I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S. ?

[bizmord]

So, today through a friend I saw a wholesale diamond dealer who has been selling diamonds for 30 years now.

Here is the offer .... please tell me if it's good.

1.01 ct, GIA rated, Round diamond
6.37 x 6.41 x 3.91mm
Color = J
Cut, Polish, Sym = Very good
Clarity = SI2

Price $4,000

I saw this diamond. To my eye .... I don't see any imperfections. On the GIA report I see a few needles, feathers, etc on side of diamond and small cloud in center. Again, I didn't notice it with naked eyes.

Now ...... GIA report is about 5 years old.
Also .... I am thinking, maybe add extra $800 for color G stone? I think color J to G will be a big change?

thank you.

 

[Niel]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

Well we would need more info about the diamonds angles, but a vg cut and symm isnt actully all that good.

 

[04diamond<3]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

Well...considering a 1ct should be about 6.5mm, I can tell it's a bit deep. So I might pass, but additional info would be helpful.

 

[bizmord]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

attached is the GIA report.

thanks guys.

 

[Christina...]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

I couldn't clearly read the report, can you list the angles from the diagram? It looks like the pavilion angle says 40.6 and the depth 61.2 maybe? Can you list those for us?

 

[JulieN]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

Sounds deep.

 

[bizmord]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

see pic plz

 

[Gypsy]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

If you can provide the GIA report number we can pull it up off the GIA website.

Also, just a note about "wholesale" jewelers. If the jeweler is selling to the public, he is retail, not wholesale, no matter what he claims or calls himself.

A REAL wholesale jeweler would not sell to you.

I can tell you that the cut grade is listed as "VERY GOOD"

To summarize cut GIA grades for you: (this applies ONLY to true modern round brilliants and does not apply to OECs in anyway shape of form).

Excellent: Some are better than others. Get and idealscope image. Strong preference for stones that score under 3 on the HCA with a good idealscope image.
Very good: Not good enough
Good: Poor
Fair: Foul
Poor: Execrable

 

[JulieN]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

I assume posting pictures is more difficult than typing the proportions?

Thick girdle is decreasing spread.

 

[distracts]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

That seems to be around retail price for a diamond with those specs/angles.

 

[vickygigi]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

High for a wholesaler. Keep shopping.

 

[Gypsy]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

J to G is going to be several thousand dollars.

You need to learn more about diamonds before you drop several thousand on one. What you know is the equivalent of walking into a car dealership and asking for an "automatic, not a manual"... that's it. Would you buy a car if you knew only that much? No.

He is not giving you a great deal. Here are two diamonds at the same specs with the same price (when you factor in bank wire discounts): http://www.jamesallen.com/#!/loose-diamonds/round-cut/1.00-carat-J-color-SI2-clarity-sku-72826 and http://www.jamesallen.com/#!/loose-diamonds/round-cut/1.01-carat-J-color-SI2-clarity-Excellent-cut-sku-185068

As I said before. The pricing he is offering you is RETAIL not WHOLESALE.

Also please note the diamonds I linked to are EXCELLENT CUTS not Very good. So they cost more. AND STILL the pricing is the same as this guys so called "wholesale" prices.

 

[Karl_K]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

some numbers cant be read in the pic. with a 61% table 13.5% ch comes out to 34.5 degrees.
AGS estimated grade ags3 where 0 is the best grade.

 

[Gypsy]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

AGS estimated grade ags3 where 0 is the best grade.

To translate this: CUT IS NOT GOOD. PASS. And learn more about diamonds before you buy. And about the jewelry trade. A REAL WHOLESALER WILL NOT SELL TO PUBLIC.

 

[MichelleCarmen]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

Hi,

Sorry, but he's not giving you a good deal...you would want excellent cut diamonds...never settle for "very good," when, for the same price you can have an EXCELLENT cut diamond!

Going from a J to a G is a big jump in both appearance and cost!

 

[JulieN]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

some numbers cant be read in the pic. with a 61% table 13.5% ch comes out to 34.5 degrees.
AGS estimated grade ags3 where 0 is the best grade.

AGS 3 for proportions and finish... possible 0 for light performance?

