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New Buyer

dead5pur

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 22, 2014
Messages
15
Hi Everyone,

This is my first post and my first foray into the wonderful world of engagement rings / diamonds. I'm looking to ask the question in January when we are planning a holiday.

I've done some reading on the 4 C's and such and have established that most important to me will be cut.

In terms of ring, I'm looking at the following which are the best examples I've seen so far, however will continue looking for other options.

http://www.bluenile.com/au/build-your-own-ring/diamond-halo-engagement-ring-platinum_38563

or

http://www.bluenile.com/au/build-your-own-ring/split-shank-halo-engagement-ring-platinum_42416?elem=img&track=product

So I am looking for a diamond to match this style of ring. My budget is around $5,000 give or take for ring and diamond. I'm based in Australia so options are a little more limited, however I've been looking at Blue Nile, Whiteflash and James Allen. I don't know of any others at this stage, but if anyone recommends any particular companies that ship to Australia that would be fantastic. I'd like something between 0.80 and up to 1c. In terms of colour and clarity, I'm not so sure, as obviously I'm aware that my budget is fairly limited. What would people recommend? I'd appreciate any assistance at all as this is all very new to me!

Thank you :)

Mike
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,225
Buy this:
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3109240.htm
or this
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2998699.htm This one is budget friendly and also hits 5.8mm I think it's a good value for your budget.
or
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3157630.htm

WF is a Ritani dealer. With this setting:
http://www.ritani.com/engagement-rings/french-set-halo-diamond-band-engagement-ring-in-14kt-white-gold/6115

Setting quality matters with pave. Ritani has very good quality for the pricepoint. And WF has nice diamonds and is used to shipping overseas. This is probably the easiest way to get you what you eant.
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,225
I really recommend you stick to Ritani vendors as that will give you the best quality setting for your budget. Quality really matters with pave halo rings.

Also you need a vendor that provides idealscope images of round stones. And ASET images for fancy stones.
 

dead5pur

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 22, 2014
Messages
15
Thank you Gypsy, you've been very helpful :)

I really like the ring setting that you suggested in your initial reply. Now just to find the right diamond. Ideally I want to try and spend around $4,000. $5,000 is more of the push amount. But I also want something above .75c ideally with a excellent / ideal cut. Maybe I'm wanting too much for my budget.
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,225
Yes, you are. A pave halo is not something you want to do on the cheap. You will regret it. And a pave halo is going to cost you 1800 in a quality that will stand up to every day wear. There are cheaper halos out there, but they will not stand up to the wear and tear that is needed for an engagement ring.

That means if you lower your budget to 4k. That leaves 2k for a center stone. And you aren't getting a decent cut stone with a color that will look good in a halo (you need I or better in a halo) at 75 points for that price.


You will have to spend a minimum of 2700-3300 for a nice I SI1 at 75 points. So that puts you back at 5k.

Two settings worth your time:
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3198020.htm
http://www.jamesallen.com/engagement-rings/halo/18k-white-gold-hand-made-pave-halo-engagement-ring-round-center-item-22654


You either you need to accept that you are going to get a stone smaller than 75 points. Or you need to accept that what you want will cost 5k. Irrespective of any import fees.

The choice is yours. But you do need to be realistic.

A couple stones that might work. Again these are 5.8mm, regardless of the actual carat weight. And that's what you want. They face up the same as a 75 point stone, but don't have the upcharge a 75 point stone commands.
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.72-carat-i-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-246668
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.73-carat-i-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-206931
Put them on hold and ask for an idealscope image.
With the halo I picked for you above that will put you at 4400.
 

dead5pur

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 22, 2014
Messages
15
Thank you so much! I have contacted them and they will come back to me within three business days with the idealscope images. Once I have them, I will post them here.
 

Lorelei

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 30, 2005
Messages
42,064
dead5pur|1408930872|3738761 said:
Thank you so much! I have contacted them and they will come back to me within three business days with the idealscope images. Once I have them, I will post them here.

