Purchasing Online without Seeing the Diamond

[festivities]

Dear DT,

May I plesae share a recent experience with you and offer a warning to anyone wanting to purchase a diamond online and hasn''t actually seen it in person and is not experienced with all the C''s?

I really wanted an Asscher cut (the real thing - vintage style) and found that I couldn''t afford it. I purchased a emerald square step from an Ebay seller with a good rating. Of course, it was advertised as an Asscher but I knew it wasn''t from reading all the wonderful info on this site. It seemed to have pretty good specs. I received it yesterday and took it to a local jeweler who previously showed me a lovely square step (I couldn''t afford that one... it was way beyond my bank account) and he originally advised me not to purchase under G color and SI1 clarity (based upon the money I had to spend and what I wanted). Well, I met those specs. He was VERY surprised that the stone matched everything the EGL USA cert. said, but his cutter said it was a "poor cut, too deep, and one of the prongs needed adjusting" and because of this, it loses some of the sparkle. There is nothing in the EGL block about the Cut... This particluar cutter said he is verfified to cut a Royal Asscher for the Asscher company and has years of experience, so I am taking his appraisal to heart and am serioulsy depressed about my purchase.

I was so worried about cost, SIZE!, color and clarity, that I didn''t really consider the cut. I did not see this exact ring/stone on Ebay, but the jeweler had one similar for sale, so I called. He made a ring for me that I receivd yesterday. He was really wonderful to work with and very friendly, but there are a few problems. Cut, depth, prong fit and the side stones are .08 each when they are supposed to be .20 each. TCW should be 1.40 as stated on the invoice and their separate appraisal, but the real TCW is 1.16!

I must say that I am disappointed overall with my online purchase. Now I must make a very uncomfortable call to the jeweler who was really nice and accommodating (I only have three days to return it) and hope that he will atleast replace the side stones for what they are supposed to be. My finacee thinks they made an honest mistake and put the wrong size baguettes in... The cutter said they will have to remount the stone because there isn''t enough gold on the band to accommodate the .20s. I know I won''t be able to return the center stone and that it''s my fault I find myself in this situation.

I wasn''t upset with the ring unitl I took it to the jeweler and learned of all these problems.

The ring itself is very pretty and does have quite a bit of sparkle (in the right light) and lots of mirror effect, and is eye clean and very white, but no one wants a poorly cut diamond, bad mounting and a stone which is too deep to reflect light correctly!

PLEASE MAKE SURE YOU SEE YOUR DIAMOND BEFORE YOU BUY IT AND HAVE A QUALIFIED PERSON LOOK AT IT! I should have asked the person I bought this from to send it to my local jewler before I bought it. Hindsight is 20-20.

Everytime I look at it (which is like every 5 seconds) I can only think of "poorly cut, too deep, bad mounting", and that the baguettes are too small!

Annie

 

[chris-uk04]

Sorry to hear about your problem. Can you get a refund? What were the guarantees or terms & conditions of the purchase? I think Ebay is the riskiest online purchase you can make, along with the big diamond brokers such as diamond.com or blue nile whereas you only see "a sample photo". Good ratings on ebay only go so far. You got a real diamond that matched it's cert. Many mall stores such as Zales will sell similar poorly cut stones. It's not poorly cut out of spite, but so it weighs more. Since the vast majority of women are carat conscious, demand for large stones at the expense of cut quality has arisen.

There are some smaller vendors out there and reccommend by this site that give data on the specifics on the cut, as well as show light return, etc. They will also take different pictures of the diamond for you. Whereas it still isn't quite as good as seeing the diamond, it's a lot better.

See about a refund or something.

 

[Hest88]

I agree with Chris. eBay is one of the last places I would go for diamonds unless I was really sure what I was doing. Really sure. Really.

 

[festivities]

Thank you both so much for the feedback! I did try calling the jeweler today and the person I worked with is out until Monday. I explained the situation and she said she would probably speak with him later this afternoon and would ask him to try and call me today.

I'm very concerned because I only have three days to return it or have them fix the baguettes and prong. I received it yesterday and hope they won't consider the weekend days... today is Friday...

