seeds.' |
| Posted: 11/7/2003 7:22:09 AM | |
| P: 11/7/2003 9:37:56 AM | |
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wanderlost Cut Rock Total Posts: 124 Last Post: 9/15/2004 Member Since: 11/3/2003 |
Let me add another material to that list there.... Platinum/SK you can read about it here, but apparently it's not new news...
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| Posted: 11/7/2003 9:37:56 AM | |
| P: 11/7/2003 1:03:00 PM | |
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lenore80 Rough Rock Total Posts: 27 Last Post: 2/15/2004 Member Since: 9/5/2003 |
Have you checked your local B&M stores? My boyfriend and I went out looking at engagement rings, and i noticed some very lovely tension settings. The saleslady told us that they need to send out the diamond with the tension settings to the actual company to set it. Just becareful of the type of stores Diamond Dazed warned about.
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| Posted: 11/7/2003 1:03:00 PM | |
| P: 7/14/2004 8:51:12 PM | |
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ceuman Rough Rock Total Posts: 1 Last Post: 7/14/2004 Member Since: 7/14/2004 |
Dear Wanderlost check this out: http://www.puttmann.nl/index2.html heres something that could help your inspiration.
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| Posted: 7/14/2004 8:51:12 PM | |
| P: 7/14/2004 9:25:45 PM | |
Superidealist Ideal Rock Total Posts: 655 Last Post: 8/23/2006 Member Since: 9/10/2003 |
I agree that you don't want to scrimp on a tension setting. If I were you, I'd spend the money and get one from a "name" source. This may not fit your budget, however, since these start high (about $2500-3000 for the Kretchmer Omega). On the plus side, they look best with diamonds on the lower end of your size range, in my opinion. They also are made in gold, but this tends not to save much, so I'd go with platinum. No hearts will be visible on her finger and you will not be able to see the heart pattern in the diamond. Contrary to what Mara has said, the arrows may be easily visible but this will depend on your diamond. In any case, I wouldn't worry about it. As far as the tweezers go, it's not a consideration. The purpose of each device is to place the diamond in a standardized environment for viewing so that you can compare it with other diamonds. A well-cut diamond should look better than a less well-cut diamond in any setting. D Riley |
| Posted: 7/14/2004 9:25:45 PM | |
| P: 7/14/2004 9:52:01 PM | |
Patty Ideal Rock Total Posts: 4,031 Last Post: 6/4/2008 Member Since: 12/7/2003 |
This is an old post...from 8 months ago. My guess is that wanderlust found something by now.
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| Posted: 7/14/2004 9:52:01 PM | |
| P: 7/14/2004 10:30:34 PM | |
ame Ideal Rock Total Posts: 3,452 Last Post: 2/7/2006 Member Since: 7/7/2004 |
I am biased, I think Platinum is the ONLY way to go for such an important set of jewelry. I also think that you should strongly consider the longetivity of the style. Tensions are ok to look at now, but they might not stand the test of time, not just style-wise but durability. If she's wearing this her whole life, and she will most likely, daily, she needs something with more security than this. I personally think that if you go tension set, do so for a right-hand ring. I prefer simple, classic platinum solitaires sometimes with a little surprise stone set it the sides of the setting. I had big design-ey hopes for my ring and when it came down to it, I wanted to be able to dress it up in other ways and not risk disliking it later in life. Also look into other round cuts. My stone is a Star 129. Because of the absurd amount of light that goes through this sucker, my H looks brighter than a flawless D. Star's aren't much more expensive than a regular Round Brilliant but youll have to look around for a jeweler that sells them. I don't know of any online vendors that do. IF you are in St. Louis or the vicinity, Vincent's is the only one I know of in the midwest thatsells them, or at least that did till last I heard.
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| Posted: 7/14/2004 10:30:34 PM | |
| P: 7/14/2004 10:33:41 PM | |
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Superidealist Ideal Rock Total Posts: 655 Last Post: 8/23/2006 Member Since: 9/10/2003 |
On 7/14/2004 9:52:01 PM Patty wrote: Talk about a misleading thread title!  D Riley |
| Posted: 7/14/2004 10:33:41 PM | |
| P: 7/14/2004 10:56:01 PM | |
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wanderlost Cut Rock Total Posts: 124 Last Post: 9/15/2004 Member Since: 11/3/2003 |
Holy cow.... I just about fell out of my chair just now to see that someone had resurrected this post. *lafs* To be honest I haven't bought the ring yet, but am about to. The wisest post that I read on here said 'let the woman choose the setting, let the man choose the stone.' I realize this is not a valid statement for everyone, however, I've found it very helpful (as the TR-004 setting that I had been captivated by she dislikes (quite a bit)). The setting that we've decided on is the Gelin & Abaci TR-025 (really a cool design that allows a lot of light into the stone).... I'm currently trying to find a good stone, preferably at a vendor who can sell me the setting as well (and hopefully has at least half the creditabilty, customer service & great policies that GOG has....) Let's let this thread rest again & if anyone would like to help me find the stone I'm looking for.... check out the other post I just posted. I've included my search criteria... (checks the old thread... well nearly the same search criteria still.... that's good news )Thanks
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| Posted: 7/14/2004 10:56:01 PM | |
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