That would be great, then we can take a look and help you decide which might be best, or help you find some others if needed.
 

dead5pur

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 22, 2014
Messages
15
Just wondering what the consensus is on B2C Jewels for their ring setting quality? I like the design of these two, but I know Gypsy said ring quality was good with Ritani and James Allan (Of which I like those suggestions also!).

http://www.b2cjewels.com/Diamond-Accent-Settings/Round-Halo-Engagement-Ring-18K-White-Gold-8480-1.aspx
http://www.b2cjewels.com/Round/1/10153/Diamond-Accent-Settings/Diamond-Halo-Solitaire-Engagement-Ring-Twist-Shank-18K-White-Gold.aspx

I like this Blue Nile on also. How is their setting quality? - http://www.bluenile.com/au/build-your-own-ring/diamond-halo-engagement-ring-platinum_38563

Also, If i purchase the ring and stone from separate places, is it easy enough to find a jeweler who can join them? Or what is the best practice here?
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,225
The diamond quality is poor on the standard settings, you would have to upgrade at extra cost. One of our members got a setting from them an returned it, and kept the stone. I personally would not buy a halo from them. The Ritani and the James Allen settings are significantly better.

Blue Nile has had many complaints about their setting quality recently.

Again, stick to JA or Ritani. You can buy both the stone and setting from the same person.

You are buying a round. You don't need to buy the stone and setting at different vendors. And quality matters.
 

Diamond_Hawk

Brilliant_Rock
Trade
Joined
Apr 8, 2014
Messages
1,229
dead5pur,

A few clarifications -

Gypsy|1409015663|3739275 said:
The diamond quality is poor on the standard settings, you would have to upgrade at extra cost.

Unlike many jewelers who offer entry level melee that is in the I SI2 range, the average quality of our melee is actually H SI1. As this is quite common we’d not characterize it as “poor,” although enthusiasts on Pricescope have different paradigms. Higher color and clarity can be subbed at cost – or lower color and clarity can be subbed at a savings - and the good part is you only pay for the cost of the diamonds, no labor cost is involved. All of our settings are done in New York by top craftsmen.

Under ‘diamond details’ on the page we have this statement - "For the side stones of this setting, we offer I-SI2 or G-VS2 options. Please call 866-522-2539 or email [email protected] for pricing information." In practice, we are not limited to I-SI2 or G-VS2 necessarily, it is all at your preference.

One of our members got a setting from them an returned it, and kept the stone.

Gypsy – can you link the thread (or send me the name) for the customer who found our setting needed to be returned? If we can find out specific reasons it will be helpful to our continuous efforts at improvement.

To this date, we have never found a negative review of our product.
 

dead5pur

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 22, 2014
Messages
15
What are people's thoughts on the following stones in comparison to the others recommended by Gypsy??

.75ct H Si1 Round Diamond - See attached GIA report.

.73ct I Si1 Round Diamond - See attached GIA report
 

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dead5pur

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 22, 2014
Messages
15
Also, I emailed Holloway Diamonds here in Melbourne in regards to a ring setting and what they could do. They could make an 18ct White Gold Halo Ring for me using one of the Diamonds I have on hold for around $2,100 AUD. Obviously I would go in and have a look first. But just wanted to ask if anyone had any experience with Holloway Diamonds before? The price seems reasonable considering I am in Australia and things are usually more expensive here.
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,225
Gary Halloway is a part owner of his site.

That said, I have never heard a complaint.


Diamond Hawk, I don't recall the posters name. They were a regular PSer, not a newbie or one timer and it was on one of the recent (last month or so) threads asking about peoples experiences with B2C. I can't recall more than that. But they stated very plainly that the setting quality was not up to their standards and they returned it, but kept the diamond. And the poster was someone I knew appreciated good quality pieces, so I trusted their judgement.

I think that the lack of "complaints" isn't really the test of people's happiness with B2C's settings. Most buyers of jewelry are looking for the least expensive bottom line, and they are not aware of the differences in quality as they just don't know anything about jewelry. If I can suggest, maybe you can look into it and see how many returns of settings there have been. That might be helpful for you.

And, I know I have given you feedback before. Posting real images of the settings will have to be a step taken before I recommend B2C for settings. CADs are not enough. Also the option of 'upgrading" to G VS is not really something that makes me inclined to recommend B2C's settings. Why? Because on similar items, JA's pricing and your STANDARD pricing are very similar. And James Allen's settings include well cut F/G melee from the outset (I know this because I have owned pieces by them). So I don't see how advising someone to pay more to upgrade to something JA has as a standard is a solution that would make me recommend B2C's settings.

Also another poster, that I will not name, went ahead and bought a halo from you, despite advice to the contrary, and posted pictures of it. I was not impressed with what those pictures showed me as to the quality of pave settings. But I of course just congratulated them, as they seemed to be happy with it. But then, they knew nothing about jewelry, so.

