It was suggested I post on this forum. Any Help would be appreciated

[mrklaig1]

I am looking at two diamonds on the internet. Can anyone give me their opinion if one is a better value then the other or if both are not of good value.

Both are round diamonds and cost about $80,000. I have been married 34 years and want to buy one perfect diamond for my wife. I realize this is a big purchase and I am a novice but here goes.

Round AGS certificate.
Cut Select Ideal
caret 2.52
color D
Clarity IF
Measurement 8.82-8.78-5.41
Depth 61.4%
Table 59%
Girdle THN-MED
Cutlet None (pointed)
Polish Excellent
Symmetry Excellent
Flourescence None (inert)

Second Diamond

Round GIA GCAL certificate.
Cut Ideal
caret 2.03
color D
Clarity FL
Measurement 8.23-8.27-4.97
Depth 60.2%
Table 57%
Girdle THN-MED faceted
Cutlet very small
Polish Excellent
Symmetry Excellent
Flourescence None

Any help/feedback would be appreciated.

Regards,
Gary

 

[Dee*Jay]

Here''s my reply from the other thread:



Welcome!


Do you have the crown and pavillion angles on these stones?


Also, is there a reason that you are going for D IF? For the same amount of $ you can get, say, an F VS2 of a larger size. (You could also potentially go lower in both color and clarity and still have a very beautiful diamond). Or, you could get a diamond of the same size, again using the F VS2 example, for less $. Just throwing some ideas out there...


If you tell us what''s important to you in terms of color and clarity and I bet you''ll get a lot of suggestions on great stones, however I do understand that some people want D IF stones, so no disrespect meant if that''s the route you have consciously chosen to go.


BTW, if you post this in Rocky Talky you get much more feedback than in this forum. Perhaps the moderator can move it for you if you send her an e-mail.

 

[fanboy]

Wow, and I thought my diamond was extravagent . . .

Those sound amazing. I can certainly understand the desire to find a D IF stone--that''s what I wanted until I realized how rare and expensive they are. You probably can''t go wrong. Although, worth noting, the second one''s FL grading won''t last when it''s set.

Where are you located? If you''re near NYC, perhaps you can help me in my search for custom setter.

Again, wow.

 

[mrklaig1]

Here is some more information on one of the diamonds.

Thanks,

Gary

 

[Kaleigh]

Congrats on being married for 34 years!!! And welcome to PS

What a lovely gift this will be for your wife. Please get crown and pavillion angles on these stones. An IS image is needed too.

 

[mrklaig1]

Thank you for your compliment. Above is the GIA certificate. Does this answer your questions?

Regards,
Gary

 

[mrklaig1]

Thank you....bottom line I am not an expert...and want to be comfortable knowing I have a near perfect diamond and went for the top grades.

Regards,
Gary

 

[mrklaig1]

I live in the States,however, I am presently working for a multi-national company in Korea.

Regards,
Gary

 

[Regular Guy]

Gary,

First, also, how lovely for you and your wife.

My first impulse was to dig around this site and BN and see what I would do with $80K, and I found I wasn't selecting D & IF...but I don't have $80 K, and you do, so more power to you. (But what the heck, of several, you might even go for this one).

Then I tried to look at some value ideas for your two.

If I read correctly the specs on the cert above (57, 60.2, 34, 40., I think it will be just lovely....maybe priced a bit high frankly. Just look at the competition above when you search, and you can see the range of prices yourself...where you'd generally spend between $42 - 98 for diamonds with similar color & clarity characteristics, weighing 2 - 2.99 carats...yours is on the lower end of of size. But...it would be lovely, by the look of those numbers.

Alternately, I think I found your other option, here (and probably available virtually through many other vendors, too...see here). According to the info, the relative look, despite the good color & clarity, would be dreadful. It was certified by AGS, but not as a zero...and has no cut guideline associated with it, thank goodness.

If you decide to search more broadly, use this site, and others referenced here (under Pricescope your diamond, BN & more).

This is a good place. You'll get help here. You're doing a remarkable thing for your wife.

Warm regards,

 

[mrklaig1]

Wow, you are very helpful. Thank you very much. It is all very confusing. 3 carets is too large for my liking. Two to 2 1/2 is my range.

It just seems like of the two I am thinking of buying, they are similar and the larger is the best value. Do you agree from the limited info I have on the 2.5 diamond?

Anyone else have a thought?