Do you happen to know if return days are Monday - Friday??

I took some digital photos with a friends camera this morning and she is going to e-mail them to me. If I post them, would you give me your expert opinions? I would so greatly appreciate it!!

MANY THANKS IN ADVANCE!!

 

[niceice]

Dear Festivities,

We are sorry to hear about your on-line experience, however we are not surprised given the fact that eBay seems to be the breeding ground for bad judgement when it comes to diamond buying! Please be assured that the majority of vendors you will find here on PS are extremely reputable and that all of them offer reasonable inspection and return policies from the beginning... Most of us see very few returns a year, but that is because we represent our product ethically and honestly which enables our customers to receive the product that they anticipated and have an enjoyable on-line shopping experience. Many of our customers have only purchased items as expensive as a compact disk before buying their diamond on-line, yet we are fortunate enough to guide them through the process of buying a diamond on-line with tremendous success. Good luck with resolving this issue, we hope that you will give another on-line dealer from Price Scope a chance to find you the diamond of your dreams when you get your refund.

 

[Hodne]

I would, without a doubt, return the ring today and make sure they have it by tomorrow and ask for a full refund!

 

[aljdewey]

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On 1/16/2004 9:15:51 AM festivities wrote:


Dear DT,

May I plesae share a recent experience with you and offer a warning to anyone wanting to purchase a diamond online and hasn't actually seen it in person and is not experienced with all the C's?

----------

Hi, Annie....sorry to hear about your bad experience.

In my honest opinion, your problem didn't stem from *how* you bought (online), but from *who* you bought from (a non-reputable, non-verifiable vendor).

Ebay is just not the place to buy a diamond. Yes, people who *know* what they are doing may do OK there, but for everyone else, Ebay is a HIGH-risk venue for diamonds. Doing that is akin to walking down the streets in NY and expecting you're going to get a *genuine* Rolex. If you want a real Rolex, go to a high-end store that sells Rolex.....don't buy from a vendor on the street.

I purchased my diamond online (as did several others here) and didn't see it first.....but I went with REPUTABLE vendors, and that makes all the difference. They provided me with appropriate, verifiable documentation, tons of pictures, etc. All of them were willing to ship to an appraiser of MY choosing pre-purchase, too. That certainly minimizes problems. Buying online isn't risky if you do your homework and learn who you're dealing with first. Please don't think that all online purchases are the same....they aren't.

I don't really understand why you're even debating on fixing this ring if all you see when you look at it is "too deep, too much, etc". Return the ring and come back here.....get some help finding a reputable vendor and get a much nicer ring for the money.

Oh, and when you do come back.....this is Pricescope, not DT (just so you can find us!)

My two cents.

 

[highendgems]

hi. very sorry to hear. i agree, ebay is not the place to buy but also keep in mind many jewelers try to downgrade a diamond not bought at their store. they try to up sell you to one of theirs in many cases. did they try that with you? if you are happy with the look, that is all that counts now. cut is the #1 most important C--although with the top of shape you like, color and clarity needs to be high-end too, since that shape easily reveals flaws. azabias and super cert are reputable online dealers w/ excellent customer service.

 

[mike04456]

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On 1/16/2004 9:15:51 AM festivities wrote:










I received it yesterday and took it to a local jeweler who previously showed me a lovely square step (I couldn't afford that one... it was way beyond my bank account) and he originally advised me not to purchase under G color and SI1 clarity (based upon the money I had to spend and what I wanted). Well, I met those specs. He was VERY surprised that the stone matched everything the EGL USA cert. said, but his cutter said it was a 'poor cut, too deep, and one of the prongs needed adjusting' and because of this, it loses some of the sparkle.

----------------

Whoa--hold the national emergency a second. I will agree with the cautions about ebay, BUT, this jeweler is not an unbiased source! He previously tried to sell you a similar stone--you shouldn't be surprised that he is criticizing one you bought elsewhere. This is unfortunately not an uncommon occurrence. Before you decide that this diamond is such a dog, you need to get it evaluated by an independent appraiser, not someone who sells diamonds and certainly not someone who has just lost a sale. This diamond may in fact be just fine. Do you have any of the measurements available?