 

[John P]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

GIA Report: https://myapps.gia.edu/ReportCheckPortal/getReportData.do?&reportno=16856778&weight=1.01

Notes:
* 61T 40.6PA 34.5CA 50S 80LH 61.2D Tn-Tk Girdle (5%)
* At 6.37-6.41 it faces up like a well-cut 0.95 carat diamond.
* Predicted AGS 3 for performance, but the girdle brings it down to AGS 4 with make considered.
* What are the grade-setting inclusions?

Good call, Karl, on 34.5. Of course, that is averaged and rounded, lest we ever forget.

 

[Karl_K]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

some numbers cant be read in the pic. with a 61% table 13.5% ch comes out to 34.5 degrees.
AGS estimated grade ags3 where 0 is the best grade.

AGS 3 for proportions and finish... possible 0 for light performance?

AGS 3 light performance or lower based on the badly rounded GIA numbers.
I didn't bother with my usual grumbling about the rounding because there is nothing in the rounding that would save it but I should have anyway.

 

[Karl_K]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

GIA Report: https://myapps.gia.edu/ReportCheckPortal/getReportData.do?&reportno=16856778&weight=1.01

Notes:
* 61T 40.6PA 34.5CA 50S 80LH 61.2D Tn-Tk Girdle (5%)
* At 6.37-6.41 it faces up like a well-cut 0.95 carat diamond.
* Predicted AGS 3 for performance, but the girdle brings it down to AGS 4 with make considered.
* What are the grade-setting inclusions?

Good call, Karl, on 34.5. Of course, that is averaged and rounded, lest we ever forget.

Thanks sir John, I should have added my usual line about the rounding.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

A REAL wholesale jeweler would not sell to you.

so true...

 

[Dancing Fire]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

So, today through a friend I saw a wholesale diamond dealer who has been selling diamonds for 30 years now.

thank you.

rule #1...never buy from a friend of a friend...

 

[bizmord]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

So let me clarify a couple of things ....

First of all .... really, really appreciate all the great advice and comments here. However ..... I don't want to be too technical with picking a diamond. It's not like I am buying a 20K diamond and want only the best of the best. As you can see, I don't have the budget to get the best.
\
When this guy showed me, side by side different diamonds with diff ratings for clarity SI2 vs VS1 vs VVS2 ... I didn't notice the difference with just my eyes. the only difference I saw was in size and color. Going from J to a G .. I saw a difference.

So .... I am trying to not over-focus on every tiny bid of number .... I just want the diamond to look nice to a naked eye. I don't plan to resell it. Just want it to look presentable when someone glares at it without a magnifying glass./

You are correct. His price is not wholesale. So the question is ... what should have been the price for something he showed me and what would be considered as a good deal for the cost of $4-5K ?

thanks to all.

P.S. As an example ... recently I was buying a home theater speakers. And ... everyone focused on spec numbers that ultimately didn't even matter because a human ear can't hear the difference between 5 and 9db. Yet folks spend money to get better spec numbers. I want to avoid this when buying a diamond.

 

[Niel]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

It doesnt matter if your paying 1k or 100k for a diamond, why would you want to pay so much money for something you know isnt the best?and as for clarity, i dont think anyone is saying you need to get high clairty. Most of us would say an si clarity as long as its eyr clean would be just fine. Cut is king. A well cut stone will look whiter and bigger than a poorly cut stone that is a higher color anf clarity. Your money is important, and why woyld you pay thousands to get something sub par?

Its like buying a car. If you had 10k for a car, would you rather spend it in a car that runs well or poorly?

 

[John P]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

So the question is ... what should have been the price for something he showed me and what would be considered as a good deal for the cost of $4-5K ?

This is a logical and basic question. The answer is to price it alongside well-cut 0.95 carat GIA J SI2s with same level of eye-clean - since that is the size at-which it faces-up, and size is the primary pricing vehicle.