Regards,
Gary

 

[Kaleigh]

Gary,
I''d work with a vendor that has all the info you need. Sarins, IS images, etc... The cert didn''t have the crown or the pavillion angles. You need those as well. Not sure who you are buying from, but I''d need that info if I was buying such a stone. HTH, Lisa

 

[cinnamon013]

I think I'd look at this stone. http://www.whiteflash.com/hearts_arrows/A-Cut-Above-H-A-cut-diamond-71804.htm#
A lot less money, but I'm betting if you compare it to the one you are considering, it would win! It's a lot less money, and with the bucks you'd save, you could take that lovely lady of yours on a nearly $40,000 vacation. Not only will she enjoy this gorgeous rock, she will have the trip of a lifetime!!!!

Here are the specs on it:

2.06 ct E VS1 A Cut Above H&A (You won't be able to see anything but bright white beauty)
$43,545.00 Item Available - Ready to ship

Item Code: AGS-6550401

. Report: AGS
. Shape: A Cut Above H&A
. Carat: 2.060
. Depth %: 61.2
. Table %: 55
. Crown Angle: 34.9
. Crown %: 15.7
. Pavilion Angle: 40.9
. Pavilion %: 43.2
. Girdle: Thin to Medium-Faceted
. Measurements: 8.23-8.26X5.05
. Light Performance: 0
. Polish: Ideal
. Symmetry: Ideal
. Culet: Pointed
. Fluorescence: Negligible

I'd have Leon Mege make a setting for this ring. She would be oh so happy with it.
If you do buy from Whiteflash, please tell them you learned about them on Pricescope. They will give you a great discount, and if you wire the money, you'll get an additional discount.


2nd:
Here is one on Leon Mege's site. It doesn't say how much, but it is a beauty as well.
http://www.artofplatinum.com/4images/details.php?image_id=350

 

[Regular Guy]

Date: 6/6/2007 10:10:33 PM
Author: Kaleigh
Gary,
I'd work with a vendor that has all the info you need. Sarins, IS images, etc... The cert didn't have the crown or the pavillion angles. You need those as well. Not sure who you are buying from, but I'd need that info if I was buying such a stone. HTH, Lisa

Yes, Lisa, the angles were at the bottom right.

I was not very convincing. You don't need to buy 3 carats or above.

But, whereas carat, color and clarity are typically understood and valued, cut is harder, but it's what this site is about.

The one you picked out that's smaller might be fine

Also, you might want to consider this 2.15 D IF.

In either case, consider checking all these out with the HCA tool here...also at the upper right under tools.

Consider cut, by some standard. If your wife would consider which she appreciates most about her diamond...color, clarity, or the way it reflects light (cut)...she would value the latter the most, assuredly. Figure out some way to judge this that makes sense to you.

Regards,

P.S. edited to add....I can easily confirm that the pick from Cinnamon is an easy other option to consider, and saving yourself $30 K to boot. You might well (oh, yeah...) decide to consider the 2.15 BN, your original GIA, and the WF one, pick only one of the best appraisers featured on this board, and for less than $1k, or several hundred anyway, get their expert opinion of which of those 3 represents the best value. How unfortunate to miss saving $30 K if an expert regards that as visibly the best at the end of the day!

 

[mrklaig1]

The one you suggested on blue Nile is beautiful and 10k less. But, I thought the florescence should be none.True? Also are the crown and pavilion angles on the GIA above good?

 

[Regular Guy]

Date: 6/6/2007 11:05:22 PM
Author: mrklaig1
The one you suggested on blue Nile is beautiful and 10k less. But, I thought the florescence should be none.True? Also are the crown and pavilion angles on the GIA above good?

Did I correctly read the crown & paviion angles above ((57 table, 60.2 depth, 34 crown, 40.8 pavilion). I think they''re good. But...test them yourself!

Re the florescence on my 2.15 BN choice...actually, I hadn''t noticed that.

Frankly...a) though I had been avoiding ones with flor for you, most experts here actually do like this. Still, unless you see it, the more conservative option is probably to avoid it. But...based on a few minutes of looking under spread sheets...this is really not the way to spend $40 - $80 grand.

Lisa is right. A couple of vendors on this board dominate, and are known for being expert at reviewing diamonds. I''d consider contacting them, telling them what you want, and having them get you a nice cup of coffee with your purchase, as well as share their intimate expertise with you. Have them look at these for you. Have them take care of you. You still might get one of the 3 I see as favorites here, but...frankly...with there being so many diamonds available...odds are on it will be a different, slightly bigger, non flor option, I''m betting.

 

[kcoursolle]

Date: 6/6/2007 9:56:11 PM
Author: mrklaig1
Wow, you are very helpful. Thank you very much. It is all very confusing. 3 carets is too large for my liking. Two to 2 1/2 is my range.

It just seems like of the two I am thinking of buying, they are similar and the larger is the best value. Do you agree from the limited info I have on the 2.5 diamond?