I do hope that B2C continues to improve though, and if they do get to the point that I feel the diamond settings are a good value, I will recommend them. But right now, I can only see myself recommending all metal settings. And even that is a big leap of faith given the lack of actual images of the settings.
 

Diamond_Hawk

Brilliant_Rock
Trade
Joined
Apr 8, 2014
Messages
1,229
Diamond Hawk, I don't recall the posters name. They were a regular PSer, not a newbie or one timer and it was on one of the recent (last month or so) threads asking about peoples experiences with B2C. I can't recall more than that. But they stated very plainly that the setting quality was not up to their standards and they returned it, but kept the diamond. And the poster was someone I knew appreciated good quality pieces, so I trusted their judgement.

Thank you for elaborating Gypsy – I do keep tabs on the forum consistently and try to respond to any concerns, questions or (as the forum rules allow) misinformation that appears regarding B2C. While I have jumped in on several threads concerning B2C diamonds, settings or the business in general I do not recall anyone returning a setting. I have spoken to our sales director and he is going to research the records in that time frame, to the end that I want to find what you’re talking about and be sure the customer concerns are noted and addressed.

I think that the lack of "complaints" isn't really the test of people's happiness with B2C's settings. Most buyers of jewelry are looking for the least expensive bottom line, and they are not aware of the differences in quality as they just don't know anything about jewelry. If I can suggest, maybe you can look into it and see how many returns of settings there have been. That might be helpful for you.

Also part of my communication with the sales department – great thought. Many pro-sumers on this forum and elsewhere do recommend looking for reviews and BBB listings for business and we value our reputation online and with the BBB for top-notch quality of product and customer service and anticipate these ratings will stay at the top end of the spectrum.

And, I know I have given you feedback before. Posting real images of the settings will have to be a step taken before I recommend B2C for settings. CADs are not enough.

Noted: The feasibility of this is being worked-up in house and strides are being made in this direction. Change doesn’t happen overnight, but you’ll be pleased down the road.

Also the option of 'upgrading" to G VS is not really something that makes me inclined to recommend B2C's settings. Why? Because on similar items, JA's pricing and your STANDARD pricing are very similar. And James Allen's settings include well cut F/G melee from the outset (I know this because I have owned pieces by them). So I don't see how advising someone to pay more to upgrade to something JA has as a standard is a solution that would make me recommend B2C's settings.

Taking nothing away from the vendor you mentioned – they are a terrific company – their standard melee is cited as G-H VS2-SI on many settings. That is the same as B2C’s citation of “minimum H SI1.” At one point I did inquire about changing ‘minimum H Si1’ to G-H VS2-SI, but there was pushback, as the management wishes to be completely transparent. I respect the decision. If you search settings on almost any site you will find a variance in the 'standard' melee used on a per-setting basis. This is where, I think, the educated PriceScoper can be a big help. As you have done previously, recommend that any buyer consider the side-stone cut and quality and pay careful attention to possible pricing and upgrade possibilities in order to compare apples to apples.

Also another poster, that I will not name, went ahead and bought a halo from you, despite advice to the contrary, and posted pictures of it. I was not impressed with what those pictures showed me as to the quality of pave settings. But I of course just congratulated them, as they seemed to be happy with it. But then, they knew nothing about jewelry, so.

I am glad they were happy.

Posts like this from long-time PSers like yourself really help B2C define and re-present our presence on the internet (particularly for the very discriminating buyers). Internal changes to satisfy both the ‘average’ online buyer and the educated PriceScope consumer are proceeding and I think you will be pleased to see many of the details you are looking for being taken into consideration as the company reacts to real-time feedback.
 

WinkHPD

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
May 3, 2001
Messages
7,516
dead5pur|1409094809|3739768 said:
Also, I emailed Holloway Diamonds here in Melbourne in regards to a ring setting and what they could do. They could make an 18ct White Gold Halo Ring for me using one of the Diamonds I have on hold for around $2,100 AUD. Obviously I would go in and have a look first. But just wanted to ask if anyone had any experience with Holloway Diamonds before? The price seems reasonable considering I am in Australia and things are usually more expensive here.

I am a HUGE fan of using a local jeweler when ever possible, especially for the setting. Then you will have a jeweler who you already trust when it is time for cleaning and maintenance on your treasured item. If that item does indeed cost you a few more Australian dollars than a similar item in the States, not a given by the way, it is probably an investment well spent for the comfort of having a local jeweler that you trust and respect. Piece of mind is usually worth spending extra for, especially for an item as important emotionally as an engagement and wedding set.