 

[bizmord]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

comparing between

$4,600
http://www.bluenile.com/build-your-own-diamond-ring?forceStep=DIAMONDS_STEP&track=sublink1a#diamonds_forceStep=DIAMONDS_STEP|builder=BYOR|pid=LD03069432

$4,900
http://www.bluenile.com/build-your-own-diamond-ring?forceStep=DIAMONDS_STEP&track=sublink1a#diamonds_forceStep=DIAMONDS_STEP|builder=BYOR|pid=LD03029125

$4,300
http://www.jamesallen.com/#!/loose-diamonds/round-cut/1.02-carat-I-color-SI2-clarity-Excellent-cut-sku-78265

$4,500
http://www.b2cjewels.com/dd-3487382-1.01-carat-Round-diamond-H-color-SI2-Clarity.aspx?sku=3487382&utm_source=pricescope.com&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=pricescope.com

 

[John P]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

To elaborate, those you linked-to have diameters at the 1.00 carat classification.

At 6.39mm the 1.02 you're considering has the face-up diameter of a well-cut 0.95 carat; meaning that if the wearer compares her "1 carat" diamond against someone else's "1 carat" hers may appear smaller; particularly away from bright spotlights.

As an exercise, you may wish to compare prices for 0.95-0.99 carat diamonds instead?

Alternately, you may have established a relationship with the jeweler and like his/her service and presentation. It also sounds like you like the diamond. That's very important and, for what it's worth, the price you've been offered is not out of bounds. In fact your jeweler may well have paid the 1.00 price to his supplier, which is dictating his terms to you. In terms of information, which this forum specializes in providing, just be aware that this diamond will look more like a well-cut 0.95 ct than 1.02 ct.

 

[bizmord]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

To elaborate, those you linked-to have diameters at the 1.00 carat classification.

At 6.39mm the 1.02 you're considering has the face-up diameter of a well-cut 0.95 carat; meaning that if the wearer compares her "1 carat" diamond against someone else's "1 carat" hers may appear smaller; particularly away from bright spotlights.

As an exercise, you may wish to compare prices for 0.95-0.99 carat diamonds instead?

Alternately, you may have established a relationship with the jeweler and like his/her service and presentation. It also sounds like you like the diamond. That's very important and, for what it's worth, the price you've been offered is not out of bounds. In fact your jeweler may well have paid the 1.00 price to his supplier, which is dictating his terms to you. In terms of information, which this forum specializes in providing, just be aware that this diamond will look more like a well-cut 0.95 ct than 1.02 ct.

For pure looks .... am I better off with the diamond this guy offered? or one of those in links? And if it's the 4 other online ... which one is the best value/look? thank you

 

[bgray]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

To elaborate, those you linked-to have diameters at the 1.00 carat classification.

At 6.39mm the 1.02 you're considering has the face-up diameter of a well-cut 0.95 carat; meaning that if the wearer compares her "1 carat" diamond against someone else's "1 carat" hers may appear smaller; particularly away from bright spotlights.

As an exercise, you may wish to compare prices for 0.95-0.99 carat diamonds instead?

Alternately, you may have established a relationship with the jeweler and like his/her service and presentation. It also sounds like you like the diamond. That's very important and, for what it's worth, the price you've been offered is not out of bounds. In fact your jeweler may well have paid the 1.00 price to his supplier, which is dictating his terms to you. In terms of information, which this forum specializes in providing, just be aware that this diamond will look more like a well-cut 0.95 ct than 1.02 ct.

For pure looks .... am I better off with the diamond this guy offered? or one of those in links? And if it's the 4 other online ... which one is the best value/look? thank you

for pure looks no--this is not a great stone. you should spend your money on the best cut stone possible.

 

[JulieN]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

You don't have to think.

You give us your budget, rank the 4Cs in order of importance and list minimum requirements. List possible vendors who have the setting you want. PSers post possible stones. Request IS pictures/eye-cleanliness confirmations as needed. Done.

 

[sonnyjane]

Re: I saw a Wholesale Jewler. Here is the Offer. Is it B.S.

So let me clarify a couple of things ....

First of all .... really, really appreciate all the great advice and comments here. However ..... I don't want to be too technical with picking a diamond. It's not like I am buying a 20K diamond and want only the best of the best. As you can see, I don't have the budget to get the best.

bizmord, as others, others who know MUCH more about diamonds than I do, have already said, just because you can't afford the best diamond on the market doesn't mean you shouldn't buy the best diamond on the market that costs $4,000, know what I mean?

If $4,000 will buy either a crappy performing stone or a fantastic one, wouldn't you want the fantastic one? Let the folks here pick your stone for you!