Anyone else have a thought?

Regards,
Gary

Please keep in mind what *she* would like. Would she rather have a larger stone with lower color/clarity or a 2 carat with perfect color/clarity? I''m sure she will be thrilled either way, but I would keep her preferences in mind and she''ll be blown away! As others have said, cut quality is the most important thing in determining a diamonds sparkle, color/clarity are secondary.

 

[Cehrabehra]

Date: 6/6/2007 11:52:03 PM
Author: kcoursolle

Date: 6/6/2007 9:56:11 PM
Author: mrklaig1
Wow, you are very helpful. Thank you very much. It is all very confusing. 3 carets is too large for my liking. Two to 2 1/2 is my range.

It just seems like of the two I am thinking of buying, they are similar and the larger is the best value. Do you agree from the limited info I have on the 2.5 diamond?

Anyone else have a thought?

Regards,
Gary

Please keep in mind what *she* would like. Would she rather have a larger stone with lower color/clarity or a 2 carat with perfect color/clarity? I''m sure she will be thrilled either way, but I would keep her preferences in mind and she''ll be blown away! As others have said, cut quality is the most important thing in determining a diamonds sparkle, color/clarity are secondary.

To buy a D IF stone you''re really throwing a lot of money on being able to say to people, this is a D IF stone If that''s worth 40 thousand dollars to you, then I guess its worth it. Because visually she nor you nor none of your friends will see the difference between the D IF and the F VS2. It would be paying for what we call her a "Mind clean issue" meaning - you can''t see it but you know it. You won''t be able to see the difference between IF and VS2 and you won''t be able to call it "flawless" you''ll have to call it "internally flawless" - even if you buy the flawless stone, setting it will mar it enough to be considered only internally flawless.

So, if it is important for you to be able to say "honey I got you this internally flawless D colored diamond" then you''re going to pay the premium for that. If you want to be able to say "honey I saved us 40 thousand bucks and you''ll never be able to tell the difference" then go for F VS2 LOL

no matter WHAT you do, D IF isn''t going to rock your world without being a top cut. A J SI2 with a top cut would kick your D IF''s butt from here to vegas if you didn''t get a top cut. And that would surely be a sad way to spend that much money.

Consider what your priorities are. Consider what her desires are. And whatever you do, buy somewhere with an upgrade plan JUST IN CASE she''d rather have a 4 carat H SI1 LOL

 

[mrklaig1]

The cut is signature ideal by Blue Nile. Does that set the ring apart?

Thank you,

Gary

 

[hikerchick]

http://www.whiteflash.com/hearts_arrows/A-Cut-Above-H-A-cut-diamond-71804.htm#
http://www.whiteflash.com/hearts_arrows/A-Cut-Above-H-A-cut-diamond-70716.htm
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamond.asp?b=16&a=12&c=77&cid=131&item=861614
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamond.asp?b=16&a=12&c=77&cid=131&item=861240

These are the 4 I would consider. Then I would choose a gorgeous setting. And with the remaining money I would buy a pair of diamond studs and a diamond pendant to go with the gorgeous ring. You can spread the 80K around to get her not just one stunning ring but an entire collection of diamond jewelry. Just my 2 cents.

 

[Jenn5504]

WOW, congrats........what an amazing thing you are doing for your precious wife!!!! It is late, I am tired, but I had to chime in real quick and say you have come to the right place for advice. But, Blue Nile''s signature ideal cut is NOT, IMO, what it may sound like. I have a BN signature ideal cut round diamond pendant and unfortnatuely it is NOT a perfect cut as I had hoped.......after learning what I have learned here on PS, I now know that my particular stone is MAYBE "VG" cut, but by no means SUPER IDEAL. That is not to say that some of their signature ideal cuts aren''t amazing, but they are just branding the stones that THEY have cut that fall "within" ideal range as signature ideal. I would strongly recommend NOT letting signature ideal be your end all be all. Research all stones for what they are, there are plenty of non-signature ideal stones they have listed that are much better cuts. And for $80k.........WOW, I would definately go with a vendor who will offer a sarin report and ideal-scope image, etc. I recently purchased a ring and band from Blue Nile but have since returned it all and am now going with White Flash because I wanted that extra info and help they will give. Best wishes, I know you will find an AmAzInG stone for you lovely wife, take the wonderful advice from these very helpful people on this site.

....and only because you are asking for input, I would definately wonder why D IF. You could go down in color and clarity and NEVER sacrifice a thing visually and also open the possibility to more wonderfully cut stones. #1 most important: CUT CUT CUT.