 

[highendgems]

exaclty to my point--let me give an example:

we received an EGL USA 1.5 round grade H, VS2, ideal cut.

took it for a GIA graduate jewelers opinion (he sells loose stones too) and he graded it J-I, VS2, ideal

when it was evaluated by an independant GIA gemologist it was found to be:
H color with a verbal "not darker than H", VVS2 and ideal cut. note: colorimeter also read H-I (low H, high I)

so consider your jewelers real intentions.

 

[MichelleCarmen]

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PLEASE MAKE SURE YOU SEE YOUR DIAMOND BEFORE YOU BUY IT AND HAVE A QUALIFIED PERSON LOOK AT IT! I should have asked the person I bought this from to send it to my local jewler before I bought it. Hindsight is 20-20.



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Annie,

You have to get an independant appraisal. Never show any jeweler you've bought online to a jeweler who would otherwise be selling you a diamond because regardless of what the diamond looks like, they WILL tell you you got a bad deal because they want your business.

I've purchased from ebay and was told EVERY line in the book when I took my diamond jewelry to my regular old jeweler, BUT when I went to an independant jeweler, they were impressed with the quality and price!

Remember, you loved the ring until you heard what the jeweler had to say! Don't let this person get you down before you know the facts.

Michelle

 

[Hodne]

Since you only have 3 days and don't seem to happy with your purchase I suggest you return it anyways.

Better to be safe than sorry!

 

[ladydia]

I am so sorry to hear your bad experience.
I suggest you to write a formal letter of your "return of purchase" and send to ebay by mail or fax. I think it is legal acceptable.

 

[festivities]

I so appreciate the comments, support, advice and concern shared by everyone!!! What a wonderful group of people!! Thank you so much. I was feeling very depressed. This post is long, but I want to let you all know what happened yesterday, which is very interesting.

The Ebay jeweler called yesterday afternoon and told me to send it back and they would fix it to my satisfaction or give me a full refund with no questions asked. They offered to find another stone for me that I would be happier with whether mine was "very poorly cut" or not. They did say that the local jeweler may not have been giving all the correct info because 1) I went there to look at one of their diamonds (as mentioned on this board above) and since it was too expensive for my budget I shopped elsewhere and 2) many times, online dealers are much less expensive than anyone else and retail stores aren't happy about it. I explained that I was talking to a local GIA Certified gemologist by Monday and would get back with them. She said that was perfectly fine and actually encouraged it because they stand behind their diamonds. She thought the GIA lady would find the diamond to be good quality and everything they represented.

Well, guess what???!! I spoke to GIA lady last night and explained the situation. She asked me for the specs and what I paid for it. It's a good thing I was sitting down when she gave me her opinion because I was floored.

She knows the local jeweler I went to and likes them but was leery about the cut and table comments. The cutter is not a cutter! His brother is who lives in Israel and based upon the specs, the Pavilion is only. 01 away from an “Ideal” cut square. It's not too deep at all!! She said there's no way they could or would have sold me the diamond I bought on line for the same price - no retail store around here would. She's a small one-woman shop who is very competitive and said she couldn't have done it either. She also said that I would be hard pressed to purchase this locally in this market wholesale for 6K from anyone and that it appears from the specs that I got the ring of my dreams for an amazing price - not even counting the side stones! I'm taking it to her today at 3:00 pm for a formal appraisal and to check out the prong problem, but she is confident that it is all the cert. says and said there's “no such thing as a perfectly cut diamond”. She said GIA stopped cert. Ideal cuts years ago for the exact same reason and why EGL doesn't rate cuts. She said I would know if the diamond was “very poorly cut” by just by looking at it!

I FEEL SO MUCH BETTER! However, I am totally appalled that the local jeweler told me these things! I also want to apologize for jumping the gun and posting my original note, but I was in such an uproar and believed everything the local jeweler told me. I purchase many items online for my work (incl. From Ebay) and have never had a problem but I’ve never purchased jewelry online before this.