The fact that I know and like Garry very much must be mentioned as otherwise it might seem that I am trying to hide that connection and the natural bias that it introduces.

He is well known here on Pricescope for his diamond elimination tool, the Holloway Cut Adviser, known as the HCA. He also makes and distributes the Ideal-Scope and the hand held version of the ASET scope. In my opinion, you are lucky to be living near a man who is so well respected for his contributions to learning about diamonds. Me, I am glad he is in Australia, so I do not have to compete with him head to head here in the States.

Wink
 

dead5pur

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 22, 2014
Messages
15
Wink|1409147909|3740080 said:
I am a HUGE fan of using a local jeweler when ever possible, especially for the setting. Then you will have a jeweler who you already trust when it is time for cleaning and maintenance on your treasured item. If that item does indeed cost you a few more Australian dollars than a similar item in the States, not a given by the way, it is probably an investment well spent for the comfort of having a local jeweler that you trust and respect. Piece of mind is usually worth spending extra for, especially for an item as important emotionally as an engagement and wedding set.

Wink

Thanks Wink. I am going to try and pop into their store next week to have a look at some of their Halo settings. Their store is quite close to my girlfriends work and her parents house, so I'll have to park strategically just in case! Ha ha.
 

dead5pur

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 22, 2014
Messages
15
Hi All,

I now have the pricescope images of three diamonds from James Allan and a further 24 hour hold.

Would appreciate your thoughts and advice! The consultant from James Allan recommended 206931 out of the three.

Links below.

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.73-carat-i-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-206931

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.70-carat-i-color-vs1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-347997

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.72-carat-i-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-246668

206931id.jpg

347997id.jpg

246668id.jpg
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,225
Performance: Either of the first two. Not the third. Spread: First one, not the second. So.. I agree with JA. :wavey:
 

SirGuy

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jun 14, 2014
Messages
441
Agreed, not the third. I'm having trouble opening the certificate on the first one, but I like its Ideal-Scope better than the second one anyway. :wavey:
 

dead5pur

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 22, 2014
Messages
15
This was the message from James Allan.


'I've taken the liberty of having the gemologist inspect your diamonds and they've given us some helpful information. I'm happy to say that diamond 206931 has excellent fire brilliance, and scintillation! It has an excellent cut and proportions and it's the brightest diamond of the three. Additionally, it's eye clean, has a true "I" color, and faces the largest.

Diamond 347997 has excellent fire, brilliance, and scintillation also, ranking a close second for light performance. Diamond 246668 has a few tiny areas of contrast, but it's still a very bright diamond. Both of them are eye clean and have a true "I" color.

This is a beautiful lineup, as each of them is bright and very attractive. I encourage you to consider diamond 206931 since it has the best light performance and faces up the largest. It's the gemologist's favorite, so I'm confident you'll love it as well.'
 

dead5pur

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 22, 2014
Messages
15
Can I ask a question? On the recommended diamond (206931), what are the marks on the diamond that you can see on the real diamond picture on the website? Will these be noticeable to the eye?

Can I also ask you for your honest opinion? I'm planning on matching this diamond with a Halo style ring, do you think I am better off sacrificing some carat size in order to opt for a better quality stone in terms of colour and other parameters? E.g. between .60 and .70 carat but with a better colour and clarity?
 

Andelain

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Mar 10, 2010
Messages
3,525
You'll be fine with an I, and you'll never see those marks with your eyes.
 

dead5pur

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 22, 2014
Messages
15
So I'm back looking again and have managed to source a local contact who can get similar prices to overseas (considering I'm in Australia and have to think about customs and gst costs, this is a big bonus!).

He has sourced the following option and I thought I'd ask the experts here what their opinion was?

ROUND 0.65 SI1 F WH EX

I've attached the GIA report.

Price is under $3,000 AUD and I wouldn't have to add any additional taxes / import charges.

The following is a list of the other options he could currently source.

Available ROUND 0.65 SI1 H WH EX $2,658
Available ROUND 0.65 VS2 H WH EX $3,122
New Available ROUND 0.61 VS2 G WH EX $3,130
Available ROUND 0.72 SI2 F WH EX $3,271
Available ROUND 0.65 SI1 F WH EX $2,845
LAB ROUND 0.72 VS2 I WH EX $3,139
New Available ROUND 0.61 VS2 I WH EX $2,402
 

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