 

[hikerchick]

Date: 6/7/2007 12:48:27 AM
Author: mrklaig1
The cut is signature ideal by Blue Nile. Does that set the ring apart?

Thank you,

Gary

Gary the cut we are all talking about has less to do with what a company calls their line of diamonds and more to do with the angles of the diamonds and the amount of light the gets bouned back out towards the top of the diamond causing the diamond to look sparkly. Most of the folks here are recommending top notch diamonds that will likely be gorgeous. The clarity of a diamond only matters in so far as you cannot see the inclusions. For someone with as large a budget as yours for a size no bigger than 2.5 carats, you have a lot of choices. I will also reiterate what I said in my last post . . . you don''t have to spend all the 80K on the ring if you don''t want a diamond that is larger than 2.5 carats, considering taking the "extra" money and buying her other beautiful jewelry to go with her ring.

 

[JulieN]

Date: 6/7/2007 12:48:27 AM
Author: mrklaig1
The cut is signature ideal by Blue Nile. Does that set the ring apart?

Thank you,

Gary

The Signature Ideals are nice.

 

[Kaleigh]

It's their top of the line. But just for kicks, since this is a lot of money, check out www.whiteflash.com Best to give them a call, it's toll free. If I was spending that amount, I'd want Brian Gavin's help, he created what we know as the ACA cut, known as A cut Above. He is very picky, honest and will be more than happy to answer any questions you may have.

Also www.goodoldgold.com Ask for Jonathathon. He's very passionate about cut, and is a pleasure to work with. His whole team is great!!!

I have bought from both vendors. Have been very pleased with both.

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 6/7/2007 1:15:48 AM
Author: Kaleigh
It''s their top of the line. But just for kicks, since this is a lot of money, check out www.whiteflash.com Best to give them a call, it''s toll free. If I was spending that amount, I''d want Brian Gavin''s help, he created what we know as the ACA cut, known as A cut Above. He is very picky, honest and will be more than happy to answer any questions you may have.

Also www.goodoldgold.com Ask for Jonathathon. He''s very passionate about cut, and is a pleasure to work with. His whole team is great!!!

I have bought from both vendors. Have been very pleased with both.

Ditto Kaleigh, I would ask for Brian or John''s help - also they might have access or knowledge of some suitable diamonds as the D IF in the larger sizes aren''t huge sellers and might need some specialized sourcing, they will know where to look and you will end up with an incredible diamond - put their expertise to work for you!

Also welcome

 

[Regular Guy]

I''ll second my, Kaleigh, and Lorelei''s advice. WF & G0G. I don''t know the balance sheet of anybody, but they are small to medium larger firms, with identifiable (we can name them) talented people on staff, who have training in diamond-ware, and their policies, with some exception (return for WF is still only 10 days), are advantaged. The additional views they can give readily of diamonds help a lot, too.

However, with more info...

Date: 6/7/2007 1:09:47 AM
Author: JulieN

Date: 6/7/2007 12:48:27 AM
Author: mrklaig1
The cut is signature ideal by Blue Nile. Does that set the ring apart?

Thank you,

Gary

The Signature Ideals are nice.

...I hadn''t seen your option on their site. But, if it''s a BN signature...from what I know they ARE in house, and have been viewed by a professional there. Too bad we don''t know a bit more about the innards there. Maybe Leonid can fix that. Otherwise, they''re well respected, and while not a price leader, they''re consistently modestly priced, respected, and known as a quality provider, with singular connections to diamonds...even if they''re not in their hands at the time.

Probably the 2.03 represents the non-discount you get when you don''t get florescence, is probably fairly priced, and you could also identify a quality appraiser, buy it, review within 30 days, and be done.

I''d spend some time on the phone with the couple of mentioned vendors, though. Is the time zone a problem? Maybe e-mail could help. But...I''d say your chosen BN could readily work. Do check out, if you can make the time, florescence, though. Three out of four (maybe) experts here would pick it over non.

Warmest regards,

 

[widget]

Hi Mrklaig...I just wanted to congratulate you on your upcoming anniversary.

I haven''t read this thread through, and maybe this has been touched on, but I just found this quote from Wink Jones on another thread that addresses the D-IF grading vis a vis cut. Basically, D-IF reflects of God-created rarity. Cut is about man-made quality:


"....I have seen more than one, to have a D-IF stone that is unattractive due to the poor quality of the cutting. It is also possible, and I have seen thousands of these gems, to have gems of lower color and clarity that are of the highest quality of cutting that are much more beautiful than any low quality D-IF.
So for me, quality is the issue of how well man the cutter has worked with the gem of which he has been presented. Rarity is the work that nature has done before man was part of the picture...."


Have fun on your quest!
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