LawGem, yes I have the specs and am posting them here. May I have expert opinion on the ring? The photos I took are terrible, so I'll try to get one taken during the appraisal today. I paid 3,219 for everything (incl. shipping).

EGL CERT: US75330916D
WT: 1.00 CT
Square Emerald Step
Measurements: 5.52 x 5.50 x 3.95 mm
Depth: 71.6%
Table: 66%
Crown: 10.0%
Pavilion: 56.9%
Girdle: Sl.Thick to Thick polished
Cutlet: None
Polish: Good to very good
Symmetry: Good
Clarity Grade: SI1
Color Grade G
Flourescence: Faint
Dec. 19, 2004 , EGL Los Angeles

Separate Card from Univ. Gem. Svc’s: value = 8,750
Dec. 19, 200

The Ring Appraisal (it came with the ring)
1.40 ct. 18K white gold ring
1.00 ct Asscher cut diamond ring with G color SI1 clarity
EGL number
0.40 Ct baguette diamond with SI clarity & G color
Value: 9,690
Jan. 14, 2004

I am planning on another ring purchase this year (sapphire), but will have the stone looked at before I finalize the deal. I will not take it to the local jeweler and I’ll never give them my business after this!

Please let me know what you think of my purchase, as I value the opinions on this board greatly. The Niceice folks have been wonderful through my whole process by responding to all my various posts and providing advice, info and just for caring!! Thanks to everyone!

 

[festivities]

Dear Highendgem,

Yes, the local jeweler had a similar stone that was twice my budget 3K) but it was 3K just for the stone. He showed it to me before I purchased online (it is beuatiful) and again when I took the ring to him for his opinion. When I left his store the other day after getting their "expert opinion" and feeling very, very bad, I was seriously considering a 5K personal loan so I could combine the onhand 3K with the 5K to have him make a ring for me, IF I could get my money back (which I doubted at the time!) My big delimma there was trying to qualify the 5K difference to my finacee. He did say okay, but thought I was putting too much emphasis on the ring and not the meaning of it.

Thanks for the question. I didn't think of an ulterior motive until I read everyone's comments after I posted my woes and spoke to the GIA lady. Honstly, I am not a stupid person. I really trusted this local jeweler because he was referred to me by a very good friend who has shopped his store for more than 10 years!

What an experience this has been! Can't wait to get the official independent appraisal today!!

Annie

 

[Hodne]

Happy to hear it worked out!

 

[festivities]

Really Great News!
Sharon, the certified GIA gemologist, said that I have a high quality, superior ring all the way around! She said the cut is superior/the finest, high quality and polish and does not think it was cut in the States, but overseas by a master! Most likely Israel (FYI - she's Catholic). She said she "has been setting for 30 years and could not have set this diamond as well"!! She called it "True craftsmanship". She also said there is nothing wrong with the prong either. She explained about the "seat" of the dimaond and how the metal may or may not be exactly against the seat in a corner, but as long as it is a solidly set fitting, it's okay to have a seat like this on one side. She said it's barely noticable and nothing to be concerned about.

She said the cut is "ideal and brilliant and as prefectly symmetical as it can be". Matter of fact, she said that although there is no such thing as a perfectly cut diamond, in her opinion, this is the finest square step cut she has ever seen! She said she can't find it 1 mm off anywhere!

She didn't say anything bad about the local jeweler except that there is absoutely nothing wrong with my ring and the local jeweler should be very ashamed. She said that if I wanted to, I could call/visit and tell them that she has appraised it and it has none of the problems they told me it did. I told her I doubted I'd do that. She said this happens fairly often and if people don't start calling them on it, they will continue to do this, but it is my choice. I don't know what to do. It has been such and up and down experience, that I'm just happy my ring is as beautifully made as it looks!

She does want to me share all of this with the online/Ebay dealer I purchased from and offer them her phone number in case they want to speak to her for any reason.

No pic yet, but I'll try to get one soon.

Thanks again to everyone who took time to read and respond to my situation. If there are any retail jewelers lurking out there, I hope you will be fair to those who come to you for your "expert advice."

Annie